gufis253 Posted January 24, 2012 Posted January 24, 2012 Hey everyone. I'm going to a Bible College right now, and we're taking a class called Science and the Bible. We're learning about evolution vs. creationism, and later on in the course, we have to write a report. Because we don't want to make things up and assume what people who believe in evolution think, we have to ask some questions. I will be handing in your answers completely unaltered. It would be awesome if you could answer them as best you could. Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. How do you think the universe began? How do you think life originated? Explain how you believe life forms evolved? How old do you think the earth is and why? Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Do you believe in life after death? Explain. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? Any other comments. Thanks!!!!
Moontanman Posted January 24, 2012 Posted January 24, 2012 Hey everyone. I'm going to a Bible College right now, and we're taking a class called Science and the Bible. We're learning about evolution vs. creationism, and later on in the course, we have to write a report. Because we don't want to make things up and assume what people who believe in evolution think, we have to ask some questions. I will be handing in your answers completely unaltered. While I know I'll be feeding the lie of religion, specifically creationism I will answer your questions with complete honesty I t would be awesome if you could answer them as best you could. I will do my best Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. No, I see no evidence of god or gods. How do you think the universe began? I don't know, right now the evidence points to an expansion of space time which released energy that coalesced into the the universe we see today. How do you think life originated? The early earth was a cauldron of reacting chemicals many of which were organic, through natural processes replicating catalysts began to become more complex, this process eventually resulted in life... Explain how you believe life forms evolved? Natural selection acting on mutations. How old do you think the earth is and why? Approximately 4.5 billion years old, radiometric dating show this to be true. Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? I'm not sure what you mean, but i think it is probable there is life other planets... Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Yes evolution is still happening, the end result will be survival of the fittest, at some point in the distant future the Earth will be sterilized by the expansion of our sun's death. Until then evolution will continue to favor the fittest organisms... Do you believe in life after death? Explain. No, I see no evidence of this. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? They do not affect sense of purpose other than making me aware of how we need to do what ever we can to have a positive influence on Humanity. Any other comments. I suggest you look past what you are being taught, you do not have to be an atheist to understand why things like evolution are true, most people who believe in evolution are theists... Thanks!!!! You are welcome 3
Arete Posted January 24, 2012 Posted January 24, 2012 A) No one who accepts the scientific theory of evolution by natural selection would be describable as an "evolutionist" any more than someone who accepts the scientific theory of gravity as "gravitationist" or the theory of the spherical earth as a "sphericist". Using the term already implies misrepresentation. B) All of your questions are highly loaded in their wording to imply that a scientific position is held on faith. The acceptance of a scientific theory is held as indefinately pending one the allowance that additional evidence could justify the modification or rejection of a currently held answer in favor of a more encompassing answer. As such, answering the questions, as currently worded leads to direct misrepresentation of the mainstream scientific position on the majority of raised issues. B) Almost all of the answers to your questions are very involved. Understanding the answers would require considerable research on your behalf to understand. Re abiogenesis, big bang theory, evolutionary theory. You're not going to get single sentence answers that honestly represent the scientific position on the above issues. That said: 1a) Do you believe in God in the Abrahamic sense? No. 1b) Do you believe in a Spinoza type pantheistic God? No, but I accept that there is probabilistically small possibility of its existence. 2. What is the explanation for the inception of the currently observed universe as we observationally know it you currently accept? The big bang theory: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/astronomy/bigbang.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang 3. What theories regarding abiogenesis you think are currently plausible? The true answer regarding the detailed events leading to abiogenesis is "We don't know and may never know precisely". However a number of plausible explanations for spontaneous abiogenesis exist. http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/abioprob/originoflife.html 4. What theory regarding the diversification of biological organisms do you currently accept? The theory of evolution via the interaction of natural selection and random mutation is overwhelmingly supported by empirical observation and experimentation. 5. What evidence do you accept as suggestive of the age of the Earth and how old does it suggest the Earth is? Radioactive decay and isochron dating of meteorites suggests the age of the Earth is 4.55 billion years old +/- 1%. http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html As an aside - a biblical young earth (approx 6000 yrs) is refuted by observation of a vast array of geological, biological, atmospheric, astronomical, oceanographic, geomorphological, atmospheric, etc data types. 6. Do you believe in extraterrestrial life? The straightforward answer is that given current evidence it is not possible to know. There is no positive evidence for extraterrestrial life so I currently accept the null hypothesis that we have no evidence to support such an assertion. I accept the possibility it may exist and would change my position based on new evidence - and thus accept the plausibility of extraterrestrial life. 7. Do you accept evolution is ongoing and what is the end result of evolution? Evolution is a continuous, directly observable phenomenon. http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/speciation.html Asking "Do you believe evolution is still happening" is like asking "Do you believe the color red is still happening?" As it is is continuous there is no end point unless life itself ceases to exist. 8. Do you believe in an afterlife? Not in the biblical sense. By passing our genetic information to our offspring we can gain a semblance of immortality, but not in the continuation of the soul in some form of supernatural sentient form our former selves sense the bible describes. 9. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? Acceptance of evidence based scientific theories, I am able to produce practical, observable outcomes from my research. This research results in applications which cure human disease, and help conserve biodiversity - which in turn gives me immense personal satisfaction.
