I for one am FED UP with the evermore INVASIVE efforts against our PRIVACY

[dr.syntax]

Young people nowdays seem to take it for granted that Governmental and private entities of ANY sort nave some RIGHT to gather as much information as they can aquire about you for any purpose they may wish to. If you have any doubt about that read the different EULAs you have electronically agreed to. A good example would be the" Adobe EULA ". No one ever reads them, but they are legalling binding contracts that inform you that they can gather any information about you for any reason whatsoever. Not only they can pass this information on to anyone for any reason. Also that you shall no recourse should any harm come to you by their SHARING this information with affiliates and third parties.

An invasion of my privacy happened to me today. I was asked for my drivers license when buying some beer. So what you say. Well, she wasn`t verifing my age , she went and recorded specifics about me into some computer system. I asked her what are you doing and she told me she was required to do this. I asked by who. She said by the State of New York. I took the beer and left, I think she lied to me because this has never occurred with me here in New York before. If it is true it is some new police spying system some dickhead dreamed up and will be happening more and more, I have been living outside of New York for less than a year,so maybe there has been some change in the laws which would only emphasize my point in all this. What has happened to: THE LAND OF THE FREE AND THE HOME OF THE BRAVE since I was a young man sickens me with the passive non-response by the public as the Corporations and Government intrude ever more into our private lives. ...Dr.Syntax

[iNow]

An invasion of my privacy happened to me today. I was asked for my drivers license when buying some beer. So what you say. Well, she wasn`t verifing my age , she went and recorded specifics about me into some computer system. I asked her what are you doing and she told me she was required to do this. I asked by who. She said by the State of New York.

 

How did you pay? Did you purchase your beer using cash, check, or credit/debit card?

 

Also, how long did she spend entering information? Was it just a second or three, or was it more than 20-30 seconds? I ask, because at the stores here in TX they have to key in the DOB before they can complete the sale. It's possible this clerk was merely keying in the DOB, and that's why I asked how long it took her.

[dr.syntax]

How did you pay? Did you purchase your beer using cash, check, or credit/debit card?

 

Also, how long did she spend entering information? Was it just a second or three, or was it more than 20-30 seconds? I ask, because at the stores here in TX they have to key in the DOB before they can complete the sale. It's possible this clerk was merely keying in the DOB, and that's why I asked how long it took her.

 

REPLY: I am old enough that no would doubt I was way over 21. I would say she spent about 2 minutes taking information from my drivers license and doing something with it. Also, I have purchased beer at other locations here in New York State and never been asked for my driver`s license. The whole incident angered me and makes me paranoid as to what she was up to.

There is another thing I have noticed that is an entirely new phenomenon. This happened in Iowa. Every where I went to get a hair cut of all things. they would demand I give them my phone number. The first time I went along with it. Now I tell them I don`t have a phone.

I know these incidents are not some horror story. But I see it all, and especially those awful EULAs you pretty much have to agree to if you want to use a computer as an increasing toward the loss of what few privacy rights still exist. There are organizations, both public and private devoted to gathering as much information as possible about each and every one of us to use for whatever reason they wish to. They sell this information to anyone willing to pay for it. This disturbs me greatly. That whole " BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING YOU " has become all to real. Regards, ...Dr.Syntax...... Hello iNow. I just realized it was you i was responding to. I appreciate your taking an interest in this issue and truly do wish you well. ...Dr.Syntax

Edited October 24, 2009 by dr.syntax

[CharonY]

Some shops want to minimize the risk of selling alcohol to minors. Many (especially chains) therefore have implemented the rule that if the buyer looks younger than 35-40 (varies from shop to shop) the driver's license has to be shown.

But of course other info including zip code are also often picked up. I have no idea at why you would assume that the government has a hand in it, as this info is mostly used for marketing purposes (or sold for the same reason). If the the government (e.g. police) wanted to know what you are buying they usually just get your credit card info (which probably is also somehow sold by the credit card company).

