Can space "fake" gravity?

[Daecon]

If gravity is caused by matter warping space instead of matter generating Gravitons, could a ripple in the fabric or space (that isn't caused by matter interacting with space) create the same effect as gravity?

 

Of course the nature and cause of these ripples (if they were to exist) would have nothing to do with any effects they may have.

[RyanJ]

If gravity is caused by matter warping space instead of matter generating Gravitons, could a ripple in the fabric or space (that isn't caused by matter interacting with space) create the same effect as gravity?

 

Of course the nature and cause of these ripples (if they were to exist) would have nothing to do with any effects they may have.

 

That's exactly what relativity says happens! Interestingly what you've described above seems very similar to a speculated phenomenon called gravitational waves, these would be produced when say two neutron stars collide with one and other (among other things). These however have not yet been observed.

 

For the record I don't think that relativity actually says anything about the carrier particle that would transmit the effect gravity. The graviton is another thing that has yet to be observed.

[swansont]

It's not an either/or situation. GR is a classical representation, that discusses warping. Gravitons are the proposed quantum force-carrier. Analogous to whether electrodynamic interactions are being caused by E or M fields, as opposed to photon exchange.

[Norman Albers]

As I modelled them, photons have transverse as well as longitudinal-scalar modes.

[tim™]

I'm certainly hoping the upcoming CERN LHC/Atlas/Hadron colliders give some evidence of the graviton.

 

It's a big long, but a good explanation if you're looking for a visual.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpbGuuGosAY

[Daecon]

I don't believe gravity is a "transmittable" force, rather an inherent property in the structure of space.

 

I hope it can be conclusively proven one way or another, although I'm aware if no gravitons are detected it's not conclusive proof they don't exist...

 

My original posting was going to lead into a question about Dark Matter, if it can only be "detected" by gravity, what would distinguish it from a gravity-faking space ripple that has no mass causing it?

[swansont]

My original posting was going to lead into a question about Dark Matter, if it can only be "detected" by gravity, what would distinguish it from a gravity-faking space ripple that has no mass causing it?

 

If it wasn't distinguishable from the effects of mass, then we'd call it mass. How could we tell if it wasn't? If it wasn't mass, then the theory would eventually be amended to include whatever property the dark matter had, much like particle physics has done (e.g. color force, isospin)

[Daecon]

I'm not sure if I worded it clearly. I mean what if dark matter isn't "matter" at all, but just a ripple in space. From what I understand of dark matter, the only indication of it's existence is it's gravitational effect...?

[swansont]

I'm not sure if I worded it clearly. I mean what if dark matter isn't "matter" at all, but just a ripple in space. From what I understand of dark matter, the only indication of it's existence is it's gravitational effect...?

 

How are the two situations distinguishable?

[Daecon]

Well is dark matter believed to be some strange and unusual physical substance that absorbs all forms of EM radiation without emitting anything in exchange?

[insane_alien]

Well is dark matter believed to be some strange and unusual physical substance that absorbs all forms of EM radiation without emitting anything in exchange?

 

no, i think its believed to not interact with light at all, hence why we have difficulty seeing it.