Cure for 95% of all diseases..?

[333]

Hi,

I thank you all for your help....(I put this is the wrong section, so I'll try it here)

 

There is a man on the internet saying that drinking three drops of his Miracle Mineral will cure us of 95% of all diseases, including cancer, malaria, etc. This "miracle mineral" is sodium chlorite that he says to add lemon juice so that it turns to chlorine dioxide. I noticed that my household Clorox says it is sodium hypochlorite, so I asked what the difference is, someone answered:

 

"NaClO is household bleach.

 

Sodium chlorite is NaClO2

 

Table salt is NaCl

 

all very different substances..

 

and in the end how they compare makes not one hair of difference because you activate miracle mineral (sodium chlorite) and change it into chlorine dioxide anyway which is ClO2, which is not chlorine anymore than NaCl is chlorine.

 

Just because something bleaches does not mean that it is the same a chlorine bleach (this "miracle mineral" bleaches).

 

Bleaching is the result of an oxidation process."

 

Can you help me figure this out? Is what he said true? My Clorox says it is sodium hypochlorite and his Miracle Mineral says it is sodium chlorite, are they different? Do you think there could be any validity to his claim of curing diseases? The Clorox site says that bleach helped the soldiers in WWII beat infection ~ topical ~ I'm guessing.

[Sisyphus]

Yes, it's a scam. It is different than NaClO, but it's still bleach, and drinking it will have pretty much the same effect as drinking Clorox. It does not cure diseases.

 

Read this:

 

http://www.fda.gov/NewsEvents/Newsroom/PressAnnouncements/ucm220747.htm

[Mr Skeptic]

Various bleaches can be used to disinfect things from almost any type of microorganism; this is because oxidizers kill life. I suppose you could use it on your skin if you wanted, without too much harm. But don't go about drinking bleaches, you will regret it.

[333]

If it can be used on skin, would it maybe kill melanoma?

 

Sisyph,

 

Yes, I was aware the FDA doesn't like MMS but I hadn't read that page you posted from the FDA. The MMS folks say that MMS is supose to cause nausea, vomitting and diarrhea, but not bad....you see, they say that when one of these happens then the formula is working, it is killing the critters (for want of a better term), then you are supose to back off and use less drops, this is "your dosage". Clorox bleach just says to drink water after you injest some of it's product.

 

I am skeptical of the FDA, as I have first hand experience that HIFU works (see my post: http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/51782-cure-for-cancer/ ), and the fact HIFU was invented in 1941 and still isn't approved makes me look at them with a sideways glance. The MMS folks say the FDA doesn't want to look at their product because it would put drug companies out of business, and we all know that - if MMS works -- they are probably right.

 

Guess though, I was looking for medical science mumbo jumbo why it wouldn't work or some convincing formula proving it hokus pocus. I would only drink some if I had a week to live and no where to turn, but I wanted to tell others some facts.

 

The internet sure opens up other worlds! Thanks!

[Mr Skeptic]

If it can be used on skin, would it maybe kill melanoma?

 

Well skin cancers would be deep within your skin, not on the surface. And yeah, it can kill a melanoma like a flamethrower can.

[Sisyphus]

Yes, the FDA is very conservative about what they approve - probably too conservative. But the "suppressing for the sake of the drug companies" thing is total BS. If it did 1/10th of what those scammers claim, there would be no way the FDA or anyone else could keep it a secret. People would be using it and getting better, and it would be big news despite not being officially approved. However, there is no evidence that it does anything but make you sick, besides the word of the people selling it. If someone claimed that getting hit in the face with a baseball bat cured cancer, I wouldn't bother looking for proof that it didn't work. I would ask for evidence that it did (but I wouldn't hold my breath).

[333]

It took the doctors of this country 12 years to tell people with ulcers that they don't need surgery, a simple antibiotic will cure them. Australian doctors had been using antibiotics for ulcers and tried to tell us, but we wouldn't listen, so I am not so sure about our honesty when it comes to $

 

Thing is, everyone is like you, very few people have tried MMS. There are some who have, I know three people who work for not-for-profits who live half the year in Africa, they took it, all the villagers take it, they say it cures malaria. However, I am skeptical, but I don't say absolutely no way until I personally know. I was hoping you guys had some scientific reason why a controlled dosage wouldn't work, afterall chemo is poison, but it doesn't kill the person until the dosage is too much.

 

Melanoma isn't always deep within the skin, it starts on the surface.

