The problem with mathematics and time

[Allan Zade]

Time, is most of the time an assumed factor.

 

 

That is precisely correct. Thinking further we have following questions. What if time is not only assumed factor? What if time itself never exists physically? In that case all speculations about nature of time become wrong. At the same time that point of view crushes Einstein'sphysics completely because it excludes time dimension from space-time continuum.

Edited December 16, 2011 by Allan Zade

[The time Traveller]

Wow good question give me 20 min and I will write down what I believe and post back

 

 

 

Well where do you start with this one ha ha ha

 

 

"Standard experimental techniques exist to determine the propagation speed of

forces.

 

When we apply these techniques to gravity, they all yield propagation

speeds too great to measure, substantially faster than lightspeed.

 

 

This is because gravity, in contrast to light, has no detectable aberration or

propagation delay for its action, even for cases (such as binary pulsars) where

sources of gravity accelerate significantly during the light time from source to

target By contrast,

 

the finite propagation speed of light causes radiation

pressure forces to have a non-radial component causing orbits to decay

 

(the 'Poynting-Robertson effect');

 

but gravity has no counterpart force proportional

to v/c to first order.

 

General relativity explains these features by suggesting that gravitation (unlike electromagnetic forces) is a pure geometric effect of curved space-time, not a force of nature that propagates.

 

 

Gravitational radiation, which surely does propagate at lightspeed but is a

fifth order effect in v/c, is too small to play a role in explaining this difference in behavior between gravity and ordinary forces of nature.

 

 

Neutrinos =faster than light

E=Mc/2 = not really there are a number of things that exist that break that rule.

Einstein's theories were based on false presuppositions drawn from Enlightenment philosophy about the nature of the cosmos.

Einstein said that he does not trust a scientific theory which cannot be reduced to a simple elegant picture which a child can understand.

 

Einstein himself started with such child-pictures and developed them through mathematics on the black board.

 

 

The whole of his work consisted of imaginative mind exercises in his office.

 

 

He left the empirical testing to others as a 'mopping up.'

 

If I can show that Einstein's child-figures are self-contradictory, then the theories based upon those concepts must be false.

 

 

Einstein uses plug figures to make the numbers balance.

 

In short, Einstein cheats.

 

The empirical proofs of Einstein's theories do not constitute a discovery of 'laws of nature,' as many people assume.

 

Even scientists sometimes fall into this trap.

 

The empirical proofs only establish that Einstein's mathematics are practically useful for a limited range of applications.

 

 

The are useless for problems which are above or below the 'radar range' of these applications.

 

 

Einstein's ability to predict physical nature in a spotty way, does indeed demonstrate the existence of orderly laws of nature we can count on, but does not demonstrate that he knows what those laws are.

 

He has only found a technique to impersonate those laws in order to calculate predictable outcomes."

 

 

Higgs boson = I think if I am correct they have just discovered a new element and not the Higgs.

 

 

but I believe that they are under so much pressure to come up with a result they may announce this new element as the Higgs.

but then later on they will retract the statement but hey what a brilliant bit of research I hope I am wrong and they have found it .

 

 

As to time well it only exists because man invented it.

 

 

matter does not move relative to space.

 

 

There was no need for the Fitzgerald/Lorentz contractions.

 

 

What really happens is that, although bodies do not move relative

to space itself, their mass/energy does flucuate to different 'space energy

levels'.

 

 

The change in 'relativistic mass' of a body indicates changes in the body's 'space energy level'.

 

 

'Rest Mass' only indicates a body's mass on earth, within our portion of our galaxy.

 

 

In other galaxies or even in other parts of our galaxy a body's rest mass may be different.

 

 

Time does not slow down as a rocket accelerates in space, only the astronaut's quartz watch slows as the quartz's mass increases.

 

 

(Its vibration changes with it mass.)"

 

 

just like god exists because man invented him everything before BC had no knowledge of god.

