GenerationOfGreenSunrise Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 Hello everybody, I would like to excuse me for what I'm going to do. I know that is quite disrespectful toward our community, and I would like to add that my parents hadn't educated me like that. But today, in my point of view, I have to be disrespectful and "spam" your forum, because I think that my idea could be productive and because I think that your clever minds can understand this. I come in this forum guilty and humble, in front of us, because I'll certainly need help of some of you. I know it isn't the right part of the forum, and actually, it's even not the right forum. I'll need your ideas and your advices. I know that it's quite strange to throw a rock trough the glass of your window, and then to ask help, but please, read the message hooked on this rock. (I'll totally accept to be banned, and I'm sorry again.) So, here is the message : ====================================================================================== Hello everybody, Hope you're all right. Yesterday I read this (it's inthisthread) : (Val, nothing against you, it's justthe example. If you want, I can find another example and delete it ) ... I don't think there will be enough"green development" in energy' date=' food and water, or reductionin population. My own personal feeling is that[b'] the realcatastrophe will happen in the late 2040s[/b], preceded by amiserable couple of decades. But I could be wrong and it couldhappen in the early 2030s, or there could be a massive increase inuse of green tech which provides power, lower water use, andnon-traditional foods to a population that decides on two kids onlyand stabilizes at some high figure and stays there, sustained,without further degradation of the biosphere. From what I can see, too little toolate seems to be the rule, unfortunately.:banghead: It isn't the first time I read thatkind of thing on this forum or in the scientific journals, and evenif sometimes they vary about the number of years (between 15 and 100years, but average of 35 years I think), they're all talking aboutthe end of our civilization, our species, our environment, ...something like that. I'm not here to define which word is the best. Even if they don't express the samereality, these words mean that a human in 35 years will be eitherdead, or much more in danger than now. Yesterday, I was the most angry I'venever been, I would have like to sue every people responsible forthis. But today I write this quietly. It isn't the time to sue theresponsible. It isn't the time to be angry. We have to be efficient !We've to be clever, we have to react ! Too many people are just waiting thatsomething happen to change the habit of our civilization. I swear : all my friends or members ofmy family are just waiting, by thinking "I don't pollute toomuch; if we all die, I can't be blamed". Even the people whodon't produce any GHG, are seeming to live in a green way-of-lifejust for their own conscience ! If they didn't do that just for theirconscience, they would move the world, they would stuck posters inthe street for 350.org or something like that ! Furthermore, there is the fear. Thefear of being marginal, of loosing his/her job, of loosing money, ofloosing comfort, of loosing time to enjoy the life. The fear of loosing the fight, the fearof doing this for finally nothing. I can understand this comportment.But this comportment has to change, because if we don't do more,finally it will be the same. However, the ecological people aregood. Each kilometer they make by bike instead of by car, it'ssomething like 0,0..01 second of life more for the next generation.So it won't give us a solution, but add all these fractions ofsecond, and we'll have more time to find a solution to our problem,so of course it's important ! I'm a teenager, and according to theprediction, I'm likely to know the "end" of thecivilization as we know it. I'm quite angry that the two thousands ofthe most responsible people have an average age of certainly 55-60and so won't be concerned by the end. Yes, I'm a rebellious youngperson, and I feel it so sad that these powerful people who couldchange our destiny by just one agreement, don't do it. But I won'ttry to sue them or something like that because I feel sorry for them.It would be paradoxical to hope for something bad for a human beingwhen I hope for the best for all the humans by hoping for theirsaving, wouldn't it ? I have try to set up a "community"to change the world, I inform and try to convince my friends (and soI'm loosing some of my wrong friends because it's not a fashionableopinion), I spend hours per day (really) to read a forum and articlesabout environment, and to write posts more or less good grammaticallyspeaking, because I'm not a native english-speaker and because thisenglish forum is the most lively I found (if you know others, contactme). I try to make the things change, with my 17-years-old person'scapacities and dreams ! I don't want to know how many "calls"for that change have ever been given, but I know that maybe 10millions of people are now calling for this. 10 millions of peoplewho aren't corrupted by the commercial globalization, or who areaware with this corruption. 