Questions regarding genetic engineering as a hobby.

[Dr. Jekyll]

I wonder how much it would cost, approximately, to set up an own "hobby lab" for genetic engineering? Of course I'm not aiming for high-end stuff, but good enough for constructing simple recombinant DNA & insert it into a living cell, perform microinjections, etc.

 

A suitable microinjection-kit seems to be way cheaper than I imagined. I figured it would cost around $15000-$20000 atleast, but for $1500-$2000 you can get quite good things, specially when considering second hand apparatus. Though micropipette pullers are quite expensive, but I've seen a few cheap ones on labx.com. Perhaps you can make them by yourself, trial & error with a burner and glass pipette?

 

However, how often is microinjection used to insert recombinant DNA or any genetic material into a cell? The usage of bacteria (plasmids), and virus, as a carrier seems way more commonly used.

 

PCR-apparatus comes quite cheap, from what I've seen.

 

The big money sinks, which are they?

 

As I said, I don't have in mind to set up a high-tech lab, if I ever will set up one. As an example of my approach: Autoclav is needed, but beggars can't be choosers so I figure a steam boiler and microwave owen will do the trick! But I've seen quite cheap second hand autoclavs from, e.g., veterinarians and tattoers.

 

Now, understand that I am a scientist (mathematics), a layman in this branch of science. The past few years I have become more and more interested in biochemistry/molecular biology. I am seriously thinking about taking a few years off and start studying molecular biology. I took a few basic chemistry courses last year to "try out" how it feels to study again; it only spurred me more.

 

I expect to be corrected on several points, but not with a typical one-liner "it just can't be done without $1000000!" from some under graduate, self proclaimed besserwisser, lacking the tiniest bit of creativity, who never thought outside of any box.

 

So, do we have any hobby genetic engineers here or don't we?

[NeonBlack]

You'll probably also want a centifuge, microscopes, a refridgerator, an incubator, which you could probably make, glassware and chemicals.

In other words, it's not going to be cheap.

 

If you are an undergrad, I reccommend getting a job in a lab at your school. They will probably let you use it for your own research when you are not working.

[ecoli]

Exactly what kind of work or experiment did you have in mind? You'd need different equipment and reagents for protein work than for DNA...

 

Also, there's legal issues here. You don't want the FBI thinking you have a drug lab.

[Dr. Jekyll]

You'll probably also want a centifuge, microscopes, a refridgerator, an incubator, which you could probably make, glassware and chemicals.

In other words, it's not going to be cheap.

 

Yes, indeed. However, those equipment are not in the division of ten thousand dollars per item. I mean, a suitable microscope for hooking up a micromanipulator can be found for $400-$500; from what I've seen. Sure, it aint gonna be cheap when summing it up all together.

 

But like most niched areas, chemistry seems filled with "over the top"-gadgets, expensive apparatures and equipment that can indeed be substituted with a bit of creativity. Need a refridgerator or heat incubator, come on; you really need to pay out a couple of $1000 for that? Sure, you will suffer in accuracy and success rate by using "K-Mart stuff" (exaggerated), but beggers cant be choosers .

 

I don't mind buying apparature for $500-$1000 dollars here and there. As long as it is not approaching $10000+ for any specific apparature.

 

If you are an undergrad, I reccommend getting a job in a lab at your school. They will probably let you use it for your own research when you are not working.

Actually I'm a PhD, but not in this area, sadly! I'm working fulltime and doing 25% research on the side. But yes, in the sence of biochemistry I am an undergrad.

 

Exactly what kind of work or experiment did you have in mind? You'd need different equipment and reagents for protein work than for DNA...

 

Also, there's legal issues here. You don't want the FBI thinking you have a drug lab.

A very good question! Actually, I dont really know what I want to to in detail since I do not possess any deeper knowledge. But I would like to experiment with genetic manipulation in my cellar! I really don't have a plan for what I would like to do in detail. I'm just curious and love trial & error research .

[ecoli]

In that case, you'll probably want a thermocycler and gel electrophoresis kit.

 

If you want to save money, you could go around to the biology departments and try to buy their old equipment.

[Dr. Jekyll]

In that case, you'll probably want a thermocycler and gel electrophoresis kit.

 

If you want to save money, you could go around to the biology departments and try to buy their old equipment.

 

That is for separating the proteins right?

 

I understand this thread seems stupid, indeed. But I'm about to quit my job for making a "dream come true," so to speak. Ask yourself, how much did you know about biochem, cell chemistry, etc., when you started studying? I am at that point, but I have a solid education in mathematics and physics; i.e, I'm not a nut case though it might seem like that. I'm just another mad scientist.

[Mr Skeptic]

I understand this thread seems stupid, indeed.

 

Actually, I think it is a good one. I'd bet several here would be interested in doing some "mad scientist" work if it were cheap enough.

[ecoli]

That is for separating the proteins right?

There's different types... SDS-PAGE is for proteins. You'd want an agarose gel kit for separating DNA fragments.

I understand this thread seems stupid, indeed.

not at all.

 

Actually, I think it is a good one. I'd bet several here would be interested in doing some "mad scientist" work if it were cheap enough.

oh hell yes.

[iNow]

Actually, I think it is a good one. I'd bet several here would be interested in doing some "mad scientist" work if it were cheap enough.

 

oh hell yes.

 

Is the the triplicate of "ditto," ... "tritto?"

[CharonY]

Well your OP is a bit vague in what you want to do. So I just assume you want to make a simple experiment involving bacteria (that is the cheapest way).

So it splits up into the following areas:

 

Cell incubation and harvesting: you got to grow your cells. An incubator that actually holds the temp is not that cheap, roughly you got to invest at least 2000$. I am not including running costs of the media. If you want to make it on your own, you need a way to sterilize it. Otherwise buy premade media (kinda expensive, though). You need at least a microcentrifuge at various points. Uncooled ones start at around 3000$.