A Tripolation Posted January 24, 2012 Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. I believe in the Judeo-Christian God with alterations reminiscent of deism and some flavors of forgiveness-for-all. I have no evidence to support this belief. How do you think the universe began? Current hypotheses, as I best understand them, lead us to believe that the universe was created due to quantum fluctuations. This was then followed by a rapid expansion of spacetime known as the Big Bang. This expansion is still occurring based off of recent astronomical observations. How do you think life originated? Our best model, and it is still in its infancy, is known as abiogenesis. After this, we use the observable fact known as evolution to show species divergence and such. Explain how you believe life forms evolved? Random mutations arise as a result of imperfect replication at the cellular level. Some of these mutations are advantageous. Others are not. The ones that adversely affect the organism are "selected against" because the organism doesn't live long enough to reproduce sexually and pass along its mutation. If the mutation is very beneficial, it will be "selected for" as the organism will have better access to resources and partners based off its mutation. This mutation will then be passed along. After many (many) years have passed, the organisms will no longer be categorically identical to their predecessors. They will be a new species. This is an incredibly simplified explanation and you should research the topic from actual biologists. How old do you think the earth is and why? The Earth is approximately 4.5 billion years old. This link contains the reasons why we know this to be true. Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? Life on other planets is a statistical certainty. By "aliens" I presume you mean highly advanced civilizations capable of interstellar travel with ease. This, I do not know. I believe so, but I have no evidence to back this up. UFOs exist. They are simply unidentified flying objects. I presume you mean alien spacecraft? If I'm right, then, no, I do not believe in those. But then again, if they were capable of coming to our planet, they are probably capable of cloaking their craft as well. Who knows. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Evolution will always happens so long as life exists and life will always find a way. There is no "end result" to evolution. Evolution does not have a goal. It does not have a direction. It is the accumulation of random mutations over a period of time. Do you believe in life after death? Explain. Yes. I believe in the Christian concept of a soul and heaven. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? It doesn't affect me at all because it is irrelevant. I try to live a good life and I want to leave this world a little better than I found it. Any other comments. Yes. If you are attending "Bible School", I'm certain that your instructors will dismiss any responses you get here as the secularist rantings of liberal nation. I urge you to not believe everything you hear without questioning it. Science is the empirical methodology by which we are able to explain our observable universe. It is not evil. It is not lying to you. Science is amoral. Science has no ulterior motives. Science does not seek converts. Science does not wish to punish those who lack "faith" in it. Science simply...is. Science does not seek to invalidate your God. Your God, if he is a transcendental God (most are), exists outside of science and logic. Remember that. I hope you stay and enjoy your time on this wonderful forum. Edited January 24, 2012 by A Tripolation 1
Dawn20 Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 Hey there, I have some questions I need answered for a school assignment. It would be most appreciated if you could toss some of your ideas my way, if you're an evolutionist that is. Thanks a heap! Here they are : 1.Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. 2. How do you think the universe began? 3. How do you think life originated? 4. Explain how you believe life forms evolved? 5.How old do you think the earth is and why? 6.Do you believe in life on other plants, aliens, and UFOs? 7. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? 8. Do you believe in life after death? Explain. 9. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? There are no wrong answers!
