First Admendment

[Rakdos]

Do I have Fist Adm. Rights on a server based in another country. I.E. IM on a message board based in England do I still have 1st Adm. rights on any messages I post there.

[ydoaPs]

You have the freedom of speech on every media no matter where it is based AS LONG AS YOU ARE A CITIZEN OF THE UNITED STATES. Is that what you were asking or were you asking about freedom of religion(which also still applies)?

[Rakdos]

Either one

[ydoaPs]

i can go anywhere in the world, and i will still have all the rights of an american citizen. why wouldn't i have them why wouldn't i have them while sitting in my house?

[Douglas]

i can go anywhere in the world, and i will still have all the rights of an american citizen. why wouldn't i have them why wouldn't i have them while sitting in my house?

Good point, you can get on an Iranian website and call them any name you want.........and still retain your rights.

[Phi for All]

Your first ammendment rights to free speech are not abrogated when you agree to the rules format of the message board or forum. If you agreed not to offend people when you signed on, you can still say anything you want, even if it is considered offensive.

 

Then the administrators and moderators are free to ban your foul self from their forum for violating your agreement.

 

Have a nice day, guys.

[Sayonara]

You have the freedom of speech on every media no matter where it is based AS LONG AS YOU ARE A CITIZEN OF THE UNITED STATES.

That's not in the slightest bit true.

[Sayonara]

Do I have Fist Adm. Rights on a server based in another country. I.E. IM on a message board based in England do I still have 1st Adm. rights on any messages I post there.

No.

 

You are considered to have presence in the country in which the server is located, and therefore are subject to the laws of that country. It's the same for online transactions, where [acr=Electronic Point of Sale]EPoS[/acr] is considered to be the server on which the transaction is carried out.

 

If a hacker in Germany attacks a server in the USA, the hacker can be extradited and charged under US law, because that is where the crime was committed (except where special diplomatic arrangements are made). It's the same for everyone, and no country can have it both ways by imposing their laws on property outside their borders.

[Sayonara]

Good point, you can get on an Iranian website and call them any name you want.........and still retain your rights.

Hurrah for not letting other people's rights get in the way of your own vastly more important ones!

 

[Skye]

i can go anywhere in the world, and i will still have all the rights of an american citizen.

[swansont]

i can go anywhere in the world, and i will still have all the rights of an american citizen.

 

I hope you don't have to find out how wrong you are, first-hand. You go to a foreign country, you have to play by their rules.

[AL]

Do I have Fist Adm. Rights on a server based in another country. I.E. IM on a message board based in England do I still have 1st Adm. rights on any messages I post there.

The first amendment doesn't even apply in this situation, even if the server was in America.

"Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble..."

This means the Federal government (plus state and local governments, thanks to the 14th amendment) cannot censor you by law should you decide to voice your opinions. This does not mean you cannot be censored by private entities who have the power to do so. If I own a billboard, I'm free to decide what doesn't go on it. If I own a forum, I'm free to decide what doesn't get posted.

i can go anywhere in the world, and i will still have all the rights of an american citizen.

Not necessarily. What if the country you're in doesn't have an American embassy?

[Sayonara]

Not necessarily. What if the country you're in doesn't have an American embassy?

Even if it does, it only means that America has a diplomatic presence there, not a legal one.

[LucidDreamer]

America's Freedom of Speech right only protects you from American punishment. You could not be arrested for speaking your mind on a U.K. forum by a U.S. law enforcement agency. If you actually go to another country then you are subject to all its laws unless they specifically grant you diplomatic immunity. You are also subject to certain laws in other countries while on the net, but I think the rules about that are pretty fuzzy. I bet I could go to any foreign website and tell them that their government sucks and that they should protest, but there is no way the U.S. government would hand me over to face their legal system. I hope.

[Dave]

America's Freedom of Speech right only protects you from American punishment. You could not be arrested for speaking your mind on a U.K. forum by a U.S. law enforcement agency. If you actually go to another country then you are subject of all its laws unless they specifically grant you diplomatic immunity. You are also subject to certain laws in other countries while on the net, but I think the rules about that are pretty fuzzy. I bet I could go to any foreign website and tell them that their government sucks and the should protest, but there is no way the U.S. government would had me over to face their legal system. I hope.

 

Personally, I'd rather not find out

[ydoaPs]

here is a little scenario:

 

I go to russia and say something the government doesn't agree with. they put me in jail.

 

the US government would have me out in under an hour

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

No, there'd be loads of negotiations and arguments until finally Russia hands you over after you pay your bail.

[ydoaPs]

the "hour" was an exaggeration.

 

i wouldn't have to pay bail. if they didn't let me out, there would be so much political crap going on, it wouldn't be funny.

