General Election Discussion (US election)

[Pangloss]

Use this thread for discussing the election results (not including the Senate races, which Bascule has started a thread for here).

 

Ohio was just called for Obama by ABC at 9:25 Eastern so that would seem to more or less cement things for him, what with PA staying on the blue side.

[iNow]

Damn it. I should know better by now. The electoral votes in my state always run counter to my choice. So very frustrating.

 

EDIT: But you got Florida, mate.

[Pangloss]

Indeed, an island of blue in a sea of red, but it appears that Florida was once again provided the critical moment (if only because Virginia and Ohio were already decided).

 

An extraordinary concession speech by McCain, taking the time and having the respect to acknowledge the victor and pledge to support him, but also taking the time to recognize the historic moment.

 

Jesse Jackson and John Lewis in tears tonight were big moments as well. What would their great leader and mentor have said or felt tonight?

[iNow]

I honestly think McCain could have won had he spoken throughout the election like he did tonight. His speech was so very well done, and so sincere and heart felt.

 

If he'd spoken that way for the past few months we may have had a different outcome tonight.

 

Obama definitely had that "spark" though, that je ne sais quoi... Regardless, he inspires people, and while folks across our nation certainly voted FOR him, I truly don't believe that anyone out there voted AGAINST McCain (maybe Palin, though).

 

McCain's handlers killed his chances. People like him. I like him. I hated his campaign, was frightened by his VP, and disgusted by many of his supporters who couldn't go more than 17 seconds without breaking into an empty, meaningless chant.

Edited November 5, 2008 by iNow
I had to fix my french

[Pangloss]

Oh my god, that speech -- that SPEECH! OH my GOD!

 

(From Obama's acceptance speech)

This election had many firsts and many stories that will be told for generations. But one that's on my mind tonight is about a woman who cast her ballot in Atlanta. She's a lot like the millions of others who stood in line to make their voice heard in this election except for one thing – Ann Nixon Cooper is 106 years old.

 

She was born just a generation past slavery; a time when there were no cars on the road or planes in the sky; when someone like her couldn't vote for two reasons – because she was a woman and because of the color of her skin.

 

And tonight, I think about all that she's seen throughout her century in America – the heartache and the hope; the struggle and the progress; the times we were told that we can't, and the people who pressed on with that American creed: Yes we can.

 

At a time when women's voices were silenced and their hopes dismissed, she lived to see them stand up and speak out and reach for the ballot. Yes we can.

 

When there was despair in the dust bowl and depression across the land, she saw a nation conquer fear itself with a New Deal, new jobs and a new sense of common purpose. Yes we can.

 

When the bombs fell on our harbor and tyranny threatened the world, she was there to witness a generation rise to greatness and a democracy was saved. Yes we can.

 

She was there for the buses in Montgomery, the hoses in Birmingham, a bridge in Selma, and a preacher from Atlanta who told a people that "We Shall Overcome." Yes we can.

 

A man touched down on the moon, a wall came down in Berlin, a world was connected by our own science and imagination. And this year, in this election, she touched her finger to a screen, and cast her vote, because after 106 years in America, through the best of times and the darkest of hours, she knows how America can change. Yes we can.

 

America, we have come so far. We have seen so much. But there is so much more to do. So tonight, let us ask ourselves – if our children should live to see the next century; if my daughters should be so lucky to live as long as Ann Nixon Cooper, what change will they see? What progress will we have made?

 

This is our chance to answer that call. This is our moment. This is our time – to put our people back to work and open doors of opportunity for our kids; to restore prosperity and promote the cause of peace; to reclaim the American Dream and reaffirm that fundamental truth – that out of many, we are one; that while we breathe, we hope, and where we are met with cynicism, and doubt, and those who tell us that we can't, we will respond with that timeless creed that sums up the spirit of a people:

 

Yes We Can.

 

Oh. My. God.

Edited November 5, 2008 by Pangloss

[Mr Skeptic]

Just to clarify: was that McCain's concession speech? If so, kudos to him.

[Pangloss]

Sorry, a little time had passed -- that was from the end of Obama's acceptance speech. I added an appropriate note to the post.