In fact it is more likely that the private sector is toying around with your private information as they have more direct interest in it.

[DJBruce]

Many companies keep basic records on their customers in order to better their customer service. For example, I am a crew leader at a pizza chain, we keep track of a person's name, phone number, order history, complaint history, and address. The only reason we keep a record of this is because it allows us to give the customer better service. For example many many people say, "What I had last time was really good. I want that again, but I don't remember what it was." Since we have a customers order history I can look it up and the customer gets what they wants. I assume that is the same reason the hairstylist asked your phone number. As when I get a haircut they know how I like my hair cut without asking me.

[insane_alien]

personally, i wouldn't choose to go to that pizza place or a hairdresser who asked for my phonenumber (for business purposes at least, and then depending on gender and attractiveness).

 

As it turns out, my hairdresser does know what i usually want him to do to my hair. this is merely because i have had the same hairdresser since i was two but still, no information was passed that i didn't want passed.

 

i'm also on first name terms with the bar staff in both of my villages pubs and the bars in the students union at my university.

 

even the staff in the starbucks i sometimes go to on my way to uni know me.

 

also the people who work at the trainstation.

 

none of these relationships were made by me handing over information like my post code or ID (well, with the pubs it required ID a few times till they knew my face). i'd like to keep it that way.

 

i have no problems with handing over ID if there is a sufficient reason for it. like buying alcohol(although i'm getting out of the stage where i could be mistaken for an 18 year old and i certainly wouldn't let them copy information into a computer from it i'd go elsewhere for beer) or if i'm renting something from a business(even down to a video shop)

[dr.syntax]

Many companies keep basic records on their customers in order to better their customer service. For example, I am a crew leader at a pizza chain, we keep track of a person's name, phone number, order history, complaint history, and address. The only reason we keep a record of this is because it allows us to give the customer better service. For example many many people say, "What I had last time was really good. I want that again, but I don't remember what it was." Since we have a customers order history I can look it up and the customer gets what they wants. I assume that is the same reason the hairstylist asked your phone number. As when I get a haircut they know how I like my hair cut without asking me.

 

 

REPLY: This may be true for this pizza chain you referred to. But this is not true of all the organizations devoted to gathering and selling information about every one they can. Also, it was not one hair salon I visited that REQUIRED my telephone number but all of the three different ones I visited. I informed them I do not like giving ot my phone number to strangers and was told it was required. So it was not something being done to help me in anyway as I was clear about not wanting to go along with this policy. As I stated , when people I don`t know ask me for my phone number I tell them I don`t have a phone. I have never been refused service yet when using this tactic. Big Brother is Alive and watching you. If you doubt this do a google search using only your name and see what pops up. Also pay attention to all the websites offering to provide much more information about you for about 25 to 30 dollars. Do that and tell me you have no concerns about this issue. Whatever, ...Dr.Syntax

[DJBruce]

REPLY: This may be true for this pizza chain you referred to. But this is not true of all the organizations devoted to gathering and selling information about every one they can. Also, it was not one hair salon I visited that REQUIRED my telephone number but all of the three different ones I visited. I informed them I do not like giving ot my phone number to strangers and was told it was required. So it was not something being done to help me in anyway as I was clear about not wanting to go along with this policy. As I stated , when people I don`t know ask me for my phone number I tell them I don`t have a phone. I have never been refused service yet when using this tactic. Big Brother is Alive and watching you. If you doubt this do a google search using only your name and see what pops up. Also pay attention to all the websites offering to provide much more information about you for about 25 to 30 dollars. Do that and tell me you have no concerns about this issue. Whatever, ...Dr.Syntax

 

Googled "David John Bruce" and I came up with 32,800,000 results not one of them in the first 13 pages was about me. I then Googled my name and full address, still nothing.