 

Make recombinate DNA: cheapest way is to amplify a gene and clone it into a vector. For this you need a thermo cycler (~5000), an electrophoresis system (to check the DNA) consisting of a chamber and a power unit (~1000, cheaper if you build the units yourself).

 

Introduce DNA into the cell: one the easiest way for you would be to buy competent cells. They are kind of expensive, but then you do not need an electroporation system or a cooling centrifuge (~7000$). You have to decide whether you prefer high initial or running costs.

 

Finally you need a pipetting system and all the consumables (including chemicals and kits). In real labs the latter is often the costliest part.

[Dr. Jekyll]

Well your OP is a bit vague in what you want to do. So I just assume you want to make a simple experiment involving bacteria (that is the cheapest way).

So it splits up into the following areas:

 

Cell incubation and harvesting: you got to grow your cells. An incubator that actually holds the temp is not that cheap, roughly you got to invest at least 2000$. I am not including running costs of the media. If you want to make it on your own, you need a way to sterilize it. Otherwise buy premade media (kinda expensive, though). You need at least a microcentrifuge at various points. Uncooled ones start at around 3000$.

 

Make recombinate DNA: cheapest way is to amplify a gene and clone it into a vector. For this you need a thermo cycler (~5000), an electrophoresis system (to check the DNA) consisting of a chamber and a power unit (~1000, cheaper if you build the units yourself).

 

Introduce DNA into the cell: one the easiest way for you would be to buy competent cells. They are kind of expensive, but then you do not need an electroporation system or a cooling centrifuge (~7000$). You have to decide whether you prefer high initial or running costs.

 

Finally you need a pipetting system and all the consumables (including chemicals and kits). In real labs the latter is often the costliest part.

 

Thanks for a very informative post! The approximate costs you presented sums up to something kinda frightening, for a hobby. Since I've found quite cheaper apparatus by googling around, I'm not ready to kill my darlings just yet!

 

I've started to make list of "neccessary apparatus," which I will post in this thread with links and prices and I will update it as I progress. Since I'm a newbie in this area I would be very glad for any contributions, ideas to substitute expensive apparatus with low-end technology and any feedback.

 

Autoclavs: ~$300 An ordinary steam boiler and a microwave oven.

 

Incubators: ~$350 (£180) http://www.laboratorytalk.com/news/eot/eot101.html

 

Microcentrifuges: ~$250 Revolutionary Science Microcentrifuge, 110V #RS-102

 

Thermal cyclers: $2000 EdvoCycler

 

Electrophoresis units + power supply: $200 + $520 = $720. BIOWORLD EP500 and EC EC250-90. Bloody hell, should it be so expensive to get a simple cheap power supply? I have to look into this.

 

Electroporators: $2000 EW-36205-00

-------

Current sum: $5620.

 

These are "kinda :-)" low-end stuff I figure, but still they should be usable for simple genetic manipulation? I have not considered second-hand apparatus from, e.g., http://www.labx.com. There, and at a few other lab-sales portals, it seems you can do some real nice deals on more high end apparatus. But I have no experience in that area, so to be consistent I leave them out of my calculations.

 

I have not looked into the djungle regarding different enzyms, agarose gels and buffers etc. needed, but I will try my best to get a fair picture of it along with other apparatus (and their accessories) needed.

 

As I said, contributions, feedback, comments and opinions (anything!) are most welcome.

[Paralith]

You're also going to need pipettes. The ones we use in my lab are $300 a pop, and you'll need at least a few sizes (10 ul, 200 ul, and 100 ul, I would say).

 

The reagents themselves will get expensive, and you will have to continually replace any consumables as you use them. Tips for the pipettes will be about $50 per case (has ten boxes), more if you want filtered tips which are a good idea if you're working with bacteria, to prevent contamination. A 100 g bottle of pure agarose to make electrophoresis gels with is over $100. PCR reagents, media, petri dishes, tubes of various sizes, TBE, antibiotics, etc etc. It tends to add up. Just keep that in mind.

 

Not to mention the fact that PCR reagents (at least the polymerase enzyme) need to be kept at -20 degrees C, and if you buy competent bacterial cells (for transformation aka plasmid uptake) they need to be stored at -80 degrees C until they are used. So you'll need some heavy duty freezers. And probably a bunsen burner to help keep the area sterile when you're working with your bacteria plates.

[h2so4hurts]

You want to set up your own home lab?? Why? If you're already in academics why don't you find someone at your school with a real lab or ask a University professor for some bench space. I have 3 undergrads in my lab and they're ALL worthless. I'm sure you wouldn't be much worse than them

[Gyrase]

One thing that I wonder is if someone dose a research work in such a home-laboratory and reach a very interesting results, can he publish it by his own name? I mean all articles usually associated to some universities, labs. Do journals publish result of a scientific work done in home-lab?

[ecoli]

One thing that I wonder is if someone dose a research work in such a home-laboratory and reach a very interesting results, can he publish it by his own name? I mean all articles usually associated to some universities, labs. Do journals publish result of a scientific work done in home-lab?

There's no policy against it, as far as I know. It's just that, who has the resources to do that?

[Mr Skeptic]

One thing that I wonder is if someone dose a research work in such a home-laboratory and reach a very interesting results, can he publish it by his own name? I mean all articles usually associated to some universities, labs. Do journals publish result of a scientific work done in home-lab?

 

Well, newspapers really like reporting certain things that were done in a home lab. Eg the "nuclear boyscout".

[CharonY]

Well, a private lab might face more scrutiny in the "professional" world. One should consider, however that certain genetic manipulations might fall under certain safety regulations. So you might have to register your lab officially somewhere.