Autism

[MolotovCocktail]

Wow, its been a while since I posted in this forum, busy with graduation lol.

 

Well, anyway,......

 

I've only recently started accepting that I'm a little different from everyone else (about a year, but relatively speaking: I've known for 7 years). I denied it for the longest time and tried to teach myself how to be social because I just don't want to be different (this is why I've read so much about conversation and everything else).

 

Yeah, I know that feeling. But in my many travels I learned that being the same as everyone else isn't quite worth it. I have always valued my individuality and my intellect (2 traits that "everyone else" seems to lack). This just isn't restricted to you, I'm sure everyone at some point in their lives wanted to be like "everyone else", and those who learned to admire their differences are the ones who turn out to be the most successful .

 

I'm a senior in high school and it feels like I've missed out on a lot of things. I work at a baseball park just to get out cause I never go anywhere with friends, and several of my closer friends work there as well. People always think it's weird that I don't go out and do things, and they think it's even weirder when I tell them that I consider working "going out." (which I've stopped telling people cause of it -- is it so wrong to enjoy working? Should I go find a place I hate working that maybe pays more? People see working like a chore, and in the end I don't even care about the money cause I only spend about $10 a week, plus I have my entire college payed for with excess money over top of that!)

 

Well, when you mean by missing out, do you mean being able to do the stuff that the typical teenager likes to do like dating and sports? Been there, done that. Well, sort of. Personally, I always found "hanging out" and all of the other things that typical teens do to be rather boring, simply because most of the time its chatting and we always go to the same places (I like to travel to exotic places a lot, and I only go to stores if I want to buy something). As for dating, I'd have to say that I don't have much experience in this realm unfortunately. I had one back in the 8th grade and another in the 11th grade, and I find that its better to date people from other towns rather than the same school. As for working as entertainment, that depends on personal taste. If you like your job then it really shouldn't be an issue.

 

I was just wondering what you think about telling people that you have AS. I've only told one person (two days ago) because I've been denying it, and recently because I figure people might think of it negatively, but I kind of feel like it might help my relations with people if they knew.

 

Well, this is up to you. The policy that I have on this is that the only people who are allowed to know about my AS are close friends and family, and anybody who has to know about it.

 

Besides, talking is a distraction. Our job was to wrap hotdogs -- what didn't she understand about that?

 

I find that when I work, it is always helpful to establish some connection with my co-workers through talking. Even though your not paid to do it, you will improve your social skills in that manner and in many cases it does relieve stress in the workplace.

 

There's this forum called wrongplanet for asperger's syndrome, but I'm asking here because there are a lot of neurotypical people here, and also because a lot of you seem to have good insight (wrongplanet seems divided on the issue anyway). So if you were to meet someone who was maybe a little strange do you think it'd be better to think of her/him as being a little weird, or to refere to him/her as the person with that "condition?" I'm still 17 so at this point it's ok for me to "lack common sense" but as I get older I think people are going to start expecting things of me that I really cant pull off, and telling them I have aspergers might be able to help.

 

In every Asperger forum I've been to (and this includes Wrongplanet), I find that they are not only divided on the subject, but they aren't very helpful in addressing any issues that a person may have. It may be great with meeting other people with AS but I find most people go to sites like that in order to get away from dealing with the real world. And, wrongplanet is full of spammers and attention seekers, I used to post there as MolotovCocktail and I didn't like it at all.

 

As for stuff like common sense, that is just something you learn through experience. Some learn that faster than others. Hell, I know a bunch of "NT's" that have less common sense than I do :rolleyes:. But I don't think that you should use AS as an "excuse". While there will be plenty of things that will be difficult because of AS, you must keep in mind that you have to do what you have to do. And one of the things you have to do is learn stuff like common sense and social skills. It ain't easy, but the reward is great if you do learn these essential skills.

 

Btw getting out or working is probably the best thing to do if you have aspergers. I think it's really helped me a lot, not just working with other people, but interacting with customers.

