chilled_fluorine Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Instead of starting a new insane political thread I'm going to post this here, I genuinely hope it is bullshit but if true the campaign has hit new low this election cycle... DVD Claims Obama's Mom Was Porn Star http://www.youtube.c...h?v=tXcDj5J39kM Wow, that's just sad. Please, don't find this representative of the party as a whole. There will always be a few assholes out there willing to call their preferred candidate's opponents mother a porn star, but those are just assholes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cuthber Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Wow, that's just sad. Please, don't find this representative of the party as a whole. There will always be a few assholes out there willing to call their preferred candidate's opponents mother a porn star, but those are just assholes. Perhaps, in the interest of balance, you would like to cite a few of the opposition's examples. Of course, if it is representative of just one side, you might find that difficult. Don't get me wrong, I know there are arses on both sides, it's just that one side seems to have more than its fair share. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Does it really matter Moon? The lady is dead! I don't condone this type of political BS any more than some of the junk I read and see from the left. To be honest rigney i think it does matter, i think it matters that anyone, left or right or up or down or what ever would use such a... I am at a loss for words here... but what ever you call such a gambit on the part of extremists this should be condemned by all human beings. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and assume that Mitt had nothing to do with it and wouldn't have allowed even the thought of such a device to be used for political gain. The bigger picture is the extreme lengths the republican fringes will go to denigrate Obama, the entire nonsensical picture they have been trying to paint of the President doesn't border on the ridiculous it is ridiculous. Obama has been attacked by the fringe elements of the republican party in a particularly vicious way. Does it really matter if his Mother was a porn star, a prostitute, a quarter girl, or a Nun gone bad? Why would anyone even delve into this, the truth of the matter is immaterial, the impotent nature of the attacks was already like the high pitched death cry of a mouse grabbed by a Owl in defiance of it's inevitable death but this is just wrong, can anyone who is a normal human being not see how wrong this type of thing is? The desperation these fringe elements seem to feel is apparent in this claim, the almost constant prattle of nigger jokes from the very beginning was nothing but a friendly pat on the back compared to this. If the republican party in it's totality doesn't reject this completely with no reservations and seek out the elements in the party responsible for it and... to be honest I don't know what comes next... but I know that at least one high ranking republican has actually embraced it publicly... and not just the fringe idiot who made it but the people who financed and anyone who is associated with it should be dragged out in the open light of court and charged with anything and everything possible for the release of this... again proper words escape me... but the republican party should not just distance it's self from this film but they should reject the fringe elements who are creating this stuff once and for all, in fact I hope it might just be bad enough for the people of our country to see just how far politics has sunk into the pit. http://digitaljournal.com/article/333796#ixzz28Df7iMma Bill Armistead, chairman of the Alabama Republican Party, urged voters to see "Dreams From My Real Father," calling it "absolutely frightening" and "factual.""I've seen it," Armistead told a gathering of conservative women in Fairhope last Wednesday. "I've verified that it's factual, all of it," he added. In some ways i think both sides are responsible for this, the very essence of politics in what I've seen in most of my politically aware life has been the lie, told as though it was a newly released secrete but from anonymous sources, this idea of helping out your guy by spreading lies and slander about their guy that cannot be traced back to your guy is so wrong so unAmerican so anti human it sickens me to think such a thing could not just happen but be politics as usual, both sides should see this as awake up call to purge their organizations of such fringe elements... I know, I'm naive, i still think there are good and bad guys... not just small vicious power hungry people who will do anything to win... the soul of the country be damned... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akh Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 (edited) Vote me down all you want for posting facts (as three of you did). The director (Joel Gilbert) of that dvd would have you believe that the pictures were taken in 1960, but the fact remains that those pictures first appeared in a magazine in 1958. Gilbert knows this, because he would not have had those pictures without the magazine. So if these pictures are real pictures of Ann Dunham, it would make her 15 years old when the pictures were taken. So its either child porn...or complete and utter, slanderous, fictitious bullshit. It screams of racism. Either way, its disgusting to the core. I'm sure I will get voted down again. That's fine. But instead of pressing the red button, maybe back up your disagreement. Or at least post your disagreement instead of hiding behind the red button. Edit: Two, but the challenge remains. Edited October 4, 2012 by akh 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Vote me down all you want for posting facts (as three of you did). One of those was a glitched double vote, so I gave you a positive to correct it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Vote me down all you want for posting facts (as three of you did). The director (Joel Gilbert) of that dvd would have you believe that the pictures were taken in 1960, but the fact remains that those pictures first appeared in a magazine in 1958. Gilbert knows this, because he would not have had those pictures without the magazine. So if these pictures are real pictures of Ann Dunham, it would make her 15 years old when the pictures were taken. So its either child porn...or complete and utter, slanderous, fictitious bullshit. It screams of racism. Either way, its disgusting to the core. I'm sure I will get voted down again. That's fine. But instead of pressing the red button, maybe back up your disagreement. Or at least post your disagreement instead of hiding behind the red button. Are you a republican, akh? :hopes desperately: Perhaps, in the interest of balance, you would like to cite a few of the