10 millions, it's few compared with 7billions, but it's only what we have for the future. And above, by "react" Idon't mean "increase public awareness" by events orsomething fun and nice like that. Not at all ! This step is finishedand hasn't worked : almost nothing has change. Maybe something likeone 18-year-old out of 2 doesn't know what "IPCC" means. Worst : the global pollution has neverbeen as serious as today. The graphics, for deforestation and for GHGemissions are exponential. Day after day, it seems harder to changeanything. The global growth, which has to be exponential according toa rule stated by the companies, are killing ourselves because it ismade in the wrong way. Today, we've to act in a good way !And it could start here and now ! Here is my project. I don't want toknow how many projects have been launched without any result, becausethis project is my best hope. I find that the general concept is thebest than I can imagine but I need YOUR imagination to improve it orfind alternative ones. I'll need your help. I'll need people who keephope and who trust in a potential global change. >>>>>>>>>>(Eachpoint of this project can be debated !)<<<<<<<<<<<<< A) WHY THISPROJECT ? Some reasons to understand why we haveto do something. 1) Survival instinct : All the humans (which mean alsonot-yet-borned humans) have to be allowed to blossom and to live witha quality of life (happiness) at least equal to our current qualityof life. Let's say that there is a balancebetween what each generation has/will have to endure (like efforts orlike climate change consequences). I don't consider the pastgenerations, because we can't change them. I.e. our generation is enduring almostnothing (0). The next generation will have to endure the end of thecivilization, of the human being really human (100). So ourgeneration has to make an effort and endure this effort to reducewhat the other generation will have to endure. But there is an urgency-variable in thesystem : Even if we decide to endure 50, thenext generation will still endure 100, because it's too late. Sowe've to endure enough to allow the human civilization to survive,even if we endure more than any generation, and even if our qualityof life (happiness) is lower than ever. Because we're only 7 billionspeople unhappy, for make the happiness of all the not-yet-bornedhumans (they're far more than 7 billions, maybe billions of billionsif the human species is still alive in 10 000 PCN). We could callthat the "survival instinct of our civilized species". I know that in your capitalist world,where thinking about our fellow man is considered like a weakness, itwill be difficult to think about people who don't yet exist. Ofcourse they'll never thanks you if you do this, they'll never kickyou if you don't. They are totally powerless, but it isn't a reasonto let them die. If according to you actually it is a reason to letthem die, read the next reasons. A lot of people criticizing thecapitalist world for its egoism don't want to move their pinkie tohelp the next generations, which is totally incoherent and has to beblamed ! Do efforts for them ! If you don't like the egoism of theworld, why wouldn't you help them ? “Lighting a candle is better thandamning the darkness” 2) Love : That seems quite naïve, but have youever been loved by the one you love too ? If yes, you should now howpleasant it is, the happiness when you're looking in his/her eyes. Ifno, it can happen at any time. I had that's kind of love few monthsago, the relation is finished now for practical reasons, but the loveisn't dead, and the memories never will dead. This love is reallypowerful, you've such energy in your heart than you're trembling whenyou're close to each other, and happy. It's maybe the best reason to dosomething : saving all the love that each human can bring to another,even if it's just helping an old lady to cross the road. Of course, you're going to say "Well,it's lovely, but what about genocides ? wars ? massacres ? rapes ?murders ? struggles ? clashes ? and many many others ? Yes humans are strange animals ... Butthe most/all of these acts are committed by psychologically devianthumans, due to unfairness and injustices the individual has endured(effects of a bad nasty society), or/and a cruel lack of love fromhis/her family when he/she was young. But when he/she borns, thishuman is the same as you were when you born (at least the firstseconds). All his/her life depends on the context where he/she growsup. So human isn't bad (or good) when he