Al Franken shows teabaggers can be reasoned with

[bascule]

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Al Franken isn't exactly known for reaching out to the other side, but here he is having a calm, rational discussion with a group of teabaggers. Will wonders never cease. I certainly couldn't talk to those people without losing my cool. Perhaps we're seeing a more mature Senator Franken.

Perhaps there is hope.

[Pangloss]

Yeah how about that? He doesn't insult their intelligence or call them "teabaggers", he patiently listens to their concerns and thanks them for their passion and interest, and then explains a different point of view. Shocking! I guess the far left is really upset with him!

 

But yeah, I'm really glad to hear Al Franken doing that and not playing the blame-Republicans game (as he usually did on his show). Thanks for passing that along.

[bascule]

Yeah how about that? He doesn't insult their intelligence or call them "teabaggers", he patiently listens to their concerns and thanks them for their passion and interest, and then explains a different point of view. Shocking!

 

I'd like to contrast this with how the people he was interacting with were operating. They like to yell! They don't really have anything intelligent to say, but they make up for it in VOLUME!

 

Yes, this is the same type of person who's wandering into a townhall. The issues involved are rather complex! Perhaps before you voice an opinion you should do some basic research, look at the available alternatives, and based on the evidence you have gathered decide what type of healthcare system you would advocate.

 

These sorts of people aren't really doing that. They're angry, but they don't even seem to really know why, and they certainly don't have coherent arguments. "Grr, taxes!" That's all I really hear out of them, however for some reason this wasn't an issue when a Republican was president.

 

It's a nice dichotomy.

 

I guess the far left is really upset with him!

 

Franken is a "far left" individual who not only got elected senator, but is able to have rational discourse with teabaggers. Perhaps you've misjudged the "far left". Perhaps the Frankens, Olbermanns, Maddows, Mahrers, and Stewarts are actually capable of rational discourse and objective, evidence-based thinking, whereas these skills are not equally reciprocated among the O'Reillys, Becks, Hannitys, Coulters, Limbaughs, and, well... Savages on the right.

 

There used to be a public discourse in this country, but since Obama has been elected it seems like it's been overwhelmed with endless noise from "the right". These are people who don't have ideas but are angry at what "the left" is trying to do. They are merely contrarians who have no knowledge of the issues and simply seek to be interruptive.

 

I miss actually having a public discourse.

[The Bear's Key]

I'd like to contrast this with how the people he was interacting with were operating. They like to yell! They don't really have anything intelligent to say, but they make up for it in VOLUME!

Nobody yelled. Or even raised their voice obnoxiously loud. At several town halls it's certainly occurred, but in your vid they seemed fairly calm.

(After looking on YouTube directly, I see the vid's poster claims it started out loud but Franken quickly calmed them....)*

 

Plus we're just assuming everyone in the crowd is a teabagger, when only the lady's got the shirt on.

(...and the poster did claim the group was all teabaggers)*

 

In any case, I think Al Franken seems a person able to take level-headed and firm control of a situation before it can escalate.

 

 

*corrections, after seeing the vid directly on YouTube

 

(the vid's title can be seen as misleading if someone didn't read its poster's notes)

 

The issues involved are rather complex! Perhaps before you voice an opinion you should do some basic research, look at the available alternatives, and based on the evidence you have gathered decide what type of healthcare system you would advocate.

Definitely.

 

...and they certainly don't have coherent arguments.

But they do have coherent questions, such as how it's going to be paid for. Of course, much of their anger has to do with misinformation they hear about costs, while not being informed about the savings -- or playing deaf to any mention of that due to heated emotions.

 

"Grr, taxes!" That's all I really hear out of them, however for some reason this wasn't an issue when a Republican was president.

If they only knew how much of a hand the usual promisers of "lower taxes" have in the whole problem. A bit of research there could be insightful and eye-opening.

 

There used to be a public discourse in this country, but since Obama has been elected it seems like it's been overwhelmed with endless noise from "the right". These are people who don't have ideas but are angry at what "the left" is trying to do.

