I'm ready to tell you my secret now...I see dumb people

[john5746]

To me, dumbness is a measure of how much one misunderestimates their own ignorance.

 

Yes, I included the Bush-ism for emphasis.

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

Well, by definition 50% of the population are of below average intelligence.

 

But if you compare IQ scores across generations, you'll find that newer generations are smarter... (or, at least, they do better on IQ tests)

[Mr Skeptic]

[some cynicism about young people]

 

I quite agree with you, that all the stuff they do for show (clothes, makeup, and slang-style speech) is really quite silly. That doesn't necessarily imply that they are stupid though. They are trying to fit in with or show off to their group, which is a valuable thing for them. Adults will do the same thing, too. The best example is called "keeping up with the Joneses" and requires them to have a huge house, and emerald lawn, and the biggest TV that they can't afford. Another thing I observed is that my grandma shops for fun; that is something I will never understand.

 

Some people are incurable socialites, and value others' perceptions of them far more than their own opinions. Other people are eccentrics, and they could care less what others think of them. Most people are in the middle ground, striking a good balance. Part of all this is genetically based. There is some value in both approaches, and also in the middle ground.

 

As for people who think ignorance is cool, that is only because they are ignorant of the value of knowledge. Probably the best way to discourage this is to give them unskilled labor type of jobs while they are still young. Enough to get a taste of how being dumb isn't really cool after all.

[ParanoiA]

Well, I did spend a bit of time poking on people and intelligence, but it's more about being frustrated with their priorities. It's not that I can't stand them because they wear stupid clothes, it's that I can't stand them because they are obsessed about their overpriced stupid clothes in a vacuum of ingratitude and total lack of appreciation for REAL LIFE.

 

I don't want to go off again, I don't have the energy for it, but it's the same old argument we've had for years - we're spoiled. Americans are spoiled babies and they bug me.

[Mr Skeptic]

Well, you can look at it differently too. According to the theory of evolution, us geeks are the big dummies because we care so much about knowledge instead of focusing on getting laid. Priority #1 is to pass on your genes.

 

Also, if we were too individualistic, our society would fall apart. People have to bend over a little if they are to work together.

[ParanoiA]

Well, you can look at it differently too. According to the theory of evolution, us geeks are the big dummies because we care so much about knowledge instead of focusing on getting laid. Priority #1 is to pass on your genes.

 

Also, if we were too individualistic, our society would fall apart. People have to bend over a little if they are to work together.

 

That's too funny, I was just saying something to that effect to my oldest. Like you say, it would certainly appear that intelligence isn't really an advantage. I mean, for the group, it can be, but for the individual nature would seem to care less.

 

I don't know how correct this is, but I told him I would think dumb people would procreate more, careless to control pregnancy and number of children, even in the face of hardship. Whereas more intelligent folk may be more thoughtful, try to protect against pregnancy, and take more care thinking ahead and limiting their number of children. My point at the time being that dumb people may be preferred by nature.(He's developing my attitude and I was trying to keep him centered...he mustn't invest in cynicism so early in life).

 

Also, if we're going to be all serious and super for real here...one's smarts isn't anymore their fault than one's stupidity. So, while we get pissy about stupid people, it's not like our smarts were "earned". That's not to be confused with intellectual laziness, which is what I think most americans are actually guilty of.

 

And Pangloss had the coolest augment to this with the reality that we old farts always bitch about the youth.

 

But for the purposes of my rant...they are stupid. All of them.

[Mr Skeptic]

That's too funny, I was just saying something to that effect to my oldest.

 

Well, you know how they say. Great minds think alike.

 

Also, if we're going to be all serious and super for real here...one's smarts isn't anymore their fault than one's stupidity. So, while we get pissy about stupid people, it's not like our smarts were "earned". That's not to be confused with intellectual laziness, which is what I think most americans are actually guilty of.

 

That's not completely true. While lots of your smarts are genetic, approximately half is due to nurture. Probably the best time to improve on your smarts is when you are very young, but you can increase your intelligence. The mind can be exercised, or rotted out. So some of the fault really does rest with the dumb people, but only a rather small portion.

 

And Pangloss had the coolest augment to this with the reality that we old farts always bitch about the youth.

 

Another one you might like is this one:

Do not say, "Why were the old days better than these?" For it is not wise to ask such questions. -- Ecclesiastes 7:10, written by King Solomon about 3000 years ago. It's no wonder the world is so bad now, it has been getting worse for 3000 years!

[padren]

Well, you can look at it differently too. According to the theory of evolution, us geeks are the big dummies because we care so much about knowledge instead of focusing on getting laid. Priority #1 is to pass on your genes.

 

Also, if we were too individualistic, our society would fall apart. People have to bend over a little if they are to work together.

 

Well, when it comes to evolution our 'evolved' goal is to reproduce, but I think self awareness gives us the option to 'rebel' against our genes, and seek the experiences we like. (And if we are socially minded, improve the experiences others can enjoy.)

 

That said, when I get 'jaded' in situations mentioned in the OP I have to fall back on my old adage: we are all made out of mud, and for mud this is all pretty brilliant.