 

Oh absolutely. I don't have much job experience, but I do go out and do a lot of extra-curricular activities, such as compete in chess tournaments. I also have experience in public speaking as well, and recently I spoke at a teacher's workshop about Asperger's Syndrome. The presentation was so good that they are going to put it on TV! I also have it recorded too, so you guys can see it once I put in on youtube .

[ParanoiA]

Fascinating. My sister in law's son (Tye), I think he's 6 now, has been diagnosed autistic. Although, I've never heard anything clinical beyond that, so I have no idea of the kind of autism we're talking about. But he is a neat kid - although a terror at the same time.

 

When we last when to visit, they put on Shrek on their big screen. He was standing in front of the TV, but facing us, acting out the movie - I was amazed because he mocked every little nuance. If Shrek's face twitched, his face twitched. His timing was incredible. He almost looked like a mirror image of whatever character he was playing, in terms of their movements and when they spoke and when they listened - all timed amazingly well - looking at us.

 

Is this a typical thing? Does it shed any light as to what kind of autism he may have?

 

His mother said he watched the movie several times, but I still don't see how someone could memorize so much, so perfectly - and this was a year ago so I'm thinking he was 5 then.

[MolotovCocktail]

Fascinating. My sister in law's son (Tye), I think he's 6 now, has been diagnosed autistic. Although, I've never heard anything clinical beyond that, so I have no idea of the kind of autism we're talking about. But he is a neat kid - although a terror at the same time.

 

When we last when to visit, they put on Shrek on their big screen. He was standing in front of the TV, but facing us, acting out the movie - I was amazed because he mocked every little nuance. If Shrek's face twitched, his face twitched. His timing was incredible. He almost looked like a mirror image of whatever character he was playing, in terms of their movements and when they spoke and when they listened - all timed amazingly well - looking at us.

 

Is this a typical thing? Does it shed any light as to what kind of autism he may have?

 

His mother said he watched the movie several times, but I still don't see how someone could memorize so much, so perfectly - and this was a year ago so I'm thinking he was 5 then.

 

Yeah, this is pretty typical for a person with Autism. Often they have a very intense interest in some subject or some form of entertainment, and they can get quite good and knowledgable at it too, as in his case with Shrek. I need to know more details before I can determine what type of Autism he has because this is common with most any form.

[armygas]

Our son was diagnosed at age two with ASD (more specifically PPD-NOS) and he is six now.

 

ABA therapy has been the only thing that has worked for him.

[Rilx]

It's not that they lack empathy or emotions, the real issue is that people with Autism have a difficult time being able to interpret what other people are feeling, and other nonverbal cues.

 

"Empathic" is often in everyday talk used as synonym for nice, kind, good and warm person. But as a psychological term it means that a person is able to know and recognize other people's feelings and other nonverbal cues.

 

Both physiological and psychological reasons can lead to different grades of weak empathy which consequently appears in different mental disorders. The wide area of undeveloped empathy disorders is often called autistic-narcissistic spectrum.

[galaxyblur]

I worked with people with autism and other conditions for 5 years. Changed my life.

 

Remember, autism can be as crippling as something like cerebral palsy. They're not all savants, or even close.

[Reaper]

I've got a friend with Tourette syndrome (Not really Autism, but symptoms are similar), and one of my brothers has Aspergers.

 

I have HFA myself, meaning High Functioning Autism. It's similar to Aspergers, but much more full blown.

 

Diagnosed since I was 9, and went through speech therapy throughout my elementary school years. I learned how to talk when I was 3 1/2 yrs. Social skills have been a pain in the arse for me. My IQ is about a high average, about 125, but I don't really pay any attention to that. I have a very good photographic memory too, but my working memory is very weak.

 

I've been on anti-depressants when I was in the middle school, and ritalin throughout both my elementary and middle school yrs. Nowadays I'm drug free.

 

To this day I'm still not very verbal at all, much easier to talk via internet or other alternative means. I'm not on any medication, and my intense interest in science helped me to get through school and make it to a very competitive college . Majoring in physics, looking to pursue astrophysics or theoretical.

