Within a reason

[EvoN1020v]

Yesterday, I had this crazy idea in my head from no where. My thoughts stated that everything is done for or within a reason.

 

For example:

• We have to go to the bathroom to dispose our wastes
  
• We have bookbags to carry our materials
  
• We walk to go from point A to B
  
• I sat down to watch TV, or play computer
  

 

These are some of the examples, and I want you guys to try to prove my silly theorem wrong. An example that something is not done for or within a reason.

 

Good luck.

[psynapse]

What about a mentally ill person. Doing something repetitively without thinking about what they are doing.

[YT2095]

why does Cyanide smell so nice and yet is so totaly toxic to us?

 

Why are the seeds in Avocados so disproportionaly large?

[GutZ]

What about a mentally ill person. Doing something repetitively without thinking about what they are doing.

 

 

 

I do lots of things without reason...I am not "mentally ill".

[psynapse]

I didn't mean to say everyone doing something repetitively is mentally ill. I wouldn't call breathing a mental health problem would you?

[EvoN1020v]

why does Cyanide smell so nice and yet is so totaly toxic to us?

 

Why are the seeds in Avocados so disproportionaly large?

 

Maybe it's a defence mechanism for cyanide.

 

I'm not sure about the seeds, but I'm sure there's a reason why it's big.

[GutZ]

I didn't mean to say everyone doing something repetitively is mentally ill. I wouldn't call breathing a mental health problem would you?

 

No but that has reason behind it...like not dying.

[EvoN1020v]

Good point.

 

Seems like my silly theorem is hard to prove it wrong, eh?

[GutZ]

Yeah it's pretty good. The only thing I could think of was:

 

1)

Scenerio:

 

I check my stove/doors/tabs/locks/fridge/ like 2-5 times each night. I do it because I don't want my apartment to catch fire/leak water/have people walking in/ruin my food. I could just do it once, but the second I let go of whatever lever I touched, I get this uneasy feeling like it was an illusion. You know like when you think you've done something and check later and you didn't, even though mentally you pictured yourself doing it...

 

It's not a particularly good reason, I haven't had a problem yet, so I know I am doing something right, yet still I do it. There is a fuzzy area where I can't say whether I have reason to continue doing it, whether my sub-conscious actions are consider to have reason, even then I could question if I am doing it sub-consciously.

 

2)Why do certian insects decapiate their mates after .

[gib65]

why does Cyanide smell so nice and yet is so totaly toxic to us?

 

Why are the seeds in Avocados so disproportionaly large?

 

So are we talking about non-volitional actions?

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

Why do I sit around flipping a coin while bored?

[psynapse]

Why do I sit around flipping a coin while bored?

 

Cause you are bored.

[EvoN1020v]

Why do I sit around flipping a coin while bored?

 

You flipped the coin for a reason - because you were bored.

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

And why do I still continue to do it while not bored?

[gib65]

It's a stim?

[CPL.Luke]

why do I stare blankly sometimes?

[EvoN1020v]

why do I stare blankly sometimes?

 

Because you are day dreaming.

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

If you're going to define "reason" like that, this exercise is rather pointless.

[Bignose]

If you're going to define "reason" like that, this exercise is rather pointless.

 

Cap'ns got a pretty good point here. Otherwise almost all leisure activities are done/were created for not much reason. E.g. most sports, soccer, basketball, football, baseball, golf, etc? For that matter, sports fanaticism (Boston Red Sox fans, I'm looking at you), or even watching a sporting event you yourself are not participating in is done for no real reason either. I can't think of any real reason most board games would have been invented. (Chess is an analogue to war, but is Monopoly designed to teach people to hoard wealth?) I think even farther, crossword puzzles don't accomplish much. This list can go on and on. Most leisure activities had to have been invented 'because someone was bored,' because there is no real reason behind them. I mean, seriously, look at caber tossing -- you know that someone had to have been pretty bored to come up with that.

[padren]

If we define a reason as something that can be, if examined closely enough, tied in a causal set of links, then as long as the universe is deterministic then there is a reason behind everything.