[insane_alien]

you know why so few have tried it? because its bloody bleach. and a potent oxidiser to boot. there is absolutely nothing to be gained from ingesting it.

[John Cuthber]

"This "miracle mineral" is sodium chlorite that he says to add lemon juice so that it turns to chlorine dioxide. "

Since lemon juice is noted for being full of vitamin C which is a strong reducing agent, the outcome of mixing chlorite and lemon juice will be a small amount of very expensive salt.

 

Malaria is known for being a relapsing disease. It comes and goes with or without snake oil.

[333]

thanks for the scientific answer, I'll try it out on the nuts

[333]

whoops,

 

it's not lemon juice that you mix it with, it's vinegar, let it sit for 3 minutes then add water and apple juice.

 

I hope that you respond...sorry for the mix up

[333]

The guy seling this stuff, it only costs $4. so he isn't trying to get rich quick, wrote this:

 

And now one small point of layman technical data.

 

Oxygen is an oxidizer. But that also makes it bleach. Oxygen oxidizes

 

things in the body which creates heat and life. Oxygen is powerful and

 

thus the body generates antioxidants to prevent oxygen from doing

 

damage, none the less, it does a certain amount of damage. MMS

 

is an oxidizer. It is a bleach as well, but it is a weaker bleach than

 

oxygen. MMS will not bleach or oxidize as many things in the body

 

as will Oxygen. The fact is MMS is less damaging to the body than

 

is oxygen, but MMS cannot keep the body alive with oxidation like

 

oxygen can. Each has its job, but the fact is, MMS cannot damage the

 

body with oxidation as it is a weaker oxidizer than oxygen. There is

 

one other thing that MMS can do in the body. It can oxidize heavy

 

metal compounds. Please understand this as it overcomes many of

 

the objections now being voiced.

[insane_alien]

The guy seling this stuff, it only costs $4. so he isn't trying to get rich quick, wrote this:

 

doesn't mean that he's right.

 

MMS

 

is an oxidizer. It is a bleach as well, but it is a weaker bleach than

 

oxygen. MMS will not bleach or oxidize as many things in the body

 

as will Oxygen.

 

it will oxidise more than just plain old oxygen because it is stronger. there is no arguement here, that is just a completely false statement.

 

The fact is MMS is less damaging to the body than

 

is oxygen, but MMS cannot keep the body alive with oxidation like

 

oxygen can.

 

again, false. (appart from the sodium chlorite not keeping you alive bit)

 

Each has its job, but the fact is, MMS cannot damage the

 

body with oxidation as it is a weaker oxidizer than oxygen.

 

again, false, repeating does not make it true. also, if it was weaker than oxygen, why the hell would it do anything at all?

 

There is

 

one other thing that MMS can do in the body. It can oxidize heavy

 

metal compounds.

 

actually, its far more likely to go for the nice abundant reducing agents in the body rather than some trace not-strongly reducing agent. and more to the point, so what? most heavy metals only cause a problem when they are in an oxidised state.

 

 

Please understand this as it overcomes many of

 

the objections now being voiced.

 

no it doesn't. please provided references to lab studies and clinical trials. also references to peer reviewed journals on the properties of sodium chlorite that back up your claims about its oxidising potential.

[John Cuthber]

whoops,

 

it's not lemon juice that you mix it with, it's vinegar, let it sit for 3 minutes then add water and apple juice.

 

I hope that you respond...sorry for the mix up

 

It hardly matters, there's vitamin C in apples too.

The glucose in most fruit juices would reduce the stuff anyway.

[dragonstar57]

it will oxidise more than just plain old oxygen because it is stronger. there is no arguement here, that is just a completely false statement.

maybe he's saying that it is less powerful than LOx.

and it is less powerful than LOx right?

[insane_alien]

maybe he's saying that it is less powerful than LOx.

and it is less powerful than LOx right?

 

well, its not as strong an oxidiser as ozone...

[dragonstar57]

well, its not as strong an oxidiser as ozone...

but isn't ozone such a powerful oxidizer that it blows up?

[insane_alien]

no not really.

 

although, interesting factoid about the ClO2 that the sodium chlorite produces, above a concentration of ~15% it WILL explosively decompose into chlorine and oxygen.

 

fairly nasty compound really.

[333]

Well, I guess what I believe now is that the guy peddling this MMS isn't a chemist and he really doesn't know a whole lot about the chemistry behind it, but he is an old guy and he says he has watched many people get cured from all kinds of stuff, the fact he doesn't sell it, another company does that has nothing to do with him, they sell it to purify water ~~ makes me wonder, maybe it does work..?