opposition's examples. Of course, if it is representative of just one side, you might find that difficult. Don't get me wrong, I know there are arses on both sides, it's just that one side seems to have more than its fair share. Can't find any democratic granny porn references, sorry John. Guess you've won this round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cuthber Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Chilled, a simple question: if someone has to lie repeatedly to persuade others of the validity of their case, is their case valid? If you agree with me that it is not then can you say why anyone votes for the right wing in US politics? (There have been a few threads where it turns out that the right wing are the real liars and idiots: I'm not saying the left is perfect- just that the dragon believers and those talking about absurd ideas of human reproduction or even plane windows seem to all be on the right. I have repeatedly asked for instances of Lefty nut-jobs and, at best, they are thin on the ground ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Chilled, a simple question: if someone has to lie repeatedly to persuade others of the validity of their case, is their case valid? If you agree with me that it is not then can you say why anyone votes for the right wing in US politics? (There have been a few threads where it turns out that the right wing are the real liars and idiots: I'm not saying the left is perfect- just that the dragon believers and those talking about absurd ideas of human reproduction or even plane windows seem to all be on the right. I have repeatedly asked for instances of Lefty nut-jobs and, at best, they are thin on the ground ) You can have the most valid case in the world, but people might still not believe you. Right-wingers don't have to lie, but they do sometimes. Did Obama lower the deficit as he promised he would? Republicans don't have to lie, so their case can be valid. Did you see Romney pretty much shove his fist up Obama's *ss last night at the debate? And he only contradicted himself once... And he succeeded by telling the truth, if Obama's campaign promises weren't any indicator. Being completely open about it, yes, most all of the nut jobs are on the right, but that's what morphine does to people. Poor McCain, such a messed up old man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontanman Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 You can have the most valid case in the world, but people might still not believe you. Right-wingers don't have to lie, but they do sometimes. Then why do they do it so much? Did Obama lower the deficit as he promised he would? Republicans don't have to lie, so their case can be valid. Did you see Romney pretty much shove his fist up Obama's *ss last night at the debate? And he only contradicted himself once... And he succeeded by telling the truth, if Obama's campaign promises weren't any indicator. Being completely open about it, yes, most all of the nut jobs are on the right, but that's what morphine does to people. Poor McCain, such a messed up old man. So Mitt's lie about his health care plan didn't bother you? He had the chance to tell the truth on national television and he lied... And you count Obama not being able to undo the mess he inherited as fast as he wanted to is a lie? epic fail dude... you are indeed a staunch Republican... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Then why do they do it so much? So Mitt's lie about his health care plan didn't bother you? He had the chance to tell the truth on national television and he lied... And you count Obama not being able to undo the mess he inherited as fast as he wanted to is a lie? epic fail dude... you are indeed a staunch Republican... I don't know why they do it so much, and I wouldn't, because I'm not that kind of republican.I really don't know why he did it, but regardless, he is still my preferred candidate. If you promise to do something in 4 years, but then you don't, then you are a liar. Isn't that obvious? He shouldn't have made promises if he didn't know for sure he could keep them. That is lying, and if you think it isn't, how is it better than lying? -1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringer Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 I don't know why they do it so much, and I wouldn't, because I'm not that kind of republican.I really don't know why he did it, but regardless, he is still my preferred candidate. If you promise to do something in 4 years, but then you don't, then you are a liar. Isn't that obvious? He shouldn't have made promises if he didn't know for sure he could keep them. That is lying, and if you think it isn't, how is it better than lying? So you count making optimistic predictions and not being able to achieve them and being knowingly deceitful as equal? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 So you count making optimistic predictions and not being able to achieve them and being knowingly deceitful as equal? If you promise to do something, and then you don't, then you are a liar. An optimistic prediction is not a promise. A promise is what he made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ydoaPs Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 If you promise to do something, and then you don't, then you are a liar. An optimistic prediction is not a promise. A promise is what he made. If you promise to feed your neighbor's dog for a week, and I hit you with my car putting you in a coma before you even feed it at all, are you a liar? You can have the most valid case in the world, but people might still not believe you. Right-wingers don't have to lie, but they do sometimes. Did Obama lower the deficit as he promised he would? Republicans don't have to lie, so their case can be valid. Did you see Romney pretty much shove his fist up Obama's *ss last night at the debate? And he only contradicted himself once... And he succeeded by telling the truth, if Obama's campaign promises weren't any indicator. Being completely open about it, yes, most all of the nut jobs are on the right, but that's what morphine does to people. Poor McCain, such a messed up old man. So, we're ignoring that Romney averaged almost a lie a minute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 If you promise to feed your neighbor's dog for a week, and I hit you with my car putting you in a coma before you even feed it at all, are you a liar? Yes, but it wouldn't have been my fault. What do you think made this the case for Obama? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ydoaPs Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 What do you think made this the case for Obama? Yeah, it's not like there was an obstructionist Congress or anything.