 

Our son was diagnosed at age two with ASD (more specifically PPD-NOS) and he is six now.

 

ABA therapy has been the only thing that has worked for him.

 

 

Same here, though drugs did help somewhat.

 

I'd say 95 and up, though most people with Asperger's do have above average IQs.

 

Not really. The diagnostic criteria is that the IQ's range from normal to above average. Most of them fall in the average range.

 

For those of you that don't know' date=' everyone actually has some level of autism. Autism just means you have an extreme male brain. There are tests you can take online that are administered by psychologists that can tell you where you are. (this is by no means a diagnosis though)

[/quote']

 

You can hold that view if you want. Personally I found quite a few holes and factual errors with this claim.

 

 

http://glennrowe.net/BaronCohen/MaleFemale.asp

 

People who are commonly labeled "smart but lack common sense" usually have a higher systemizing quotient then people who are "really nice but not that good at math." Women are ten times less likely to have autism' date=' and we all know about the gender difference with math/science.

 

 

This is just statistical averaging though. And the male brain isn't really smarter then the female brain, it's just that systematizing is what we commonly correlate with "smart" -- math, science, and engineering. You can read about all of this in [i']Essential Differences, the truth about the male and female brain.[/i]

 

The Simon-Baron Cohen model states that women are predominantly wired for empathy while men are predominantly wired for systemizing. As for the math difference, men tend to have better mathematical and logical reasoning. As for calculation they are about the same. Verbal and empathy scores aren't really that much different either, though women tend to test slightly better in those areas.

 

As for autism, I find that the Simon-Baron Cohen model isn't adequate for determining autism because it is only testing for SQ and EQ skills. One can have a high SQ score and still have decent social skills.

 

You have to be careful with intelligence tests, especially with regards to gender, because often you will find that the actual results and averages don't differ by that much (usually a 2-3 point difference). It all depends on the sample. Almost all intelligence tests are culturally based and biased, and the tests themselves only test a limited portion of human intellect.

 

I was wondering what it's like in college with asperger's syndrome.

 

Well, from my experience, I've spent about 4 days in college and I already have more than 10 new contacts on the cellphone, so socially there isn't much worry. You should avoid going to a big university because then you may get overwhelmed. I go to a technical institute and they have about ~3000 students, so it's not that bad.

 

 

Well, when you mean by missing out, do you mean being able to do the stuff that the typical teenager likes to do like dating and sports? Been there, done that. Well, sort of. Personally, I always found "hanging out" and all of the other things that typical teens do to be rather boring.......

 

 

I had quite a different experience. I like to hang out. Makes me feel less lonely, and it's a lot more fun to go with a group of people rather than by yourself all the time.

 

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You guys should watch this video. It contains one of my most favorite people and it's really good in general. It's about Kim Peek.

[1veedo]

You can hold that view if you want. Personally I found quite a few holes and factual errors with this claim.

I'm saying autism exists on a scale, and that people in the general population can have small amounts of it. There's actually a debate as to whether or not a large percentage of people with Asperger's syndrome really have a disorder in the first place or if it just reflects a natural distribution in the gene pool (the debate is if we should tighten the criteria some). Likewise there are a lot of neurotypical people who resemble autistics but don't necessarily qualify for full-blown Aspergers.

 

This is unrelated to Simon-Baron Cohen. It's known as the autistic spectrum. When applied to the Simon-Baron Cohen model it means that instead of existing on an "autistic scale" you exist on a sort of "how male is your brain" scale.

 

Btw I've done some research sense about Simon-Baron Cohen and I would to a limited extent agree with you. More so than I would have a couple months ago. Autism can be explained on an EQ and SQ scale fairly well, and in autistic people you do see a much larger amount of androgen and testosterone, especially prenatally and before puberty, but this alone doesn't necessarily indicate a "male brain." Higher SQ and lower EQ does however seem to be characteristic of males, and even more so for autistics.

