Conformation of GOD

[rigney]

Is it necessary to believe in a Creator other than that which we find in our minds? At night, have you ever stood on a mountain, walked along a river or lain in bed and felt absolute contentment while looking out into a creation no one can explain? Then, have you not wondered? This is GOD in his infinitesimal(ism). Many well intended people will try bending your mind to their way of addressing this supreme power; but you are the only one who can make that decision. GOD is real, it's just a matter of pacifying your mind in dealing with such an enigma.

Edited June 25, 2010 by rigney

[Moontanman]

No, I look at the magnificence of what can happen when chaos is unleashed.

[Genecks]

I sometimes like to look in the mirror.

[rigney]

Genecks, finally got back after a time trying to figure out how to give an answer. Likely, I've probably missed your point completely; but I'd like to give it a shot. Having looked in my own mirror thousands of times now, I believe I understand where you are goin with this. Yes, there is more than a reflection staring back. Much more than a couple of eyes, a nose, mouth, and some hair. And why? There is a brain, facial and racial features attached to a body no other living soul can share. You are an individual! You stand alone in your make up regardless of if you are a twin, triplet or conjoined. There is only one other with whom you can share these most inner thoughts. If you fail to make the connection right away, keep trying; because there is a patience beyond anything we can comprehend.

Edited June 26, 2010 by rigney

[Moontanman]

Thou art god...

[Horza2002]

No i dont think "wow thats good work God". I'd marvel at what nature can do given enough time and that the image of beauty came from utter chaos

[John Cuthber]

The universe is astonishing enough without having to add God to it.

[rigney]

No i dont think "wow thats good work God". I'd marvel at what nature can do given enough time and that the image of beauty came from utter chaos

 

 

 

Moontanman made almost the same comment. If there was utter chaos in the beginning, can you relate to me from where it came? If you can, and without equivocation???, I will forsake my creator.

[ydoaPs]

Moontanman made almost the same comment. If there was utter chaos in the beginning, can you relate to me from where it came? If you can, and without equivocation???, I will forsake my creator.

 

I came from my mother's vagina. That's how those sort of things usually happen.

[rigney]

The universe is astonishing enough without having to add God to it.

 

 

 

Isn't it though? But what is even more amazing is that we have been living through the preamble of scientific convention for the past few thousand years and are just now getting down to the culmination of two basic issues. Where did it all come from and what is it all about? As mentioned in a couple earlier posts, while I'm a bit more agnostic than religious, I tend to see us as an abstraction, rather than just a casual convenience???

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Merged post follows:

Consecutive posts merged

I came from my mother's vagina. That's how those sort of things usually happen.

 

 

Your'e lucky! As much as I like to drink with my sex, I'm careful; and would have likely flushed ya down the john!

Edited June 27, 2010 by Phi for All
Duplicate posts removed.

[John Cuthber]

Moontanman made almost the same comment. If there was utter chaos in the beginning, can you relate to me from where it came? If you can, and without equivocation???, I will forsake my creator.

 

If you can tell me where this "creator" came from then I will forsake the Universe.

 

Incidentally, there is evidence for the big bang, but there's none for God.

[Moontanman]

Moontanman made almost the same comment. If there was utter chaos in the beginning, can you relate to me from where it came? If you can, and without equivocation???, I will forsake my creator.

 

Personally I am leaning toward colliding membranes in a multidimensional bulk space....

[Phi for All]

Is it necessary to believe in a Creator other than that which we find in our minds? At night, have you ever stood on a mountain, walked along a river or lain in bed and felt absolute contentment while looking out into a creation no one can explain? Then, have you not wondered? This is GOD in his infinitesimal(ism). Many well intended people will try bending your mind to their way of addressing this supreme power; but you are the only one who can make that decision. GOD is real, it's just a matter of pacifying your mind in dealing with such an enigma.

Stop trying to bend my mind to your way of addressing this supreme power; I am the only one who can make that decision.

[rigney]

I couldn't have said it better myself. If I was leaning a bit to my left with the comment, it's just that I make a better draw using my right hand. Wasn't trying to inspire or make you uncomfortable at all, just stating what I believe to be fact. Had I aspired to be a preacher or a politician, I'd stay on a stump. And bend your mind? If you let someone do that without absolute conviction and take a chance of going to "blaas" in a hand basket, you're just as bad off as the nut trying to make his case. Naa!, If you feel a need for something different in your life, you'll find it. And if you think I'm trying to use reverse phychology, ?

Edited June 28, 2010 by rigney

[padren]

If there was utter chaos in the beginning, can you relate to me from where it came? If you can, and without equivocation???, I will forsake my creator.

 

Why do you think the answer to that question is within our realm of understanding? It seems to me, that if both space and time is a result of an event, than we can't even use the language in this very sentence: "result" of an "event" implies causality, that something happened somewhere at some time.

The "creation" of the universe whether by physics or a creator is not a sufficient description. The word "creation" implies a process - no matter how short - of something changing from one state into another, such as the state of no Universe into the very first moment of the Universe. Nothing can change state without time. Nothing has a definable state without space.