 

 

( I just know I am going to get some stick for that statement just to let you know I am not out to try and disprove the existence of god its just a dame good reference point and if any one is offended by my comment I apologise. )

 

 

Now back to time ! Time is still a collection of numbers that has been put into some sort of order just like language is made up from letters put into some sort of order to make up words.

 

 

its just man has had a lot longer to get language rite

 

.

What I will say is the new language maths in its own rite isn't wrong as you car' t argue 2+2=4 and so on with in mans under standing of the maths but when you try to use this language to map the universe and space time continuum it doesn't quit fit it will give you a dame good representation of it but not the correct answer one was looking for.

 

There isn't a mathematical language yet that can do this .

 

 

Example The same Electrons can exist in two places at the same time and zip in and out of this phase at will.

 

' light can be bent around planets or a strong magnetic field yet the same two beams of light left at the same time the beam that was bent around the planet has clearly travelled a greater distance yet arrives at the same time.

 

Neutrinos =faster than light.

 

the practical zoo a whole number of elements that the big bang could not have produced and dare I say it a new one they have just discovered.

 

 

Electrons fired at a 2 slits form a orderly spectrum but the minuet you physically view this happening they scatter.

 

 

This is just a small amount of examples of things not fitting into the frame of time.

Edited December 16, 2011 by The time Traveller

[The time Traveller]

my brain hurts lol

Edited December 16, 2011 by The time Traveller

[Allan Zade]

As to time well it only exists because man invented it.

 

 

Very well! It's a man-made thing. Great! But we have one more question here. Is it possible to logically made thing to have interaction with PHYSICAL aspects of surrounding world? If time exists only in human mind it is unable to change physical processes anyway! And we come back to Einstein's theory again. If we exclude man-made category from that theory it crushes completely.

Edited December 17, 2011 by Allan Zade

[The time Traveller]

Yes

 

If you exclude the man-made category from that theory it dose indeed crushes completely.

 

But however as you know everything is made up of electrons that all vibrate at different rates that make up all the elements ! Pretty much every thing in the see able universe.

 

Sorry for stating the obvious !

 

But one has to take into account that there is much evidence to show that the electrical magnetic energy produced by the mind can inter act with its physical surroundings.

 

So if mankind invents time concept then the minuet he invented it it come into existence and began to interact with the physical but when you don't observe it then time the concept becomes irrelevant and behaves so. (particles / dark matter / electrons / neutrinos / ?????? Believe me there are more ooh gravity! )

 

just like the experiment with Electrons fired at a 2 slits form a orderly spectrum but the minuet you physically view this happening they scatter.

 

The reason this happens is the brain creates a electromagnetic pulse when a thought is manifested it is the interaction of this energy field that the brain creates that interacts with the electrons behaviour thus causing them to scatter.

 

 

So I would conclude from this and may I say there are lots of other examples of this sort of interactions going on including the concept time can also interact with the physical universe.

 

Whether or not mans interpretations of these interactions are correct ore incorrect is down to ones own judgment ore ones findings after many years of research .

 

Lets say for example if man says that light travels at a speed of 186000 miles a second or 700 million miles an hour. Then that is his interpretation of it based on his own interpretation of maths so all interactions with this theory will obviously abide by the interactions on the subatomic level.( magnetic resonance )

 

But that is why things like dark matter and things like electrons being in two places at the same time and neutrinos faster than light do not fit into mans understanding.

 

and because of this they behave in a way that doesn't fit mans concept of time yet these interactions that carry on and on and on irrespective of his concept (time).

 

They are perfectly normal occurrences in the universe.

 

I believe it will take mankind to reinvent himself before he can grasp the type of new physics needed to interact with this reality.

