Why do men like lesbians so much?

[dstebbins]

Note, I'm putting this in the biology forum because there is no "sexology" forum. Also, I'm using this site (a science site) because I am not just looking for the reasons that you, personally, like lesbians, but rather, the scientific reason why they're so popular on a general level.

 

Think about it: Why do men enjoy homosexual porn of the opposite sex, but that same fetish is not near as widespread among women? How, exactly, does testosterone accomplish one thing, but estrogen does not accomplish the exact opposite?

 

Most guys give the reason of "twice the fun" for why they like lesbians, but that logic does not work with women liking gay men.

 

It is the job of scientists to inquire as to why lesbians are so popular among the sex they aren't attracted to, yet that does not work vice versa.

 

Why is that?

[gib65]

Personally, I think it's highly cultural, not biological.

 

But if there is a biological component, the "twice the fun" response would have some reasoning behind it when you consider it's the male of the species who is typically more polygomous/permiscuous. So it might be that lesbians - or rather bisexual women - would be more open to a polygomous relationship than heterosexual ones.

[Genecks]

Perhaps watching a man have sex with a woman will cause jealousy or a negative response in the male watching the pornography. As such, the male will like lesbian pornography more than male-female pornography.

 

Furthermore, I've read and heard that pornography attempts to remove the face of the male most of the time in order to give the male viewer the impression that he is the one in the scene with the woman.

 

p.s.

 

This would more than likely be better in the psychology board.

[Icefire]

Because, they're women, but Men can understand their thought patterns (mostly)

[Unite17]

most men want to be in "charge" or control things(me included), so it makes sense when a man does not want see another man have what he has. ( having sex)

[Darwinsbulldog]

Lots of females having sex, but without males! [Where is the downside???]

[CaptainPanic]

A woman only needs 1 man to become pregnant... but 1 man can make many women pregnant (unless they're very serious about being lesbian, and don't allow men near them... but the porn lesbians don't tend to be very strict).

 

Just my 2 cents.

[randomguy444]

my take on the subject is that a guys mind works like this 2 is better thern 1 where as a females mind is thinking what kind of bastard would watch that and besides who would get off on 2 guys?

[Little Bellamy]

Actually, a lot of girls like reading homosexual porn of the opposite sex - "slash fiction". It's a genre written almost entirely by women on the internet. As for men liking lesbians - I'd say the reasons differ among them, but someone I asked replied that it stimulated him more than heterosexual porn.

 

 

[Seiryuu]

Given that the percentage of heterosexual men outstrips men of any other sexuality, women are valued in porn. Heterosexual men don't like looking at other dudes' penises. Hence, lesbian porn seems to be liked the most.

 

Men are more visual; women, not as much. Women prefer emotions and imagination. Thus there is more literary erotica geared to women.

[Kehvan]

As studies have shown, many homophobic men are secretly experiencing their own homosexual desires, and they attempt to hide it behind a wall of antipathy for gay men.

 

Being a man who, at 18, expressed many homophobic opinions, it ought not surprise anyone that at 30 I came out as gay. Coinciding with my homophobic rants in my youth was the opinion that lesbians were hot, and me and my other friends routinely talked about the desire to have a sexual experiences with a couple of females; the idea of two guys and a girl was always castigated as "gay".

 

The more I've learned about psychology and human sexuality, the more I've come to the conclusion that men, in particular, young men, use the fantasy of two lesbians in order to avoid the hidden fascination they have with other men. In short, they're projecting their own deep seated fears about sexuality onto women as a defensive mechanism.

[Delta1212]

Just a point: The popular conception of testosterone and estrogen as the "male" and "female" hormones responsible for all differences between the sexes is a wild mischaracrerization.

 

They are both present in both sexes and do not do the same thing (or correspondingly opposite thing) for each sex.

[MirceaKitsune]

I think this is an interesting question, from a biological / psychological point of view... but which can probably have many answers.