born. He is an animal. Asall animals, he can become either aggressive, or kind. So we don't have to fight for the humanspecies because humans are good or bad, but because they're justalive, and life worth to be lived. Each human has to have the choiceof being good or being bad, and for that, he/she has to live. They say “We can choose our friends,but we can't choose our family” to express that we're linked togroup of people sometimes we don't like, but we're linked and it'slike that. So, as our family, we can't choose our generation, and wecan't choose our species. We've to sort it out with. 3) Economy – money – business: For bankers, traders and business men: in 20 years, there will be the big consequences on the economy. Theshortage of materials will start to be felt : fierce wars andeconomical deficiency will start too. This will be the beginning ofthe financial chaos, it will be more difficult for bankers, traders,big business men to earn money. So your comfort will decrease andyour children will be unhappy. 4) Let a print in the history: For people who would like go down inthe history or any kind of gratitude : if we start it now and iflater we achieve this exploit to save the next generation, you willbe allowed to tell your grandchildren "I'm from THE generationwhich has saved the human species from the chaos" and historybooks will speak about you. Being the heroes of not one hundred, notone thousand, but well billions of people, absolutely by an unselfishway, quite cool isn't it ? 5) Elevating our civilization: For people who would like a globalpeace, who would like that all the humans walk hand in hand, like themembers of the same species should do : if this project comes to itsappointed end, it is possible that the years of fighting side by sideagainst the global warming generate a "true trust" betweennations, what is lacking to our world. This "true trust"wouldn't standardize/uniform our culture, but it would create a newculture on top of the national, familial, religious culture : thehuman culture. The feeling of being members of the same species.Thanks to that, we could rediscover at the international scale somevalues like fraternity, disinterestedness, trust, value of gift, andthen, the "honour". 6) Satisfaction feeling : Furthermore, if we achieve it or not,while we've tried to achieve it, we'll have a deep satisfactionfeeling, and I think we could die more in peace than if we haven'ttry. B) GOAL OFTHIS PROJECT (= THE DREAM, THE FUTURE REALITY): (need rewording and specifying) Themain goal of this project is : beating the problem which can lead tothe extinction/decline of our species. The consequences could be (read above(A.5.) Elevating our civilization) : -The next generation wiser than theprevious ones, living in harmony with the world. -The human species becoming an advancedspecies, as sometimes the extraterrestrial ones are in sci-fistories. C) THEPROBLEM(S) : 1) Problem or problems ? Are there several independent problemswhich can lead to an extinction/decline? Yes : there are the failure of ouratmosphere, the pollution of the water, the deforestation, theoverfishing, ... and many others that you can find inthisforum. 2) Which one is the main problem? The main problem is the failure of ouratmosphere. Because this failure lead to the global warming. It's aproblem because global warming lead to climate change (rise oftemperature), and climate change lead to ecosystemial perturbations,which lead themselves to adaption, which lead to the death of theless adapted beings and above all, global warming lead to the end ofour "humanity" in that sense that people will stay membersof the human species, but as animals (I can debate it with theskeptics ). Or maybe human species extinction, purely and simply. Ican't predict this. Are there other problems which canlead to the extinction/decline ? Yes certainly, but not as fast asthe failure of our atmosphere is doing. By its global and urgentaspects and by its heavy impact, the failure of our atmosphere is thefirst we should have to deal with. Saving the red mexican trapdoorspiders is good. But useless if 40 years later, our atmosphere'sgiving the earth up, making the earth like a oven. We don't haveenough time for this, it's too late. Atmosphere is our only protection tolive (more info about atmospherehere) 3) What are the origins of thisproblem ? It's due to the abnormal concentrationof GHG (GreenHouse Gases : Co2 is the better known) which makes anabnormal composition for our atmosphere, which changes itsproperties, which make that atmosphere of our planet is less and lessa good protection for the development of life on the Earth, whichmeans that preexistent life is going to die more or less quickly. These abnormal concentration of GHG aredue to two main things (tell me if I'm wrong) : a) Artificial emissions of GHG(data from IPCC's synthesis report 2007): -From