In need of encouragement.

[MicroGirl]

Hi everyone ,

 

Ive come to the forum looking for some encouragement from all my fellow scientists. Im a university Microbiology honours student that has been having a few troubles with her project. Every time i try to do an experiment, it fails and i have to do it again and again to get it to work. I tend to make allot of stupid mistakes and ask allot of stupid questions and at the moment i feel like a real idiot . Im really afraid that i wont get my project done in time for me to write my thesis as i am hoping to get a 1st class honours so that i can apply for a PhD scholarship.

 

I was just looking for some words of encouragement and/or advice to help me get through this difficult year.

[Glider]

I'm not being patronising, but it depends what you mean by 'fail'. Here I'm talking about one particular possibility and it's an error that my students sometimes make.

 

When running experiments for course work, some of them obtain null results. Then, when they write-up, they spend a lot of time in the discussion criticising the methodology and trying to present reasons why their experiment 'failed'.

 

This is because they got fixated on finding an effect (or correlation or difference, whatever they were looking for), and anything other than that must be a failure and due to some flaw in the experiment.

 

I have to explain that an experiment is essentially a question and it has two possible answers (yes or no). It never pays to get too invested in a particular answer (usually 'yes') as neither answer is intrinsically more valuable than the other. Both are answers and, as long as the methodology is sound, either answer has value.

 

By failing to accept the 'no' answer (null result), they end up arguing for a type two error in their report (i.e. 'an effect really does exist, but this experiment was too flawed to find it'). This is a fatal mistake, because they are arguing for an effect for which they have no evidence, and they are trashing their own experiment in writing. The first is very bad science and the second is just foolish.

 

I have to remind them that a null result is still a result and just as valuable in principle as a significant result (albeit harder to publish) because science is about finding true (i.e. valid and reliable) answers, not about finding the answers we'd like, and as long as the methodology is sound and they write it up appropriately, then they have successfully achieved the object of the exercise and will be marked accordingly. You don't get lower marks for a null result.

 

However, this is in Psychology. Your issue in microbiology might be completely different, e.g. some practical problem, like not being able to get some culture to grow, in which case I apologise for appearing patronising, but I thought I'd just cover this one possibility as it seems to come up quite frequently.

 

I do think you need to explain exactly what is 'failing' though. It might help others in their responses to you.

Edited September 26, 2008 by Glider

[YT2095]

there is no such thing as a "Failed" experiment, only more data.

[Klaynos]

there is no such thing as a "Failed" experiment, only more data.

 

Unless part of the kit doesn't work...

 

I spent a long long time trying to work out why a spectrometer gave discontinuous results, which moved...

 

It ended up with the spectrometer on a floating table, in the dark with no one allowed to touch the table...

 

But it was the software doing some "matching" between different frames (it scanned accross a ccd), there was nothing I could do to change this and as it moved where the discontinuities every time it meant that anything we were looking for might be lost in one of them (as we had to compare different scans)... So sometimes experiements don't work...

 

I know that most of my friends for their masters projects spent most of the 2 years trying to just get the experiment to produce reproducible results....

 

In what way does it fail? Is it a null result or does something just not grow or similar?

[MicroGirl]

Thank you everyone for your responces, its nice to know that people out there are willing to give support. When i mean 'fail' I mean my experiment didnt work...not a 'negative' result but wasnt sucessfull. For example im trying to build a clone library. its the first time ive ever done one. I did the ligation and transformation and plated the cells out only to find very few colonies growning, not enough for me to build a clone library from. Also i just make silly mistakes, wich i know i should'nt get too upset over...but i think its because i care and try so hard that i end up making these mistakes. (like over diluting my oglionucliotide primers by 100 times by using the wrong measurment on a pippett). They are mistakes i KNOW not to do but i do them. Its not that im careless....Because i care and worry so much. My supervisor says that i stress too much. So i guess i have to try and relax a bit.

 

What im really worried about is getting some results to talk about in my thesis. As an Honurs student i only have 1 year to complete a project and talk about it. I feel that i have been given quite a challenging project to complete in 1 year...mostly due to my inexperience in the lab.

 

Thank you all for your replies keep them comming!

[CharonY]

There are failures and then they are failures.