 

One subconscious and less obvious reason might be that, because being gay has been (sadly) condemned and demonized over the course of history, some might consider it thrilling because it has an "out of the ordinary" status. The mind tends to be drawn to unusual things, when they're identified as something that doesn't pose a threat and doesn't need to be avoided. From an evolutionary point of view, it also makes sense for this effect to be stronger in men... since males were usually the ones who went hunting in dangerous areas, so to survive they had to be motivated to venture into the unknown and learn / experience as much as possible. Of course this is a different thing... just saying the base concept might still relate.

 

Other reasons are harder to think about in depth... especially on a still sensitive mater like this. But for example, males tend to be attracted to female stuff... and lesbians can be perceived as multiplied femininity.

 

I'm not a psychologist to be clear. But I often wonder about many things, including how the brain works. Some functionality makes sense if you think about it, and add evolution into the mix at times... but yeah.

[MonDie]

As studies have shown, many homophobic men are secretly experiencing their own homosexual desires, and they attempt to hide it behind a wall of antipathy for gay men.

 

Being a man who, at 18, expressed many homophobic opinions, it ought not surprise anyone that at 30 I came out as gay. Coinciding with my homophobic rants in my youth was the opinion that lesbians were hot, and me and my other friends routinely talked about the desire to have a sexual experiences with a couple of females; the idea of two guys and a girl was always castigated as "gay".

 

The more I've learned about psychology and human sexuality, the more I've come to the conclusion that men, in particular, young men, use the fantasy of two lesbians in order to avoid the hidden fascination they have with other men. In short, they're projecting their own deep seated fears about sexuality onto women as a defensive mechanism.

 

What!? If it's homophobic at all, I would say it's because they're so aversive to naked men that they don't even like male-on-female erotica. What's your reasoning?

 

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Gender and Sexual Orientation Differences in Sexual Response to Sexual Activities Versus Gender of Actors in Sexual Films (Chivers, Seto & Blanchard)

http://www.indiana.edu/~sexlab/files/pubs/Chivers_Seto_Blanchard_2007.pdf

 

On page 1114 are the penile plethysmograh scores of hetero- and homosexual men. On page 1115 are the subjective reports of arousal for men and women of each orientation. Ignore the first graph on page 1113.

 

These researchers confirm what's been said (if you ignore the vaginal photoplethysmograph scores, which don't correlate with subjective reports of arousal). They pose the hypothesis that women are aroused by sexual activity cues, and men by gender cues. These cues are concordant for homosexuals, but discordant for heterosexuals.

As expected, gay men and women were very aroused by man-man and female-female intercourse (Male / Female, I), respectively, but didn't have a strong response to the female-male (FM) intercourse.

The heterosexual men were strongly aroused by female masturbation (Female, M), female-female intercourse, and FM intercourse.

The heterosexual women reported their strongest response to the FM intercourse. This was followed by female-female intercourse, followed by masturbating men or women (Male / Female, M), followed by man-man intercourse. Heterosexual women didn't seem to exhibit a "category specific" response pattern that relies on gender cues.

 

I'm still reading the (unusually long) discussion section.

 

"Participants were classified as heterosexual or homosexual on the basis of their self-assessment on the Kinsey Sexual Attraction Scale (Kinsey, et al., 1948; Kinsey et al., 1953). Individuals who rated their sexual attractions as predominantly toward opposite-gender persons were classified as heterosexual (score equal to or lower than 2 on a scale from 0 to 6), and those rating their sexual attractions as predominantly toward same-gender persons (score equal to or greater than 4 on the same scale) were classified as homosexual. (Chivers et al)"

Edited August 19, 2014 by MonDie

[Fuzzwood]

Twice the boobies and no schlongs in sight. Problem? I see none.

[MonDie]

This thread is HOT apparently, but I'll be absent until August 29th.

 

 

Think about it: Why do men enjoy homosexual porn of the opposite sex, but that same fetish is not near as widespread among women?

 

A small quip about terminology. I wouldn't call it "homosexual" or lesbian porn unless it was directed toward those groups. A lot of female-on-female porn is actually directed toward guys, and the participants aren't necessarily lesbians.

Edited August 19, 2014 by MonDie

[Thorham]

Is this really a serious question?

 

The answer is simple, of course: Imagine two hot babes being busy together... need I say more? Damn, makes me wish I had a button I could press to become a woman myself. That way I'd be able to join!