what ? Energetic supplying (25,9%), industry(19,4%), forestry (including deforestation; 17,4%), agriculture(13,5%), transport (13,1%), residential and commercial buildings(7,9%) and the waste and sewerage (2,8%) -What kind of GHG ? Co2 from fossil fuel (56,6%), Co2 fromdeforestation and biomass decomposition, etc (17,3%), CH4 (14,3%),N2O (7,9%), Co2 from others sources (2,8%), fluoride gases (1,1%). So Co2 at 76,7% (I think). But it'smore complex than that : Co2 hasn't the same effect on our atmospherethan CH4 or N2O or fluoride ... (It's per example for that kind ofmatter that I need the help of informed people) . -From where ? (data from the UN MillenniumDevelopment Indicators and from Carbon Dioxide Information AnalysisCenter, 2008) : COUNTRY (THOUSAND OF TONNES OFCo2/TONNES OF Co2 PER HEAD) USA (5 461 014/17,5220) China (7 031 916/5,2579) Russia (1 708 653/12,0843) India (1 742 698/1,4751) Japan (1 208 163/9,4912) Germany (786660/9,5626) Canada, Iran, UK, South Korea, Mexico,Italy, South Africa, Saudi Arabia, ... All the figures areherefor tonnes per head andherefor thousands of tonnes. Andherefor general table b) Deforestation : As you can read above, deforestationproduces Co2. Why ? Because the trees (and all the photosynthesisplants) by the photosynthesis catch Co2 and transform it by the nextchemical equation : 6Co2+6H20 =>(Sun light) =>6O2 +C6H12O6 So each cut down tree is an amount ofCo2 non-caught which increases the concentration in the atmosphere,which makes an abnormal composition of it, etc (read above). -Where ? (data from FAO 2000-2005) : Mainly South America, Africa and South& south-east Asia. Especially Brazil (3,1 millions hectares/yeardeforested) and Indonesia (1,8 million hectares/year deforested). D) HOW TOBEAT IT (= PROJECT, THE WAY TO MAKE THE DREAM A REALITY)? Here is the most interesting part ofthis post ... There are two ways of acting : thelegal way and the illegal way. 1) Legal/Illegal way : I want to be clear : I'm against theillegal way. It isn't the good solution. Why ? Because per example,if you start to spray paint all the non-electric cars in your town(to make people buying electric car and so change the production ofthe car industry), after few weeks, you'll maybe start to wreck itbecause according to you there still are too much non-electric cars,so to make the people's mind change faster. And then you'll wreck itwhen people are inside the car (to traumatize them and make thembuying electric car quickly). But what after ? You'll beat them ? Getting over the line of illegalityisn't the right thing to do, because it's opening the door for theextremism. Furthermore, in the people's mind,ecologists will seem as the bad ones, and so the conservativeanti-ecologists as the good ones. So the ecologists would loose theircredibility. That's why we have to choose a legalway. WHAT HAPPENS IN CONCRETE TERMS ? 1) International context : As the global warming is a globalproblem, we've to deal with it at a global scale. First, to keep theinternational balance. Because if only USA, Canada, UK, France orGermany start to be ecologist, their economy will be weaker than theother (till the end of the petroleum age at least), and their will benothing to I.e. fend off the imperialist commercial ambitions ofChina (still led by the current party). So we should study theconsequences of each decision who could disturb the economy of thecountry, and so the international balance. That's why we should create party ineach very polluting and powerful country. Then, to be efficient: if party iscreate in only one country, it won't change almost anything, becausepolluting companies will just have to relocate. 2) How to have the power tochange the world ? Generally, the ethics-less capitalists(because there exist also ethicsful capitalists, and evenecologist-capitalists) have the influent jobs, the powerful positionsin the industries and commerces worldwide and often/sometimes, in thegovernments. That's because generally, they're the « true »capitalists, well productive because not carrying about people andabout the ecology. But don't forget another origin ofpower : the People ! (Look at what happens in Tunisia, Egypt, Libya,Syria, Morocco, ...) So the truly ecologists have to usethese sources of power. a) In the industries andcommercial, it's quite difficult to reach a powerful job (isn'tit ? share your ideas). But, we could increase industrials andcommercials awareness about the gravity of the situation, by personaltalks to convince them to become an ecological company, or bysubsidies. I'm sure it could be possible to change the mind of thebiggest ethics-less capitalists in the world, if you touch him/herdeeply, straight in his/her heart. We could create ecological companies,and with a good business plan, motivated managers and workers, makethem of vital importance for the country in 5 years, by truesolidarity