marmer Posted August 2, 2010 Share Posted August 2, 2010 I saw in a zoo an interesting event: An Asian elephant was using wooden sticks to scratch its armpit, a place which it could not easily scratch with its soft trunk. Some animals use tools, usually the very intelligent ones (and elephants are clever). I do not know if this particular elephant was an animal recovered from India where they are used for farming purposes or if it had invented the trick on its own account or perhaps was it imitating its caretakers. In any case this tool behaviour is known in elephants, according to the wikipedia. Elephants also drink a particular type of mud in order to use its clay as a filter against the poisons of certain plants they eat. Other animals do something similar. The use of tools by animals reflects intelligence and I wonder if intelligence is spreading by mimicry among different animals and different species, at least on a general basis. Humans are by far the most intelligent species, and we learn from others and enlarge our knowledge and problem solving abilities by getting trained within our societies. Are animals getting increasingly intelligent, increasingly able to sort out challenges? If so, is this happening in animals which are regularly in contact with humans? Or is it being observed also in animals completely severed from our lives? I remember a cat of mine. He had learnt to open a difficult door to go in and out to the garden at his own will. That cat was not particularly clever but he must have seen me all the time opening the garden door and took advantage of the tuition. Also I remember my finch who used to go mad with joy when hearing violin concertos, so much that I had to take it out of the room if I wanted to listen at ease. Pet owners have delightful stories to tell. But besides their amusing side these odd stories might have a more significant meaning which could be going quite unnoticed by us, brain masters but sometimes surpirisingly blind. Where lies the limit for animal intelligence, for the higher intellectual resources of different species, of different individuals? Are there any programs to selectively breed intelligent dogs, felines, crows, octopuses, etc? Are there any genetically engineered mice with intelligent traits? Is animal intelligence, everything associated to mental capabilities (appreciation of different sounds, of ways to escape, to find food,...) getting increasingly enlarged since the last 10 thousand years, since animals and humans have been coexisting in not too remote proximity? Are there any fossile indications about tool use by ancient, now extinct species? Are animals learning from us and getting more clever on a large scale? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eleven Posted August 2, 2010 Share Posted August 2, 2010 I would say "Dumber" by nature - we're placing them in zoo's etc, and the ones free in the world are having to adapt to the man-made structure of everything; burning/cutting down trees, releasing poisonous gasses into the air, and many other factors as the why the animals don't have the space/natural ability to evolve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringer Posted August 3, 2010 Share Posted August 3, 2010 I doubt there would be any way to really test if they are getting smarter, whatever that would imply, because, as far as I'm aware, we don't really have a meaningful way to test our intelligence. Also, what makes you think it would even be good for most animals to become more intelligent. It takes an incredible amount of energy to have a brain like ours, and I don't see most animals developing a need for any sort of "higher" intelligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringer Posted August 3, 2010 Share Posted August 3, 2010 (edited) Also, animals don't really evolve similarly just because they are in contact with each other, say like us growing tails because we are around a lot of animals with tails. If animals could become more intelligent by being in contact with us it would probably be safe to assume that domesticated animals would be the first to develop that sort of thing. Edited August 3, 2010 by Ringer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted August 3, 2010 Share Posted August 3, 2010 I saw in a zoo an interesting event: An Asian elephant was using wooden sticks to scratch its armpit, a place which it could not easily scratch with its soft trunk. Some animals use tools, usually the very intelligent ones (and elephants are clever). I do not know if this particular elephant was an animal recovered from India where they are used for farming purposes or if it had invented the trick on its own account or perhaps was it imitating its caretakers. In any case this tool behaviour is known in elephants, according to the wikipedia. Elephants also drink a particular type of mud in order to use its clay as a filter against the poisons of certain plants they eat. Other animals do something similar. The use of tools by animals reflects intelligence and I wonder if intelligence is spreading by mimicry among different animals and different species, at least on a general basis. Humans are by far the most intelligent species, and we learn from others and enlarge our knowledge and problem solving abilities by getting trained within our societies. Are animals getting increasingly intelligent, increasingly able to sort out challenges? If so, is this happening in animals which are regularly in contact with humans? Or is it being observed also in animals completely severed from our lives? I remember a cat of mine. He had learnt to open a difficult door to go in and out to the garden at his own will. That cat was not particularly clever but he must have seen me all the time opening the garden door and took advantage of the tuition. Also I remember my finch who used to go mad with joy when hearing violin concertos, so much that I had to take it out of the room if I wanted to listen at ease. Pet owners have delightful stories to tell. But besides their amusing side these odd stories might have a more significant meaning which could be going quite unnoticed by us, brain masters but sometimes surpirisingly blind. Where lies the limit for animal intelligence, for the higher intellectual resources of different species, of different individuals? Are there any programs to selectively breed intelligent dogs, felines, crows, octopuses, etc? Are there any genetically engineered mice with intelligent traits? Is animal intelligence, everything associated to mental capabilities (appreciation of different sounds, of ways to escape, to find food,...) getting increasingly enlarged since the last 10 thousand years, since animals and humans have been coexisting in not too remote proximity? Are there any fossile indications about tool use by ancient, now extinct species? Are animals learning from us and getting more clever on a large scale? I think it's more like knowledge is spreading rather than intelligence. I think in some limited ways animals can get ideas for tools from watching us, I don't expect to see a non tool using animal suddenly show up with a birch bark canoe but in the wild elephants will break off limbs and use them that way. I saw it on a nature show is the best I can do as proof.... but it seems quite reasonable so using a stick is not unnatural fro an elephant... Yes there are many extinct species that used tools, some of them were quite advanced as stone age tools go but they are all hominids. I think it's possible that some bits of knowledge by mimicry might cross over but only to the ability of the animal to use this, far too little time has passed for animals to do much more than use the brains the have now, growing bigger ones seems unlikely on a wide scale for sure.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marmer Posted August 11, 2010 Author Share Posted August 11, 2010 Thanks everyone for your comments. I do not mean that it would be good or possible for animals to get smarter, I simply wonder if this might be happening and in that case we, conceited humans, might not realize it. I absolutely agree that there are no "good" ways to test human intelligence since those famous IQ tests are very limited, good for academic knowledge mostly or only. Also you are right that animals in captivity are not the best way to study animal behaviour. So from a strict scientific point we have no serious means to assess the issue. But in any case in my opinion it would be very interesting from an evolutionary point of view to try to guess if intelligence, at least the one shown by means of the use of tools, might be increasing, through mimicry or whatever other means of animal thinking. It is very obvious that the use of tools opens new opportunities for development and access to different resources and this might eventually influence the success and the further evolution of at least some animal species. Anyone knows of other interesting events concerning animal use of tools or other clever reactions in front of challenges? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzwood Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 I think all creatures with a brain are able to evolve their intelligence. We (humans as they are now) simply did it first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharonY Posted August 11, 2010 Share Posted August 11, 2010 However, tool use of wild animals has often been reported and is likely to have predated human tool use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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