 

Twice the boobies and no schlongs in sight. Problem? I see none.

 

+1

Edited August 19, 2014 by Thorham

[Iota]

Note, I'm putting this in the biology forum because there is no "sexology" forum. Also, I'm using this site (a science site) because I am not just looking for the reasons that you, personally, like lesbians, but rather, the scientific reason why they're so popular on a general level.

 

Think about it: Why do men enjoy homosexual porn of the opposite sex, but that same fetish is not near as widespread among women? How, exactly, does testosterone accomplish one thing, but estrogen does not accomplish the exact opposite?

 

Most guys give the reason of "twice the fun" for why they like lesbians, but that logic does not work with women liking gay men.

 

It is the job of scientists to inquire as to why lesbians are so popular among the sex they aren't attracted to, yet that does not work vice versa.

 

Why is that?

 

I think you're over thinking it, looking for a missing link that perhaps doesn't exist. It's the same reason we like women, except with two women you add in sexual acts to the equation, which is more exciting. And how do you know the same isn't true with women for gay men?

 

I find I liked the lesbian stuff much more when I was younger and first looking at porn. These days I prefer heterosexual stuff, find it more exciting; probably because it seems more relatable in a sense, now that I'm at the age where I'm seeing women, it's more realistic in a sense. I think age and mind-set may have something to do with it therefore. Not just from my experience but conferring with mates on the topic in the past.

[Deseoso]

I think that in general men and women's brains work very differently with regards to physical attraction. I believe that man utilizes their sense of sight more than their other senses when it comes to attraction while women access the other senses more and visual stimuli is not as important for them. I realize that my next statement is a generalization but I have certainly noticed many more occurrences of unattractive to average men with beautiful girlfriends than I have seen unattractive to average women with very attractive men.

 

I am 38 years old and I have been single for 36 of those years so I have seen my fair share of adult videos and I would have to say that lesbian videos would definitely be my preference but I've never had any particularly strong desire to be with multiple women. For me it is more just that watching a sexual act is more fulfilling when both of parties involved are physically attractive to me. I think that when god, mother earth, evolution or whatever you believe in chose to create the two genders they went for curves and grace and elegance when they built women. When it came to guys they went for, "the last chicken in the shop" look. Personally I am glad that women aren't as visual as guys because I cannot see what any woman would want from us.

[Thorham]

Personally I am glad that women aren't as visual as guys because I cannot see what any woman would want from us.

Perhaps not equally visual, but still visual enough. There are plenty of straight women who like handsome, well built men. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying

 

Here's a little joke link that shows what straight women like (just google images): https://www.google.nl/search?q=romance+novels&client=firefox-a&hs=tlH&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=sb&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=Ljn1U4DgE8WuO_30gdAC&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1024&bih=674

Edited August 21, 2014 by Thorham

[Marshalscienceguy]

Note, I'm putting this in the biology forum because there is no "sexology" forum. Also, I'm using this site (a science site) because I am not just looking for the reasons that you, personally, like lesbians, but rather, the scientific reason why they're so popular on a general level.

 

Think about it: Why do men enjoy homosexual porn of the opposite sex, but that same fetish is not near as widespread among women? How, exactly, does testosterone accomplish one thing, but estrogen does not accomplish the exact opposite?

 

Most guys give the reason of "twice the fun" for why they like lesbians, but that logic does not work with women liking gay men.

 

It is the job of scientists to inquire as to why lesbians are so popular among the sex they aren't attracted to, yet that does not work vice versa.

 

Why is that?

You know a lot of women like Gay men for some reason to. Not just dudes and lesbians.

[MonDie]

And how do you know the same isn't true with women for gay men?

Because Chivers 2007 replicated the finding that heterosexual women report quite a bit more arousal to female-on-female intercourse than to male-on-male intercourse, and this was even corroborated by vasocongestion measured as vaginal pulse amplitude.

The authors note that, at least for heteroseuxal women, their findings are consistent with Symon's idenfication hypothesis, wherein women become aroused by identifying themselves with the actors in the films. Again consistent, researchers have found that both men and women spend more time looking at the female actors in erotic films.

