So what do you want me to invent or discover ?

[The Clairvoyant]

......or what would be the greatest invention/discovery of all time ?

 

Read on, i'm new !

 

Hello all,

 

Since I was a kid i've always felt that I was going to do something great or miraculous in my life. I'm not sure what this thing is. I was never particularly interested in Science at school and to be honest it bored me rigid. Science Fiction has never been my favourite type of book r film (although I did like Asimovs 'Foundation' series). I was never very good at Maths or anything practical. I have never found mechanics or engineering very interesting (although when I have attempted anything mechanical I have found I am pretty good at it).

 

I'm really just an ordinary bloke. New lady in my life, ex-wife (!), kids, mortgage, watch the footie and have a pint or three. That kind of thing ! I'm 42 now and work in consultancy/training type roles in factories all over the UK working on Business Improvement Techniques, Lean Manufacturing that kind of thing. I can get obsessive about things, i'm not particularly bright but have a tendency to think differently to the masses. I'm the employee who comes up with different ideas to 'everyone else' and then goes about proving them wrong when they say it won't work ! I tend to think in a logical, sequenced kind of way. I need to understand the workings to get the point.

 

Bored yet, read on..........

 

Yesterday. Something really strange happened. As a complete sceptic I went to see a clairvoyant with my new partner. Tarot, crystal ball, palmistry. I don't know why I went because i've never believed in anything supernatural or in fact been interested in it. I have always felt that science would eventually explain everything. Anyway, she asked me my name and asked me to shuffle and cut the cards, then put one hand on the crystal ball. Laughing yet ?! Lol, sounds ridiculous I know. She then asks me to think of a question i'd like to ask the ball (lol!) As I didn't want to ask the usual stuff about family, future, friends etc, I thought of the 'invention' feeling I had had since a boy.

 

Anyway, she puts the cards into a weird formation and then turns over the top card and says :

 

'Are you interested in Science, because the cards are saying that you are going to invent something incredible'

 

You could have knocked me down with a feather, smacked me in the face with a kipper and zapped me with 10,000 volts. She looked at me with a 'Gotcha !' look in her eye.

 

After the initial shock, she said that the invention would come with a change of job, possibly through setting up my own business and a change in country (I didn't tell her this but my partner and I are thinking of emigrating to Cyprus in 7-8 years time).

 

So here I am, this is the first day of my new hobby !

 

Here's the question:

 

What do you want me to invent or discover ?

 

May as well start off with something huge. The greatest invention or discovery of all time. Teleportation perhaps ? Something that will allow us to go to the stars in an Asimov kind of way ? Knowing my luck I will become famous after my death in typical Picasso style

 

Cheers all,

 

The Clairvoyant (Paul)

 

P.S, I'm not nuts or been on the funny chemicals.

 

And on a more sceptical note the clairvoyant also told me that I was being followed by three orbs from the spirit world and not to ring her up if I started seeing them !

[Kyrisch]

So you scorned all your previous mental scientific rigour for a mountebank with a good guess?

[The Clairvoyant]

So you scorned all your previous mental scientific rigour for a mountebank with a good guess?

 

1. No it was completely a logical thing to do. My partner wanted to go and she's a woman. If you are happy to be known as a scientist you will know that the female of the species knows best on all matters.

 

2. How would you rate 'good' ? I think it was a truly, staggering exceptional guess, rather than just a good one. I wonder how many others she used the same 'invention' line on ? Just one, I suspect. Me.

 

Anyway, back to the thread title. What can I invent/discover ? What's the thing that will propel mankind forward onto another level ? Skybikes maybe, they sound like fun !

[mooeypoo]

Many claimed clairvoyants and psychics do something quite "simple", actually, that is called Cold Reading. If you master it, it's really not hard to make it seem as if you're the best clairvoyant in the world. Some of them are self-deluded. Some know exactly what they're doing (and how, and mean it) and some are not too good.

 

There might be real psychics out there, sure. Might. Just like there might be anything out there, but so far, all and any clairvoyant that was actually put to a *scientifically rigorous* test (that includes your basic double-blided testing and some basic limitations that otherwise make their "discoveries" trivial, like checking them for radio transmitters) failed miserably.

 

When you know what methods these people use, you see that their "predictions" are quite easy to figure out.

