Structure and Information

[stevo247]

Does the molecular structure of a mineral express a "form" of information? If so, is crystallization a transfer of that information?

[thedarkshade]

Does the molecular structure of a mineral express a "form" of information? If so, is crystallization a transfer of that information?

I'm not sure if I follow here but the structure of any mineral expresses some things like: type of the bond, the angel of bonding, hardness of the substance, single double of triple bond (in the case of covalent bonds), why is an allotrope (in the case of allotropic modification) etc.

 

Then judging by the structure you can why some substances are conductive and some other not, why are they stable or not stable, understand the features and a lot more!

 

If this doesn't apply to your question, just ignore it!

 

Cheers!

[stevo247]

I think I’m trying to get a handle on what "information” is. I tried dissecting the word and found that “inform, comes (via French) from the Latin verb informare, to give form to.” I started thinking about crystals and what would be considered the “information” involved in the structure. I thought that maybe the molecular structure would be considered the source of the crystals “information system” and that crystal growth would be some sort of transfer of information. Then I started thinking about snowflakes, and the diversity of form that is built on a rather simple molecular structure.

 

Today I learned that information is physical. Apparently, there is no such thing as disembodied information. Information is relational, in that it has to do with the relationship of the parts of a system to each other. Information is also fungible. I think that means that information can be transformed.

 

This whole idea of “information” and the transfer of information is very new to me. I’m trying to develop some kind of understanding of the nature of information. I just thought that crystals were a good place to start.

[thedarkshade]

Today I learned that information is physical.

Not really! The information is not physical itself, but the source of information is! I mean, if you start to study the molecular structure of any substance, you find really find any information 'stored' there, you get the information about that specific substance by the characteristics it has, the interactions it does, the way it behaves in different conditions. There is no 'smart center' in the molecular structure which would contain all the informations about that specific substance. It is the features that it has, that make you possible to get informations about it.

 

An information is a data, an important of a non-important one. You can derive informations for literally everything, by just observing, experimenting, and studying it.

 

And yeah, structure would be a nice place to start. Find out how it is, what it is and then move to how it interacts!

 

Cheers!

[stevo247]

I see what your saying and I appreciate your input. It helps me to clarify my own question to myself.

 

What is the role of "information" (that slippery something) in the determination of the thing itself? For example, a snowflake. All snowflakes have a hexagonal basic shape determined by the molecular structure of ice. So there is a fundamental form or structure. Due to the temperature and the humidity and the way the flake tumbles through the air etc.; the particular form of the individual snowflake is crystallized. So in the production and formation of a single snowflake, is the concept of information involved? I was thinking that perhaps the molecular structure was some kind of blueprint that manifested structure as it interacted with the environment.

 

Since the idea of information appears to be significantly involved in the development and activity of biological processes (DNA, neurons, etc.), I thought that maybe I could take a look at crystallization for clues about the nature of information processing.

[thedarkshade]

What is the role of "information" (that slippery something) in the determination of the thing itself? For example, a snowflake. All snowflakes have a hexagonal basic shape determined by the molecular structure of ice. So there is a fundamental form or structure. Due to the temperature and the humidity and the way the flake tumbles through the air etc.; the particular form of the individual snowflake is crystallized. So in the production and formation of a single snowflake, is the concept of information involved? I was thinking that perhaps the molecular structure was some kind of blueprint that manifested structure as it interacted with the environment.

You mean like there's something that carries the information of how a snowflake is formed? Not really! The snowflake production happens by going through a series of processes in specific conditions.

 

Since the idea of information appears to be significantly involved in the development and activity of biological processes (DNA, neurons, etc.), I thought that maybe I could take a look at crystallization for clues about the nature of information processing.

Aaah, so this is what you you mean. Like there might me something that informs in the production of a snowflake (e.g.) like the RNAi informs ribosomes what proteins to make. Well, I don't know! But probably not! I mean, in protein synthesis RNAi tells exactly what aminoacids should be bonded together, how many of them etc., but on the other side when a snowflake is produced there really isn't really anything 'telling' to decrease the temperature so the snowflake can be made. The production happens only due to being in the right conditions for that action to take place!