 

Do I have concerns about spyware and other malicious software stealing my identity? Yes, that why I have antivirus/antispyware. Am I worried about telling the teenager working the counter at the local 7/11, pizza place, or saloon my name and phone number, absolutely not.

[iNow]

Also, it was not one hair salon I visited that REQUIRED my telephone number but all of the three different ones I visited. I informed them I do not like giving ot my phone number to strangers and was told it was required. So it was not something being done to help me in anyway as I was clear about not wanting to go along with this policy.

It's because they perform reminder calls the night before the appointment. They can't call you to remind you if you don't provide a phone number. It's that simple. Also, sometimes stylists go to other salons, but like to take their clients with them... They obviously need a phone number to inform them of the transfer. Nothing nefarious going on.

 

DJBruce also raises a good point. It's good to be aware of identity theft issues and inappropriate surveillance... However, it's important for your focus to be on the right things and at the right places. I'm relatively confident that the hair salon and pizza parlors are not your biggest threats.

[JillSwift]

Nothing makes me wonder more than the irony of posting about privacy concerns on the Internet, where you leave a little trail of your doings, via your IP address, everywhere you go.

[dr.syntax]

Nothing makes me wonder more than the irony of posting about privacy concerns on the Internet, where you leave a little trail of your doings, via your IP address, everywhere you go.

 

REPLY: Hello JillSwift, I am pleased to hear from you. I am well aware of that trail and it does concern me. Nevertheless I feel compelled to fight back when I sense the forces of repression gaining the upper hand in the Nation and World that I have no choice but to live and die in. The sooner we start to resist and fight back, the better our chances of prevailing.

It is not some noble ideals I try and live up to. It seems to be my instinctive reactions to perceived threats I sense out there. I say that because I have always had these instinctive reactions to people messing with me since I was a boy. I have suffered severely on a few occations. I had my guts blown out my back by a high powered rifle at very close range once over in Viet Nam for one example. I chose to involve myself in that war because I believed at that time the Soviet Union was truly determined to defeat us one way or another. I felt this proxy war was a necessary show on the part of the U.S. of a willingness to fight a costly war to stand up to them. There are many events that happened while I was growing up that led me to feel this way.

I not only survived that incident but was returned to Viet Nam for a second tour of duty. Things are not all that different today for Marines and Soldiers are they ?

Some things are worth fighting for. I believe very strongly in the importance of privacy. With all the right wing nuts out there trying to bully the rest of us into some sexless, joyless lifestyle, the time is past due to resist and fight back. It`s the way I am and I would not want to be any other way. Now, if I end up being burned at the stake I expect I may have second thoughts about all this at that time only. You take care JillSwift, ...Dr.Syntax

Edited October 25, 2009 by dr.syntax
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[insane_alien]

if you are really concerned about your privacy on the internet, there is an application called 'TOR' basically it takes your IP traffic, encrypts it, shunts it round various 'nodes' and then out a random 'exit node'.

 

the ones that know where to send the data do not know what they are sending and the ones that know what to send do not know where to send it(or something, i'm not to clear on the specifics) but it does give you anonimity on the internet(for free too).

 

there are a few downsides though, it makes the internet slow. really slow. think back to the days of 56k modems. this is due in part to the latencies involved in excessive routing and encryption of data and in part to the lack of people functioning as exit nodes while a lot of people are using it as users. essentialy you have a few hundred people all trying to get a share of the same internet connection.

[ydoaPs]

dr.syntax, if you're so concerned, do us all a favor. Close your browser and never open it again.

[insane_alien]

thats a bit uncalled for. you were worse in your early days here.

[ydoaPs]

thats a bit uncalled for. you were worse in your early days here.

 

I was being serious; it's the only way to maintain your privacy. If he's so concerned, he needs to live off the grid(no computer, no cell phone, no credit card, etc).

 

It is not obligatory to use the programs which have license agreements.

