Star Trek - Where To Start

[MulderMan]

Ive been a avid xfiles fan all my life, but now i think its time to get a bit of star trek experiance. I went on Sayo's site the other day and found it usefull. I just want to know where is the best place to start, the best series and the like. What tv channels its on if all, best place to learn about it in general, the ships + the characters. I watched the movie last night on sci-fi, where spock died.

 

Thanks.

[ydoaPs]

for a beginner, i would suggest the last few seasons of TNG. it is on SpikeTV.

[Guest Endeavour3d]

I would think it would be best to start with the Original Series first, to most it is very corny so you could just skip it and move onto the first 6 movies instead. Try TNG and Deep Space Nine, they are both being shown on SpikeTV, avoid Voyager if you can...

 

DITL.org has alot of information, some of it is speculative however, it is still a good resource, as well as http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/index.htm

 

Ironic, the first thread I post in is about Star Trek, I'm actually a heavy Trek fan..heh

[Sayonara]

"Avoid Voyager"?

 

Heathen.

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

I've never seen voyager!

 

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!

[YT2095]

the YT likes Voyager (although it`s a bit "hammy" at times) if there`s anything to AVOID, "Enterprise" would be it!

[Guest Endeavour3d]

"Avoid Voyager"?

 

Heathen.

There are few good episodes, but most were mostly a slap in the face of continuity. Lots of recycled storylines, time travel was used to the point of stupidity, characters that had no purpose other than sex appeal (no name needed). Mostly what pissed me off was the bad writing, EndGame was a weak ending for a series that had potential. If Rick Berman and Brannon Bragga were fired from the start, brought in some good producers, they could have saved the show. I actually liked the premise and I liked the characters, but it was all wasted when B&B decided to be the morons they are... Bah, I watch Stargate now so meh..

[ydoaPs]

voyager is good. most newbies would like enterprise. it is good for dipping into the startrek universe for the first time.

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

If they liked Enterprise, then to them, Voyager or TNG would be heaven.

In other words, Enterprise sucks.

[ydoaPs]

what is wrong with enterprise?

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

IT SUCKS!

Believe me. I've seen it. And don't continue discussing this, because I can tell you have strange opinions on EVERYTHING.

[ydoaPs]

how do i have strange opinions on everything? you don't even know me.

 

if you don't like enterprise, then don't tell people not to watch it. maybe they would like it. i don't like DS9, but you don't see me saying "deep space nine sux ass."

[Sayonara]

I think Enterprise is awful too, but I still watch it. For all their weaknesses, it has to be noted that Berman and Braga have avoiding messing too much with the pre-history of Trek that was established in the other series and films (assuming they don't cock up the end of the Temporal Cold War).

 

You asked what's wrong with it:

 

- It has pushed zero (count 'em, zero) boundaries since it began (which is the point of sci fi, and the Star Trek tradition)

 

- It has had few interesting stories, and the majority of the plots are recycled

 

- Every character except for Phlox has been pulled out of the standard 2D ensemble bin

 

- Despite the constant complaints from Voy fans that "devoting" an episode to a character is not a substitute for developing the characters properly, they continued the trend

 

- Characters frequently do things that make no sense whatsoever or are contrary to their training

 

- The structures of the scripts are not of a consistent quality, which is amateurish

 

- The dialogue is appalling

 

- The technobabble - which should have become more realistic - has got worse

 

- The stories and dialogue frequently incorporate really basic scientific errors

 

- There are too many TOS pastiche episodes. Are they aiming at the old skool fans, or a new generation? They need to decide

 

- The sophistication of the Enterprise's weapons and defences seems to be highly variable

 

- Scott Bakula is the hammiest actor in the Alpha Quadrant

 

- Still, the costume and props people insist on giving every alien goon and planet-side civilian clothes that are brand new and shiny, equipment that has obviously never been used, spotless quarters etc etc. It's just not realistic.

[atinymonkey]

- Scott Bakula is the hammiest actor in the Alpha Quadrant

 

Now, that's the odd thing. Scott Bakula is actually a sound workhorse of an actor, not great but better than most. We know he can play 'smart' from Quantum Leap, was in American Beauty (Oscar for best picture) which show how he can perform under a skilled director, he can carry a sci fi film with screen presence (Lord of Illusions) but dosen't seem to have got Capt Archer defined at all. He seems to have been told to drop his voice two octaves when he's being official and when he's off duty he never stays still (sways, paces and fidgets) I presume to show a dynamic man. It just doesn't fit his style of acting, nor does it portray someone you would trust with the flagship of Starfleet.

 

All of the crew, short of the aliens, need to be acting like the actual military personnel they are portraying. FFS they are supposed to be the very best selection of scientific minds available trained by the military and in peak physical condition, like the current astronauts. The crew just seems to be confused most of the time (or plain crazy) and patting themselves on the back every second scene. Plus, the whole Archer 'Trip is my best pal' just doesn't work as it's obvious the actors don't get on at all (they are separated by a 20 year age gap for a start).