iNow Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 1.Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. No, because there's simply no good reason to. I don't believe in god for the same reason I don't believe in santa claus. 2. How do you think the universe began? I don't know, and I much prefer to say I don't yet know instead of making up a fictional answer that is unlikely to be true. 3. How do you think life originated? Chemistry, and vast eons of time combined with natural selection. 4. Explain how you believe life forms evolved? Those suited to their environment reproduced more than those not suited to their environment. Lather, rinse, repeat. 5.How old do you think the earth is and why? Roughly 4.6 billion years, because that's what the evidence from multiple sources suggests consistently. 6.Do you believe in life on other plants, aliens, and UFOs? I think it is highly likely that there is life on other planets, and even intelligent life. This is the most reasonable position given the VAST size of the universe. It would seem like an awful waste of space if only one planet in one tiny insignificant solar system on the outer edge of one insignificant galaxy in one insignificant supercluster had life. I don't, however, think we've been visited by UFOs. 7. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Evolution is always happening, and the end result will be life forms better suited to their environment. There is not, however, any direction to evolution. 8. Do you believe in life after death? Explain. No. Once we die, we're gone. The only place we exist is in the memories of those who survive us. 9. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? They don't, really. I find my purpose elsewhere, like with my family, my evolved curiosity and desire to learn, and my membership in the social group known as humanity. There are no wrong answers! Sure there are. 1
Dawn20 Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 Thanks so much for your time! And as far as the last statement, I was trying to accommodate all answers, but I do recognize the reality of an incorrect response. Thanks again! No, because there's simply no good reason to. I don't believe in god for the same reason I don't believe in santa claus. I don't know, and I much prefer to say I don't yet know instead of making up a fictional answer that is unlikely to be true. Chemistry, and vast eons of time combined with natural selection. Those suited to their environment reproduced more than those not suited to their environment. Lather, rinse, repeat. Roughly 4.6 billion years, because that's what the evidence from multiple sources suggests consistently. I think it is highly likely that there is life on other planets, and even intelligent life. This is the most reasonable position given the VAST size of the universe. It would seem like an awful waste of space if only one planet in one tiny insignificant solar system on the outer edge of one insignificant galaxy in one insignificant supercluster had life. I don't, however, think we've been visited by UFOs. Evolution is always happening, and the end result will be life forms better suited to their environment. There is not, however, any direction to evolution. No. Once we die, we're gone. The only place we exist is in the memories of those who survive us. They don't, really. I find my purpose elsewhere, like with my family, my evolved curiosity and desire to learn, and my membership in the social group known as humanity. Sure there are.
imatfaal Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 Dawn & iNow - I have opened a thread in the Religion sub-forum to ask about the word "evolutionist" if you are interested. Evolutionist? Is this a common term in the USA?
imatfaal Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) I have opened a thread in the Religion sub-forum to ask about the word "evolutionist" if you are interested. Evolutionist? Is this a common term in the USA? I wrote that question before I read this second thread and I note that Arete has already raised this point above. edited to fix link Edited January 25, 2012 by imatfaal
Tres Juicy Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 8. Do you believe in life after death? Explain. "If I thought I had to do a whole other life after this one I'd kill myself now"
CaptainPanic Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) First of all, I am not an evolutionist. Evolutionism is not a church, and you cannot "believe" in it. Evolution is a scientific topic. If I am anything, I am a chemical engineer, because I studied that some time ago. Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. No. There's no reason to assume there is a god (I've never seen anything that I have reason to believe is caused by any god), so I see no point to believe in a god. How do you think the universe began? I think it's larger than just our own, and that what we think is our universe simply expands into something larger. But we cannot prove that now, because we cannot observe anything beyond the edge of our known universe. So the Big Bang is as good an explanation as any. It fits what we observe so far, and I cannot deny that this might just as well be true. Somehow a universe with a beginning (or an end) just doesn't make sense to me. How do you think life originated? By coincidence. Put many billions of tons of carbon, nitrogen, hydrogen and oxygen on a planet somewhere, and give it a few billion year, and it is very very likely that something amazing forms by purely chemical reactions. Makes a lot of sense from a statistical point of view. Whether that happened here on earth, or life arrived on some asteroid which crashed into earth a couple of billion years ago, I don't know. Explain how you believe life forms evolved? Evolution doesn't need to be explained. It is obvious, and occurs all around us. Because kids are different than their parents, it's just logical that change occurs over time. How old do you think the earth is and why? About 5 billion years. Reason: because science says so. I do not understand the method to measure it myself (they measure some radioactive materials or so), but I have no reason not to trust some other scientists. Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? Yes, Yes, and No. The universe is so big, there is likely other life somewhere else. That other life is automatically alien - although probably not like in the movies. I have no idea how intelligent such life would be. A UFO is an unidentified flying object. It can be human made, and they exist. The USAF's experimental aircraft probably caused more than one UFO sighting. But I do NOT believe that aliens are flying around our planet on spaceships with the shape of a flying saucer... so I answer no. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Yes. It never stops, so there is no end result. Do you believe in life after death? Explain. I do not think there is an afterlife, if that is what you mean. But we will be 'recycled' and new life will follow us. I will not be aware of it though. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? i want to make this world a good place to life. I want to live in harmony with other humans and other life. I have no idea how my "beliefs" affect me, because I have never known any other "belief" than this one. [edit] Why are there 2 threads with identical questions, both in homework help, but from 2 different members (same person, with 2 accounts?)? There is this thread. And this is the other one. I've reported both - hopefully to be merged... Edited January 25, 2012 by CaptainPanic
CaptainPanic Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Why are there 2 threads with identical questions, both in homework help, but from 2 different members (same person, with 2 accounts?)? There is this thread. And this is the other one. I've reported both - hopefully to be merged... [edit] Thanks Klaynos for merging them Edited January 25, 2012 by CaptainPanic
Tres Juicy Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 Hey everyone. I'm going to a Bible College right now, and we're taking a class called Science and the Bible. We're learning about evolution vs. creationism, and later on in the course, we have to write a report. Because we don't want to make things up and assume what people who believe in evolution think, we have to ask some questions. I will be handing in your answers completely unaltered. It would be awesome if you could answer them as best you could. Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. How do you think the universe began? How do you think life originated? Explain how you believe life forms evolved? How old do you think the earth is and why? Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Do you believe in life after death? Explain. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? Any other comments. Thanks!!!! Just out of interest, what are your thoughts on the above questions?
Moontanman Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 Open message to the OP, you say you go to bible college, i am going to assume that means you are religious, your use of the word evolutionist, suggests you are not only religious but a fundamentalist. I wonder how you would react if some one went to a religious forum and asked questions about the beliefs of Creatards? Yes, the term Evolutionist is insulting, so is Darwinist, they both suggest that not only is evolution a religion but that to believe evolution is the best explanation for the biodiversity makes you an atheist and that evolutionism is the religion of atheism. It is not, you are being systematically lied to by the people you are trusting to direct your education. Who, i would like to ask you, is the author of all lies? 2
Tres Juicy Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 Open message to the OP, you say you go to bible college, i am going to assume that means you are religious, your use of the word evolutionist, suggests you are not only religious but a fundamentalist. I wonder how you would react if some one went to a religious forum and asked questions about the beliefs of Creatards? Yes, the term Evolutionist is insulting, so is Darwinist, they both suggest that not only is evolution a religion but that to believe evolution is the best explanation for the biodiversity makes you an atheist and that evolutionism is the religion of atheism. It is not, you are being systematically lied to by the people you are trusting to direct your education. Who, i would like to ask you, is the author of all lies? Well... I was going to be a little more subtle, but this will work. 1
Phi for All Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 1. I don't believe there is a god like the Abrahamic God is described to be. I do hold open the possibility that there is a higher power than humans in the universe, but I don't think it's responsible for creating the universe. 2. The Big Bang theory has the most evidence to support it. 3. Chemicals, heat, pressure, an enormous cauldron and unbelievable amounts of time. 4. It's not a "belief". We see evolution happening in the world around us every day. Every creature works to survive. If they survive long enough, they reproduce. The creatures who are best adapted to their environment are the most successful at surviving to reproduce. As each generation gives birth to the next, traits that keep creatures from surviving aren't passed along while those that help it survive continue into the next generation, perhaps even magnified. Like honeycreepers in Hawaii developing more curved bills that fit the nectar flowers they prefer to drink from, and the nectar flowers co-evolving more pronouncedly curved shapes to accommodate the honeycreepers. 5. About 4.5 billion years. There are multiple dating systems that we can use to give us this best approximation. 