[dr.syntax]

Some shops want to minimize the risk of selling alcohol to minors. Many (especially chains) therefore have implemented the rule that if the buyer looks younger than 35-40 (varies from shop to shop) the driver's license has to be shown.

But of course other info including zip code are also often picked up. I have no idea at why you would assume that the government has a hand in it, as this info is mostly used for marketing purposes (or sold for the same reason). If the the government (e.g. police) wanted to know what you are buying they usually just get your credit card info (which probably is also somehow sold by the credit card company).

In fact it is more likely that the private sector is toying around with your private information as they have more direct interest in it.

 

 

REPLY:Hello CharnY, As far as age goes, I am a Viet Nam War veteran, so you can know by that information that I am way beyond the age when anyone would ever question my being 21 or not. She may have recorded my address along with my date of birth I would imagine. This is the sort of information that can be used for identity theft. Surely you have heard of that. Also, personal information about people is a tradeable commodity . If you doubt that, do a google search using your name only. You may be unpleasantly surprised at what all pops up along with people offering to do background checks and such on you for 25 to 30 dollars, Something like that. I have since that time purchased beer at other locations and no one has ever asked to see my drivers licence. I expect she is either gathering data about people as a sideline bussiness of her own, or she is one of these people who enjoy snooping on others herself. When I complained about the high price of cigarrettes [ over 8 dollars a pack ] she let me know she thought they should charge more. She didn`t like me because I am a cigarette smoker. And then when I went and bought some beer she must of figured I was some sort of heathen. She is probably one of these right wing Christian nuts who keeps tabs on her fellow citizens. There are a lot of these types in UPSTATE NEW YORK, along with much of the rest of the country.

Maybe you see nothing wrong about all this snooping, I don`t know. I see a lot wrong with it. A man was arrested for being naked in his own kitchen recently at 5:30 in the morning. A woman who was trespassing on his property at that early hour took it upon herself to call the police and they went along with thiss nonsense and arrested him. If it had been a man trespassing and peeking in a womans window at that early hour you can be assured HE would have been arrested, not her. I could go on but those EULAs you had to have signed to use a computer ought to concern you. Do that google search on your name and see how happy that makes you. ...Dr.Syntax

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I was being serious; it's the only way to maintain your privacy. If he's so concerned, he needs to live off the grid(no computer, no cell phone, no credit card, etc).

 

It is not obligatory to use the programs which have license agreements.

 

 

REPLY: YEAH RIGHT, that`s the way to answer this problem. How about we people start demanding some privacy protection rights. By the way a part of most of those EULAs is that you shall have no recourse under any circumstances should harm come to you as a result of their practices. Say someone stole your Identity and managed to extract a large amount of money from an account of yours because someone gained personal information about you because some one at " adobe " sold it to them. Read that "adobe " EULA. Do a google search on your name and see how pleased you are with the results. ...Dr.Syntax

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Googled "David John Bruce" and I came up with 32,800,000 results not one of them in the first 13 pages was about me. I then Googled my name and full address, still nothing.

 

Do I have concerns about spyware and other malicious software stealing my identity? Yes, that why I have antivirus/antispyware. Am I worried about telling the teenager working the counter at the local 7/11, pizza place, or saloon my name and phone number, absolutely not.

 

REPLY: Well, I`ve probably been around a good bit longer than you, bought homes and such which gives all sorts of different entities access to a whole lot of information about you. You`ve been lucky up till now. I wouldn`t count lasting fore ever. ...DS

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REPLY:Hello CharnY, As far as age goes, I am a Viet Nam War veteran, so you can know by that information that I am way beyond the age when anyone would ever question my being 21 or not. She may have recorded my address along with my date of birth I would imagine. This is the sort of information that can be used for identity theft. Surely you have heard of that. Also, personal information about people is a tradeable commodity . If you doubt that, do a google search using your name only. You may be unpleasantly surprised at what all pops up along with people offering to do background checks and such on you for 25 to 30 dollars, Something like that. I have since that time purchased beer at other locations and no one has ever asked to see my drivers licence. I expect she is either gathering data about people as a sideline bussiness of her own, or she is one of these people who enjoy snooping on others herself. When I complained about the high price of cigarrettes [ over 8 dollars a pack ] she let me know she thought they should charge more. She didn`t like me because I am a cigarette smoker. And then when I went and bought some beer she must of figured I was some sort of heathen. She is probably one of these right wing Christian nuts who keeps tabs on her fellow citizens. There are a lot of these types in UPSTATE NEW YORK, along with much of the rest of the country.