[Sayonara]

Now, that's the odd thing. Scott Bakula is actually a sound workhorse of an actor, not great but better than most. We know he can play 'smart' from Quantum Leap, was in American Beauty (Oscar for best picture) which show how he can perform under a skilled director, he can carry a sci fi film with screen presence (Lord of Illusions) but dosen't seem to have got Capt Archer defined at all.

I don't think you can call him a "sound workhouse" just because you looked at his profile on IMDB. Come on, I am sat right next to you. The fact that American Beauty won Best Picture has little to do with Bakula's talent, and even less to do with the way he presents his lines on Enterprise.

I haven't seen Lord of Illusions but while I accept he may have had presence I don't believe for a moment that Bakula managed to deliver lines in a non-schlocky fashion.

 

"Better than most" is fairly subjective. He's only better than most because of the vast number of appalling actors on the screen. I think you might be interpreting "...in the Alpha Quadrant" literally, whereas I meant it in the sense that he is the worst actor on the show.

 

One has to wonder why, if he's a good actor, he doesn't bother to act well in his role on one of the most widely recognised shows ever made, considering it is both his source of income and what he has chosen to be known for.

 

 

He seems to have been told to drop his voice two octaves when he's being official and when he's off duty he never stays still (sways, paces and fidgets) I presume to show a dynamic man. It just doesn't fit his style of acting, nor does it portray someone you would trust with the flagship of Starfleet.

No, not in the least.

[atinymonkey]

I don't think you can call him a "sound workhouse" just because you looked at his profile on IMDB. Come on, I am[/i'] sat right next to you. The fact that American Beauty won Best Picture has little to do with Bakula's talent, and even less to do with the way he presents his lines on Enterprise.

 

Actually, he not only acted in American Beauty he also provided the filmography alongside Mendes and Steven Speilberg. Even without reviews of his performance to hand, you can guess that he's a respected actor from that and nothing else.

 

I don't think looking at IMDB detracts from my ability to voice my opinion on an actor I've watched for over 15 years of my life. Besides which, I defy you to recite any actors film appearances without reference.

 

I haven't seen Lord of Illusions but while I accept he may have had presence I don't believe for a moment that Bakula managed to deliver lines in a non-schlocky fashion.

 

"Better than most" is fairly subjective. He's only better than most because of the vast number of appalling actors on the screen. I think you might be interpreting "...in the Alpha Quadrant" literally' date=' whereas I meant it in the sense that he is the worst actor on the show.[/quote']

 

In Lord of Illusions he was almost exactly the definition of non-schlocky, as in not a iridescent performance but not wooden either. The point is he does have a range of abilities and is able to act convincingly, he just doesn't in Enterprise. Whether he's hampered by the producers or just got the whole characterization wrong, he's not doing his best.

 

He's not the worst actor on the show, Malcom is pretty bad as is Mayweather. Bakula's character just don't fit convincingly into his surroundings, which is jarring for a man captaining a hand picked crew in a ship he built.

 

One has to wonder why' date=' if he's a good actor, he doesn't bother to act well in his role on one of the most widely recognised shows ever made, considering it is both his source of income and what he has chosen to be known for.

[/quote']

 

I don't know. Maybe he know's he's set for life, lets face it the crap actors in Star Trek don't seem to be removed (apart from Will Weaton). It could just be the micromanagement of him by the producers, like Janways hair, that give him contradicting motivations (be angry, be xenophobic, be tolerant, be forceful, be funny, be bleedy).

[Sayonara]

Actually, he not only acted in American Beauty he also provided the filmography alongside Mendes and Steven Speilberg. Even without reviews of his performance to hand, you can guess that he's a respected actor from that and nothing else.

I'm still not certain how that relates to his poor performance on Enterprise. Are you suggesting I should overlook this massive detraction from my enjoyment of the series, just because he can do voice-over on bonus discs or because the studio-enslaved back-slappers he works with like to be seen to be pleased with their employment decisions?

 

 

I don't think looking at IMDB detracts from my ability to voice my opinion on an actor I've watched for over 15 years of my life. Besides which, I defy you to recite any actors film appearances without reference.

No, but it does detract from your credibility as a "Bakula expert" considering you just said you have watched him for over 15 years of your life.

One might reasonably expect his outstanding performances to stick out in your mind, seeing as you are such a long-time watcher. But no... even with the IMDB's help you bring us a film in which he was a tertiary character (and essentially a plot device, if you remember), which happened to win "Best Picture" at the Oscars - a feat that is somehow [as you suggested offline] attributable to everyone who worked on the film - and therefore makes Bakula super-great; and Lord of Illusions.

 

Whether or not I can recite an actor's performances rather depends on the actor, not that that is anything to do with this discussion.

 

 

He's not the worst actor on the show, Malcom is pretty bad as is Mayweather.

Malcolm and Mayweather don't make me cringe with every line, and they display range. Mayweather's character had virtually no lines in season 2 & 3 combined, which is really unfair considering he played the "fresh faced boomer" part very convincingly in S1.

Rather than the "worst actor" I think it would be more fair if I were to accuse Bakula of giving the most consistently poor performance.

 

 

Bakula's character just don't fit convincingly into his surroundings, which is jarring for a man captaining a hand picked crew in a ship he built.

Well quite. But it would help a great deal if he actually gave the character some character.