6. Your definitions were not provided for these three separate items, so I'll define them as I answer the question. Life, or what we would technically term "life", on other planets seems inevitable, or at least highly probable. By aliens, I'm going to define that as intelligent extraterrestrial life, and again, it seems probable that out of the entire universe there is life we would term intelligent. UFO's I will define as intelligent extraterrestrial life that is currently visiting us in some form of spacecraft, and I think it is possible but not very probable. 7. Yes, evolution is still happening all around us. It's a common misconception that evolution is working towards some kind of ultimate creature or something. It doesn't work like that, a creature that excels in one environment might be extremely unsuccessful in any other. Humans are smart, and we communicate and cooperate on a scale that is incredible compared to other creatures, but put us in a cave alone 100 feet underground and a blind millipede has a better chance of surviving to pass on its genes. As long as the planet has different environments, there will never be an "end result", just survival into the next generation. 8. There is little to support the notion of life after death, but if there is something unique about consciousness that allows it to survive the death of our body, then any "life" after death would be completely unlike anything we're used to in these bodies with these senses. 9. Again, I don't "believe" in evolution. Science gives me the tools to test any claim made by others. I can either do experiments myself (which is very cool and satisfying), or I can read about how others did the same experiments and decide if the work and it's peer reviews sufficiently support the claims so I can accept the work of others. I am able to find purpose in my life knowing that every step I take is solid and supported by observation and rational thought. I can look at the way evolution has shaped humans to be communal, cooperative, societal creatures capable of changing themselves AND their environment and allow that to guide me to a better realization of how mankind can get along and prosper together. 10. I'll echo others here and say that the term "evolutionist" is a derogatory term made up by those who haven't studied evolution. I also have to say that I don't know that the term "creationist" isn't the same way. Do creationists call themselves creationists? I've always made a distinction between someone who believes in creation and a creationist. Believing that God created everything is different than believing in an inerrant, literally-translated Bible whose sloppy maths based on people who herded sheep for their entire 900+ years of life gives us an Earth that's only 6000 years old. 2
jeskill Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view.No. How do you think the universe began?Don't know. This is not relevant to Evolution, as the theory of evolution describes the change in allele frequencies in a population of living organisms over a period of time. Cosmology is the science that deals with the origin of the universe, not evolution. How do you think life originated?Abiogenesis. It should be noted that this is a also separate theory from the theory of evolution. Explain how you believe life forms evolved.Evolution occurs when there is a change in the allele frequencies in a population over time. This can occur via natural selection, artificial selection, genetic drift, sexual selection, gene flow, and mutation (did I miss any?) Important Note: I do not "believe" that life forms evolve. I accept the theory of evolution because there is a highly robust collection of evidence supporting this theory. I have read a significant amount of this evidence and I understand it. Belief is not a word that should be used when discussing science -- it implies that you are not basing your assessment on evidence, but on personal conviction. How old do you think the earth is and why?Geological evidence suggests that the earth is approximately 4.5 billion years old. Some of the evidence is listed here. Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs?I neither "believe" nor "disbelieve" in aliens. Evidence suggests it is possible, but as far as I know, there is no strong evidence to suggest that we have found any or any have found us. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result?Yes, evolution is still happening and will continue to happen. It can be hard for us to observe because evolution happens over a long period of time -- over generations. It's easier to observe when generation time is quicker than ours. For example, scientists have definitely observed evolution in bacteria, C. elegans, and weeds. There is no end result. Evolution is not a means to an end, it's just a process that brings about change. This question seems to imply that evolution always changes organisms from simple to complex, or inferior to superior. This is not always the case. Sometimes, evolution changes organisms from complex to simple (google "blind cave tetra fish"). Sometimes, evolution can cause changes that eventually make a population unfit for its environment. Do you believe in life after death? Explain.No, I don't. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life?It is my sense that we only have one life and currently, one planet. Once things are gone, they're gone. This viewpoint has made me a humanist who believes very strongly in social justice. My purpose in life is to work towards creating an environmentally sustainable future for our children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren, etc. etc. Any other comments. Edit: I did this blindly without looking at other people's answers first -- it was interesting to see how similar my answers were to some others. Edited January 25, 2012 by jeskill