Maybe you see nothing wrong about all this snooping, I don`t know. I see a lot wrong with it. A man was arrested for being naked in his own kitchen recently at 5:30 in the morning. A woman who was trespassing on his property at that early hour took it upon herself to call the police and they went along with thiss nonsense and arrested him. If it had been a man trespassing and peeking in a womans window at that early hour you can be assured HE would have been arrested, not her. I could go on but those EULAs you had to have signed to use a computer ought to concern you. Do that google search on your name and see how happy that makes you. ...Dr.Syntax

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REPLY: YEAH RIGHT, that`s the way to answer this problem. How about we people start demanding some privacy protection rights. By the way a part of most of those EULAs is that you shall have no recourse under any circumstances should harm come to you as a result of their practices. Say someone stole your Identity and managed to extract a large amount of money from an account of yours because someone gained personal information about you because some one at " adobe " sold it to them. Read that "adobe " EULA. Do a google search on your name and see how pleased you are with the results. ...Dr.Syntax

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REPLY: Well, I`ve probably been around a good bit longer than you, bought homes and such which gives all sorts of different entities access to a whole lot of information about you. You`ve been lucky up till now. I wouldn`t count on that luck lasting fore ever. ...DS

 

REPLY: You have to type in something like: WHO IS, INVESTIGATE,I WANT TO KNOW ALL ABOUT+ your name to get any results. I apologize for not stating it the way you have to, to get results doing a google search on yourself or anyone else for that matter. Sorry, ...Dr. Syntax

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Googled "David John Bruce" and I came up with 32,800,000 results not one of them in the first 13 pages was about me. I then Googled my name and full address, still nothing.

 

Do I have concerns about spyware and other malicious software stealing my identity? Yes, that why I have antivirus/antispyware. Am I worried about telling the teenager working the counter at the local 7/11, pizza place, or saloon my name and phone number, absolutely not.

 

REPLY: Try doing that search with : who is, I want to know all about,and investigate + your name . I should have been much clearer about how anyone can go about google searching anyone`s name and the sort of information so easily obtained. And if you are willing to pay a few bucks to one of these professional internet snoopers it becomes much more of a concern. I expect many of these prosnoops are policemen, any lawyer and such that can access records that are supposed to be off limits to the general public. Many seem to have this attitude of why should I care about this. One very good reason is called IDENTITY THEFT. I get the feeling many think: I have nothing to hide so why should I care. I just gave you one very good reason for you to care. ...Dr.Syntax

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[[MODE NOTE: INAPPROPRIATE BANTER DELETED]]

Edited October 26, 2009 by mooeypoo
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[mooeypoo]

Okay that's quite enough. Drop the attitude, all of you!

 

You have a report button on top of posts, use it!

 

No one here is stupid. Stop being so defensive, and stop leading one another towards personal insults. You are all adults, you are all perfectly aware of what you're doing: STOP IT.

 

~moo

[dr.syntax]

if you are really concerned about your privacy on the internet, there is an application called 'TOR' basically it takes your IP traffic, encrypts it, shunts it round various 'nodes' and then out a random 'exit node'.

 

the ones that know where to send the data do not know what they are sending and the ones that know what to send do not know where to send it(or something, i'm not to clear on the specifics) but it does give you anonimity on the internet(for free too).

