Pangloss Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Good points, IMO. I'm still not convinced on the hate crimes for speech point that you raised, but I thought it was interesting and I see your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Hanging nooses from a tree is not illegal. Beating people is. I think the noose incident creates a hostile environment, and should have been dealt with. Oh, wait — it was. Those students were suspended. It sounds like a complete non-sequitur to the case at hand, meant to make the prosecution appear racist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Why isn't hanging a noose from a tree a hate crime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoiA Posted September 28, 2007 Author Share Posted September 28, 2007 Why isn't hanging a noose from a tree a hate crime? Because it has to be a crime first, before you can make it a "hate" crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Does it? I don't know that to be the case, and I'm not convinced they didn't commit a regular crime, either. How about littering? I ask again: Why isn't hanging a noose from a tree a hate crime? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisyphus Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Seems like hate littering to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoiA Posted September 28, 2007 Author Share Posted September 28, 2007 Does it? I don't know that to be the case, and I'm not convinced they didn't commit a regular crime, either. How about littering? I ask again: Why isn't hanging a noose from a tree a hate crime? How is hanging a rope a crime? Does it have to be a noose? And when does it become a noose rather than a loop for me to hold onto (with my hands) and swing with? It requires historical reference and interpretation in order to find offense, so how is it a violation of anyone's rights? And not to mention the noose is a useful tool. Not just for hanging people. Also, it's not illegal to be racist. It's not illegal to express racism either. I'm not fond of anyone exercising this particular set of rights, but we have to be consistent here, and tolerant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pangloss Posted September 29, 2007 Share Posted September 29, 2007 You think it takes that much logic to contruct grounds for a hate crime, ParanoiA? Seriously? That's entirely my point -- hate crimes legislation defies common sense. This situation is teaching us how stupid those laws are, and we're not showing any sign at the moment that we're going to learn the lesson this time around either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecoli Posted September 29, 2007 Share Posted September 29, 2007 You think it takes that much logic to contruct grounds for a hate crime, ParanoiA? Seriously? That's entirely my point -- hate crimes legislation defies common sense. especially considering many racist believe that their racism is rational and logical. I'm sure the more educated ones will try and use logic to justify it. It's not much hate, but a whole lot of ignorance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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