Ignorance is bliss.

[Phi for All]

Well wouldn't not knowing a problem even existed beat the problem all together? Why live life worrying about every single outcome. Preparing for stuff that most likely will never happen. What is the definition of "safe enough"? Give me an example of "safe enough" and I promise you I can find a way around it.

 

Your little example of an asteroid headed our way, do you really think the best thing to do is to tell 7 billion people that they are all going to die and there is nothing that they can do about it? Would it not be better to let them live what little time they had left in whatever blissful moment they can cling on to?

Nice strawmen. I said you do as much preparation as makes you feel safe enough. Whether or not it really is enough is beside the point. Again, your ability to deal with calamity is greater when you know what you're dealing with. That's not ever going to change, so whether you ever find out about the calamity or not, knowledge is the only thing that can really help. Ignorance pretty much guarantees you're going to succumb to whatever comes along.

 

And I said I wanted to know about the asteroid, not that I'm telling the entire planet's population. But I understand why you have to use fallacies to make ignorance look good.

[Greg H.]

I repeat the key phrase in my example was "BUT NEVER FOUND OUT ABOUT IT." An IRS agent coming to your door to NOTIFY you is, I'm pretty sure, FINDING OUT ABOUT IT. Here's one that has been around for a while and can convey almost the same message;

 

"If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

- http://en.wikipedia....lls_in_a_forest

 

Well,, if we lived in a magical world where large piles of unaccounted for money can simply hang around and no one notices or cares, then I doubt it would have any impact on your state of bliss at all. Why should being unaware of things you are unaware of make you any more or less happy?

 

And if a tree falls in the forest, sound is created whether any suitable receptors are there to receive it or not. Sound is just one form of energy created when the potential energy of the tree's vertical position is released by it falling over.

[HerbertSu]

Nice strawmen. I said you do as much preparation as makes you feel safe enough. Whether or not it really is enough is beside the point. Again, your ability to deal with calamity is greater when you know what you're dealing with. That's not ever going to change, so whether you ever find out about the calamity or not, knowledge is the only thing that can really help. Ignorance pretty much guarantees you're going to succumb to whatever comes along.

 

And I said I wanted to know about the asteroid, not that I'm telling the entire planet's population. But I understand why you have to use fallacies to make ignorance look good.

 

 

"Whether or not it really is enough is beside the point." How can you FEEL safe enough when you don't know what ENOUGH is? And you are missing my point, when calamity, i.e. a disaster, strikes you are no other ignorant but aware and is entirely not my point.

 

Okay lets play this out, you know that an asteroid is coming to wipe out the Earth and there's nothing you can do about it, what are you going to do next?

 

Well,, if we lived in a magical world where large piles of unaccounted for money can simply hang around and no one notices or cares, then I doubt it would have any impact on your state of bliss at all. Why should being unaware of things you are unaware of make you any more or less happy?

 

And if a tree falls in the forest, sound is created whether any suitable receptors are there to receive it or not. Sound is just one form of energy created when the potential energy of the tree's vertical position is released by it falling over.

 

Have you been absent for most of this forum? Go reread some of it and most of your questions have been addressed.

 

If there was no one around, then who would have heard it to acknowledge that a sound was even made?

[brockw69]

I stumbled upon this exact topic when someone said to me that ignorance is bliss. Although the topic [here] is relatively old, the topic and statement often arises.
Let us look at a fact. A cow is not a monkey. That is a fact.
IMHO the statement, "Ignorance is Bliss." , is wrong.
The fact is that ignorance is ignorance. The fact is that bliss is bliss. To say that something is any other thing, other than what it is, hence the term, "It is what it is." , brings me to conclude that, beyond the facts, there is no more.
I will disclaim that I have arrived at this conclusion through knowledge and not through the fact that a cow is not a monkey.
To remain ignorant of the facts may cause bliss, however, this is relative to the situation.
Just as with the term "happiness", there are many way's one can arrive at bliss, ignorance is just one of the many way's.
Monks have for centuries discovered and rediscovered way's of achieving bliss. Bliss is a describing word that describes an emotional state brought about in many way's.
Ignorance is not bliss. Bliss is not ignorance. Ignorance is ignorance and bliss is bliss.
Now I am blissfully ignorant to any other reply or comment on the subject that may disprove the facts above and I shall remain so until the topic is bought to my attention in the future.

<------------>
Warren

[Endy0816]

I generally agree, but there is some knowledge out there that can lead to self destruction.

 

So, yeah, depends on what you are ignorant of, rather than a blanket statement.