 

Here are a few principles worth remembering:

 

1. People tend to forget the misses and remember only the hits.
   Psychics tell you something "almost right" and yet still wrong for 10 times and hit the mark once or twice. Our human nature is to remember the once or twice that impressed us and forget the 10 other times where they missed.
   
2. People have natural body language that isn't hard to decipher.
   If you know how to read body language, you know where to go with your questions according to the reactions of the person in front of you.
   
3. Certain statements are so general and vague, they fit anything you want them to fit.
   That's a usual concept with astrology, for example, but it works well with other "supernatural" readers. The statement, if read separately, can fit almost any individual, but since the person listening expects to hear something related to himself, he or she makes the connection.
   
4. People have a tendency to find patterns even when those don't exist.
   You can see this when you look up at the clouds, or at rorshach ink blots, or at randomly-placed anything. Our brain makes a visual image from randomly placed items, and we tend to see patterns. If you know this principle, you can take advantage of it.
   

Also, remember that you have no way of knowing how many misses the clairvoyant had before you. Even if we relate to everything as purely statistical (and ignore all the other "tricks" that one can perform, consciously or subconsciously, to figure a 'good guess' out) then even let's say the odds of the clairvoyant being right with you is one in 10,000. It's enough the clairvoyant had 20,000 other people in her lifetime, and this "lucky guess", even if we ignore everything else, is still not all that incredible. It's statistics.

 

There are very low odds of any man to be hit by a meteorite. And yet, it *does* happen, because the number of people is so large, even large-number statistical odds have an eventual chance of happening.

 

So, in short, you don't quite have enough information there to judge if the clairvoyant is truly "good", or if he or she has any real supernatural powers. The only way to check this is to perform external test using a double-blinded control.

 

And so far, all clairvoyants and psychics who went through such test (even those in which they agreed in advance to the rules!) failed. Completely.

 

I'm not saying psychics CAN'T exist, I'm saying that according to everything we know, including all tests in the matter (and quite a large number of tests), psychics and clairvoyants most probably don't exist.

 

Unless someone proves otherwise.

 

Proves scientifically,though And perhaps wins a Million Dollars.

 

 

 

 

Now, that said, I don't see anything wrong with having a new hobby, specially one that involves science and critical thinking. I think that's an awesome hobby, incredibly interesting and has a lot of potential in it for being and inventing something "incredible".

But one of the strongest principles in science is the scientific method, and maybe you should read a bit about how it works; its purpose is meant to eliminate exactly the above "tricks" (again, some people don't realise they're using those tricks, and aren't doing them out of malice) and avoid subjectivity.

 

So, to get rid of subjectivity, you use controls -- double blinded experiments, for instance, where you can't influence the result, or peer review, where people intentionally try to play "Devil's Advocate" with a theory, trying to destroy its principles, so that if it survives the process it is *truly* strong and valid. And more, and more.

 

Getting into science is great, it's very interesting and rewarding, but it comes with its own responsibility and with a unique method. I recommend that before you start thinking what you should invent, you first read a bit about the scientific method and how experiments are performed.

 

Then, start thinking what gets you excited about nature and science.. there are so many subjects - physics, chemistry, biology, environment... - the list is huge, and it really depends on what makes you excited. Inventing something - incredible or not - takes time and effort, and you should go for something that excites you and interests you.

 

Good luck

 

 

~moo

[The Clairvoyant]

I'm not saying psychics CAN'T exist, I'm saying that according to everything we know, including all tests in the matter (and quite a large number of tests), psychics and clairvoyants most probably don't exist.

 

Yeah. I know all this really, but imagine the shock !

 

 

Now, that said, I don't see anything wrong with having a new hobby, specially one that involves science and critical thinking..

 

Yeah. I'm quite looking forward to pushing myself to be honest and as i've said I do get quite obsessive about things. Your point about 'going for something that excites and interests you' is spot on. There is no way i'd get obsessive about something that didn't interest me. I normally need two things :

 

1. Somebody tells me 'You'll never do it' (which would be true if I wasn't committed to it. This acts as some sort of catalyst and gives me some sort of inspiration

2. If I am interested enough, I prove them wrong.

 

Catalyst + inspiration + interest = obsession (ha ! ha ! There you go my first formula ! )

 

 

 

But one of the strongest principles in science is the scientific method, and maybe you should read a bit about how it works

 

