dimreepr Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Guess it boils down to self satisfaction. Yes it does, thanks for your honesty. True to a point. We know that singularity is there BECAUSE the maths break down at that point. We can reasonably deduce the nature by examining other singularities (or the stuff around them). But even that tells us a lot about the nature of the beast. And as I stated before, this is not something I'm claiming to be 100% accurate. It is just what can reasonably be deduced from what is known and has been observed. People just tend to freak out when the word "creator" pops up. My comments weren't intended to be fully directed at a creator, but instead in the conditions that are necessary for one to exist. Something had to ocurr with that singularity that was outside the realm of its existance. Does it have to be an outside force? Couldn’t it be that it reached a critical mass? A black hole continuously sucks in (for want of a better word) matter or photons that cross the event horizon, at some point could this not be the reason for the reaction rather than a creator?
iNow Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 We know that singularity is there BECAUSE the maths break down at that point. We can reasonably deduce the nature by examining other singularities. No, we really cannot. Your premise is invalid. All we know is that is where are models currently breakdown. That is all that can be accurately said.
rajakrsna Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 (edited) If you possess the will to love your enemy. How many here has the will to forgive and love Osama Bin Laden? I`ve been a prison doctor for almost six years before I was recalled to my mother office and not once did I condemn an inmate accused of raping his daughter to go to hell. Superfluous video link deleted by Moderator Edited March 9, 2012 by Phi for All off-topic link removed
dimreepr Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 If you possess the will to love your enemy. How many here has the will to forgive and love Osama Bin Laden? I`ve been a prison doctor for almost six years before I was recalled to my mother office and not once did I condemn an inmate accused of raping his daughter to go to hell. Really njaohnt, it seems you can’t even reply to your own post with any coherence.
rajakrsna Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Really njaohnt, it seems you can't even reply to your own post with any coherence. I`m here to defend the devotees of God from being slaughtered ( not literally) by atheists and scientists.
dimreepr Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 I`m here to defend the devotees of God from being slaughtered ( not literally) by atheists and scientists. It strikes me that the devotees of god are not the ones being attacked.
rajakrsna Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 It strikes me that the devotees of god are not the ones being attacked. Well, it`s your word against mine.
Tres Juicy Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 I`ve been a prison doctor for almost six years before I was recalled to my mother office and not once did I condemn an inmate accused of raping his daughter to go to hell. Then you're a fool. If I believed in hell then surely that's what it's there for?
rajakrsna Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 (edited) Then you're a fool. If I believed in hell then surely that's what it's there for? Well, God has a plan for all of us, sinners. A heaven on earth. If earth is hell, me and Krishna-my God are planning earth (hell) prisons or whatever to become a new heaven. You saw the video. The inmates are dancing? is it not an evidence? Can scientists dance like the CPDRC inmates do? Edited March 9, 2012 by rajakrsna -3
Tres Juicy Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Well, God has a plan for all of us, sinners. A heaven on earth. If earth is hell, me and Krishna-my God are planning earth (hell) prisons or whatever to become a new heaven. You saw the video. The inmates are dancing? is it not an evidence? Can scientists dance like the CPDRC inmates do? Ridiculous. The one saving grace of any religion is that it lays down moral guidelines. What's the point if you can break them whenever you like with no repercussions
rajakrsna Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Ridiculous. The one saving grace of any religion is that it lays down moral guidelines. What's the point if you can break them whenever you like with no repercussions Well, my profession is to treat them as humanely as possible not break them. Maybe if you were in my shoes, you will. But not me because not only I`m a Christian but its the most reasonable thing to do. It is what separates the men from the boys.
JustinW Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Does it have to be an outside force? Couldn’t it be that it reached a critical mass?If it IS all there is in existance how can it GAIN anything. A black hole continuously sucks in (for want of a better word) matter or photons that cross the event horizon, at some point could this not be the reason for the reaction rather than a creator? If it was all there is in existance then what could it suck in? An even further problem I have when thinking about this, is how could IT even exist, when there is nothing to feed it? iNow, No, we really cannot. Your premise is invalid. All we know is that is where are models currently breakdown. That is all that can be accurately said.So that's it then? There is no room for reducing a scenario down to a reasonable likelyhood? And there is no likelyhood that the models break down because that is where a singularity exists? It is just a coincidence that this singularity can be broken down the same way as those observed? GR tells us that singularities are unavoidable as long as conditions remain satisfied.(which they have so far) Do you think that singularities are just GR's breaking point and that GR is not an accurate model of the universe? And also "that is all that can be accurately said" is not so. Things are known such as charge, structure, size, strength, shelf life, formative origin...guess no of that matters though.
iNow Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Talking about likelihoods is fine. You seem, however, to be drawing conclusions. As I said previously, singularities almost certainly do not exist in nature.