 

It is unfortunate that humans have stoped thinking about humans. Fortunately many thinking people of our time have pinpointed the problem and insist on thinking "scientifically", rather than thinking "scientifically as physicists"…

 

Science is not only "thinking numbers based on physical evidence" – it can also be "thinking logically" or "thinking systematically".And even more important is the fact that really great science is about thinking "out of the box", it is about thinking in a way that one would consider "illogical"…

 

The greatest scientific theories were the result of irrational thinking of great minds, who went outside the "logic" of their time…

Edited December 17, 2011 by The time Traveller

[Allan Zade]

But one hasto take into account that there is much evidence to show that the electricalmagnetic energy produced by the mind can inter act with its physicalsurroundings.

 

So if mankind invents time concept then the minuet he invented it it come intoexistence and began to interact with the physical but when you don't observe itthen time the concept becomes irrelevant and behaves so. (particles / darkmatter / electrons / neutrinos / ?????? Believe me there are more ooh gravity!)

 

 

If that is true then start point of time must coincide with first man thought. That is impossible because universe exists much longer than mankind! As a result we can see this. Time flow is unable to have any relation to physical implementation of humanbrain (as a physical object).

 

 

The greatest scientific theories were the result of irrational thinkingof great minds, who went outside the "logic" of their time…

 

 

Well, what if I show to you something that goes out of the present time logic? Can you recognize me as the greatest scientist of all time? Be careful with answer on that question please.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 18, 2011 by Allan Zade

[michel123456]

I agree with this I finished my PhD15 years ago along with several other letters after my name to my dismay feel are worthless now.

 

I have worked along side BAE DERA and NASA and a lot has changed since then new ideas come and go and come and go again.

 

I work in a class 7 security government labs (...)

 

What is a class 7 security lab ?

[insane_alien]

What is a class 7 security lab ?

 

The only classification that could come under (that i know of) is a class 7 (iso 7) clean room. which quite frankly, isn't that clean.

 

apart from that the statement is meaningless unless there is common knowledge of the class system used.

[The time Traveller]

No what I am saying is that time has always been there but not in the same order that mankind has applied to it .

 

Its obvious that we can track the universe all the way back with mankind’s mathematics and his given measurement of time.

 

To what mankind believes to be the beginning the big bang theory just to mention one of a few which is his given interpretation of it but yes time did exist before man .

 

The only difference was it wasn’t put in to a box with constraints like it exists now.

 

 

 

Class 7 security is a in joke amongst us all here at the labs we have several different departments ours is department 7 and we do work for the government that they consider to be confidential the other departments do other work for industry

 

The only classification that could come under (that i know of) is a class 7 (iso 7) clean room. which quite frankly, isn't that clean.

 

apart from that the statement is meaningless unless there is common knowledge of the class system used.

 

And just to add to that the saying come about down the pub after work when one of the other departments personnel asked us what we was working on and we replied we could tell you but then we would have to shoot you lol and they give our department the nickname class 7 government security

 

No what I am saying is that time has always been there but not in the same order that mankind has applied to it .

 

Its obvious that we can track the universe all the way back with mankind's mathematics and his given measurement of time.

 

To what mankind believes to be the beginning the big bang theory just to mention one of a few which is his given interpretation of it but yes time did exist before man .

 

The only difference was it wasn't put in to a box with constraints like it exists now.

 

 

 

Class 7 security is a in joke amongst us all here at the labs we have several different departments ours is department 7 and we do work for the government that they consider to be confidential the other departments do other work for industry

 

 

 

I do apologise I just assumed that people working in the industry would have under stud the in jokes in some labs I have had the privilege to work in it went all the way to class 17 ha ha ha

 

 

[michel123456]

Sorry Time Traveller, now I don't believe you.

Ha ha ha.

[The time Traveller]

i was being Facetious its not ones place to ask about ones work when its Classified! (class 7 is just a bit of a in joke) the GOVERMENT and the MOD dont take to

 

Kindly to its personnel discussing its projects out side of the labs

 

But hey its better that way now you have a good day

 

[Tres Juicy]

"just like the experiment with Electrons fired at a 2 slits form a orderly spectrum but the minuet you physically view this happening they scatter.