O.K right. Do you have any suggestions as to where to start ? What's good to read ? I've two weeks holiday soon and I want to distance myself from work and throw myself into something new. I'll follow it cover to cover and do what it says. Go easy on me, I was never that great at Science at school (mind you, I could never be arsed with it either). Something simple, easy to read, logical, chunk by chunk type of thing. Things that interest me :

 

1. Astronomy - I have an ok scope at home but not sure where this would take me as far as an invention or discovery. (Yeah, maybe i'll discover some rock hurtling towards us but that's not big enough for what I want to look at ! )

 

2. Bacteria - I have an o.k miroscope at home but not sure where this would take me either.

 

I'd be quite interested in something to do with magnetism. I've got a Levitron somewhere and was always staggered by how that 'top thing' could float in the air.

 

Really I suppose i'm looking for the inspirational spark the 'Eureka' moment or 'apple falling on the head'.

 

What's the next big thing ? What's the invention that everyone wants and needs to progress mankind to another level ? I would assume that there's some sort of Holy Grail that somebody would love to invent/discover ? Time travel, teleportation something like that ? If so, then I also suspect that someone, somewhere is already on the path to discovery, possibly even making it their lifetimes work. I'd like to read about them too.

 

O.K, enough about me. Can someone recommend me some stuff ?

[mooeypoo]

Yeah. I know all this really, but imagine the shock !

Trust me, I was there! I went through something very similar a few years ago. I was also shocked, and I was also quite impressed, until I read a bit about the methods and I stopped being shocked.

 

Yeah. I'm quite looking forward to pushing myself to be honest and as i've said I do get quite obsessive about things. Your point about 'going for something that excites and interests you' is spot on. There is no way i'd get obsessive about something that didn't interest me. I normally need two things :

 

1. Somebody tells me 'You'll never do it' (which would be true if I wasn't committed to it. This acts as some sort of catalyst and gives me some sort of inspiration

2. If I am interested enough, I prove them wrong.

 

Catalyst + inspiration + interest = obsession (ha ! ha ! There you go my first formula ! )

You know what, then? Good thing the clairvoyant gave you that motivation, even if it was a bit of a weird way to give it My point, however, is that as a scientist, you will need to exercise a bit more skepticism and try to find explanations to events and phenomena that fit reality. Those can be difficult sometimes, and you shouldn't give up looking for answers. The only thing that bugs me about your clairvoyant story is that it is a perfect example for a case where the "easy answer" - that the clairvoyant has supernatural abilities - is not the logical one. Not without further proof. As a scientist, you should demand more rigor. That's my only point.

 

However, seeing as you seem to take this as your catalyst rather than a case study in supernatural abilities, I think we can move on from this story

 

 

O.K right. Do you have any suggestions as to where to start ? What's good to read ? I've two weeks holiday soon and I want to distance myself from work and throw myself into something new. I'll follow it cover to cover and do what it says. Go easy on me, I was never that great at Science at school (mind you, I could never be arsed with it either). Something simple, easy to read, logical, chunk by chunk type of thing. Things that interest me :

 

1. Astronomy - I have an ok scope at home but not sure where this would take me as far as an invention or discovery. (Yeah, maybe i'll discover some rock hurtling towards us but that's not big enough for what I want to look at ! )

Incidentally, I'm a physicist-minded soon-to-be Astrophysicist. I'd go for that, but I'm biased. A double-blinded test is required..

 

Seriously, though, if you want to get into astrophysics, I suggest you get into the "light" stuff first. You should first get into what stars and planets are, how we know what we know about the Earth's orbit around the sun and the Moon's orbit around the Earth, etc. Read a bit about Einstein's special relativity and general relativity, but take into account people spend their entire lives studying these subjects and astrophysics in general -- don't expect to be an expert in two weeks! But you can definitely get into it.

 

And the more you read, the more you'll figure out which sub-specialty or specific subject interests you, and you will be able to get more information and more research into those.

 

2. Bacteria - I have an o.k miroscope at home but not sure where this would take me either.

 

I'd be quite interested in something to do with magnetism. I've got a Levitron somewhere and was always staggered by how that 'top thing' could float in the air.

Biology is not my strong suit but there are plenty of bio experts here to help you out if you so choose. I wouldn't know where to recommend you start with that, so I'll let them do that.