Phi for All Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 Then you're a fool. ! Moderator Note Tres Juicy, you've been here long enough to know this is an ad hominem attack and is against the rules you agreed to when you joined. No further warnings will be given. Your vacation starts with the next personal attack. 2
JustinW Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 As I said previously, singularities almost certainly do not exist in nature. Ah you're of the notion that blackholes do not represent what could be considered a singularity?
iNow Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 (edited) What happens at the center of a black hole and the black hole iself are not the same thing. As I said multiple times, all we know is that`s where our mathematical models breakdown. We cannot say anything more than that and hope to remain correct. However at this point it feels that we are now hopelessly beyond the actual topic of the thread. Edited March 9, 2012 by iNow
JustinW Posted March 9, 2012 Posted March 9, 2012 What happens at the center of a black hole and the black hole iself are not the same thing. As I said multiple times, all we know is that`s where our mathematical models breakdown. We cannot say anything more than that and hope to remain correct. However at this point it feels that we are now hopelessly beyond the actual topic of the thread. Agreed, I think to continue this particular discussion any further it will have to be in speculations since this scenario of likelyhood can't be pinned down to absolution, which seem to be what is required.
njaohnt Posted April 11, 2012 Author Posted April 11, 2012 (edited) I have gathered some evidence. Before I say it, you atheists really need to realize that you're dealing with something very big here. By the posts I've seen that it seems that you're not 99% (or more) sure that Christianity is false. It seems like 10, 20, or even 30% that Christianity is true. Is this true? The thing is that if you're wrong, you go to hell. I don't want to be mean, but you don't seem to realize how serious this is. Evidence: http://runnemederemembered.blogspot.ca/2009/04/doesnt-it-always-rain-on-good-friday.html How many years does it take for an "odd coincidence" become a miracle? More evidence: Now I've tried to explain this before, but I don't think anyone understood. Our souls. How did they become here? You would say that they don't exist, wouldn't you? I don't think that that is possible. Now I would ask you some questions here, but there are obvious answers, so I'll answer them myself. Me: Why are you you and not someone else? You(if you're an atheist): Because I was born in myself, not in anyone else's. Me: Why weren't you born as someone else? You: Because that is how my brain came to be! Me: So you're brain operates on electrical signals that make you know that you are you? You: Yes. Me: So you feel your sense your brain signals, and not some else's? Why? You: Because those are my brain signals, and not yours. Me: Why? You: Because they are in my head! Me: How is that your head? You: I was born with it! You see how this is? You are feeling your brain signals with something... a soul, electrical signals don't feel themselves. More evidence: Somethings to think about... http://web001.rbc.or...ence-of-god.pdf More evidence: This is not much evidence, but I think that to world is too complex, and amazing for a god to have not have created it. More evidence: Now this may not be evidence, but wouldn't we have grown wings by now if evolution were real? Edited April 11, 2012 by njaohnt -3
iNow Posted April 12, 2012 Posted April 12, 2012 Watch this, my friend: http://riatheist.com/blog/2011/10/03/pascals-wager-debunked/
Phi for All Posted April 12, 2012 Posted April 12, 2012 I have gathered some evidence. Before I say it, you atheists really need to realize that you're dealing with something very big here. By the posts I've seen that it seems that you're not 99% (or more) sure that Christianity is false. It seems like 10, 20, or even 30% that Christianity is true. Is this true? The thing is that if you're wrong, you go to hell. I don't want to be mean, but you don't seem to realize how serious this is. So far, there has been no evidence (NONE) that can't be explained in simpler terms than "Christianity is correct". As for the threat of going to hell, I look at it this way. If, at the end of my life, I find myself being judged by a God that tells me I'll be tormented forever for not worshiping Him, I'll be happy to tell Him I would never dream of being so cruel to anyone, so who was made in Who's image? If this God tells me I'll be tormented forever because I flubbed on a couple of His commandments, I'll tell Him that even though He etched them in stone for Moses, they got hidden in the Ark of the Covenant, so people couldn't agree on whether to follow the version in Exodus or the one in Deuteronomy. He shouldn't hold that against us, since Someone hid the Ark. And if He tells me I'll be tormented forever because I should have worshiped His son, I'll point out that His son got misused by a lot of people who did horrible things in his name, and I didn't want to take the chance of being one of them. Evidence:http://runnemedereme...ood-friday.html How many years does it take for an "odd coincidence" become a miracle? I'm thinking more than "several of those Fridays". More evidence:Now I've tried to explain this before, but I don't think anyone understood. Our souls. How did they become here? You would say that they don't exist, wouldn't you? I don't think that that is possible. Is a soul different from consciousness? Now I would ask you some questions here, but there are obvious answers, so I'll answer them myself.Me: Why are you you and not someone else? You(if you're an atheist): Because I was born in myself, not in anyone else's. Me: Why weren't you born as someone else? You: Because that is how my brain came to be! Me: So you're brain operates on electrical signals that make you know that you are you? You: Yes. Me: So you feel your sense your brain signals, and not some else's? Why? You: Because those are my brain signals, and not yours. Me: Why? You: Because they are in my head! Me: How is that your head? You: I was born with it! You see how this is? You are feeling your brain signals with something... a soul, electrical signals don't feel themselves. Your thoughts are individual to you and don't travel outside your brain. Why is that evidence that Christianity is correct? More evidence:Somethings to think about... http://web001.rbc.or...ence-of-god.pdf This is just more circular reasoning, God is real because the Bible says so and the Bible is the word of God, who is real because the Bible says so. More evidence:This is not much evidence, but I think that to world is too complex, and amazing for a god to have not have created it. This is evidence to support the fact that you didn't read any of the talkorigins links that were given to you. More evidence:Now this may not be evidence, but wouldn't we have grown wings by now if evolution were real? Why? Is flight the ultimate survival benefit for every creature? Is any creature that flies today better suited to our environment than we are? Think about how enormous wings on a human would have to be, and how much more muscle we'd need to use them. Creatures with wings have extremely lightweight bodies with hollow bones. Isn't it better to have dense muscles and arms with hands and opposable thumbs so we can build airplanes?