 

The reason this happens is the brain creates a electromagnetic pulse when a thought is manifested it is the interaction of this energy field that the brain creates that interacts with the electrons behaviour thus causing them to scatter."

Can you provide a reference for this? It doesn't sound right to me

 

It would also be quite easy to test

[The time Traveller]

http://www.crystalinks.com/medbrain.html

"just like the experiment with Electrons fired at a 2 slits form a orderly spectrum but the minuet you physically view this happening they scatter.

 

The reason this happens is the brain creates a electromagnetic pulse when a thought is manifested it is the interaction of this energy field that the brain creates that interacts with the electrons behaviour thus causing them to scatter."

Can you provide a reference for this? It doesn't sound right to me

 

It would also be quite easy to test

[Tres Juicy]

http://www.crystalin...m/medbrain.html

 

 

Ok... Not really what I meant.

 

I wanted proof of this:

 

"Electrons fired at a 2 slits form a orderly spectrum but the minuet you physically view this happening they scatter.

 

The reason this happens is the brain creates a electromagnetic pulse"

 

You're saying that the reason is human thought, this would be observable yet I have never heard mention of it.

 

The site you've linked to seems a bit psuedo too.....

[The time Traveller]

this is from a web site that Explains it all

 

 

Understanding the Transmission of Nerve ImpulsesNerve impulses have a domino effect. Each neuron receives an impulse and must pass it on to the next neuron and make sure the correct impulse continues on its path. Through a chain of chemical events, the dendrites (part of a neuron) pick up an impulse that's shuttled through the axon and transmitted to the next neuron. The entire impulse passes through a neuron in about seven milliseconds — faster than a lightning strike. Here's what happens in just six easy steps:

 

1. Polarization of the neuron's membrane: Sodium is on the outside, and potassium is on the inside.
    
   Cell membranes surround neurons just as any other cell in the body has a membrane. When a neuron is not stimulated — it's just sitting with no impulse to carry or transmit — its membrane is polarized. Not paralyzed. Polarized. Being polarized means that the electrical charge on the outside of the membrane is positive while the electrical charge on the inside of the membrane is negative. The outside of the cell contains excess sodium ions (Na+); the inside of the cell contains excess potassium ions (K+). (Ions are atoms of an element with a positive or negative charge.)
    
   You're probably wondering: How can the charge inside the cell be negative if the cell contains positive ions? Good question. The answer is that in addition to the K+, negatively charged protein and nucleic acid molecules also inhabit the cell; therefore, the inside is negative as compared to the outside.
    
   Then, if cell membranes allow ions to cross, how does the Na+ stay outside and the K+ stay inside? If this thought crossed your mind, you deserve a huge gold star! The answer is that the Na+ and K+ do, in fact, move back and forth across the membrane. However, Mother Nature thought of everything. There are Na+/K+ pumps on the membrane that pump the Na+ back outside and the K+ back inside. The charge of an ion inhibits membrane permeability (that is, makes it difficult for other things to cross the membrane).
2. Resting potential gives the neuron a break.
    
   When the neuron is inactive and polarized, it's said to be at its resting potential. It remains this way until a stimulus comes along.
3. Action potential: Sodium ions move inside the membrane.
    
   When a stimulus reaches a resting neuron, the gated ion channels on the resting neuron's membrane open suddenly and allow the Na+ that was on the outside of the membrane to go rushing into the cell. As this happens, the neuron goes from being polarized to being depolarized.
    
   Remember that when the neuron was polarized, the outside of the membrane was positive, and the inside of the membrane was negative. Well, after more positive ions go charging inside the membrane, the inside becomes positive, as well; polarization is removed and the threshold is reached.
    
   Each neuron has a threshold level — the point at which there's no holding back. After the stimulus goes above the threshold level, more gated ion channels open and allow more Na+ inside the cell. This causes complete depolarization of the neuron and an action potential is created. In this state, the neuron continues to open Na+ channels all along the membrane. When this occurs, it's an all-or-none phenomenon. "All-or-none" means that if a stimulus doesn't exceed the threshold level and cause all the gates to open, no action potential results; however, after the threshold is crossed, there's no turning back: Complete depolarization occurs and the stimulus will be transmitted.
    