It started way before Obama. We just noticed it more during Bush and now its surge after Obama -- as pundits went into hysteria overdrive, because their system's possibly never been so threatened.

 

What's sucky is having to count on Dems to finally stand up, and who, as the majority power, are still tiptoeing around the politicians of the Right...almost seemingly with fear. Is there any reason for this? What does the Right have in their arsenal that has Dems so cautious?

Edited September 5, 2009 by The Bear's Key
corrections

[Pangloss]

Franken is a "far left" individual who not only got elected senator, but is able to have rational discourse

 

Sure, absolutely.

 

Just speaking for myself, I've never doubted that that return to civility (the lost public discourse you refer to) could come from either side of the aisle. Though I readily confess I didn't expect to see it from Al Franken. I'm still just completely aghast that he went ten full minutes without mentioning George Bush or the Republican party. I'm floored. But hey, I'm glad to see it. Really glad. He won HUGE points from me with that video. It's exactly what drew me to vote for Obama.

 

As for the rest, I'll just second what TBK said above. The right is just repeating what the left did to Bush, which was a repeat of what the right did to Clinton. I think we have to break the cycle of political partisanship, which in my view is no less dangerous and emotional than the cycle of violence and retribution in the Middle East.

 

I saw this video posted on some of my more liberal friends blogs and Facebook today, and it seemed to me that many of them learned the wrong lesson from this. It's not about putting those stupid "teabaggers" in their place. It's about respectful discourse and listening to one another's concerns. Those who support health care reform here at SFN, such as yourself and iNow, have been respectful and listened to the points of view put forth by myself, ParanoiA, and others, and then put forth your own opinions, even agreeing when we found shortcomings in the approaches that we're looking at. We've had an informative and detailed discussion that's probably impacted on every single person who read it. That's awesome.

 

The whole country needs that public discourse, as you put it. We shouldn't implement ANY health care system -- or any OTHER political plan -- just because so-and-so says it's a good idea. Not ever! But with health care the problem is even more insidious, because nobody -- not one person on this entire planet -- knows how to do health care without any drawbacks.

 

So I'm really glad Al Franken is out there telling people what he thinks, and listening to what they think, on this issue. That's awesome. That's exactly how this country is supposed to work.

[The Bear's Key]

Though I readily confess I didn't expect to see it from Al Franken.

Yeah I didn't really enjoy his approaches until this video. Hopefully it's a permanent change, no act. He does seem candid, but then so do actors.

 

As for the rest, I'll just second what TBK said above. The right is just repeating what the left did to Bush, which was a repeat of what the right did to Clinton.

I didn't say that

 

My description's of neocons steadily generating anger build-up till the 2000 elections, afterwards going full-on lockstep and terror boogeyman-ing, and now the modern equivalent of the Red Scare propaganda -- except today it's not China, but Obama.

 

The whole country needs that public discourse, as you put it. We shouldn't implement ANY health care system -- or any OTHER political plan -- just because so-and-so says it's a good idea. Not ever!

Agreed.

[Pangloss]

I could have phrased that better. I was just agreeing with your point that it started way before Obama.

[iNow]

I really like the studious approach we're seeing from ole' Al... An SNL vet.

 

Here, from last weeks hearings:

 

 

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h/t Effect Measure

In this clip from hearings this week he nails a witness from the right wing Hudson Institute pimping for the health care industry. Her claim? That health care reform would lead to more bankruptcies. He makes his point and thanks the witness, but she tries to score with a question of her own. Bad move. It turns out Franken knows the answer:

[bob000555]

Senator Franken is doing a very good job of shutting up people who thought his congressional career would be a joke.

 

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[bascule]

Yeah, Al Franken and Alan Grayson are definitely the two standout Democrats of this Congress who actually seem willing to take a stand and call out their opponents. I was beginning to think the Democrats don't have a spine.

[uncool]

His congressional career is a joke. A cruel joke on the idiots he takes down.

=Uncool-

[bascule]

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Edited October 26, 2009 by bascule
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