 

 

I find I liked the lesbian stuff much more when I was younger and first looking at porn. These days I prefer heterosexual stuff, find it more exciting; probably because it seems more relatable in a sense, now that I'm at the age where I'm seeing women, it's more realistic in a sense. I think age and mind-set may have something to do with it therefore. Not just from my experience but conferring with mates on the topic in the past.

I was surprised that this wasn't mentioned in the Discussion of Chivers 2007, but I saw support for men becoming aroused through identification too. Subjective or penile, the gay men were roughly equally turned-off (or not turned-on, depending on the graph) by all female stimuli, but the heterosexual mens' scores were higher for a masturbating man versus a naked man exercising, and even higher for man-man intercourse. This could be because gay men cannot identify themselves with the non-preferred sex, whereas heterosexual men can, despite that the heterosexuals (compared to gays) seemed slightly more turned off by seeing the non-preferred sex in the nude.

 

I would be interested to see whether the relative strength of arousal cues depends on hormone levels. For example, men tend to have more testosterone, so maybe they would be less responsive to gender cues (and exhibit a more female-like response pattern) if they had lower testosterone levels.

 

---

 

 

 

You know a lot of women like Gay men for some reason to. Not just dudes and lesbians.

But they're not turned on by man-on-man porn (on average).

Edited August 29, 2014 by MonDie

[mriver8]

Perhaps watching a man have sex with a woman will cause jealousy or a negative response in the male watching the pornography. As such, the male will like lesbian pornography more than male-female pornography.

 

Furthermore, I've read and heard that pornography attempts to remove the face of the male most of the time in order to give the male viewer the impression that he is the one in the scene with the woman.

 

p.s.

 

This would more than likely be better in the psychology board.

 

 

I have to disagree with you. He is asking why men evolved with this fancy, or rather why a high percentage did. They're are some heterosexual men who do not but a lot do. I myself have questioned the scientific reasons behind it and I think there are multiple reasons.

 

 

Bisexuality in women makes it easier to nuture both sexes.

Men instinctively wish to spread their genes to as many women as possible. If your wife also has a wife then you have 2 wives as in a harem.

Most men lack the desire to always satisfy a woman rather then get off whereas bisexual women prefer to satisfy eachother.

Many women find eachother very attractive visually like men. In fact many of them find the same features that show reproductive health attractive and are more attracted to men romantically but to women sexually which creates lubrication of the vagina for both women which is desirable for the male counterpart. A biological reason for this would be a dominant male would have many wives and it would be in eachother's best interest for all the women to be healthy for many reasons like infecting the children. Remember women evolved with an instinct to nurture that was historically their role during the course of evolution. This is why even today women are ins more likely to wish to engage in threesomes with a man, or even just fantisize about it if he has money. And so I would imagine it's much more likeky that a rich man can have multiple girlfriends if he wants then a poor one past a certain age. I've heard stories that rich men have private mistresses that tbey keep secret. A cultural/evolutionary reasoning may be rich men subconsciously realize that all men can't afford a lot of women so it's better public relations to set the example for all. It's an argument like some men feel you should hide porn, while others wish to shoot it.

Because, they're women, but Men can understand their thought patterns (mostly)

I agree.

As studies have shown, many homophobic men are secretly experiencing their own homosexual desires, and they attempt to hide it behind a wall of antipathy for gay men.

 

Being a man who, at 18, expressed many homophobic opinions, it ought not surprise anyone that at 30 I came out as gay. Coinciding with my homophobic rants in my youth was the opinion that lesbians were hot, and me and my other friends routinely talked about the desire to have a sexual experiences with a couple of females; the idea of two guys and a girl was always castigated as "gay".

 

The more I've learned about psychology and human sexuality, the more I've come to the conclusion that men, in particular, young men, use the fantasy of two lesbians in order to avoid the hidden fascination they have with other men. In short, they're projecting their own deep seated fears about sexuality onto women as a defensive mechanism.