   When an impulse travels down an axon covered by a myelin sheath, the impulse must move between the uninsulated gaps called nodes of Ranvier that exist between each Schwann cell.
4. Repolarization: Potassium ions move outside, and sodium ions stay inside the membrane.
    
   After the inside of the cell becomes flooded with Na+, the gated ion channels on the inside of the membrane open to allow the K+ to move to the outside of the membrane. With K+ moving to the outside, the membrane's repolarization restores electrical balance, although it's opposite of the initial polarized membrane that had Na+ on the outside and K+ on the inside. Just after the K+ gates open, the Na+ gates close; otherwise, the membrane couldn't repolarize.
5. Hyperpolarization: More potassium ions are on the outside than there are sodium ions on the inside.
    
   When the K+ gates finally close, the neuron has slightly more K+ on the outside than it has Na+ on the inside. This causes the membrane potential to drop slightly lower than the resting potential, and the membrane is said to be hyperpolarized because it has a greater potential. (Because the membrane's potential is lower, it has more room to "grow."). This period doesn't last long, though (well, none of these steps take long!). After the impulse has traveled through the neuron, the action potential is over, and the cell membrane returns to normal (that is, the resting potential).
6. Refractory period puts everything back to normal: Potassium returns inside, sodium returns outside.
    
   The refractory period is when the Na+ and K+ are returned to their original sides: Na+ on the outside and K+ on the inside. While the neuron is busy returning everything to normal, it doesn't respond to any incoming stimuli. It's kind of like letting your answering machine pick up the phone call that makes your phone ring just as you walk in the door with your hands full. After the Na+/K+ pumps return the ions to their rightful side of the neuron's cell membrane, the neuron is back to its normal polarized state and stays in the resting potential until another impulse comes along.
    
   The following figure shows transmission of an impulse.

 

Transmission of a nerve impulse: Resting potential and action potential.Like the gaps between the Schwann cells on an insulated axon, a gap called a synapse or synaptic cleft separates the axon of one neuron and the dendrites of the next neuron. Neurons don't touch. The signal must traverse the synapse to continue on its path through the nervous system. Electrical conduction carries an impulse across synapses in the brain, but in other parts of the body, impulses are carried across synapses as the following chemical changes occur:

 

1. Calcium gates open.
    
   At the end of the axon from which the impulse is coming, the membrane depolarizes, gated ion channels open, and calcium ions (Ca2+) are allowed to enter the cell.
2. Releasing a neurotransmitter.
    
   When the calcium ions rush in, a chemical called a neurotransmitter is released into the synapse.
3. The neurotransmitter binds with receptors on the neuron.
    
   The chemical that serves as the neurotransmitter moves across the synapse and binds to proteins on the neuron membrane that's about to receive the impulse. The proteins serve as the receptors, and different proteins serve as receptors for different neurotransmitters — that is, neurotransmitters have specific receptors.
4. Excitation or inhibition of the membrane occurs.
    
   Whether excitation or inhibition occurs depends on what chemical served as the neurotransmitter and the result that it had. For example, if the neurotransmitter causes the Na+ channels to open, the neuron membrane becomes depolarized, and the impulse is carried through that neuron. If the K+ channels open, the neuron membrane becomes hyperpolarized, and inhibition occurs. The impulse is stopped dead if an action potential cannot be generated.
    
   If you're wondering what happens to the neurotransmitter after it binds to the receptor, you're really getting good at this anatomy and physiology stuff. Here's the story: After the neurotransmitter produces its effect, whether it's excitation or inhibition, the receptor releases it and the neurotransmitter goes back into the synapse. In the synapse, the cell "recycles" the degraded neurotransmitter. The chemicals go back into the membrane so that during the next impulse, when the synaptic vesicles bind to the membrane, the complete neurotransmitter can again be released.

