The Hundreth Monkey theory

[RED FIRE COW]

Well for those who dont know the Hundreth monkey theory, Summin it up it means that every species can at difficult times(to be precise)share thoughts for example... Hundred Monkeys each in neighboring Islands, scientists put potatoes in the sand of each Island(note those monkeys had never seen a potatoe in there life)It all started in one Island one monkey took the potatoe and started to wash it another monkey saw it and did the same then all the monkeys in that Island started doing it, then heres the weird part the monkeys in the neighboring Islands all did the same right after withought any communication from the neighborng Island Monkeys.

 

So is it possible to pass your knowledge by thought to another, like in the Hundreth monkey theory? I personaly dont know, wich is why its a theory but I i would like to see others Ideas about this.

[fafalone]

Can you provide an original source on this? I'm thinking more along the lines of it being a natural instinct to wash the potato.

[Glider]

Me too

[Sayonara]

This isn't called Hundredth Monkey theory, it's called morphic resonance, and line of site between subjects is not required.

 

The vast majority of research has been done using rats in mazes.

[blike]

According to some websites there is a big push to get results published in respected journals; because the results are often significant.

 

One specific study was cited where 41% of dogs knew when their owner was coming home, even after all the variables were changed around that the dog might normally recognize that would signal "coming home".

 

Ever notice how birds change direction in flight at the same time? Or massive schools of fish all change direction? Ever know when someone is staring at you behind your back? Some attribute this to "morphic resonance".

[blike]

It seems like a fellow named Rupert Sheldrake is behind some of the major research. Rupert Sheldrake is a former Research Fellow of the Royal Society at Cambridge University and has a Ph.D in biochemistry.

[RED FIRE COW]

Thank you Blike thats exactly what I was talking about.

 

But not exactly how the birds change direction at the same time in the sky but how for instance some birds in a certain part of the world, lets say expirience something new and learn it and the same species of bird in another part of the world will automatically learn it as well.

[Dudde]

it could also be possible that these animals are using the same sort of thinking, deducing or logically breaking down (in simple ways) in the same manner as their same specied counterparts?

[RED FIRE COW]

Yes it is true that their brains are very similar just like human brains are very similar to each other but still the coinsidence as some may say, is too big. For example when groups of scientists were all in the brink of discovering the HIV virus they were competing with each other and wouldnt share information with the other groups yet they ended up sharing te award at the end when they discovered it, because they all discovered it like only seconds or minutes apart. Coinsidence or what thats just another example.

[blike]

Well, there tends to be general trends in science. Like right now everyone is interested in quantum mechanics and such. 50 Years ago biologists were interested in DNA. So when people discover something at relatively close times, its usually because thats what the brunt of scientific research is being done on.

[Dudde]

animals seem to think alike as most of their species do, so if they find something at the same time with the same intelligence, they'll probably reach their conclusion at the same time;)

[RED FIRE COW]

Here is the article about this and its not something recent.

 

The Hundredth Monkey

by Ken Keyes, jr.

The Japanese monkey, Macaca fuscata, had been observed in the wild for a period of over 30 years.

 

In 1952, on the island of Koshima, scientists were providing monkeys with sweet potatoes dropped in the sand. The monkeys liked the taste of the raw sweet potatoes, but they found the dirt unpleasant.

 

An 18-month-old female named Imo found she could solve the problem by washing the potatoes in a nearby stream. She taught this trick to her mother. Her playmates also learned this new way and they taught their mothers too.

 

This cultural innovation was gradually picked up by various monkeys before the eyes of the scientists.

 

Between 1952 and 1958 all the young monkeys learned to wash the sandy sweet potatoes to make them more palatable.

 

Only the adults who imitated their children learned this social improvement. Other adults kept eating the dirty sweet potatoes.

 

Then something startling took place. In the autumn of 1958, a certain number of Koshima monkeys were washing sweet potatoes -- the exact number is not known.

 

Let us suppose that when the sun rose one morning there were 99 monkeys on Koshima Island who had learned to wash their sweet potatoes.

 

Let's further suppose that later that morning, the hundredth monkey learned to wash potatoes.

 

THEN IT HAPPENED!

 

By that evening almost everyone in the tribe was washing sweet potatoes before eating them.

 

The added energy of this hundredth monkey somehow created an ideological breakthrough!

 

But notice.

 

A most surprising thing observed by these scientists was that the habit of washing sweet potatoes then jumped over the sea --

 

Colonies of monkeys on other islands and the mainland troop of monkeys at Takasakiyama began washing their sweet potatoes.

 

Thus, when a certain critical number achieves an awareness, this new awareness may be communicated from mind to mind.

 

Although the exact number may vary, this Hundredth Monkey Phenomenon means that when only a limited number of people know of a new way, it may remain the conscious property of these people.

 

But there is a point at which if only one more person tunes-in to a new awareness, a field is strengthened so that this awareness is picked up by almost everyone!

[Dudde]

it is entirely possible that the theory is actual;)

it just doesn't seem plausible really, that'd be almost like telepathy...unwilled telepathy

[Glider]

Originally posted by blike

According to some websites there is a big push to get results published in respected journals; because the results are often significant.

 

One specific study was cited where 41% of dogs knew when their owner was coming home, even after all the variables were changed around that the dog might normally recognize that would signal "coming home".