 

Secondarily, if the term reason is less tied to direct causality and we go with "reasoned thought, subconcious desire, or best method available to us" then it still largely if not totally true: we either do something because we thought it out or because some subconcious drive pushes us to, or because (such as blinking for no reason) it gets us back on track without our even knowing it when nothing else would more effeciently.

 

Other than the above, I wouldn't know how to define a reason any other way, so I wouldn't know how to state something that breaks the theorom.

 

I do things that are erratic all the time, for no reason known to me...but I also am quite comfortable running with the most whimsical impulse so I can't say I don't have a reasonable expectation that it is worth following.

 

I can't think of a definition of reason that would allow doing things "for no reason" at all.

[psynapse]

What about something like gravity, why does it behave the way it does. Explain that.

[Glider]

If we are talking about determinism in human behaviour (rather than properties of inanimate things) then the OP is right IMO.

 

All human behaviour has underlying drives, whether or not those drives are rational. Drives can come from inside (endogenous) like hunger, thirst and so-on, but a surprising number are exogenous, resulting from our non-conscious (preattentive) processing of the environment.

 

For example, GutZ's habit of checking his "stove/doors/tabs/locks/fridge/ like 2-5 times each night. I do it because I don't want my apartment to catch fire/leak water/have people walking in/ruin my food. I could just do it once, but the second I let go of whatever lever I touched, I get this uneasy feeling like it was an illusion. You know like when you think you've done something and check later and you didn't, even though mentally you pictured yourself doing it..."

 

This behaviour is driven by anxiety, although not necessarily to do with the reasons listed by GutZ. Performing the behaviour alleviates that anxiety.

 

This actually sounds like the start of a compulsive obsessive ritual because stopping the behaviour results in your getting "this uneasy feeling like it was an illusion". Where not performing a ritulistic behaviour pattern results in anxiety means the ritual is a compulsive behaviour. Where stopping the ritual induces anxiety or disquiet, means the ritual is obsessive.

 

This is ok as it stands, but if it starts to interfere with other asects of life it can become a big problem.

 

2)Why do certian insects decapiate their mates after.

In many cases, such as mantids, it provides the extra nutritional boost to start forming the (many) eggs the female will lay. It also prevents the male from making a post-coital meal of the female, which would be bad for propagation of the species.

[EvoN1020v]

What about something like gravity, why does it behave the way it does. Explain that.

 

Because gravity behaves as centripetal acceleration toward the center of the Earth.

 

Simple.

[5614]

If you're going to define "reason" like that, this exercise is rather pointless.

I agree.

 

In the end the reasons will be "because you're human", "because you want to" or "because that's how the universe is".

 

Whilst you could define that as a reason, it is hardly a deep explanation as to why we are doing it. Maybe talking about the neuron paths in ours brains which cause us to do the things we do.

 

If we are talking about determinism in human behaviour (rather than properties of inanimate things) then the OP is right IMO.

I agree with this too. Whether it is basic instinct, our desire or malfunctions within our brains, there is an explanation for all human actions.

 

But that does not mean that everything is done for a reason.

 

So I've been thinking through a few examples and each one seemed to have some kind of reason, but in the end I come back to the true randomness of nature. And I ask you this: why does one atom decay in a radioactive material and another atom not? What is the reason for this atom decaying and the other one not decaying?

 

My initial thought was that the reason for this is so that the radioactive compound becomes a more stable, however then I realised that this was not my question. I am questioning the reason behind the randomness of which actual atom decays. As that is, what I would refer to as, true randomness, I say there is no real reason as to why one specific atom decays whilst another specific atom does not (in a radioactive material).

 

My thoughts stated that everything is done for or within a reason[/i'].

Whilst initially I agree with Cap'n saying this is pointless, I'm now challenging you instead!

[GutZ]

In many cases, such as mantids, it provides the extra nutritional boost to start forming the (many) eggs the female will lay. It also prevents the male from making a post-coital meal of the female, which would be bad for propagation of the species.

 

Interesting. Is that for the head specifically (lots of nutients)? Is that also the specific aim of the female? For protection I guess it's pretty damn quick and effective way to kill something.