   
   Ok... Not really what I meant.
    
   I wanted proof of this:
    
   "Electrons fired at a 2 slits form a orderly spectrum but the minuet you physically view this happening they scatter.
    
   The reason this happens is the brain creates a electromagnetic pulse"
    
   You're saying that the reason is human thought, this would be observable yet I have never heard mention of it.
    
   The site you've linked to seems a bit psuedo too.....
   
   

[Klaynos]

The linked site is not a reputable source.

[The time Traveller]

Why is life never easy lol ha ha ha and just after a hard days work I hope the other explanation from the other site is ok my friend

 

The linked site is not a reputable source.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-slit_experiment this will explaine

this is from a web site that Explains it all

 

 

Understanding the Transmission of Nerve ImpulsesNerve impulses have a domino effect. Each neuron receives an impulse and must pass it on to the next neuron and make sure the correct impulse continues on its path. Through a chain of chemical events, the dendrites (part of a neuron) pick up an impulse that's shuttled through the axon and transmitted to the next neuron. The entire impulse passes through a neuron in about seven milliseconds — faster than a lightning strike. Here's what happens in just six easy steps:

 

1. Polarization of the neuron's membrane: Sodium is on the outside, and potassium is on the inside.
    
   Cell membranes surround neurons just as any other cell in the body has a membrane. When a neuron is not stimulated — it's just sitting with no impulse to carry or transmit — its membrane is polarized. Not paralyzed. Polarized. Being polarized means that the electrical charge on the outside of the membrane is positive while the electrical charge on the inside of the membrane is negative. The outside of the cell contains excess sodium ions (Na+); the inside of the cell contains excess potassium ions (K+). (Ions are atoms of an element with a positive or negative charge.)
    
   You're probably wondering: How can the charge inside the cell be negative if the cell contains positive ions? Good question. The answer is that in addition to the K+, negatively charged protein and nucleic acid molecules also inhabit the cell; therefore, the inside is negative as compared to the outside.
    
   Then, if cell membranes allow ions to cross, how does the Na+ stay outside and the K+ stay inside? If this thought crossed your mind, you deserve a huge gold star! The answer is that the Na+ and K+ do, in fact, move back and forth across the membrane. However, Mother Nature thought of everything. There are Na+/K+ pumps on the membrane that pump the Na+ back outside and the K+ back inside. The charge of an ion inhibits membrane permeability (that is, makes it difficult for other things to cross the membrane).
2. Resting potential gives the neuron a break.
    
   When the neuron is inactive and polarized, it's said to be at its resting potential. It remains this way until a stimulus comes along.
3. Action potential: Sodium ions move inside the membrane.
    
   When a stimulus reaches a resting neuron, the gated ion channels on the resting neuron's membrane open suddenly and allow the Na+ that was on the outside of the membrane to go rushing into the cell. As this happens, the neuron goes from being polarized to being depolarized.
    
   Remember that when the neuron was polarized, the outside of the membrane was positive, and the inside of the membrane was negative. Well, after more positive ions go charging inside the membrane, the inside becomes positive, as well; polarization is removed and the threshold is reached.
    
   Each neuron has a threshold level — the point at which there's no holding back. After the stimulus goes above the threshold level, more gated ion channels open and allow more Na+ inside the cell. This causes complete depolarization of the neuron and an action potential is created. In this state, the neuron continues to open Na+ channels all along the membrane. When this occurs, it's an all-or-none phenomenon. "All-or-none" means that if a stimulus doesn't exceed the threshold level and cause all the gates to open, no action potential results; however, after the threshold is crossed, there's no turning back: Complete depolarization occurs and the stimulus will be transmitted.
    
   When an impulse travels down an axon covered by a myelin sheath, the impulse must move between the uninsulated gaps called nodes of Ranvier that exist between each Schwann cell.
4. Repolarization: Potassium ions move outside, and sodium ions stay inside the membrane.
    