 

This suggests that 59% didn't know when their owner was coming home. In any event, irrespective of other variables, (the sound of footsteps, or the car pulling up, and so-on), dogs and cats are known to have a sense of time, insofar as they recognise certain significant (to them) points in their day such as when to expect food (dogs and cats will begin to signal that time if the owner forgets). This occurs as a result of repeated laying down of the association between regular events (of which feeding and the arrival of the owner are examples) and regular periods in the day of the animal. This is an example of Pavlovian stimulus-response conditioning, where certain zeitgeibers significant to the animal act as the conditioned stimuli. If the owner comes home at a more or less regular time each day, the dog will begin to show signs of expectancy around that time each day. I find it more interesting that 59% of dogs didn't learn that association. It is possible that their owners had a less regular timetable.

 

Ever notice how birds change direction in flight at the same time? Or massive schools of fish all change direction? Ever know when someone is staring at you behind your back? Some attribute this to "morphic resonance".

 

Others attribute it to the perception-behaviour link. Briefly, this proposes a direct link between perception of the behaviour of others, and one's own behaviour. In things such as schooling fish, this has been shown to be a function of central mechanisms; neural circuits that link the detected motion of other fish to motor centres of the brain, and directly influence the behaviour of the perciever, keeping it 'in phase' (Dijksterhuis, Bargh & Miedema. 2000). This is entirely automatic. The argument goes that as these mechanisms still exist in higher animals (in the brain stem and limbic brain), there is no reason to suppose they do not exert the same effect. There is a large body of empirical evidence showing that even in humans, the behaviour of an individual can be directly influence by the behaviour of those around him (see e.g. Chartrand & Bargh. 1999). This effect is entirely automatic and occurs outside of conscious awareness.

 

With respect to the monkeys washing the potatoes, if we were to place two people in two separate rooms each containing a wash basin, and gave each person an apple covered in some distasteful substance, it is reasonable to suppose that both individuals would wash their apple, and that this would occur in the absence of line of sight, or any other contact between them. I see no reason to suppose the principle would be any different for macaques. Many higher primates have been observed washing food spontaniously. I see no argument for telepathy.

 

 

References

 

Chartrand, T. L., & Bargh, J. A. (1999). The chameleon effect: The perception-behavior link and social interaction. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 76 (6), 893-910.

 

Dijksterhuis, A., Bargh, J. A., & Miedema, J. (2000). Of men and mackerels: Attention, subjective experience, and automatic social behavior. In H. Bless & J. P. Forgas (Eds.), The message within: The role of subjective experience in social cognition and behavior (pp. 37-51). Philadelphia: Psychology Press/Taylor & Francis.

[blike]

Thanks glider, great post!

[Guest Torrere]

The hundred monkey story is mostly true. They did dump potatoes on sand, a monkey did learn how to wash the potatoes and did teach the others to wash them too. The younger monkeys all learned to wash potatoes, but the older monkeys didn't.

 

The whole part about monkeys from other islands suddenly knowing to wash the potatoes, however, is nonsense. Some other monkeys did, however it is likely that they simply learned on their own. It wasn't like there was suddenly widespread potato washing, as Keyes suggested.

 

The research doesn't suggest morphic resonance, or anything like that. It shows how ideas are adopted by the young and how cultures change.

[BPHgravity]

This thread reminds me of a great show I watched on Discovery Channel a few months back on Pyramids.

 

A few thousand years ago, every known civilization on the planet started building pyramids all over the place with no knowledge of the other societies doing the same thing.

 

It appears that all the separate cultures at nearly the same time became aware of time, space, religion, and incredible construction techniques.

 

From what I remember, there is a pyramid on every continent but Antartica, and all of these communites had great centers of religion and very accurate time calenders.

 

For whatever reason, at nearly all the same time, all humanity forgot how this was all done and most of these societies came to an end.

 

Pretty neat stuff!

[blike]

Originally posted by BPHgravity

This thread reminds me of a great show I watched on Discovery Channel a few months back on Pyramids.

 

A few thousand years ago, every known civilization on the planet started building pyramids all over the place with no knowledge of the other societies doing the same thing.

 

It appears that all the separate cultures at nearly the same time became aware of time, space, religion, and incredible construction techniques.

 

From what I remember, there is a pyramid on every continent but Antartica, and all of these communites had great centers of religion and very accurate time calenders.

 

For whatever reason, at nearly all the same time, all humanity forgot how this was all done and most of these societies came to an end.

 

Pretty neat stuff!

 

I saw a similar show on discovery! i don't know if it was the same one. The one i was watching was pushing the theory that maybe there was trans-atlantic travel during that time period.

[JaKiri]

Another explanation could be that hte pyramid is the easiest large structure to build, of course.

[blike]

Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri

Another explanation could be that hte pyramid is the easiest large structure to build, of course.

 

very true...they were also mentioning marijuana traces in mummies or something. i can't remember much about it.

[BPHgravity]

It was more than just the building of the strutures.

 

It was also developing a calender all at the same time. Star charts, relgious practices, etc....

 

The point was that the use of the pyramids appeared to be for the same purpose for all the civilizations that built them, though none of them knew of each other. Unless there is a missing peice of the puzzle like early transatlantic travel as mentioned by Blike.

 

Its just interesting that all humanity found value in time and existence at about the same time in history without learning it from each other directly.