What do you make of this ?

[Royston]

I was watching BBC breakfast this morning, where a Dad and his daughter who suffers from Down Syndrome were in the studio. The topic, was these new 'Down Syndrome Dolls' see the official website below.

I'll be perfectly honest, I can't put into words what to make of this, my first thoughts were it was some twisted joke, and although I love dark humour, the fact that the sentiment behind making these dolls is maybe sincere, it seems terribly misguided, and well, a bit wrong. The Dad and the daughter on the show, were equally bewildered, and just couldn't see the benefit.

Thoughts...is this some rather bizarre joke ?

For example, can you honestly imagine a child with severe Psoriasis playing with a doll whose skin flakes off at the touch of a button. I can think of many other examples, but I'm interested what people make of this...not, who can think of the poorest taste in children’s toys.

 

http://www.downsyndromedolls.com/

[Phi for All]

Psoriasis clears up. Down syndrome doesn't. I see it as an attempt to show a Downs child that they're people too, and that there are dolls out there that resemble them.

 

Have you ever seen the comedian Carlos Mencia make fun of people with Cerebral Palsy? He rags on everyone, so why should they be different? Some of the CP people find it offensive, but most don't, probably about the same ratio as all the other ethnic, gender and social groups he makes fun of. Many appreciate the fact that he sees them like he sees everyone else, like people.

[CDarwin]

I get the idea. If you're a kid and all the dolls you can get are of "normal" children, they would seem to just be more evidence that you're "abnormal." At least I would imagine that's the theory.

[Royston]

I see it as an attempt to show a Downs child that they're people too, and that there are dolls out there that resemble them.

 

Well obviously that's what they're trying to do. Perhaps I didn't make my point clear. The idea backfires, because they've created 'stereotypical' Downs children dolls, which is just patronizing...this isn't some ideal they're trying to emulate like Barbie.

 

It just reminded me of something you'd see on a satirical news programme, or perhaps something a media student would concoct for shock value. The fact it was aimed as a sincere gesture, makes it all the more twisted. I know perfectly well, that's not the intention, but I thought it was quite interesting. The dolls really are, incredibly tacky, and at $ 49.99, just seems to add to the insult.

[Phi for All]

Well obviously that's what they're trying to do. Perhaps I didn't make my point clear. The idea backfires, because they've created 'stereotypical' Downs children dolls, which is just patronizing...this isn't some ideal they're trying to emulate like Barbie.

Stereotyping to some degree is inevitable when you're emulating a phenotype for use in a doll. Is it the "tongue-out" that bothers you? Not all Downs kids do that, but not all the dolls did either.

 

It just reminded me of something you'd see on a satirical news programme, or perhaps something a media student would concoct for shock value. The fact it was aimed as a sincere gesture, makes it all the more twisted.

I didn't get that at all, maybe because my daughter has karate classes with a boy with Downs, known him and his family since she was in pre-school. I don't think Drew's parents would see it as shocking or twisted and Drew himself might even get a kick out of it (he's still young enough to where a boy having a doll isn't that big a deal).

 

The dolls really are, incredibly tacky, and at $ 49.99, just seems to add to the insult.

They looked pretty cute to me. And try producing dolls like that in limited quantities, it gets expensive. They're probably buying regular doll clothes and marking them up too, that adds to the cost. $50 is more than I'd want to spend on a doll, I agree, but I'd look at it differently if my child's self-esteem were an issue.

[john5746]

I didn't like the tongue out thing myself, but then I don't have much experience with Downs. Other than that, seems OK to me. It makes dolls that look like them available, if they want them. If they don't like them, they don't buy them.

 

I guess if they sold like hotcakes everywhere and were being displayed all the time and it offended most of them, then that would be a different story.

[iNow]

Think about the kids without downs sydnrome using the dolls to make fun of others. We have a very inherent "us/them" mentality, and kids can be brutal.

[CDarwin]

Think about the kids without downs sydnrome using the dolls to make fun of others. We have a very inherent "us/them" mentality, and kids can be brutal.

 

Do kids use dolls to make fun of each other that much really? I can't imagine how a 10 year old would get a hold of one of these if his parents didn't buy it for him online. Now teenagers are a different issue.

[iNow]

Ah... I'm older than you. To me, there is no difference between the word kids and the word teenagers.

 

 

No offense.

[Royston]

Stereotyping to some degree is inevitable when you're emulating a phenotype for use in a doll. Is it the "tongue-out" that bothers you? Not all Downs kids do that, but not all the dolls did either.

 

I think it's because they're emulating a condition, rather than some stereotype superhero, or some childhood ideal such as a princess. The dolls don't bother me, in the sense, this is outrageous...they bother me in that I found them rather amusing. Not because, 'hey, look at the funny doll', but because they're trying to integrate Downs children by making obvious differences to the dolls. Whether a Downs child or the parents aren't bothered by this, is actually irrelevant, it's still patronizing...'hmmm, I think this doll needs a bigger forehead.'

 

I didn't get that at all, maybe because my daughter has karate classes with a boy with Downs, known him and his family since she was in pre-school. I don't think Drew's parents would see it as shocking or twisted and Drew himself might even get a kick out of it (he's still young enough to where a boy having a doll isn't that big a deal).

 

Well I had regular contact with my friends uncle who had Downs Syndrome as I grew up, and my Mum was a teacher for the mentally handicapped for many years, so maybe this is a case of cultural humour clash...not sure, although I think I've made a pigs ear in getting my point across. I've had a lot on my plate recently

 

They looked pretty cute to me. And try producing dolls like that in limited quantities, it gets expensive. They're probably buying regular doll clothes and marking them up too, that adds to the cost. $50 is more than I'd want to spend on a doll, I agree, but I'd look at it differently if my child's self-esteem were an issue.

 

Well, fair enough. Perhaps if I catch you on IRC in the near future, and I may have thought of a better way to articulate where I'm coming from with this, because I'm not sure how to further explain my point.

 

I guess if they sold like hotcakes everywhere and were being displayed all the time and it offended most of them, then that would be a different story.

 

I wasn't intending to make a big issue out of the dolls, because they're not, it's just that I can see a number of issues surrounding this method of trying to integrate, which I was trying to explore, but in a rather clumsy manner, it seems.

Edited June 27, 2008 by Snail
multiple post merged

[Sayonara]

I understand the point of the dolls, but I don't get why each doll has a bizarre quote next to it, like:

 

Flowers and animals is what I enjoy painting in Northern Europe.

 

That particular doll is described as "She is our beautiful blonde Friend with blue eyes". O----kay.

 

They all seem to be described as being from "Eastern Europe", or "Northern Europe" (except for one which is from a Bavarian Forest, wtf?). Europia must be where all the Downs' Syndrome kids are coming from.

[john5746]

I wasn't intending to make a big issue out of the dolls, because they're not, it's just that I can see a number of issues surrounding this method of trying to integrate, which I was trying to explore, but in a rather clumsy manner, it seems.

 

On the contrary, I think it is a good topic for discussion. In this case, I can see where it would bother some - the tongue bothered me.