 

About magnetism, it's a humongous subject, I suggest you start "small", with relatively simple experiments you can do at home, like understanding how to create a (temporary) magnet from metalic objects (bang them together, hard) and why that happens, then maybe look up some experiments with magnets and electromagnetism.

 

Do you have any university courses you can take for introductory physics? If you can, it is worth it. You'll get the basic stuff that you can move on from there, see what interests you and pick specific subjects to continue researching.

 

This applies to the other subjects as well, of course, like biology and chemistry, but i'm less inclined on those so - again - I'm biased

 

Really I suppose i'm looking for the inspirational spark the 'Eureka' moment or 'apple falling on the head'.

As a side note to this, you need to understand that these stories are inspirational but they are mostly false. Newton didn't *really* come up with his theory because an apple fall on his head, it took him years of study and research (and some rigorous math, he invented calculus..) to come up with his (multiple) theories. The story told is a simplified, romantic version.

 

But I think I get what you're saying, and I think that the best way this can happen is if you just start reading up on the subjects you find interesting. No one expects you will be an expert in two weeks and come up with some revolutionary theory in a month - but if you start getting into the subjects, maybe the "ooh!" moment will come in the shape of a specialty you find interesting, or an idea you feel you must research into.

 

Many times the process itself is more important and fruitful than the "question" that lead to it. By exposing yourself to as many questions as you can, you will have the best chances in finding your 'way' into what truly interests you and makes you passionate.

 

 

What's the next big thing ? What's the invention that everyone wants and needs to progress mankind to another level ? I would assume that there's some sort of Holy Grail that somebody would love to invent/discover ? Time travel, teleportation something like that ? If so, then I also suspect that someone, somewhere is already on the path to discovery, possibly even making it their lifetimes work. I'd like to read about them too.

That is HARD to tell. There are so many things that are "big" and "great" and awesome that already have a chance of existing in the relatively near future, this is a question that only you can answer for yourself.

 

Stem cell research can produce insanely cool applications. Space research has been incredibly fruitful in the past 40 years, and Biology/Immunology has concrete results you can experience for yourself.

 

Many of the "cool" inventions were discovered accidently when the researchers were looking for something else entirely. Some were gradual progression into the "cool thing" from a "not so cool thing"... it's so broad, that it's really not easy to answer.

 

You need to get yourself a bit more familiar with the subsets of the scientific subjects you find interesting and your passion will spawn from there. I always knew I love space but I didn't know what, exactly, I want to do in that subject.. it's a huuuuge subject! But now, as I'm studying and broadening my knowledge about it and about what exists (and doesn't) and what the community is researching and what not-just-yet, etc, I keep getting ideas on what I want to do. On what makes *me* passionate.

 

 

Start by reading the general things and see which of the above subjects you want to start with, will be my advice.

If you can find a general course in your town's university or school, even better -- usually those include labs and very cool experiments you can't do at home. Just start reading.. your curiosity will lead you to what interests you.

 

~moo

[cameron marical]

Nanotechnology.

 

Quantum computers.

 

Long distance space flight {fuel, design, need for gravity or something that simulates it}

 

Space elevator.

 

bioengineering.

 

Artificial speech improvements.

 

Global warming solution.

 

Cleaner {Greener}...everything.

 

Better information storage systems.

 

Artificial intelligence.

 

Cellular biology/immunology.

 

Quantum Gravity theory.

 

Nueroscience.

 

Microbiology.

 

Genetics.

 

These are all just some of the things that would help if they were invented/modeled. I myself want to go further in Computer science and Robotics for Artificial Intelligence.

 

Good luck with becoming the new Einstein or Da Vinci. {really, I think that that is what everyone here wants to do and beleives that they are going to, including myself [but I am only 16 so maybe that is just my youth]}.

Edited August 19, 2009 by cameron marical

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

All I need is a simple way to whack people over the head through the Internet. That's all.

[insane_alien]

you want FoIP(Fist over Internet Protocol) then.

 

only down side is that the other persons browser must support it too.

[ydoaPs]

All I need is a simple way to whack people over the head through the Internet. That's all.

SoIP is better

[The Clairvoyant]

Many thanks for the above replies.

 

I've ordered a book called '700 Science experiments for everyone' by Unesco. It seems like it's very general and hopefully will provide me with an inkling as to what I am interested in. As I work at a local college, getting on any sort of course is never a problem. Therefore, i'll have a play with the book whilst on hols and then have a crack at a course in the next academic year.