 

 

Bro what you just said is ridiculous all of the friends you talked to who wanted threesomes didn't turn gay. The first time I saw lesbians naked engaging in sex I became very aroused around like 6 or 7. So much so that I wanted to keep ny friends magazine and tried talking him in to it. What you are saying may hold true for you but is a pyschological and not a biological response to the question the man asked. He was looking for reasons that these preferences in sexual attraction evolved as being preferable survival traits. For example not to insult you but if all men were gay the human race would die and if there weren't any gay men there would be too many kids.

Because Chivers 2007 replicated the finding that heterosexual women report quite a bit more arousal to female-on-female intercourse than to male-on-male intercourse, and this was even corroborated by vasocongestion measured as vaginal pulse amplitude.

The authors note that, at least for heteroseuxal women, their findings are consistent with Symon's idenfication hypothesis, wherein women become aroused by identifying themselves with the actors in the films. Again consistent, researchers have found that both men and women spend more time looking at the female actors in erotic films.

 

 

 

I was surprised that this wasn't mentioned in the Discussion of Chivers 2007, but I saw support for men becoming aroused through identification too. Subjective or penile, the gay men were roughly equally turned-off (or not turned-on, depending on the graph) by all female stimuli, but the heterosexual mens' scores were higher for a masturbating man versus a naked man exercising, and even higher for man-man intercourse. This could be because gay men cannot identify themselves with the non-preferred sex, whereas heterosexual men can, despite that the heterosexuals (compared to gays) seemed slightly more turned off by seeing the non-preferred sex in the nude.

 

I would be interested to see whether the relative strength of arousal cues depends on hormone levels. For example, men tend to have more testosterone, so maybe they would be less responsive to gender cues (and exhibit a more female-like response pattern) if they had lower testosterone levels.

 

---

 

 

 

 

But they're not turned on by man-on-man porn (on average).

No I know what you're saying the first porn I ever saw was a man and woman nude and fantazing about the woman's butt aroused me even though the man was there and seeing her enjoy a head in her butt, and I've seen porn where I get turned on by this girl loves to give oral sex, or looking at how she looks but I prefer lesbian because it's more women the idea of having a lot is a turn on, and I don't have to tune out the fact this guy is having sex with her and I'm not. I don't know like I find the idea of doing things with a girl hotter if the dude isn't there. I'd say I probably like girl girl, solo, and heterosexual in that order. Not that I think dudes that only like to watch that are gay really. I would watch it if the others didn't exist and that was all they put out. Just like I would eat a hamburger if I didn't have a cheesburger but prefer a bacon cheeseburger with mayo and onions, maybe an onion ring.

Note, I'm putting this in the biology forum because there is no "sexology" forum. Also, I'm using this site (a science site) because I am not just looking for the reasons that you, personally, like lesbians, but rather, the scientific reason why they're so popular on a general level.

 

Think about it: Why do men enjoy homosexual porn of the opposite sex, but that same fetish is not near as widespread among women? How, exactly, does testosterone accomplish one thing, but estrogen does not accomplish the exact opposite?

 

Most guys give the reason of "twice the fun" for why they like lesbians, but that logic does not work with women liking gay men.

 

It is the job of scientists to inquire as to why lesbians are so popular among the sex they aren't attracted to, yet that does not work vice versa.

 

Why is that?

I agree this is a biological issue a a lot of religious nuts who are unwilling to accept this are annoying to me. Maybe they can just become priests and worry about other men's sexual likes all day.

I do agree that most women are more tuned on by other women sexually but not romantically as it has excited every girl I've ever had sex with and they were of various types and races. You also can't find one one female orn actor who has never done a gg scene but you can find aot who will only do gg but aren't true lesbians in that they'll have sex with a lot of women but only one man. I would imagine monarchs had similar situations.

[MonDie]

Maybe a better term than identification would be vicarious stimulation. I think it says it better.

---

 

mriver8, the point is that, although they were turned off by naked men, they were less turned-off by naked men engaged in intercourse. However, they determined preference on the sole basis of a self-report, so perhaps some gay men infiltrated the experiment as heterosexuals, which would also explain the pattern. It looks like we have a mystery on our hands!

[Thorham]

Men instinctively wish to spread their genes to as many women as possible.

Thank goodness I don't have that problem.