Behavioral Modification / Neurological Bioengineering

[Guest komouse]

The problem with your proposal isn't just the difference between negative and positive behavior, which is very hard to define unless your talking about a specific mental illness. The problem is the drug you've chosen to stop the "transmission" of these behaviors doesn't even have a point of action in the brain. IT AFFECTS MUSCLES, which you state in your original post. You might be able to imobilize your patient, but you won't address any of your theory about behavior. Your experiment is terribly flawed. I'd try doing some more research into the brain areas involved in reward processing and dopamine transmission with in it. Address issues of motivation and pleasure before "negative" and "positive" behavior. I think you'll find that the line is extremely blurry.

[Guest Viaggio]

...if there was a way to stop a convicted man/woman from committing violent acts such as murder or rape, wouldnt you want to try and find it? I'm not saying that if you could stop it that you would stop everyone from having emotions. I just like the idea of maybe stopping a known alcoholic from beating their spouses or children.

Sounds like a noble cause, but the "cure" looks worse than the disease. Unless I'm mistaken, you want to tamper with an individual's free will. Free will is part of an individual's essence. I believe the obvious moral concerns with your idea distracts most folks. Example: gene cleansing (Hitler).

[Quixix]

Sounds like a noble cause, but the "cure" looks worse than the disease. Unless I'm mistaken, you want to tamper with an individual's free will. Free will is part of an individual's essence. I believe the obvious moral concerns with your idea distracts most folks. [b']Example: gene cleansing (Hitler).[/b]

I would absolutely agree with you, but I have terrible doubts. According to my latest thinking, the cortex appears in evolution much after the limbic and reptilian brain. Much after instinctive and emotional behaviour, that is, built and evolved in order to improve on the capacities of survival of the species.Like if the cortex and its cognitive capacities were an appendix at the service of the more primitive functions . This does not seem to leave much room for free will. And this has nothing to do with genes or manipulation, it is not important what you think about what you will or will not do. The result will be the same.

Best wishes

Pau

[Kindria2000]

Your experiment is terribly flawed. I'd try doing some more research into the brain areas involved in reward processing and dopamine transmission with in it.

 

The reason that I posted this thread in the first place was to further my research. The point of this is to get input from others so I can refine my theory.

 

Another thing, I dont think that its fair to compare me to Hitler. Trying to prevent murder and performing genocide and the modification of race are different things.

[Kindria2000]

I've now added information to my paper concerning PET and fMRI scans. Does anyone else have any input? It would be greatly appreciated.

[Kygron]

Wow, you're trying to do SCIENCE and everyone just wants to tell you about ETHICS! Chemicals and the ability to control life are far more interesting than what you would ever actually DO with that power, right?

 

However, many different people seem to believe that those topics ARE important to your paper, or they wouldn't be suggesting them to you. They really are trying to help you.

 

I suggest you add another section to your paper. "The ethics of widespread behavioral modification" or something along those lines. I'm NOT telling you what to write in that section. I'm asking you to do the research yourself. Do it however you want to, but do it. Your peers will consider you far more mature if you approach the problem from ALL angles!

 

I will also challenge you. If for some reason you discover that you don't want to continue the research for ethical reasons, DON'T LET THAT STOP YOU! Research ignored for ethical reasons just leaves it open for a unethical person to continue. Potential problems should always be dealt with as they arise, not put off until someone forgets it and ends up causing the problem!

 

But please, deal with the problems by adding a section on ethics to your paper. If that's uninteresting, then ask a friend to do that section and submit the whole thing as a joint effort.

[Kindria2000]

Wow, THANK YOU!!! You seem to be the first person to get what I'm saying. I currently do have a section in my paper of the ethics of approaching a subject this morally turpitude. Right now though, all I've been trying to do is get some information on how I can further extend the plausibility of the different pieces of my research. For example: finding which part of the brain, or how the brain processes negative and violent behavior; If there is a chemical or mineral substance that can disable the violent behavior, etc.