 

How do you eat an elephant ?

 

Chunk by chunk.

[mooeypoo]

you want FoIP(Fist over Internet Protocol) then.

 

only down side is that the other persons browser must support it too.

Clearly you need to watch Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back.

[Mokele]

How do you eat an elephant ?

 

Chunk by chunk.

 

This is actually a good attitude to have. Most truly great discoveries didn't just fall out of the sky - they were the product of a tremendous work, effort, and time. Even regular, non-world-changing science papers are often the result of *years* of sustained effort.

[ajb]

What do you want me to invent or discover ?

 

A complete classification of Einstein manifolds for [math]d \geq 4[/math].

 

Seriously, have fun discovering science and mathematics for yourself

[the tree]

This is actually a good attitude to have. Most truly great discoveries didn't just fall out of the sky - they were the product of a tremendous work, effort, and time. Even regular, non-world-changing science papers are often the result of *years* of sustained effort.

Not to mention that it's rarely an individual effort.

[The Clairvoyant]

Cheers all.

 

Give me one book I should read (reference) and another one to stimulate my brain into some scientific thinking (fiction/biography/anything). In you all I put my trust !

 

I've read Hawkings Time thing. Enjoyed the first page, then it got a bit tricky.

[iNow]

I enjoyed "The Magic Furnace" by Marcus Chown. Also, "Blackholes, Wormholes, and Time Warps: Einstein's Outrageous Legacy" by Kip Thorne. Both are somewhat dated, but very informative and accessible.

 

 

...Oh yeah... "Six Easy Pieces" and "Six Not So Easy Pieces" by Richard Feynman.

[the tree]

I've read Hawkings Time thing. Enjoyed the first page, then it got a bit tricky.

If Brief History Of Time was too tricky then take a look at The Universe In A Nutshell - also by Hawkings and largely covering the same content.

[The Clairvoyant]

Cheers Guys. I will check out those books and have some good reading time. I'll let you know how I get on.

[John Phoenix]

I would like you to invent or discover:

 

Scientist who are open minded to the point where they believe that they don't know everything, that they should always challenge the so called laws of physics because these laws can always be wrong or at least upgraded given new understanding.

 

These Scientist should always say " 'blank' appears to be not possible now with our present understanding of science" and never say " 'blank' is impossible, my understanding of science is so absolute I can never be wrong and my science can never fail" because in 100 or 200 years when the worlds perceptions about science changes all these guys will look really foolish with all the 'knew' they were right about. After all this is what has happened to science in the past few hundred years. History will always repeat itself.

 

I am convinced if we had more of this type of scientist we would have already solved the worlds energy and hunger problems and quite possibly by on our way to traveling the universe through hyperspace ships and beaming down to the planets we wish to explore.

 

Yes, invent for me or discover these types of scientists. The world could benefit from this more than it could benefit from anything else.

[Sisyphus]

I would like you to invent or discover:

 

Scientist who are open minded to the point where they believe that they don't know everything,

 

A scientist by definition does not believe that he knows everything.

[ajb]

A scientist by definition does not believe that he knows everything.

 

Even if he starts out believing he knows it all, he will quickly come to the realisation of how little he actually does know.

[Sisyphus]

Especially since the job description doesn't make any sense in the case of already knowing everything.

[John Phoenix]

That's well said.. but if you read enough post on here you will see that a lot of scientist don't ACT as if that is true... <grin>

[The Clairvoyant]

I would like you to invent or discover:

 

Scientist who are open minded to the point where they believe that they don't know everything, that they should always challenge the so called laws of physics because these laws can always be wrong or at least upgraded given new understanding.

 

.

 

It's a good point. This is my first step into Science and already I feel that I have to do things in a certain way. I don't feel free to explore, to go off at a tangent, to drift or to discover.

 

I feel that if I have a light bulb moment then I will need to justify it and argue it's case when in fact that might just be wasting time.

 

Sometimes the proof is in the pudding, not in the cooking instructions.

 

Having said that, the responses on here and on the 'magic' thread have all been helpful and helped me build an initial picture in my mind as to what the world of science is all about and who the people are who inhabit it.

 

It's my beginning and i'm enjoying finding out.