Moontanman Posted April 12, 2012 Posted April 12, 2012 I have gathered some evidence. Before I say it, you atheists really need to realize that you're dealing with something very big here. By the posts I've seen that it seems that you're not 99% (or more) sure that Christianity is false. It seems like 10, 20, or even 30% that Christianity is true. Is this true? The thing is that if you're wrong, you go to hell. I don't want to be mean, but you don't seem to realize how serious this is. njaohnt! oh how i wish i could say i am glad to see you back but sadly i cannot. You come back with the same condescending attitude you left with. Again assuming that none of us have ever given any thought to this at all and big brother njaohnt is here to show the realy really really obvious truth of the matter. Evidence:http://runnemederemembered.blogspot.ca/2009/04/doesnt-it-always-rain-on-good-friday.html How many years does it take for an "odd coincidence" become a miracle? Horse feathers, it was nice and sunny here on good Friday, beautiful day, the weather on any particular good friday is no different than the weather on any other particular day. I am assuming this was ajoke on your part, have you now become an atheist and just funning us? More evidence:Now I've tried to explain this before, but I don't think anyone understood. Our souls. How did they become here? You would say that they don't exist, wouldn't you? I don't think that that is possible. Now I would ask you some questions here, but there are obvious answers, so I'll answer them myself. What you think is irrelevant to this discussion, evidence talks horse feathers walk my friend. Me: Why are you you and not someone else?You(if you're an atheist): Because I was born in myself, not in anyone else's. My genetics and my experiences are what made me ... me Me: Why weren't you born as someone else?You: Because that is how my brain came to be! See above... Me: So you're brain operates on electrical signals that make you know that you are you?You: Yes. Me: So you feel your sense your brain signals, and not some else's? Why? You: Because those are my brain signals, and not yours. Me: Why? You: Because they are in my head! Me: How is that your head? You: I was born with it! You see how this is? You are feeling your brain signals with something... a soul, electrical signals don't feel themselves. You honestly think this is an argument? it's childish nonsense at best, insanity at worst. More evidence:Somethings to think about... http://web001.rbc.or...ence-of-god.pdf Much of this is simply lies. if you want me to take the time to refute each one independently you will have to take the time to type each one. More evidence:This is not much evidence, but I think that to world is too complex, and amazing for a god to have not have created it. Again what you think is not relevant, evidence points to a naturalistic cause to the world around us, if you disagree show evidence of why, your inability to see it is meaningless. More evidence:Now this may not be evidence, but wouldn't we have grown wings by now if evolution were real? Why would you expect people to have grown wings?
njaohnt Posted April 12, 2012 Author Posted April 12, 2012 Watch this, my friend: http://riatheist.com...wager-debunked/ Oh wow, that lacks so much evidence.
iNow Posted April 12, 2012 Posted April 12, 2012 Oh wow, that lacks so much evidence. How does one provide evidence that a position is inherently baseless and illogical?
mooeypoo Posted April 12, 2012 Posted April 12, 2012 I have gathered some evidence. Before I say it, you atheists really need to realize that you're dealing with something very big here. By the posts I've seen that it seems that you're not 99% (or more) sure that Christianity is false. It seems like 10, 20, or even 30% that Christianity is true. Is this true? The thing is that if you're wrong, you go to hell. I don't want to be mean, but you don't seem to realize how serious this is. Evidence: http://runnemederemembered.blogspot.ca/2009/04/doesnt-it-always-rain-on-good-friday.html How many years does it take for an "odd coincidence" become a miracle? Never, if it is explained scientifically, which even the christian church admits 99.99% of "miracles" are. So, if that's the case, why define anythign at all as a miracle? Why not assume there is, somewhere, an explanation, and look for it, instead of settling for "it's a miracle" and forgoing any sort of explanation, until someone comes back with one by accident or by research? That's not evidence. ~mooey
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