[Greg H.]

I generally agree, but there is some knowledge out there that can lead to self destruction.

 

So, yeah, depends on what you are ignorant of, rather than a blanket statement.

I'd be curious to know what knowledge is self destructive in and of iteself. Normally self-destruction comes from the application of (or mis-application) of knowledge, not simply the knowing of something.

[Endy0816]

Knowledge of an insane act can cause copycats. Suicide is a big area you see this in.

 

Depending on your country there may already be media restrictions in place.

[Greg H.]

Knowledge of an insane act can cause copycats. Suicide is a big area you see this in.

 

Depending on your country there may already be media restrictions in place.

Now we're getting into a fuzzy linquistic area, I think. What you're referring to as knowledge, I'm more inclined to see as application of knowledge. And I think the distinction is important - if two people see a media report about suicides, and one commits suicide while the other doesn't, was the knowledge self destructive or not? Can it be both? Or is it more correct to say that the individual reaction to the knowledge was self-destructive?

[Phi for All]

How can you FEEL safe enough when you don't know what ENOUGH is?

Aren't you making my point here? Ignorance would leave you without the data to make informed decisions, like how safe is safe enough. Only by removing ignorance do you get the kind of information you need, information that only the most intelligent species could ever benefit from.

 

If I find a home for my family, I want to know as much as I can about it so I can take appropriate measures for safety. I know I can't protect them from everything, but removing ignorance so I can know as much about my home as possible gives me the best chance to protect them. If I know there's a high school nearby, I might put some extra locks on the doors and windows. If there are coyotes in the area, I'll be extra vigilant about when I let my small dog outside. It's not about being as safe as possible all the time, it's about knowing when it's appropriate to take different measures to increase safety.

 

This seems so basic to me. If you don't know there's angry bees in the box, you're most likely going to do what you normally do with boxes.

 

And you are missing my point, when calamity, i.e. a disaster, strikes you are no other ignorant but aware and is entirel not my point.

I didn't understand this. Please reiterate.

 

Okay lets play this out, you know that an asteroid is coming to wipe out the Earth and there's nothing you can do about it, what are you going to do next?

Let's further assume there's no way for me to get my family offplanet. And that it will mean total destruction, no chance of weathering it out underground and helping the species survive. We're all going to die, and I'm the only one who knows it.

 

How much time is left? I'm assuming not much, since more time might mean at least a chance of escape. If it's a matter of weeks, I'd tell my family and friends, at least the ones who feel as I do about ignorance. Sell off some assets and book a world cruise with the folks I love best.

 

Then I'd proceed to absorb all the beauty and love and laughter Earth has to offer before it all goes away. Without that knowledge, I'd otherwise be doing too much cleaning and lawn mowing and not making enough opportunities for intelligent bliss.

 

If there was no one around, then who would have heard it to acknowledge that a sound was even made?

We know sound was made because that's what happens when energy is released in this way. There's nothing else in reality that suggests it would be any different if nobody was there.

[Marshalscienceguy]

Yup, those who are ignorance do not see the issues in life. Those who are not aware enough to figure this stuff out are very happy.

[brockw69]

I would put your statement more like what is about to follow: Those whom are ignorant are not aware of some issues in life and are not in a position to know this stuff and are very happy as a result.

Now I shall mute that statement by using an example. In India's cast society, there exists people known as untouchables. These people are in the lowest cast and are forced to savage food from rubbish dumps. Most of these people are aware of the upper class and the problems they have, including having too much food left over after dinner so that goes in the bin etc... Most of the people living in the cast society in India believe that they are not permitted to rise above the cast level of society they are born into as that level of society as a result of karma from whatever bad things they did in a past life. A few of the people living at the bottom of the cast society live their lives happy as they believe that if they go through the suffering that accompanies life at the bottom of the cast system of society, and remain as pure as they can, they may be reborn into a higher cast of society in their next life.
This example is probably not the best example to make my point.

Another example is that a person living in western society, middle class worker, may be fully aware of the problems of having to pay too much tax because they made too much money for the year.

All said, ignorance is still ignorance and bliss is still bliss. There are countless reasons for ignorance and equally countless ways one can arrive at a state of bliss.
I think that being content with what you know and what you have will cause you to be in a state of bliss. If one is not content and coverts things, one will likely be unhappy and not feeling blissful. Some people remain very happy living a life of simplicity, having enough food; shelter and clothing and, perhaps, some herb superb growing and some dried so they can add it to their brownies, live a very happy life. [ herb is optional and not necessary for a blissful life].