 

I mean, we evolved out of primordial ooze, pushing out in every direction of diversity through mutated genes and adaptive learning techniques, mostly to end up in complete dead ends, but with some pretty interesting results as well to find ourselves in the world today. No blueprints, instruction manuals, no overall design - just millions of years of trial and error that as a video would best be put to Benny Hill music and played back faster than life.

 

So, it's like being in one of those films - when on set, it seems excruciatingly slow to film it but sped up it's hilarious and pretty great for a bunch of mud.

 

And we are still going off in every direction, by mutation (very slowly) or by learned techniques, most will be dead ends, but who knows what the sum effects will be. I can't help but to enjoy the diversity and even the absurdity - but then Douglass Adams is one of my favorite authors.

[the tree]

Well, I did spend a bit of time poking on people and intelligence, but it's more about being frustrated with their priorities. It's not that I can't stand them because they wear stupid clothes, it's that I can't stand them because they are obsessed about their overpriced stupid clothes in a vacuum of ingratitude and total lack of appreciation for REAL LIFE.

Here's the way I see it from recently having been a 'British Youth' (I own a hoody and everything). Real life may or may not exist but either way it is completely inaccessible when you're young. Getting a job is too difficult, playing football in the street is criminal, spending time on your education just isn't going to happen when your school is too obsessed with exam results to notice the students and really, there's sod all else to do except for act like a douche in public places unless you want to sit at home killing time on-line which is a clear sign of some kind of social ineptitude.

[Genecks]

Would a highly intelligent and incredibly wise and perceptive person be at a mall?

And if so, would that person be socializing?

And if socializing, to what limit?

 

People are stupid.

It's a fact of life.

Attribute it however you like.

 

There are a large portion of people who don't understand the big picture.

Otherwise, people don't want to see or even think about the big picture.

Some people simply don't want to have social and personal responsibilities.

Intelligence comes with power, and both can have responsibilities.

 

At 37, I'm surprised you really have to discuss the stupidity of the human race. Humanity's stupidity is nothing new.

 

It is disappointing, though.

Throughout the years, I've come to believe in forms of socialism, dictatorship, communism, and more.

 

It's based on the idea that many people can't take care of themselves.

And a good amount of them, when taking care of themselves, often piddle their time and abilities in futile tasks and social constructions that advance humanity no where.

 

I think I understand why older adults become republicans and so forth.

Yes, democracy would be beautiful is people didn't act like self-destructive, irrational fools.

 

What I'm trying to say is that if people acted intelligent and wise, they would be suffering.

It could bring them suffering.

And the true question is this: Is it ethical to desire others to be intelligent?

Edited November 3, 2008 by Genecks

[Pangloss]

Do not say, "Why were the old days better than these?" For it is not wise to ask such questions. -- Ecclesiastes 7:10, written by King Solomon about 3000 years ago. It's no wonder the world is so bad now, it has been getting worse for 3000 years!

 

Good one.

[Riogho]

I agree with everything the O.P. said.

 

Unfortunately, as every rant can be, it is generalizing. But you know what, generalizing is okay. If 95% of the terrorists bombing shit are wearing turbans, I'm going to be wary of people wearing turbans. It applies in the stupidity sense too.

 

You can consider yourself lucky though. You arn't surrounded by these people 10 hours a day, 5 days a week in a terrible land called 'school'. The benefit is honours classes tend to segregate.

 

Oh well, take a small bit of happiness in what I do as well. When you find yourself hating them, know, deep down, that they are trash, and their entire life they live is going to suck.

 

And if you're into slavery consider owning one.

[Genecks]

but that's assuming an even distribution!

 

But, if I understand right, about 25% of Americans (or was it adults?) have a college degree or some college education?

Census bureau stats ought to clear these stats up. *me = busy*

 

So, that would mean 75% of American adults are undereducated.

 

 

Therefore, yeah, it would be common to run into stupid/ignorant people on a daily basis.

 

And how do you determine a degree as worthy?

I find if it has serious philosophical roots, then it could be worthy.

Otherwise, I don't think a masters degree in physical education is that worthy; sadly, they earn too much @#$!#@$ money!

 

And if you're into slavery consider owning one.

 

You mean having a kid?

Hmm, "slave." I suspect I could use that word more often than "tool" para refer to people.

Edited November 3, 2008 by Genecks

[NIN]

I can't say I completely disagree - although I'm effectively a hypocrite just for that, I suppose. I'm a 15 year old American, so I guess I'm used to it...But at the same time, I'm not too different from what you described. I don't talk like a gangsta, I don't walk around with "gadgets" (never had an iPod, only had one cell phone), I don't wear a hat, and I don't compete to look like others at all, and yet I can still see a resemblance in my self of what you speak of. Interesting.

 

EDIT: After thinking it a bit more, I'm really starting to realize what you're talking about. Walking around school, all you see is guys walking around with chicks trying to sneak in a mention about their penis in every sentence, or all-to-often people making out on the walls to show how cool they are for having a girlfriend. Just like everyone else. And then there's the prejudice. Everyone seems to love making fun of gays, Jews, emos etc, just so that they can rejoice in the fact that people are "under" them.