between every created companies. And this network ofcompanies will have to be self-sufficient, because if they depend ofa capitalist company, it could make us complete failure. Ecology is a good source of business.And it will be better when people realize that's vital to be moreecologist. If benefits are quite enough and thanthe network budget can devote an large amount of money to buypreexistent companies, it should do, and turn it into ecologicalcompanies. b) In the governments worldwide,by electing. There is a lot of democratic countries where it's "easy"to create a party (easier than in North Korea i.e. I mean). If wecreate a plan suitable for each country (financed by the companies Iwas talking above), with a good popular propaganda, this party canhave a seat in the parliament at the first election. If the peopleare well informed about the situation (without make them afraid orhopeless, to avoid chaos), and if a quite strong ecological party iscreated in each priority country, we have a chance to achieve theproject. We can use also the ecological partypreexistent. But well, the most of the parties aresupported by lobbies. And ecological lobby (if it only exists?) iscertainly 100 times weaker than industrial one. So even if we cancreate a party, even if this party win the election, after that,we'll have to deal with the industrial lobby, which will befrustrated because it won't be the "master" of the country.I don't know if the multinational companies and the other parties areworking like in the movies (i.e. by using professional killers), butif they do, if/when we arrive at this point of the project we couldbe really in danger. How to make the people voting for thisparty ? As the economic exponential growth isn't the most importantcriteria, I hope it will be easier to give a better level of qualityof life (to rich ones and poor ones) as to promote a 100% greenway-of-life. Actually, I hope that if we don't need to obey to theindustrial lobby, we could easier listen to the people needs. Andpeople need, among other things, a bearable Earth. When we're at the top of the power, wewon't be allowed to make any error. And opposite parties can try tomake the ecologist party falling down. Creating inter-dependent parties inseveral countries can look like Eastern Bloc. But here there isn'tany imposed government ! This won't be a dictatorship. What the ecologist project has incommon with the URSS, is the fact that it tries to change the entireworld. The ecologist project doesn't try to beat the capitalism. Ittries to make it cleaner and greener. And as the history has shown with theURSS, when something quite powerful trying to change the world habits(in a good or a bad way), all the world tries to make it fallingdown. So we'll have to face it. What makes me thinking that ourparties will be elected ? The solidarity of the network and ambitiousbut feasible suitable electoral plans. c) Then the People : bynon-profit organizations, we can increase the public awareness, likethere is already for years now, like 350.org, Greenpeace, etc etc ... It's the easier way to have power. It'sthe necessary but weaker power. Necessary, because without it, in 5years maybe people will be revolted. Weaker because it will bedifficult to convince a number of people big enough to change theindustry and the government. I don't know if these new non-profitorganizations have to be politically implicated, because if they are,they'll maybe loose their credibility. They would be considered like"propaganda tools" and not like organizations (let'sdiscuss about this). If we're able to bring togethersomething like 3, 4 or even 5% of the population of each country(between 12 and 70 years old) around these organizations, revolutioncan start (peacefully, but really annoying for industries andgovernment, if we know which factories/offices are vital for them). Could you imagine what can do 1 millionof people united for the same aim when it's well organized ? 3) Synthesis of the project: To cut a long story short, what Ipropose is to create a global self-sufficient network stretching over3 main departments - politic one, industrial/commercial one andpopular one - and over 2 main levels - international and national (soa third one : local, to spread the idea). (We'll need lawyers to knowwhether we can bring political parties from different countriestogether or whether we'll have to create a new alliance. It's thesame for the law of markets : isn't it illegal to favour ourcompanies and to not deal with the polluting ones ?). The network would consult anassociation of experts for each decisions. The advantage of this project, whatmakes him different from other ones in my point of view, is its scaleand its relations between the 3 departments, which make it strong ifwell managed, organized and coordinated. Furthermore, I think thatacting in politics and in industries within