rigadin Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 I would want if you guys can tell me whyand how do forces occur?? Thanks:doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvp45 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Forces are, after all's said and done, only a description of what actually happens. You can do all of Physics without the concept of force; it's just easier to use that idea at first. My advice - just accept them and use them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaynos Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 By forces do you mean something like a ball being pushed, or the 4 fundemental forces? And tvp45 for ALOT (if not nearly all) mechanics problems not using forces normally works out easier (reduces the complexity of the differential equations that need to be solved)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meir Achuz Posted November 3, 2007 Share Posted November 3, 2007 I would want if you guys can tell me whyand how do forces occur??Thanks:doh: Forces are useful concepts in statics problems and were historically important in Newtonian mechanics, but using force in relativistic or quantum mechnics is confusing, and generally avoided. The concept of force is ambiguous in relativity and QM, often being used incorrectly if tried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rigadin Posted November 6, 2007 Author Share Posted November 6, 2007 Forces are, after all's said and done, only a description of what actually happens. You can do all of Physics without the concept of force; it's just easier to use that idea at first. My advice - just accept them and use them. But my teacher asked me to find out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severian Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Tell your teacher that forces are a consequence of insisting that the universe be symmetric under the local transformations of particular Lie groups. Ask your teacher to explain that statement in detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajb Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 Nice way of putting it Severian! If he is looking at the "fundamental forces". I expect that rigadin teacher is after an explanation of forces in the "Newtonian" sense. So, rate of "change of momentum". Or maybe he is looking for "generalised forces" in the Lagrangian formalism. But then what school teacher knows about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedarkshade Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 I would want if you guys can tell me whyand how do forces occur??Thanks:doh: My definition of force is "a change in inertial state"! Because bodies are in inertial state when nothing acts on them, so a change on that state is actually a force! And yet an easier definition of force (on a book I've read) is "force is a push or a pull"! And they're physicists who wrote that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klaynos Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 When I was young... (around 10) I was taught by a "physics teacher" that a force is a pull, push or a twist (which can be considered a combination of the former 2).... Now I'm not young I know differently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swansont Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 My definition of force is "a change in inertial state"! Because bodies are in inertial state when nothing acts on them, so a change on that state is actually a force! But which is the cause and which the effect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frost Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 But which is the cause and which the effect? The cause is the force acting on the body and the effect is the change of inertial state! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riogho Posted November 11, 2007 Share Posted November 11, 2007 What is the force that causes subatomic particles to be in constant motion, you know the fact that atoms are always moving, and stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insane_alien Posted November 11, 2007 Share Posted November 11, 2007 What is the force that causes subatomic particles to be in constant motion, you know the fact that atoms are always moving, and stuff theres no force causing that. you might want to look up 'momentum' and newtons laws of motion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brainfart94 Posted November 11, 2007 Share Posted November 11, 2007 The cause is the force acting on the body and the effect is the change of inertial state! What rigadin is trying to ask is what causes the force, rather than what it does, and since every force is a result of another force in some way, you could follow a whole chain of different forces that would eventually lead you back to the first force in the universe: the Big Bang. But then that raises your question even further; how the heck did that force occur? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Encrypted Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 God? *Runs away and prepares a bunker against anti-religious misiles"* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ydoaPs Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 Forces are, after all's said and done, only a description of what actually happens. Isn't all of science just a description of what actually happens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedarkshade Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 Isn't all of science just a description of what actually happens? It's a bit more I think! It's knowing why they happen and making them happen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMongoose Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 Why they happen is theology and making them happen is engineering. Whether engineering is science is doubtful (say's an ashamed engineer). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedarkshade Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 Why they happen is theology and making them happen is engineering. Whether engineering is science is doubtful (say's an ashamed engineer). But ain't engineering a product of science? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMongoose Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 The way I do it is, but it seems im surrounded by people who prefer to bodge stuff and fix it later. I think they all wanted to be car mechanics but with a bigger paycheck, then started crying when they realised they'd have to do some maths. Nothing wrong with mechanics but I'm sure if they'd designed my pedestal it'd be too weak or overpriced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedarkshade Posted November 18, 2007 Share Posted November 18, 2007 ... but it seems im surrounded by people who prefer to bodge stuff and fix it later. Looks like everywhere is the same situation:doh: . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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