 

Our minds and our entire way of conceiving the Universe is the result of casual events within space over time, and has adapted to thinking about patterns in space over time.

 

 

Whether the universe was the result of a creator or a non-volitional event - I don't think we will ever know.

 

Without an actual answer, I prefer to leave the question marked as "unknown" and not assume to fill it with a creator. I don't need an answer. If I was to lean one way or the other, it's towards natural creation without volition of some being... because we've come to learn over and over again that incredibly complex systems emerge from simple ones.

That's a lesson drawn from observations within space and time, but it's the only environment we have to analyze. I would have to see some evidence that this is unlikely to be the case in the creation of the Universe itself, and "not having a definitive answer" is not evidence. It's just lack of an answer.

[rigney]

Why do you think the answer to that question is within our realm of understanding? It seems to me, that if both space and time is a result of an event, than we can't even use the language in this very sentence: "result" of an "event" implies causality, that something happened somewhere at some time.

The "creation" of the universe whether by physics or a creator is not a sufficient description. The word "creation" implies a process - no matter how short - of something changing from one state into another, such as the state of no Universe into the very first moment of the Universe. Nothing can change state without time. Nothing has a definable state without space.

 

Our minds and our entire way of conceiving the Universe is the result of casual events within space over time, and has adapted to thinking about patterns in space over time.

 

 

Whether the universe was the result of a creator or a non-volitional event - I don't think we will ever know.

 

Without an actual answer, I prefer to leave the question marked as "unknown" and not assume to fill it with a creator. I don't need an answer. If I was to lean one way or the other, it's towards natural creation without volition of some being... because we've come to learn over and over again that incredibly complex systems emerge from simple ones.

That's a lesson drawn from observations within space and time, but it's the only environment we have to analyze. I would have to see some evidence that this is unlikely to be the case in the creation of the Universe itself, and "not having a definitive answer" is not evidence. It's just lack of an answer.

 

 

It's likely those two words: Creator and Creation add more conflict than harmony, between religious factions. Arguably, science finds itself in this quandry from time to time, competing for bragging rights to a specific formula or system. So, we wind up with three or four different ones in tandem, which isn't bad. Eventually though, science always comes up with an answer, making progress to the next step a lot easier. Not so with religion. Glad to get your reply.

[Realitycheck]

No i dont think "wow thats good work God". I'd marvel at what nature can do given enough time and that the image of beauty came from utter chaos

 

I've read that beauty is defined as being the most average looking, with the least imperfections. It's amazing what a little Proactiv will do for cave-hardened skin.

Edited July 6, 2010 by agentchange

[rigney]

I've read that beauty is defined as being the most average looking, with the least imperfections. It's amazing what a little Proactiv will do for cave-hardened skin.

 

 

Not nearly so amazing as what it might do for a glib, and carelessly "case hardened" tongue.

Edited July 6, 2010 by rigney

[forufes]

for the OP;

 

so what role does your god play in your life?

 

If you can tell me where this "creator" came from then I will forsake the Universe.

and if he can't, then you won't?

how are the two related?

Incidentally, there is evidence for the big bang, but there's none for God.

vice versa will be asserted by a layman religious person.(it's just a theory)

what i'm saying is; philosophically, this is an argument from ignorance.

No, I look at the magnificence of what can happen when chaos is unleashed.

it slowly dies away?

[Moontanman]

for the OP;

 

so what role does your god play in your life?

 

I have no problem with God in my life, it's his fan club that pisses me off...

 

 

and if he can't, then you won't?

how are the two related?

 

 

vice versa will be asserted by a layman religious person.(it's just a theory)

what i'm saying is; philosophically, this is an argument from ignorance.

 

it slowly dies away?

 

No order emerges from chaos, it's magnificent to see how much can happen when chaos is left to evolve into complex patterns of splendor, of course our association with the result is why we think it's magnificent to begin with. If we had evolved in a liquid metallic hydrogen sea we might think the helium rain was fantastic....

[rigney]

I believe your synopsis is absolutely right. An untrained "want to be" swordsman should never cross blades with a tested artisan, but should continue on a path of truth. People look for GOD in many ways, yours truely included. I may have found what I have been looking for. You, on the other hand; may find more in a minute of faith; than I will have found in a lifetime.

[Moontanman]

Moontanman made almost the same comment. If there was utter chaos in the beginning, can you relate to me from where it came? If you can, and without equivocation???, I will forsake my creator.

 

No need to forsake your creator, but I'd be on guard for the creators spokesmen....

[rigney]

No need to forsake your creator, but I'd be on guard for the creators spokesmen....

 

Can't fault you on that statement Moontan. Seen to many Swaggarts, Jones's and Bakers come down the pike with their hands out. But, when anyone wants to make that supplication for either you or me, let's both just say no. Few devout persons have ever walked that last mile and not wondered about GOD and the hereafter? But then, there are few atheist who don't also have hope?

Edited July 7, 2010 by rigney