the same framework hasnever been done. We will have to manage the upsurge ofthe extremism. Which will be a challenge too. WHAT WILL WE NEED ? Hope, time, energy, courage,motivation, ... and in more practical terms : -Money (unfortunately) from gift andsponsors at the beginning (a good beginning with good sponsors is thekey for a good success). Later, we could launch worldwide giftscampaigns, meet in person the richest ones to convince them, hopethat companies will give to us to make their own publicity, ... -Up-to-date data for GHG emissions (anddeforestation) -Data about what is already existinglike organizations, political parties, industries that we coulduse/be helped by. And aware, clever and motivated peoplelike : -Thousands of motivated employees torun the industries/commerces (managers, workers, security guards, ...) -A goodly number of citizens to do thelocal "propaganda". -(Best) biologists, physicists andenvironmentalist scientists; to know our enemy (the global warming). -(Best) political scientists from eachcountries, to know how create a party and the political habits. -(Best) sociologists, to know how tomake the political plan. And to know many other interesting things. -(Best) international relationsexperts, to know the evolution of the international balance. -(Best) lawyers in several fields andfor several countries, to know what's legal and what isn't. -(Best) economists and (best) peoplefrom the economic and business' world, to know the economicalconsequences of our decisions, to run the companies in a right way,to have the perfect business plan. -(Best) communication experts, for setup the "propaganda" of the project and for the parties. -Charismatic people to convince the bigbosses of this world to become ecologist. - And friends. = maybe 300 000 people worldwide ? Andthousands of (best) experts in their fields. It depends on till wherethis project is going, how many companies, how many parties, ... But it could be the biggest grouping ofimplicated people for a common cause that ever existed. Why do I want "Best" expertsto organize it ? Because we can't suffer any failure, any defeat !We'll have only one trial, after, most of people will be hopeless,and it will be too late : the global change will have won. We've to find quickly a 100% greenway-of-life, we've to find ways to allowed the human species to livelike human but without pollute anymore, we've to change almosteverything in the world, like a new age, not dark grey anymore, butvery green. We could be the last generation of “dark grey” age,and by the same, the first generation of the green one. We've tostart this age, to start the sunrise of a green new day for the humanspecies. We're the last generation which can make the world changing.So we've to change ! We have to be the generation of the greensunrise of the human species, because we're maybe the last one ofthis species ! And with the power, yes, we can ! >>>>>>>>>>(Eachpoint of this project can be debated !)<<<<<<<<<<<<< I have put forward my strategy tochange. I'm waiting for reaction. Even if you don't agree, if youdon't want take part to this “adventure of the last chance”,share it with your acquaintances to let them choose and give theiropinions. If each human on the Earth could have an idea of theproject, it would be a big step forwards. Let this project a chance. I need your sharing it, I need yourimagination, I need your intelligence, I need your ideas, I need yourmotivation, I need your confidence, I need your trust, I need yourhelp to concretize it. But personally I've nothing to give youback, except my gratitude, my hope and the promise that if we achieveit, all that it's in the power of "simple" people will havebeen made to change the world, despite of the result. The three latest centuries have beendevoted to spreading the Freedom and improving the human Dignity. Howmany fights have been in the name of these values ? We're now fighting for Life ! Theessential condition to have the choice between fighting for the humanDignity or not. The essential condition to be aware of somethingextraordinary precious : the feeling of existence . We're existing,we're in the reality. Don't believe that dying is like waking up, wedon't know what happens ! How many people don't have any sense totheir life ? We have to fight for this, not becauseif we don't we're going to die, but because it's our responsibilityas aware being-lived. Even if we can think “well, the Life would bebetter without human species”, that's wrong because no species hasto disappear because Life would be better without, because it's Lifewhich makes all the species, and human species isn't as differentfrom other ones as what a lot of people are thinking. Some of you are certainly thinking"Too cute ! It seems like a little mouse ... crying becausetrapped. How naïve it is. It finds a poetic name and it wants tosave the world