Keenidiot Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 It would be awesome if you could answer them as best you could. I’m less qualified than others, but I’ll give it my best shot. Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. See no need to believe in the Judeo/Christian god, or any other for that matter. If I can ask you in turn, why do you not believe in Zues? How do you think the universe began? All of the matter in the universe was created in the event we know as the Big Bang, though I’m not to deep into physics to know more about it. It should be noted this is not related to the theroy of evolution, which I only concerned with the diversification of life. How do you think life originated? Not sure, we have some good examples on how it might have happened, but there’s still work to be done. The two I’m aware of is the idea of the primordial soup, and an idea about repeated freezing and thawing helping clump together different organic compounds. Again, this is a somewhat separate science called abiogenisis, which is the study of how life developed. Evolution is the study of how life adapts after it develops. Explain how you believe life forms evolved? When animals reproduce, you get copying errors in the form of mutations in DNA. Most of these are harmful, many are indifferent, and a few are helpful. Those helpful ones provides benefits to the creature with those characteristics and are usually passed on to the next generation. How old do you think the earth is and why? Current estimates put it up to 4.5 billion years ago, this is a combination of several factors, like the luminosity of the sun, radiometric dating, I forgot the term, but the measurement of age based off of impact craters on surfaces like the moon and Mars, among others. Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? I think there is probably life out there, probably intelligent life out there. It may be rare, but space is really big and really old. We already know of a few places in our own solar systems that seem to be hospitable for life, and several exo planets that seem hopeful. However, there’s no good evidence for visitation, or or proof of life elsewhere. I suppose you could say I’m agnostic on the subject. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Yep, in fact, humanity is now an active factor in the process due to the way we damage habitats. Humans are still evolving as well, though it’s less driven by natural selection and more by sexual choices now. What might be the end result? Dunno, evolution has no goal in mind and no direction. (Look at animals like the platypus. It evolved away from having a stomach.) Do you believe in life after death? Explain. No, except in the sense that we are survived by those who knew us and remember us. No real reason to suppose an afterlife. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? They don’t, so far as I can figure. Also, it’s not a belief. That’s a weasel word. I accept the evidence instead. Evidence points to evolution. Any other comments. Yes, is this one of those schools that attempts to teach student how to side step science? Does your school have hang ups about the classification of bats as mammals instead of birds, as according to the Bible? Or of the moon as a light source, instead of a reflector? If your school concludes that God created the world in such a state as to implicate an ancient universe, why then is God such a trickster then? It seems in the past faith was not required, yet now is. What does your school teach concerning the other gods? Are you a fan of Kent Hovind?
ajb Posted January 25, 2012 Posted January 25, 2012 Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. In short, no. I see no evidence for God or gods. Therefore I have no reason to suppose that such an "being" exists and certainly no way of proving so. The notion of God or gods seems to me to be human construction. How do you think the universe began? Well, in truth no one knows. What we do know is the physics just after the "big bang". In fact we think we know this very well. How do you think life originated? I don't know what the modern scientific thinking is. Explain how you believe life forms evolved? There is plenty of evidence for evolution. No reputable scientist really disputes this. This is far from my area of expertise, but for me the real evidence is in the DNA which can be used to show common ancestry. How old do you think the earth is and why? 4.54 billion years (ish). The evidence is in radiometric dating of minerals and meteorites. This is also supported by dating the Moon which is nearly as old as the Earth. Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? Given that we know we do not hold any privileged place in the Universe, that we are now discovering Earth-like exoplanets and the shear size of the cosmos it seems very likely that life has developed elsewhere. This is different to the prospect of aliens visiting us. In my opinion aliens would either avoid contact with us, and so we don't see them, or they will make contact in an obvious way. Say for example land on the White House lawn. So I do not think that UFO's are alien space-ships. Almost all of them can be explained without the need for aliens. The others we may never fully know. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Evolution never stops. I don't think there is a well defined end, up to the Universe still be habitable. Do you believe in life after death? Explain. No. I am not aware of any evidence for life after death. Any "proof" offered is anecdotal and personal. There is just no reason to believe in anything paranormal or that Heaven exists. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? They do not diminish my sense of purpose, if that is what you are implying? In fact the opposite. I believe that we have one life, that we have a humanistic duty to make the most of it and generally do good for mankind. Any other comments. What is an evolutionist? It sounds a strange term to me.