[Pangloss]

You really can't count on that. You break the law in a foreign country, you are on your own. The embassy can help you in a lot of ways -- finding a lawyer for example -- but they can't just get you out of there. You do not have "diplomatic immunity". Well, unless of course you are an official diplomat.

[LucidDreamer]

here is a little scenario:

 

I go to russia and say something the government doesn't agree with. they put me in jail.

 

the US government would have me out in under an hour

 

Here is another scenario:

You go to Mexico for a vacation. You decide you want to visit authentic parts of Mexico to experience their culture so you wander outside the tourist area. You break a law and are sent to Jail. You have to give all of your food to a guy named Paco and you become his girlfriend for 2 weeks before anyone even finds out where you are. Your relatives have to spend a considerable amount of money to bribe the officials to get you out, but that money is a mere pittance to the amount of money you have to spend on therapy.

 

You can't count on US government to bail you out of everything. There are plenty of U.S. citizens in foreign prisons right now for what would only be a minor crime or not a crime at all in the U.S.

[Phi for All]

i wouldn't have to pay bail. if they didn't let me out, there would be so much political crap going on, it wouldn't be funny.

You're right about the political crap. Their State Dept would tell our State Dept, "Look, this little слабоумный spouted off nasty about Mother Russia so we've trumped up a charge of public indecency. We're going to hold him in here till his visa expires, then ban him from our country for five years. If you give us any crap about it, we'll change the charges to political espionage and tell the press. Which do you prefer?"

 

The State Dept rep, when he gets around to you, will tell you you shouldn't do indecent things while traveling in foreign countries.

[Sayonara]

America's Freedom of Speech right only protects you from American punishment. You could not be arrested for speaking your mind on a U.K. forum by a U.S. law enforcement agency. If you actually go to another country then you are subject to all its laws unless they specifically grant you diplomatic immunity. You are also subject to certain laws in other countries while on the net, but I think the rules about that are pretty fuzzy. I bet I could go to any foreign website and tell them that their government sucks and that they should protest, but there is no way the U.S. government would hand me over to face their legal system. I hope.

Actually it's not fuzzy at all.

 

Perhaps you should actually read the end-user agreements for services before you sign up to them. Most of them specify the country in which the server resides, and under whose laws legal action will be carried out in response to offences committed by people using or abusing the service.

[LucidDreamer]

Actually it's not fuzzy at all.

 

Perhaps you should actually read the end-user agreements for services before you sign up to them. Most of them specify the country in which the server resides' date=' and under whose laws legal action will be carried out in response to offences committed by people using or abusing the service.[/quote']

 

True, yet half the world uses pirated American software. Those end-user agreements don't mean anything unless the other people's countries are willing to actually to prosecute or extradite everyone. And I have never heard of anyone in America being handed over to a foreign country for saying something that is protected under our free speech yet violates another country's law. There may be some rare case but I am pretty sure the U.S. has a policy against handing over U.S. citizens lightly. I mean if America is going to go invade other countries and make them form democracies then I doubt we would just hand over citizens that violate net laws that don't violate laws in democratic countries. I doubt the U.K. will hand over its citizens lightly either. That's what I mean by fuzzy. How exactly is a country going to respond to another country that wants to prosecute its citizens.

 

All those end-user agreements are fuzzy anyway. Sometimes they say ridiculous things that no court of law will actually enforce. They throw every right they can think of into those things, yet they would not necessarily get all those things in court. I could throw in that you agree to give me your first born son and all of your money for the next three years in the middle of one of those yet I doubt I could actually get your son skip.

[bloodhound]

American software is greatly exxaggerated.. I for one had diplomatic immunity for 4 years hehe.... . now i am on student visa

[Sayonara]

True, yet half the world uses pirated American software. Those end-user agreements don't mean anything unless the other people's countries are willing to actually to prosecute or extradite everyone. And I have never heard of anyone in America being handed over to a foreign country for saying something that is protected under our free speech yet violates another country's law. There may be some rare case but I am pretty sure the U.S. has a policy against handing over U.S. citizens lightly. I mean if America is going to go invade other countries and make them form democracies then I doubt we would just hand over citizens that violate net laws that don't violate laws in democratic countries. I doubt the U.K. will hand over its citizens lightly either. That's what I mean by fuzzy. How exactly is a country going to respond to another country that wants to prosecute its citizens.

While all of this is true, Schrodngr's_cat is not asking if he is likely to be prosecuted.

 

He is asking if he has first ammendment rights on services that operate from foreign servers.

 

The fact that you might not be punished for circumventing or ignoring your rights does not make the allocation of those rights any less delineated.