 

"Research ignored for ethical reasons just leaves it open for a unethical person to continue." That is another good point. Unfortunatly, I am a morally developed enough person to never put my research to practical application (and I say unfortunatly because I think it would be a interesting scientifical achievment.) Before I even started my research I was greatly agitated because of my morals and this subject. I mean, who am I to try and stunt a humans natural emotion. but for the sake of curiosity I have continued.

 

I hope this helps readers to understand that I am not morally inept, but I do this for the sake of possibly enhancing our understanding of emotions and the brains' process of deciphering information.

[badchad]

Okay Kindria, the honest answer to your question is that your suggesting something that is completely impossible to do. You may re-read the thread to see all the problems associated with such an experiment.

 

However, you seem enthusiastic, an unable to accept "no" for an answer so I'll give you a hypothetical experiment. As a side note to those who will criticize ME, trust me I realize the difficulties of such an experiment, I'm just offering advice.

 

A simple experiment:

 

1. Show human subjects extremely violent images, video etc. while performing an MRI and or PET scan. This will in essence show areas of the brain which "light up" or are otherwise activated in response to violence. You've identified the areas of the brain which are prone to "negative behavior".

 

2. Use your toxin, cut off blood supply, or some other way destroy these areas of the brain.

 

3. If you've chosen correctly you'll have a non-violent happy person.

 

4. Publish results, claim your nobel prize.

 

5. DO the procedure on yourself.

 

6. Live happily ever after.

[reverse]

You mean anti-social behaviour.

 

Anger is quite close to determination.

 

you might clip out an undesired emotion and find out it was part of a desired one.

 

I think as well, take the previous suggestion to watch a Clockwork orange.

 

Testosterone seems to be linked to violence.

maybe look there.

 

I know it’s not what you want; you want to work at the synaptic level.

 

Some drugs are used by medical professionals to control antisocial behaviour in the mentally ill , I think you could look up abnormal psychology for those.

 

Also adrenalin, what would be the effect of clipping that.

Calm bad guys…I don’t know.

 

 

 

Doh!.

 

What about finding a way to boost the empathy response in the brain.

Should go a long way to your objective.

not sure what will do that.

check mothers at birth time, maybe?

[Kindria2000]

Okay Kindria, the honest answer to your question is that your suggesting something that is completely impossible to do.

 

You know what? Your right! Its probibly is impossible, but by doing this research, not only have I found some interesting points for my paper, but it has also made me grow in knowledge and as a person. I have learned more about emotions and the human brain than I would have if I hadnt started this paper (duh). That, of course, was the entire purpose of starting this project in the first place! It was to make me grow. Of course, it has developed far beond that, and my curiosity has now lead me to see this through and try, no matter what, to research more on this subject.

 

I know that this will in all probibility never ever happen, but I wont let that stop me from trying. As for all the people telling me to watch clockwork orange, I tried to rent it but the college movie rentals didnt have it, but I will look around for it.

 

~blurb from paper on ethics~

"The next subject that I am going to present has been a topic of concern to certain people pertaining to this research issue. At this time, people are concerned with the morality of controlling human emotions. Personally, I do not believe that researching this subject is immoral. The only thing that I believe to be immoral about it is the fact that it could be put to practical application. I do not think that this research should be used to affect a person’s free will. I simply believe that the research could help us develop a better knowledge of the human brain and our emotions. Am I an immoral person for wanting to know more about the mysteries of the mind? Do you as a reader and a fellow human find me unethical in my pursuit of knowledge? Perhaps, but I believe that the pursuit of knowledge is not evil or unethical, but it is the actions that we take that defines who we are."

[Kindria2000]

During my research I'm hearing more and more about the amygdala (the right prefrontal cortex.) So does anyone have any imput on the anti-social ("negative") reactions of the brain.

 

A big place that i have been researching is the news archives of the University of Wisconsin-Madison college. http://www.news.wisc.edu/releases/

[Kindria2000]

http://www.scienceforums.net/forums/showthread.php?p=163576#post163576

 

Might I be able to use a procedure similar to this? I wonder I wonder....

[Kindria2000]

Meow... So does no-one have any more input?