 

CNN has the video here. You have to see this moment in video -- the way the crowd repeats his refrain -- it's just stunning. One of the most incredible moments I can remember in American politics.

 

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/11/05/sot.obama.victory.yes.we.can.cnn

 

Couple other bits from the speech that really spoke to me:

 

What began twenty-one months ago in the depths of winter must not end on this autumn night. This victory alone is not the change we seek – it is only the chance for us to make that change. And that cannot happen if we go back to the way things were. It cannot happen without you.

 

Let us resist the temptation to fall back on the same partisanship and pettiness and immaturity that has poisoned our politics for so long. Let us remember that it was a man from this state who first carried the banner of the Republican Party to the White House – a party founded on the values of self-reliance, individual liberty, and national unity. Those are values we all share, and while the Democratic Party has won a great victory tonight, we do so with a measure of humility and determination to heal the divides that have held back our progress. As Lincoln said to a nation far more divided than ours, "We are not enemies, but friends…though passion may have strained it must not break our bonds of affection." And to those Americans whose support I have yet to earn – I may not have won your vote, but I hear your voices, I need your help, and I will be your President too.

Edited November 5, 2008 by Pangloss
multiple post merged

[D H]

Both speeches were incredibly well done.

 

Text of McCain's concession speech

 

Text of Obama's victory speech

[Sisyphus]

I'm just about the last person to get worked up by this kind of thing, but damn. That was amazing. The gravity of what happened last night will likely be sinking in for a long time, but right now, I'm just basking in it. I think that whole crowd was literally in tears last night.

 

And kudos, too, to John McCain. Both speeches showed those two men at their very best, each in their own way doing what nobody else could. I look forward to seeing them work together.

[ydoaPs]

Both speeches were incredibly well done.

 

Text of McCain's concession speech

 

Text of Obama's victory speech

 

Anyone know where to find Obama's concession speech and McCains acceptance speech?

[ecoli]

I'm sorry to break the mood of awe here. But what did american do yesterday? elect another pandering, corporate sponsered politician. Oh yes... he happens to be black, so that's why the minorities and lower class decided to finally go out and vote.

 

I've been in a fairly negative mood all day, but if America thinks any part of this country is going to fundamentally change, they're going to be surprised. All we've done is elect another big government politician, who's going to increase spending and erode our economic freedoms.

 

Yes, its great that he's black. It's great that black people can vote. But the labelling of this election as "historic" is a pretty superficial, IMO. We're so concerned with overcoming "racial boundaries" that we forget what the real problems facing this country are.

[YT2095]

I read the speech and must admit to a tear or 2 as well, I`m so overcome by the fact that IT`S FINALLY OVER!

 

no more political spam for Ages now

[Sisyphus]

no more political spam for Ages now

 

Speaking of which, it's about time the 2012 Republican primaries started up. At this point my money is on--

 

*ducks hail of rotten fruit, runs offstage*

[john5746]

Speaking of which, it's about time the 2012 Republican primaries started up. At this point my money is on--

 

*ducks hail of rotten fruit, runs offstage*

 

What? I thought Obama would have 8 years, not just 4. Do we HAVE to do an election in 4 years?

[iNow]

[john5746]

Yes, its great that he's black. It's great that black people can vote. But the labelling of this election as "historic" is a pretty superficial, IMO. We're so concerned with overcoming "racial boundaries" that we forget what the real problems facing this country are.

 

Lots of truth in that statement. Cultural issues tend to give emotional appeal to either side. Racism is a deep wound in the American psyche that just got a little better though. We have a tough road ahead and Obama has been given a big mess to deal with. He has already set the sights lower, setting the stage for more realistic expectations.

[Pangloss]

More happened last night to solve the problem of fatherless African American families than any other thing that's been done in the last 30 years.

 

But it's worth recognizing that Democrats didn't get anything like the mandate they were looking for, falling far short of the projected gains in congress. This was a mandate for change, not a mandate for the Democratic party or liberalism, or for that matter a rejection of conservatism. This was a mandate for common sense and reason. Some things liberals are looking for will be realized. Some will not. Some things conservatives fear will happen, others will not.