   After the inside of the cell becomes flooded with Na+, the gated ion channels on the inside of the membrane open to allow the K+ to move to the outside of the membrane. With K+ moving to the outside, the membrane's repolarization restores electrical balance, although it's opposite of the initial polarized membrane that had Na+ on the outside and K+ on the inside. Just after the K+ gates open, the Na+ gates close; otherwise, the membrane couldn't repolarize.
5. Hyperpolarization: More potassium ions are on the outside than there are sodium ions on the inside.
    
   When the K+ gates finally close, the neuron has slightly more K+ on the outside than it has Na+ on the inside. This causes the membrane potential to drop slightly lower than the resting potential, and the membrane is said to be hyperpolarized because it has a greater potential. (Because the membrane's potential is lower, it has more room to "grow."). This period doesn't last long, though (well, none of these steps take long!). After the impulse has traveled through the neuron, the action potential is over, and the cell membrane returns to normal (that is, the resting potential).
6. Refractory period puts everything back to normal: Potassium returns inside, sodium returns outside.
    
   The refractory period is when the Na+ and K+ are returned to their original sides: Na+ on the outside and K+ on the inside. While the neuron is busy returning everything to normal, it doesn't respond to any incoming stimuli. It's kind of like letting your answering machine pick up the phone call that makes your phone ring just as you walk in the door with your hands full. After the Na+/K+ pumps return the ions to their rightful side of the neuron's cell membrane, the neuron is back to its normal polarized state and stays in the resting potential until another impulse comes along.
    
   The following figure shows transmission of an impulse.

 

Transmission of a nerve impulse: Resting potential and action potential.Like the gaps between the Schwann cells on an insulated axon, a gap called a synapse or synaptic cleft separates the axon of one neuron and the dendrites of the next neuron. Neurons don't touch. The signal must traverse the synapse to continue on its path through the nervous system. Electrical conduction carries an impulse across synapses in the brain, but in other parts of the body, impulses are carried across synapses as the following chemical changes occur:

 

1. Calcium gates open.
    
   At the end of the axon from which the impulse is coming, the membrane depolarizes, gated ion channels open, and calcium ions (Ca2+) are allowed to enter the cell.
2. Releasing a neurotransmitter.
    
   When the calcium ions rush in, a chemical called a neurotransmitter is released into the synapse.
3. The neurotransmitter binds with receptors on the neuron.
    
   The chemical that serves as the neurotransmitter moves across the synapse and binds to proteins on the neuron membrane that's about to receive the impulse. The proteins serve as the receptors, and different proteins serve as receptors for different neurotransmitters — that is, neurotransmitters have specific receptors.
4. Excitation or inhibition of the membrane occurs.
    
   Whether excitation or inhibition occurs depends on what chemical served as the neurotransmitter and the result that it had. For example, if the neurotransmitter causes the Na+ channels to open, the neuron membrane becomes depolarized, and the impulse is carried through that neuron. If the K+ channels open, the neuron membrane becomes hyperpolarized, and inhibition occurs. The impulse is stopped dead if an action potential cannot be generated.
    
   If you're wondering what happens to the neurotransmitter after it binds to the receptor, you're really getting good at this anatomy and physiology stuff. Here's the story: After the neurotransmitter produces its effect, whether it's excitation or inhibition, the receptor releases it and the neurotransmitter goes back into the synapse. In the synapse, the cell "recycles" the degraded neurotransmitter. The chemicals go back into the membrane so that during the next impulse, when the synaptic vesicles bind to the membrane, the complete neurotransmitter can again be released.

[Tres Juicy]

Why is life never easy lol ha ha ha and just after a hard days work I hope the other explanation from the other site is ok my friend

 

If human thought affected electrons (outside the brain) it would have been noted and well documented by now, scientists are always playing with electrons - They love 'em.