[Reaper]

I'm saying autism exists on a scale, and that people in the general population can have small amounts of it.

 

I know what you are saying. What I'm saying is that it isn't true. Yes, it does exist on a scale in that people on the autistic spectrum can range from mild to severe, but it is not representative of the whole population. Some people might display some characteristics, but most of the time it is not clinically significant, and it certainly doesn't mean that they have it. Also, some symptoms of Autism are also present in ADD/ADHD and Schizophrenia.

 

There's actually a debate as to whether or not a large percentage of people with Asperger's syndrome really have a disorder in the first place or if it just reflects a natural distribution in the gene pool (the debate is if we should tighten the criteria some). Likewise there are a lot of neurotypical people who resemble autistics but don't necessarily qualify for full-blown Aspergers.

 

Yeah, that is because Asperger's Syndrome is very hard to diagnose. In some cases, they may have some other disorder. Also, there seems to be the misconception that shyness or being introverted means that you have Aspergers or some other ASD. The DSM-IV books list otherwise.

 

 

 

This is unrelated to Simon-Baron Cohen. It's known as the autistic spectrum. When applied to the Simon-Baron Cohen model it means that instead of existing on an "autistic scale" you exist on a sort of "how male is your brain" scale.

 

Btw I've done some research sense about Simon-Baron Cohen and I would to a limited extent agree with you. More so than I would have a couple months ago. Autism can be explained on an EQ and SQ scale fairly well, Higher SQ and lower EQ does however seem to be characteristic of males, and even more so for autistics.

 

 

Lack of empathy is a characteristic of ASD so it is no surprise that people with ASD's will score much lower on the EQ test. I'm quite skeptical on the SQ part though. Having a high SQ score means that one is quite good with analytical skills and to some extent mathematical or logical reasoning. From what I know, some symptoms of Aspergers and other ASD's actually interfere with the ability to do that properly such as working memory and the tendency to be literal. While the results do show that some people with Aspergers can score high on the SQ part, I'm not convinced that it means that people with Aspergers have an "extreme male brain".

 

and in autistic people you do see a much larger amount of androgen and testosterone, especially prenatally and before puberty, but this alone doesn't necessarily indicate a "male brain."

 

True. It is believed that these increased testosterone levels are responsible for superior attention to detail in infants but lack of social adequacy.

 

As for symptoms, current research indicates that a deficiency in grey matter in both the frontal lobes and the cerebellum may be primarily responsible for them. In more full blown autistics, there is also an abnormal levels of white matter. However, the study also indicated that the brains of normal people, not Aspergers, tend to decrease in volume as they increase in age.

[Reaper]

You guys might find this article interesting, its about recent findings in early brain development for autistic children, by neuron.org. Pretty much, they mapped the brain in early stages of development and compared them to adults:

 

http://www.neuron.org/content/article/abstract?uid=PIIS0896627307007775

[JeffreyNYA]

Not exactly. People with autism can also be a prodigy in music, history, etc. It is more or less based on what their intense interest is. Sometimes their interest changes while other times it stays static and they may become experts in their interests. I have had a passion for science and math since about the 3rd grade because I am a math prodigy and I tend to be a very logical person (hence science makes a lot more sense than religion for me).

 

And yes, all people have some traits associated with personality disorders and mental illnesses but they are not severe enough to be considered as such.

 

Autism is neither a mental illness nor a personality disorder. It is a developmental disorder, but has some traits associated with OCD.

 

 

 

you can start by looking here:

 

link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autistic_Savant

 

I had this thought about Autism. I know that it is a disability to most that have it in whatever form it takes, but I have to wonder if it is really a disease or disorder. Let me explain as I don't want to offend anyone.

 

When I see the savant for example, I often wonder what happened in his brain and what went wrong. I start to think that it’s like a programmer messing around with code trying to make a program better but to only improve one area and to add bugs into another. It just seems to me that there may be some kind of evolution going on here. Like nature is trying to make us like a savant but in everyway.