like an heroes ! It's pitiful sight, isn't it ?" I don't care, really. Most of you are between 30 and 50years old, so you won't live till “the End”. It's quite normalthat some of you don't care, because you aren't concerned. I can'tbear a grudge against them. You want to be happy and it's quitenormal. Some other ones are just thinking “Itis fool” or “It is still living with its childish dreams of aperfect world” Yes my heart works with my childishdreams, yes I remember all of my childish fears. But I've also therebellion instinct peculiar to teenagers and young adults who aren'tyet hopeless and corrupted by the society. I've also a survivalinstinct, the same instinct that a lot of people have loose with timebecause society of comfort has lessened it. But I'm sure that some of us careabout the future generation, care about young people and want to savethem from a sure death, even if they seem more aggressive thanbefore. And if they're more aggressive than before, it's actuallybecause they don't have any sense for their life, so they listen thefirst message that the degenerate society send them day after day bythe media : CONSUME ! BUY ! PAY ! AND DIE IF YOU DON'T HAVEMONEY,TRAMP! DIE IF YOU AREN'T LIKE IN THE ADVERTISEMENT, LOOSER! Give them an other message for theirlife ! Like LIVE ! LOVE ! THINK ! READ ! Give them hope forthe next decades. Young people from the next generationare sentenced to die for a crime committed by theirs judges andtheirs executioners ! And WE ARE these executioners. But we're thejudges so we can do something to change it. I think that I can say, in the name ofevery young people of the planet : we don't want to die, and we don'twant let us dying. If you find it interesting, a goodbasis for doing something, if you find it cool, if you find it almostgoof, if you want to discuss about this, if you want moreexplanations, I'm totally available, and I just excuse me ahead formy bad english. I can explain more each phrase I've written and I'mready to do this. To contact me : Generation of Green Sunrise – Gogs –generationofgreensunrise@hotmail.com Facebookprofile Facebookpage Hotmailprofile Bloggerblog Bloggerprofile Twitterprofile Furthermore, here is a summary for whatI've to find quickly : -Forums about ecology (as big aspossible) -Another potential origin from thefailure of our atmosphere (I know GHG and deforestation, which arelinked) -Ideas to get powerful jobs -2010 data for GHG emissions Thanks for reading (till the end ^^).Thanks for reacting. Thanks for sharing. Keep hope. And goodbye ====================================================================================== I hope you'll understand my situation, have a good day, and keep hope PS : Sciences would certainly have been the grade(s) I would choose, but with a project like that, I've to choose a grade which brings as contacts with powerful people as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realitycheck Posted August 9, 2011 Share Posted August 9, 2011 (edited) I think adaptation is a very significant variable, no matter where you live. People tend to stay relatively aware and if a two children limit becomes necessary, I don't think it will be an issue with the advent of technology. The U.S already relies on immigration for population growth. I don't have an answer ready for places like Ethiopia, but that is not representative of the entire world. I would venture to say that some parts of the world could use a little help in terms of enlightenment and responsibility, but the age of information is still young. As far as your personal plans are, best of luck to you. Edited August 9, 2011 by Realitycheck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Boyles Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 (edited) Hello everybody, I would like to excuse me for what I'm going to do. I know that is quite disrespectful toward our community, and I would like to add that my parents hadn't educated me like that. But today, in my point of view, I have to be disrespectful and "spam" your forum, because I think that my idea could be productive and because I think that your clever minds can understand this. I come in this forum guilty and humble, in front of us, because I'll certainly need help of some of you. I know it isn't the right part of the forum, and actually, it's even not the right forum. I'll need your ideas and your advices. I know that it's quite strange to throw a rock trough the glass of your window, and then to ask help, but please, read the message hooked on this rock. All this assumes that all humans act with intellgence and rationaility at all times, which is clearly (to me) not the case. We are far more subject to are base instincts, that are focused on short term survival, than we care to admit to ourselves. Education is of course a great enabler, allowing us to transcend our base instincts at times, but it