Ophiolite Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. I am a devout agnostic. I am quite confident the God of the bible is a fiction. How do you think the universe began? I suspect the present form of the observable universe went through what is commonly called the Big Bang. Although I have philosophical objections to this concept the weight of evidence is in favour of it. You should note that Big Bang theory does not actually deal with the origin of the universe, but only its development from a point only a tiny fraction of a second after that origin. How do you think life originated?Through gradual development of increasingly complex chemical reactions in a rich diversity of chemicals produced by several natural means on the primitive Earth. Explain how you believe life forms evolved?I have no belief in this matter. Belief is a matter of opinion. It is subjective. It implies uncertainty about the issue under consideration. So I accept the enormous body of evidence from palaeontology, biology, genetics, embryology that life evolved as envisaged in the Modern Synthesis and modified by subsequent studies. (Details will be provided on request.) How old do you think the earth is and why?4.5 billion year +/- based upon vast bodies of mutually consistent evidence from geophysics, astronomy, geology, cosmology, etc Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? I have no firm opinion on this matter as one cannot make meaningful predictions from a sample size of one. I suspect that primitive life is abundant in the universe, but intelligent life is less common. I should be astounded if UFOs turned out to be alien spacecraft. There are many more mundane explanations that account for such sightings. Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Of course evolution is still happening. We routinely observe it. I suspect, from context, that like many laypersons you are obsessed with the evolution of humans rather than evolution in general. (If so it is an arrogance I find difficult to understand.) So there is no end result, but evolution will continue delivering responses to changing environments and probably the occassional introduction of novelty over the next billion years. Beyond that would require more data to predict. Do you believe in life after death? Explain.It seems highly unlikely. There seems to be no significant evidence for it. Please note the following: if there is life after death there is no reason to assume it would be eternal life. There is no reason to believe it would be remotely akin to the Biblical Heaven and Hell. Life after death could exist even if there were no God, of any kind. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? They demand of me the following: Respect for life in all its varied forms. Cooperation with my fellow humans. Full effort to achieve all that I am capable of Thanks!!!! You are welcome. Open message to the OP, you say you go to bible college, i am going to assume that means you are religious, your use of the word evolutionist, suggests you are not only religious but a fundamentalist. I wonder how you would react if some one went to a religious forum and asked questions about the beliefs of Creatards? Yes, the term Evolutionist is insulting, so is Darwinist, they both suggest that not only is evolution a religion but that to believe evolution is the best explanation for the biodiversity makes you an atheist and that evolutionism is the religion of atheism. It is not, you are being systematically lied to by the people you are trusting to direct your education. Who, i would like to ask you, is the author of all lies? Excuse the forthcoming bad language (or not - on this issue I really don't care) I am frigging well tired of the ignorance of individuals who should know better. Evolutionist is a perfectly respectable term to apply to those of us who believe in evolution. The fact that you are unaware of this indicates that you are prone to the same emotional knee-jerk reactions we rightly accuse many fundamentalists of. In support of my view I need go no further than to note the title of Ernst Mayr's book, Toward a New Philosophy of Biology - Observations of an Evolutionist . If one of the founding fathers of the Modern Synthesis feels it is acceptable, even honourable to be called an evolutionist then it is fine with me. It ought to be fine with you also.
Tres Juicy Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Explain how you believe life forms evolved? I have no belief in this matter. Belief is a matter of opinion. It is subjective. It implies uncertainty about the issue under consideration. So I accept the enormous body of evidence from palaeontology, biology, genetics, embryology that life evolved as envisaged in the Modern Synthesis and modified by subsequent studies. (Details will be provided on request.) Evolutionist is a perfectly respectable term to apply to those of us who believe in evolution. 4
Ophiolite Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Well spotted. Your reward is a + like. However, recognise the precise meaning of words varies with context. In my reply to the bible scholar I was making a subtle distinction. In my rant to Moontanman I was lapsing into the colloquial.