 

I am pretty sure there is no way to prove any of this really, but it some how makes sense to me.

[bascule]

My gut feeling on autism is that there are certain genes which select for different modes of verbal vs. non-verbal communication, particularly in regard to mirror neurons. Just exactly how these genes express themselves depends on what combination you have. Some configurations may work great and produce a genius (albeit a socially inept one) who relies on non-verbal modes of thought as the primary means of formulating complex ideas. Other configurations lead to a situation where a person's modes of thought are completely non-verbal and they are unable to understand either verbal or non-verbal communication of others.

[Reaper]

When I see the savant for example, I often wonder what happened in his brain and what went wrong. I start to think that it’s like a programmer messing around with code trying to make a program better but to only improve one area and to add bugs into another. It just seems to me that there may be some kind of evolution going on here. Like nature is trying to make us like a savant but in everyway.

 

Well, regarding that, according to the video I posted (man, that was a while ago!) I remember them saying that savant-like capabilities aren't even possible in normal people, unless there is some fundamental changes within the brain itself.

 

Likewise, I also heard of attempts to use transcranial magnetic stimulation to induce savant-like abilities. But, I don't know how effective that was (or read any peer reviewed papers on it for that matter), and overall I really haven't kept up with autism research updates for quite a while now.

[zule]

I am currently reading a novel entitled “The curious incident of the dog in the night-time”, by Mark Haddon. The author was working with autistic children, and he writes the novel from the point of view of one of them.

 

Thank you to this novel, I have gotten to know something about how an autistic person sees the world, how he feels about the “normal” people. Besides, the book is very entertaining, so, I recommend its reading.

[drochaid]

I had this thought about Autism. I know that it is a disability to most that have it in whatever form it takes, but I have to wonder if it is really a disease or disorder.

 

It's not a disease (to the best research we have available) but it is a disorder.

 

You need to remember that the term disorder is in relation to the norm .. whether it represents a genetic trait which would prove beneficial and a direction for the human race is irrelevant as it's apart from the norm right now.

 

You may like to read Foucault's Madness and Civilisation, a mid-20th Century social philosopher/historian who charts the history of madness in (mostly) France but with references to elsewhere as relevant. Opinion on disorders such as autism have changed drastically a number of times over the centuries.. and I'm not convinced the current widely held stance is the best of them.

[cre8ivmind]

I thought it would be appropriate to put a post about this in this section.

 

Basically, for those of you who don't know, Autism is a neurological disorder that interferes with the ability to communicate. Symptoms include delayed speech or language impairment, poor social skills, some features of obsessive compulsive disorder(s), and in some cases (usually low functioning autism), deficiencies in cognitive abilities.

 

I put this up mainly because I have high functioning autism. More specifically, I have Asperger's Syndrome, which is on the mild side of the autistic spectrum disorders. High functioning autism basically means that the person does not have any cognitive or language deficiencies, but still have other characteristics with associated with autism (most notably, poor social skills). They also have normal to above average IQ's (I scored a whopping 165 on the IQ test long ago).

 

There are many discussions that one can have on this thread on it such as:

 

-Who has it

-Who knows about it and what do you know

-Who here researches it

-Personal experiences

-Questions

-Historic Figures

-And other stuff you may think of

 

I too have Aspergers. My family and friends know about it, but they don't fully understand it. Are Asperger people more concious about the natural world than other people, or is it just me?

[Amylene]

Do you know the name of this experiment by any chance?

 

I know I'm a bit too late, but in case if you're still interested, I found some info here:

http://neshealthblog.wordpress.com/2011/09/09/empathy-enhanced-by-magnetic-stimulation-of-the-brain/

http://jerobison.blogspot.com/2008/04/standing-on-brink.html

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/my-life-aspergers/201002/how-science-is-using-magnetic-energy-rewire-our-brains

http://jerobison.blogspot.com/2008/05/another-participants-view-of-tms.html