 

there are a few downsides though, it makes the internet slow. really slow. think back to the days of 56k modems. this is due in part to the latencies involved in excessive routing and encryption of data and in part to the lack of people functioning as exit nodes while a lot of people are using it as users. essentialy you have a few hundred people all trying to get a share of the same internet connection.

 

REPLY: I appreciate your feed back regarding all this. Boy,that is a big downside. If it makes it the same as using a 56k modem it really has a very big effect on what you can do. Just downloading updates to my security programs and windows updates became at times a 10 to 20 hour process that as often as not would fail and I would have to start all over again. But, please know that I appreciate your expert advise when it comes to technological know how.Sincerely, ...Dr.Syntax

Edited October 26, 2009 by dr.syntax
spelling

[ydoaPs]

REPLY: YEAH RIGHT, that`s the way to answer this problem. How about we people start demanding some privacy protection rights. By the way a part of most of those EULAs is that you shall have no recourse under any circumstances should harm come to you as a result of their practices. Say someone stole your Identity and managed to extract a large amount of money from an account of yours because someone gained personal information about you because some one at " adobe " sold it to them. Read that "adobe " EULA. Do a google search on your name and see how pleased you are with the results. ...Dr.Syntax

You know the agreements are there. No one is forcing you to use the programs. IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE AGREEMENTS, DON'T USE THE PROGRAM.

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You are all adults

 

I know you are, but what am I?

[dr.syntax]

dr.syntax, if you're so concerned, do us all a favor. Close your browser and never open it again.

 

REPLY: I have no desire to do you any favor you arrogant whatever. Why would I ? So spare me your snide remarks and I`ll do the same. ...DS

[mooeypoo]

When I asked everyone to stop with the bickering, I meant everyone.

 

Please don't make the moderators take a more permanent action for the sake of attitude of the posters in this thread. If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. Keep your insults to yourselves.

 

All of you.

 

~moo

[JillSwift]

Syntax:

 

If the EULAs and licences of proprietary software gives you reason to pause, may I suggest looking into Free/Open Source Software.

 

Operating systems like those based on Linux or FreeBSD don't come with a corporation hungry for information on their customers.

 

For first time users of Linux, I suggest Ubuntu. It's arguably the easiest to use of all the flavors of Linux, and comes with an on-line repository of free and open source programs to cover just about any computing need you have.

 

I'm unsure how to maintain any level of freedom from intrusion in interaction with most companies away from my computer, but on my computer this is pretty much tops.

[dr.syntax]

Syntax:

 

If the EULAs and licences of proprietary software gives you reason to pause, may I suggest looking into Free/Open Source Software.

 

Operating systems like those based on Linux or FreeBSD don't come with a corporation hungry for information on their customers.

 

For first time users of Linux, I suggest Ubuntu. It's arguably the easiest to use of all the flavors of Linux, and comes with an on-line repository of free and open source programs to cover just about any computing need you have.

 

I'm unsure how to maintain any level of freedom from intrusion in interaction with most companies away from my computer, but on my computer this is pretty much tops.

 

REPLY: Thank you JillSwift, I am hitting that link and heading there now. Good night my friend, ...Dr.Syntax

[Pantaz]

...

I'm unsure how to maintain any level of freedom from intrusion in interaction with most companies away from my computer, but on my computer this is pretty much tops.

 

If I don't want to give a company/website my personal information, I just use a fake name, address, phone, SSN, and of course, I dedicate a throw-away e-mail for SPAM. (The Firefox add-on FireForm actually has that as a feature.)

 

For things such as a grocery store "rewards card", I change the spelling of my name. I still receive my "rewards" coupons in the mail, but if they sell my info to a mailing list, I can easily identify the junk mail.

[insane_alien]

dr.syntax, you don't need to have all internet traffic going through tor. updates would be fine without (they're hardly exclusive to you are they? kind of like saying you want all menus for local chinese takeaways delivered in locked boxes for security reasons).