 

If you tend to do mistakes in your experiments, then slow down, write up every single step and before you do anything look at the protocol you wrote up (use colour if you must). Except for time critical steps that is.

 

Transformation of ligations are always hit and miss. Later on, you talk about what you finally got. Sounds simple but that is that. You cannot worry about data you do not have yet. Concentrate on getting things done first. I have to remind you that certain kinds of experiments may also fail (unfortunately clone libraries are one of them) even if everything is done correctly. So in order to be able to troubleshoot you have got to get to the point that you follow protocols 100%. And then you can start to vary them.

 

But rest assured, in biological (esp. basic reseach) areas it is not uncommon that experiments fail. Enzymes may die, there may be smallish but fatal fluctuations in your equipment, room temperature, intrinsic fickleness of cells/tissues/rats/dinosaurs/cauliflower...

 

Working in a biological lab is much about frustration management. But again, first get proficient in conducting the experiments. Only after that worry about results.

[iNow]

Most of the time, mistakes and unexpected results in an experiment are the best thing that can happen to you. That's when you learn the most about what's actually happening.

[YT2095]

it sounds like all you need is some extra Lab time, to improve on your skills and familiarity with the equipment, getting comfortable being in a lab environment.

 

I`m the other end of the spectrum, I`d sooner be in a Lab and skip the paperwork stuff

[CharonY]

Ah yeah. Quite understandable. I wish I had a ghostwriter.

[pioneer]

To help avoid the mistakes, you might write down your procedures like a recipe in a cookbook. Then gather all your ingredients and tools needed and then follow your own procedure in a simulated run. Maybe before you go to the lab go through the procedures in your mind sort of like a simulation and picture the results always coming out the way you want them to. After this mental preparation go to the lab.

 

As far as growing life, some people have a green thumb or in this case a slimy thumb. Remember it is life you are dealing with, so don't be afraid to act a little silly and talk to the bugs. I remember many years ago, I was given a project to grow anaerobic bacteria in an open 2M gallon pond with conditions that exceeded all the parameters of the bacteria. It was not suppose to work, because the pH was not under control, nitrates were at levels 10 times optimum, their were nasty heavy metals like lead, mercury to name a few, all types of chlorinated solvents plus no way to create anaerobic conditions since it was an open outdoor pond. I had to become a bug whisperer to even the odds. The bugs ended up not caring about the impossible and performed beyond expectations. All I am saying is treat the bugs like pets because it will make it more fun and bring out that maternal side of you that keep you aware of all the little details needed for their care. Right now your focus is elsewhere, and not on the immediate needs of the bugs. They need TLC.

[Monomer]

I tend to make lots of silly mistakes when I'm stressed, so you definitely need to learn to relax. If you want to get through your PhD and work in research you won't last too long and you won't get a good reference if you keep making silly mistakes.

 

I know the pressure is on for you this year, but take plenty of breaks, get lots of exercise, eat well, and make time for the things you enjoy.

 

Even though you have a difficult project to get through this will be a very valuable year and the experience will be incredibly beneficial. You don't have much lab experience, but everyone starts at that point. It's a steep learning curve but hopefully you'll find it quite rewarding.

[gary350]

You have not really failed, you just have not yet learned to do the work without making mistakes. Mistakes are how you learn. If you don't make mistakes you don't learn anything. People that never try never learn. It is very frustrating to make mistakes. I use to make so many mistakes I made really terrable grades in school. My mistakes were stupid mistakes. I finally learned to go slow, read questions several times, try and figure out what the question is asking very often some of the information in the problem has nothing to do with the problem, double check and triple check all my work. I got my Science grades up from a 30 to about 85 to 90 range just by being extra careful but still most of my trouble was goofy mistakes.

 

I had a math teacher once that make everyone do homework on 1/4 inch graph paper. You right the problems in the 1/4" squares then when you do the work make sure all the numbers are in the correct boxes. The graph paper kept everything lined up it was impossible to make a mistake. My math grades went from 20's to 90's.

 

I had the same problem in Physics class. I learned to go slow and take my time and triple check my work and my grades went from the 20 range to the 90 range here too.

 

It is so easy to make a simple mistake. I don't recall getting may 100s on any of my work. You have to develope your own methods of doing your work many people can give you ideas but you have to do what works best for you.