clearly does not free us entirely from them. I suspect that if a truly sustainable human civilisation is to arise, and it is a very big if, then it will have to be from the ashes of our current civilisation. But bare in mind there have been countless major human civilisations throughout our history and not one of them has survived to the present. In all likelihood future archeologists, if there are any, will examine the buried ruins of our global civilisation and wonder what caused it all to collapse........and similarly ignore the environmental and over population indications. Edited August 10, 2011 by Greg Boyles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realitycheck Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 But with plagues and barbarianism and superstition, it was hardly the age of enlightenment. We invest so much in foreign policy, I have a really hard time seeing that. But mathematically, I agree that it's no guarantee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenerationOfGreenSunrise Posted August 10, 2011 Author Share Posted August 10, 2011 (edited) But there are thousands of people as I'm, who want to change the world. I don't talk you in scientific issues, but in ethical and philosophical ones. You can't evolve without making any experiment ! It's a basis of Science. I had to try to do something to change it. Because without trying, the probability of success would be 0%. And then, when we agree that a trial has to be done, on what depends the probability of success ? -The protagonist(s)' abilities to achieve what they undertake (which depends themselves on ambition, courage, intelligence, ...) -The resources -The context -Luck -Time Edited August 10, 2011 by GenerationOfGreenSunrise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JorgeLobo Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Rambling, very emotional, marked with cute terms "greenways" from" generationofgreensunrise" and no of substance. Only generationofgreensunrise (and thousands of others) understands this and is now uniquely motivated by an anonymous quote from the net predicting catastrophy - wow, that's never appeared before! Alot of silly emotional comments supported by nothing. Pop psychology of motoviation. Global pollution has never been worse? Bycicling adds 0.01 seconds of life the the next generation? " Atmosphere failure - whatever that means. Hard to understand the business aspects - but I just know leaders wil listen to a teenager with angst who of course knows so much more than they do. Eco-motivated political parties exist - the Greens in Europe and a tiny green patry in the US. You asked folks to agree to a "trial" of your vaguely described plan - unspecified objective, success criteria and protocol. Assume you'll tell us the detials of this trial with the understanding that you effectively know nothing of science, business, politics but are driven by youthful ignorance, anger, enthusiasm and angst. I do not agree. Calm down. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realitycheck Posted August 10, 2011 Share Posted August 10, 2011 Boohoo. How many people with a dream had it all figured out from the beginning? I'm not arguing that reality couldn't set in at any given moment. Too many variables. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenerationOfGreenSunrise Posted August 11, 2011 Author Share Posted August 11, 2011 ... Assume you'll tell us the detials of this trial with the understanding that you effectively know nothing of science, business, politics ... Of course I don't have any knowledge !I've never claimed the opposite. I'm 17, I don't have yet undergraduate degree, sorry not to be a genius. That's why I try to convince people who have these knowledges, to help me. I can't concretize it alone, I've never said that. I have to find people who accept to take part in it. Eco-motivated political parties exist, yes, but even if they were majority, they have to deal with industrial lobbies (made up of polluting companies), so these couldn't take any significant anti-polluting decisions, at the risk of damaging the national economy. So that's why one of the aspect of the project is to create some eco-enterprises, make them vital for the national economy and so have an industrial lobby (made up of ecological companies) which would be pros the ecological political decisions. Ecology has to become the "fashion". PS: Atmospheric failure is the fact that the mixed of gases which composes the atmosphere (and allows the development of life on Earth) is changing. And you know certainly better than me that it is the/a reason of the global warming. I'm not english speaker, so I try to find words in dictionary which could express what I mean. And sometimes it doesn't work sorry ^^. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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