 

Here's something from his letters:

 

Chlorine dioxide does no damage to the human body: The next argument was that chlorine dioxide goes forth and kills everything in its path including good and bad bacteria, parasites, viruses, fungus and also damages human body parts. But that is not so. There are thousands of industrial corporations listed on the Internet that use chlorine dioxide for the very reason, because it can be very selective in what it destroys (oxidizes). When properly used at low levels of concentration it can select pathogens and not affect body parts. For a list of companies using chlorine dioxide because it is selective, Google “chlorine dioxide selective.” Here is a quote by the US Gov EPA Http://www.epa.gov./ogwdw000/mdbp/pdf/alter/chapt_4.pdf 4.1 Chlorine Dioxide Chemistry: Chlorine dioxide functions as a highly selective oxidant due to its unique, one-electron transfer mechanism where it is reduced to chlorite (ClO2-) (Hoehn et al., 1996). 4.4 – Chlorine dioxide is a strong oxidant and disinfectant. Its disinfecting mechanisms are not well understood, but appear to vary by the type of microorganism. 4.4.1 – In the first disinfection mechanism, chlorine dioxide reacts readily with amino acids cysteine, tryptophan, and tyrosine, but not with viral ribonucleic acid (RNA) (Noss etal., 1983; Olivier et al., 1985) It was concluded that chlorine dioxide inactivated viruses by altering the viral capsid proteins.

 

Do you See? These quotes and hundreds of other quotes I didn’t have room for prove conclusively that MMS can be selective and is indeed selective. Now one more thing: www.lenntech.com/index.htm#ixzz0wGcRVcfM This data written by Lenntech is often quoted around the world by universities and in scientific papers. This company, along with others, proves that chlorine dioxide does not harm the human body in low concentrations such as those used by MMS. This is the quote:

 

“As an oxidizer chlorine dioxide is very selective. It has the ability due to unique one-electron exchange mechanism. Chlorine dioxide attacks the electron-rich center of organic molecules. One electron is transferred and chlorine dioxide is reduced to chlorite (ClO2).” Then the chlorite attracts four more electrons which rips a hole in the side of the pathogen, killing it.

There is no dangerous liability to ingesting chlorine dioxide over an extended period of time. The next argument was the concept that taking MMS might be dangerous when taking it for a few days. But that has also been proven not true. Back in 1982, the National Institutes of Health in Washington, DC conducted an extended double blind clinical trial to determine that very fact, whether there is a liability in taking chlorine dioxide over a period of time. They also tested the chemicals sodium chlorite, and sodium chlorate at the same time. The tests were conducted with humans and not with rats, thus one does not have to try to extrapolate to show that rats can equal humans. The tests conducted showed that no adverse conditions resulted in human bodies. Here is the link to the report. Read it for yourself and decide. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article ... 3-0059.pdf

[John Cuthber]

no not really.

 

although, interesting factoid about the ClO2 that the sodium chlorite produces, above a concentration of ~15% it WILL explosively decompose into chlorine and oxygen.

 

fairly nasty compound really.

Actually, pure ozone is also explosively unstable. It's also quite toxic.

It also has little or nothing to do with the fact that this MMS stuff is all balderdash.

I have seldom seen something as absurd as the suggestion that "Chlorine dioxide does no damage to the human body".

Don't believe me? OK- fine, go and breathe some. (don't get your next of kin to sue me though- if you want to kill yourself, that's your decision, not mine)

 

This "chlorine dioxide reacts readily with amino acids cysteine, tryptophan, and tyrosine,", on the other hand is perfectly plausible.

Since all those things are vital to the human body it's hard to see how you can say that something that destroys them "does no damage".

It seems they can't even get their own story straight.

For the record "It has the ability due to unique one-electron exchange mechanism." is bollocks too. Plenty of materials in the body are capable of single electron transfers. Iron and copper are probably the best known.

 

Like the guy says

"Read it for yourself and decide"

[Mr Skeptic]

Well, you could read about what people have to say about its safety:

http://en.wikipedia...._dioxide#Safety

 

And the Material Safety Data Sheet too:

http://www.haloxtech...2%29-540ppm.pdf

 

---

 

333, please do go breath a little of it or inject yourself with a very small quantity of it, so you know how nasty it is and stop trying to convince people to kill themselves.

[divagreen]

Plenty of materials in the body are capable of single electron transfers. Iron and copper are probably the best known.

 

What about magnesium?

[John Cuthber]

Single electron transfer in magnesium would be very odd.