 

The thing conservatives need to realize is that the best lessons of the great movement of Ronald Reagan have not been forgotten. We didn't REJECT them last night, we STOOD UP for them. They should have found something familiar in last night's excitement, not something alien or incomprehensible or frightening.

 

Similarly, if people out in the world saw this as a leap towards socialism and the far left then they were grossly mistaken, and we will show them the truth over the next few years. What they should see (and what I think most of our SFN members saw) is that this was a leap back to the center, towards moderacy and common ground and compromise and common sense.

[Mr Skeptic]

Anyone know where to find Obama's concession speech and McCains acceptance speech?

 

Ha, ha. It would be funny if someone leaked those.

[ecoli]

Lots of truth in that statement. Cultural issues tend to give emotional appeal to either side. Racism is a deep wound in the American psyche that just got a little better though. We have a tough road ahead and Obama has been given a big mess to deal with. He has already set the sights lower, setting the stage for more realistic expectations.

'His supports don't seem to realize that yet. I can't believe how many people I saw crying in happiness, thinking that Obama is going to save this country.

 

OTOH, my brand of free market capitlism probably isn't going to be supported by either party anymore. So Obama = McCain for all intensive purposes.

 

Similarly, if people out in the world saw this as a leap towards socialism and the far left then they were grossly mistaken, and we will show them the truth over the next few years. What they should see (and what I think most of our SFN members saw) is that this was a leap back to the center, towards moderacy and common ground and compromise and common sense.

 

I know its early, but so far, far from being a unifier, Obama has been divisive. Those who like him are completely enamored and have turned into drooling idiots. Those who dislike him have begun their snarling.

 

Where's the promised unity?

[iNow]

Lol. ecoli just called Pangloss a drooling idiot.

[ecoli]

Lol. ecoli just called Pangloss a drooling idiot.

well no, I meant the hardcore supporters. There were a lot of them on TV last night. I couldn't tell if it was political rally or 12 year old girls at a Beatles concert in the 60s.

[iNow]

I suppose you're still too young to remember that this happens at nearly every election. Granted, I'm only about a decade older than you, but still, people celebrate when their "team" wins. It won't last. Your anger, however, will unless you let it go or become the change you wish to see.

[jackson33]

I suppose you're still too young to remember that this happens at nearly every election. Granted, I'm only about a decade older than you, but still, people celebrate when their "team" wins. It won't last. Your anger, however, will unless you let it go or become the change you wish to see.

 

When High School kids are bussed to register and vote (Florida), during school hours, when the homeless are given anything to register and/or vote or when the Military continuously are denied rights...at best its manipulating the vote. The founders must be sore from turning over in the graves and would never have sanctioned, much less amended the constitution to allow 18 yo to vote. (I know the arguments, don't bother).

 

Technically today any State that does not have a minimum age for voting could allow 16 yo or younger to vote. I am surprised this has not already been tried, with all the movements out there to do just that. The 26th Amendment only says that 18-20 yo CANNOT BE REFUSED THE RIGHT, not that any other age could be.

 

If as a society we agree with the Constitution and a person should be 25 years old to serve the people, why should the people who choose those people also be at least 25. The Constitution wasn't set up for public vote of Senators (30) or the P/VP (35) however were chose by legislatures assumed knowledgeable to their States needs or the relation to Common Interest of all States.

[Pangloss]

On the "drooling idiot" subject I have to say I was surprised by my own emotional reaction last night. Maybe it's just me, but I worked very hard to make as objective an assessment as possible in this election and make my choice based on logic and intelligence and my basic ideology of middle ground and non-partisanship. So you could have knocked me over with a spoon when I found myself chanting "yes we can" at the television screen, like I was some sort of hypnotized zealot.

 

But I dimly remember the way Ronald Reagan took the country by storm in 1980, and this is really not all that different. I think it's just been a while since a politician really captured our imaginations this thoroughly.

 

But listen, I understand your reticence, and even applaud it. People SHOULD be skeptical. Skepticism is going to be just as important as it always has been. The last thing we want is to just swing the pendulum to the left as far as it will go and hope for the best. That won't cut it.

[iNow]

Jackson,

 

I really have no idea what you're on about, nor why you chose to post what you did after quoting me, but to be perfectly honest with you, I really don't care all that much either.