 

Linking to a pseudoscientific site about meditation and brainwaves is not the kind of example I was after, you'll have to do better than that my chronologically challenged friend...

[The time Traveller]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurostimulation

the brain creates a electromagnetic pulse"

 

God dam it my dongle keep dropping in and out going to have to get my internet paid ha ha ha

 

 

[Klaynos]

I'm unclear as to what you are stating happens in the brain/nerves that is not covered by classical electrodynamics?

[Tres Juicy]

http://en.wikipedia....eurostimulation

the brain creates a electromagnetic pulse"

 

God dam it my dongle keep dropping in and out going to have to get my internet paid ha ha ha

 

 

 

From reading the article, the only reference to electrical pulses refer to an external source and using them to treat or test the brain

 

"There are available commercial devices ^[7] that can deliver an electrical pulse at scheduled time intervals."

(from the wiki)

 

Nothing about the brain creating them or their supposed effect on electrons

[The time Traveller]

I am very sorry if it seem like I am posting just random thoughts but all I can say is it is science fact where I work .

 

Not being able to tell you exactly what we do here.

 

what I can say is as an example do you know about the fighter pilot helmets that can control the weapon systems in the fighter jets.

 

well they pick up the electromagnetic pulses from the pilots brain and convert it in to a control signal for the weapons systems in the aircraft.

 

its not the best explanation but it’s the most I can tell you I am very sorry

 

I'm unclear as to what you are stating happens in the brain/nerves that is not covered by classical electrodynamics?

 

I am very sorry if it seem like I am posting just random thoughts but all I can say is it is science fact where I work .

 

Not being able to tell you exactly what we do here.

 

what I can say is as an example do you know about the fighter pilot helmets that can control the weapon systems in the fighter jets.

 

well they pick up the electromagnetic pulses from the pilots brain and convert it in to a control signal for the weapons systems in the aircraft

 

its not the best explanation but it’s the most I can tell you I am very sorry

 

I am very sorry if it seem like I am posting just random thoughts but all I can say is it is science fact where I work .

 

Not being able to tell you exactly what we do here.

 

what I can say is as an example do you know about the fighter pilot helmets that can control the weapon systems in the fighter jets.

 

well they pick up the electromagnetic pulses from the pilots brain and convert it in to a control signal for the weapons systems in the aircraft.

 

its not the best explanation but it's the most I can tell you I am very sorry

 

 

[Klaynos]

I am very sorry if it seem like I am posting just random thoughts but all I can say is it is science fact where I work .

 

Then it should be trivial for you to post us some peer reviewed articles on the subject.

 

I can recall something from a couple of years ago that with very precise sensors strapped onto (possibly under the skin) to try and gain some level of control under specific circumstances of a computer. But I can only faintly recall this and it might have been something completely different...

[Tres Juicy]

I am very sorry if it seem like I am posting just random thoughts but all I can say is it is science fact where I work .

 

Not being able to tell you exactly what we do here.

 

what I can say is as an example do you know about the fighter pilot helmets that can control the weapon systems in the fighter jets.

 

well they pick up the electromagnetic pulses from the pilots brain and convert it in to a control signal for the weapons systems in the aircraft

 

its not the best explanation but it's the most I can tell you I am very sorry

 

"all I can say is it is science fact where I work ."

 

"Not being able to tell you exactly what we do here."

This is very convenient... we are not asking for government secrets - just adherence to rule #1

 

Back up your claims TT

[The time Traveller]

Ok my friend I will see what I can do

 

Then it should be trivial for you to post us some peer reviewed articles on the subject.

 

I can recall something from a couple of years ago that with very precise sensors strapped onto (possibly under the skin) to try and gain some level of control under specific circumstances of a computer. But I can only faintly recall this and it might have been something completely different...

 

And just to let you know your recollections are correct the helmet picks up the electrical signals from the brain and they are amplified and certain thought pattern can control the weapons systems in the aircraft

 

Ok my friend I will see what I can do