cause of gravitational lensing

[spunnery]

is there anybody to explain me why am i wrong,if i argue that gravitational lensing is not caused by gravity,but because of the change in medium(from vaccum to the atmosphere and back to vaccum).?

[insane_alien]

well, seeing as there is no appreciable density change over the distances involved apart from very very close the the centre. then this can be discounted.

 

if you are thinking of the earths atmosphere then remember that we can see them from space(outside our own atmosphere)

 

we can conclude from the last fact alone that it is not from an atmospheric effect.

 

another thing that discounts an atmospheric effect is that there is no spectral diffraction observed (where white light splits into its respective colours) this would be seen if it was a normal lens effect like an atmosphere would produce. gravity on the other hand would not cause this because it bends all wavelegnths equally

[spunnery]

well, seeing as there is no appreciable density change over the distances involved apart from very very close the the centre. then this can be discounted.

 

if you are thinking of the earths atmosphere then remember that we can see them from space(outside our own atmosphere)

 

we can conclude from the last fact alone that it is not from an atmospheric effect.

 

another thing that discounts an atmospheric effect is that there is no spectral diffraction observed (where white light splits into its respective colours) this would be seen if it was a normal lens effect like an atmosphere would produce. gravity on the other hand would not cause this because it bends all wavelegnths equally

reflection is also a property of light when it passes from one medium to another,bending all wave lengths at same angle.I am not only talking abot the earths atmosphere but also all the atmospheres(whatever gas at whatever temperature) crossed by the heavenly lights to reach earth. For example the bending of light during solar eclipse,which is aproof of Einstein's relativity, could it be happened due to the reflection of light when it passes from vaccum to sun's atmosphere and back to vaccum?.the reflection caused by eartth's atmosphere will not be noticable to us because we are inside the same medium

[swansont]

reflection is also a property of light when it passes from one medium to another,bending all wave lengths at same angle.I am not only talking abot the earths atmosphere but also all the atmospheres(whatever gas at whatever temperature) crossed by the heavenly lights to reach earth. For example the bending of light during solar eclipse,which is aproof of Einstein's relativity, could it be happened due to the reflection of light when it passes from vaccum to sun's atmosphere and back to vaccum?.the reflection caused by eartth's atmosphere will not be noticable to us because we are inside the same medium

 

i_a already addressed this. The atmospheric effects you propose do not account for what is observed.

[spunnery]

i_a already addressed this. The atmospheric effects you propose do not account for what is observed.

reflection of light when it changes the medium,is a phenomenon which we are experiensing in our daily life. for example ,A stick dip inside a pool seems to be bend at the junction of the mediums.could you please explain more clearly how this is not coming into account for a the lensing and why we are going for a more complicated explanation, without proper reasoning? Sorry to say everybody wants to proove Einstein was right! Of course he was a geneious ,but Galeilio & sir Issac newton too was?

[Royston]

reflection of light when it changes the medium,is a phenomenon which we are experiensing in our daily life. for example ,A stick dip inside a pool seems to be bend at the junction of the mediums.could you please explain more clearly how this is not coming into account for a the lensing and why we are going for a more complicated explanation, without proper reasoning? Sorry to say everybody wants to proove Einstein was right! Of course he was a geneious ,but Galeilio & sir Issac newton too was?

 

But that's just a change in refractive index, how can you apply the same principle to, for example, gamma ray bursts ? Also, I don't understand your point with Issac Newton was a genius... it's contempary physics you should be concerned with, Newtons laws of gravitation do not account for gravitational lensing.

[spunnery]

But that's just a change in refractive index, how can you apply the same principle to, for example, gamma ray bursts ? Also, I don't understand your point with Issac Newton was a genius... it's contempary physics you should be concerned with, Newtons laws of gravitation do not account for gravitational lensing.

sorry I used the term reflection instead of refraction.

why not? visible and non visible part of the spectrum should behave same to gravity or refraction or reflection .

Can you please let me know how many equations based on GR is being used for orbital calculation of satelites.Do you know still newton's gravitational equations are being used in these sort of calculations? Newtons law of gravitation cannot explain gravitational lensing because ,may be as i said this phenomenon is occured due to atmosphere.

[Royston]

why not? visible and non visible part of the spectrum should behave same to gravity or refraction or reflection .

Can you please let me know how many equations based on GR is being used for orbital calculation of satelites.Do you know still newton's gravitational equations are being used in these sort of calculations? Newtons law of gravitation cannot explain gravitational lensing because ,may be as i said this phenomenon is occured due to atmosphere

 

You only need to use equations concerning GR, where there's the speed of light to worry about e.g GPS, so calculating orbits of objects, Newtons Laws suffice, that doesn't mean it's the 'last word' in gravity, it's just an approximation.

[spunnery]

You only need to use equations concerning GR, where there's the speed of light to worry about e.g GPS, so calculating orbits of objects, Newtons Laws suffice, that doesn't mean it's the 'last word' in gravity, it's just an approximation.

I have given you reply about what you have mentioned as contemporary science.newton is not the final word nor Einsterin

[Royston]

I have given you reply about what you have mentioned as contemporary science.newton is not the final word nor Einsterin

 

I never said they were

[insane_alien]

okay, reflection would look very very different to refraction and would produce poor quality images seeing as gasses aren't going to stay in the necessary shape for ver long or have it be good enough to act as a lens. also, the density would have to be at least a few trillion times greater and be composed entirely of metallic components. smooth and shiny metallic components at that.

 

all in all, general relativity predicted it quite nicely before it was observed. also, if it was a gas (reflected or refracted) we would see a lot of absorbtion lines in different quantities than we would expect for normal star emissions.

[swansont]

Newtons law of gravitation cannot explain gravitational lensing because ,may be as i said this phenomenon is occured due to atmosphere.

 

Feel free to do the calculations necessary to back this up.

[merlin wood]

Whether all of the observed cosmic lensing is due to gravity depends on whether you believe in dark matter.

 

Galaxies have been found to produce lensing that is consiistent with their possessing no dark matter halo.

 

Is there another kind of causation that produces lensing apart from gravity. I;ve found reasons to believe that there is and that explains how galaxies foemed in the fist place, as well as the rapid orbital motion of stars round spiral galaxies.

[merlin wood]

Whether all of the observed cosmic lensing is due to gravity depends on whether you believe in dark matter.

 

Galaxies have been found to produce lensing that is consiistent with their possessing no dark matter halo.

 

Is there another kind of causation that produces lensing apart from gravity. I've found reasons to believe that there is, and that also explains how galaxies formed in the first place, as well as the rapid orbital motion of stars rond spiral galaxies.