 

Again, I'm probably a hypocrite, as I'm still a bit of an attention whore just like everyone else, it's just that I achieve that status in a different way than all the other bone-heads my age

Edited November 3, 2008 by NIN
Adding in the second and third paragraphs.

[big314mp]

There is no way you are 15. I refuse to believe that a 15 year old is more mature than I am

[the tree]

Would a highly intelligent and incredibly wise and perceptive person be at a mall?

Yes, being wise and intelligent doesn't stop you from needing food and clothes and amusing gadgets.

And if so, would that person be socializing?

Yes, only stupid people never socialise.

And if socializing, to what limit?

I tend to think that when you need the toilet, you should stop socialising for a while, apart from that, the more the merrier applies to most situations.

 

What I'm trying to say is that if people acted intelligent and wise, they would be suffering.

That's the pessimistic attitude of a 14 year old who thinks they're clever because they read H2G2 before their classmates had heard of it. If you think intelligence brings suffering, you have no idea what intelligence or suffering are.

 

And the true question is this: Is it ethical to desire others to be intelligent?

Yes.

[big314mp]

Yes, being wise and intelligent doesn't stop you from needing food and clothes and amusing gadgets.

 

This is hardly the dominant reason for people to go to the mall.

[insane_alien]

thats the ONLY reason i go to the mall. not entirely sure what else there is to do there. the only other use i can think of is as an impromptu fortress when the zombie uprising happens.

[Gilded]

thats the ONLY reason i go to the mall. not entirely sure what else there is to do there. the only other use i can think of is as an impromptu fortress when the zombie uprising happens.

 

Especially around the holidays there's lots to do at the mall. Like tackling the mall pianist and playing the Star Wars Cantina Band theme on the piano until security comes to drag you away.

[Flashman]

Our mall has a redeeming feature at least, these folks...

http://www.scienceline.net/

[big314mp]

thats the ONLY reason i go to the mall. not entirely sure what else there is to do there. the only other use i can think of is as an impromptu fortress when the zombie uprising happens.

 

Some of the kids here will skip school and hang out at the library. Why? Because its there.

 

Not to read books. But because it just happens to be there.

 

Sort of like a mall.

[Dudde]

You guys are all crazy. Honestly people annoy me like no other, but it's probably because I naturally rebel against the grain! It's natural for me to strike up the opposing side of an argument, even if I don't agree with it, ...which might make me whatever you want to call it, but it's fun!

 

However, I've become quite antisocial as of late, and go to walmart at 2am because there are fewer people, I think it's time I get stupid and go to the mall! .... except the mall is so boring...what do you guys do, besides defending against zombies, that makes it fun? Reveal your witches secrets to me!

[Flashman]

I don't get the defending against zombie outbreaks. If I was a zombie outbreak, I'd start at the mall, no-one would notice for days.

[Ophiolite]

I see most of you reside in a world where the glass isn't even half full. How depressing. I celebrate the renaissance for da Vinci and Galileo, not for a gross of lazy sheepherders, or a score of thieving vagabonds.

The behaviour you describe and decry is part of a process of establishing identity and finding a place within the 'tribe'. Expecting well judged, rational decisions from a bunch of confused, youthful naked apes is expecting rather too much.

[Flashman]

I'd say the "gross of lazy sheepherders" made the renaissance possible.

 

""The wool trade developed into serious business, the generator of capital. In the thirteenth century, the wool trade was the economic engine of the Low Countries and of Central Italy; by the end of the following century Italy predominated, though in the 16th century Italian production turned to silk (Braudel p 312). Both pre-industries were based on English raw wool exports - rivaled only by the sheepwalks of Castile, developed from the fifteenth century - which were a significant source of income to the English crown, which from 1275 imposed an export tax on wool called the "Great Custom". The importance of wool to the English economy can be shown by the fact that since the 14th Century, the presiding officer of the House of Lords has sat on the "Woolsack", a chair stuffed with wool.""

 

""Before the flowering of the Renaissance, the Medici and other great banking houses of Florence had built their wealth and banking system on their textile industry based on wool, overseen by the Arte della Lana, the wool guild: wool textile interests guided Florentine policies. Francesco Datini, the "merchant of Prato", established in 1383 an Arte della Lana for that small Tuscan city. The sheepwalks of Castile shaped the landscape and the fortunes of the meseta that lies in the heart of the Iberian peninsula; in the sixteenth century, a unified Spain allowed export of Merino lambs only with royal permission. The German wool market - based on sheep of Spanish origin - did not overtake British wool until comparatively late.""

 

This economic engine fomented the development of bustling street markets, which developed into covered markets, and row stores developed into covered arcades, both presaging the ultimate temple of mindless consumerism, on which altar we sacrifice our youth, the mall.

 

So actually we have those shepherds to thank for being too damn busy and begetting the cloth, clothing and fashion industries that are something of a cornerstone of consumerism.

 

Anyway, without the shepherds lining the pockets of the Medicis, Leonardo wouldn't have been able to sit around dreaming of helicopters, and Galilei would have still had his world revolving around where he got his next meal.