Phi for All Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 Ophiolite changed my mind about the Evolutionist argument. -ist can denote "someone who studies" as well as "follower or believer". Creationists don't seem to take exception to being called Creationists, so I suppose it's not necessarily an attempt to demean Evolution by suggesting it's a belief. In my rant to Moontanman I was lapsing into the colloquial. We need a corollary to Skitt's Law for ranting. Whenever you're ranting at someone, you're bound to make a mistake that's much worse than what you're ranting about.
DrRocket Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 (edited) Hey everyone. I'm going to a Bible College right now, and we're taking a class called Science and the Bible. We're learning about evolution vs. creationism, and later on in the course, we have to write a report. Because we don't want to make things up and assume what people who believe in evolution think, we have to ask some questions. I will be handing in your answers completely unaltered. It would be awesome if you could answer them as best you could. Do you believe in God? If so, briefly explain your view. How do you think the universe began? How do you think life originated? Explain how you believe life forms evolved? How old do you think the earth is and why? Do you believe in life on other planets, aliens, and UFOs? Is evolution still happening, and if so, what do you think will be the end result? Do you believe in life after death? Explain. How do your beliefs in origins and evolution affect your sense of purpose for your own life? Any other comments. Thanks!!!! 1. I believe that there is order in the universe and that the laws that govern that order have an intrinsic beauty that is not the result of happenstance. I am comfortable calling the source of that order "God". 2. The origins of the universe from about 10^-33 sec onward are pretty well described by existing theory based on general relativity. Prior to that we are pretty clueless. It is not even crystal clear that the universe "began" and no one has a clue as to how it began if it began. 3. I have no idea how life originated, and neither does anyone else. There are some responsible speculations, but not much in the way of deep understanding -- yet. However, molecular biology is making rapid progress and I have no doubt that in the not-to-distant future that the mechanisms involved will be much more fully understood. But your question is really the question as to how those mechanisms came to be and historically how and when they operated. That is not a scientific question and you are free to indulge your fantasies as you please -- which gets back to the non-scientific question as to the source of order in nature. 4. While there is not yet any quantitative, predictive single theory of evolution, what we know of genetics combined with direct observations of nature makes it a pretty good bet that the basic notion of natural selection is responsible for speciation. This is quite consistent with the observation that nature is orderly. 5. I am very damn certain that the Earth is a LOT older than 6000 years. Radiometric aging shows that the Earth is about 4.5 billion years old and our knowledge of physics tells us that the material of which the solar system, and thus the Earth, is composed originated in some supernova. 6. There is thus far zero evidence of extraterrestrial life. However, the universe is a REALLY big place and there is ample opportunity for life to have arisen by the same processes, which we do not yet understand elsewhere. Thus while one cannot state with certainty that there is extra-terrestrial life, I would be rather surprised if there were not. However, the universe is a REALLY big place and it is quite likely that we will never encounter that life. As to UFO's certainly there are UFOs. I once say an object flying in the air that I could not immediately identify, hence at that time it was an UFO. Turned out to be an eagle. Claims of alien visits, alien abduction, etc. are utter nonsense. 7. Of course evolution is "happening". I have no clue what the "end result" will be, and neither does anyone else. One can hope that evolution will result in people in the future who do not compose lists of leading inane questions. But there is little evidence at this juncture. 8. One might hope that the order in the universe is such that what we see in this life is not the end. But there is zero evidence either way and the question is essentially unanswerable. I hope to not find out for quite some time. 9. One has some purpose in the hope of educating people to rational thinking and application of that scientific knowledge that we do have. Countering the idiotic notions of creationists provides some purpose, and quite a bit of amusement. But the existence of such irrational people is also a source of melancholy -- evolution in modern times is apparently not all that efficient at weeding out the profoundly stupid. 10. Science has nothing to do with the Bible and vice versa. If you are being taught anything different from that then you need to learn what science is really about lest you become part of the problem rather than part of the solution. Edited January 27, 2012 by DrRocket
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