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 If you promise to feed your neighbor's dog for a week, and I hit you with my car putting you in a coma before you even feed it at all, are you a liar? So, we're ignoring that Romney averaged almost a lie a minute? I was only half paying attention. Would you care to point out the other lies? Yeah, it's not like there was an obstructionist Congress or anything.... Shouldn't he have predicted that congress would obstruct him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Shouldn't he have predicted that congress would obstruct him? On job creation?! Who in the world would have predicted the GOP would block initiatives aimed at "onshoring" jobs for Americans? Isn't that exactly what Mitt says he really wants to do? Doesn't that mean that either Mitt is lying again, or the GOP is willing to harm the country to get back in power? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ringer Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 I was only half paying attention. Would you care to point out the other lies? http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-first-debate-mitt-romneys-five-biggest-lies-20121004 http://blog.nj.com/njv_john_atlas/2012/10/who_won_the_debate_romney_or_o.html Shouldn't he have predicted that congress would obstruct him? You really think he should have predicted them obstructing him not on any merits of the proposals, but only on the fact that the proposals were his? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 On job creation?! Who in the world would have predicted the GOP would block initiatives aimed at "onshoring" jobs for Americans? Isn't that exactly what Mitt says he really wants to do? Doesn't that mean that either Mitt is lying again, or the GOP is willing to harm the country to get back in power? The republicans didn't like his idea. Surely they must have liked the idea of job creation, just not the way he proposed they do it. If you don't like how Obama does things, no, it does not mean that, as long as you have a better idea. http://www.rollingst...t-lies-20121004 http://blog.nj.com/n...omney_or_o.html You really think he should have predicted them obstructing him not on any merits of the proposals, but only on the fact that the proposals were his? Thanks for the links. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The republicans didn't like his idea. Surely they must have liked the idea of job creation, just not the way he proposed they do it. If you don't like how Obama does things, no, it does not mean that, as long as you have a better idea. The Bring Jobs Home Act would've only impacted businesses that were continuing to send our jobs overseas and taking deductions for it. Again, if what you say is true, either someone is lying or someone isn't really interested in helping fix our unemployment problems: http://www.cnn.com/2...cked/index.html The Bring Jobs Home Act would provide a 20% tax break for the costs of moving jobs back to the United States and would rescind business expense deductions available to companies that are associated with the cost of moving operations overseas. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 The Bring Jobs Home Act would've only impacted businesses that were continuing to send our jobs overseas and taking deductions for it. Again, if what you say is true, either someone is lying or someone isn't really interested in helping fix our unemployment problems: http://www.cnn.com/2...cked/index.html Romney isn't a congressman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phi for All Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 Romney isn't a congressman. But we were talking about Congressional Republicans blocking Obama's job creation bill. Both Romney and Congressional Republicans claim they want to create jobs for Americans, but when they had a chance to prove it earlier this year, they decided to obstruct instead. What's wrong with giving a tax break to companies that want to hire Americans, and denying the deductions business gets for relocating overseas? It sounds pretty ideal to me. It would have been a great incentive, just the right amount of carrot and stick. If you have a real argument that makes it sound like the Republicans didn't purposely harm the American economy in order to get Romney elected, I'd love to hear it. "Romney isn't a congressman" is very weak, imo. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cuthber Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 (edited) 1 You can have the most valid case in the world, but people might still not believe you. 2 Right-wingers don't have to lie, but they do sometimes. 3 Did Obama lower the deficit as he promised he would? Republicans don't have to lie, so their case can be valid. 4 Did you see Romney pretty much shove his fist up Obama's *ss last night at the debate? 5 And he only contradicted himself once... And he succeeded by telling the truth, if Obama's campaign promises weren't any indicator. 6 Being completely open about it, yes, most all of the nut jobs are on the right, 7 but that's what morphine does to people. Poor McCain, such a messed up old man. 1 Not if you are a competent speaker. Remember you don't need to get everyone to believe you. You need to get more than half the votes. If you can't convince most people by telling the truth then it's because either you are incompetent at explaining or your ideas are wrong. Both of those should debar you from office. 2 yes, and the issue seems to be that they do it a lot. Much more than their opponents, and their lies are also much more outrageous. Why is that? 3 No he did not. However,a as has been pointed out elsewhere, that''s not a lie. It's a failure and there are reasons for it. Calling it a lie is a lie. 4 No, I didn't see it. Is it relevant? Did they debate the number of lies in each other's campaigns? If not, are you just trying to distract attention away from the lies the US right wing tells? 5 how many incidences of not knowing what you are talking about is considered excessive? I'd say 1 was enough to show that you are insincere or a lousy speaker. 6 yes, we know. The question is why? I content that their position is intrinsically untenable so they have to lie to defend it. Do you have either a counterpoint to that explanation or even an alternative? If you want to offer an explanation centred on the idea that the right wing in the US are all on morphine that's "interesting". I rather doubt the validity of the assumption. BTW, I didn't see the debate but it seems to have left Obama with a clear lead in the slightly longer run- once the facts came out. Perhaps the US public doesn't like being lied to. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-19835176 Edited October 5, 2012 by John Cuthber 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilled_fluorine Posted October 5, 2012 Share Posted October 5, 2012 But we were talking about Congressional Republicans blocking Obama's job creation bill. Both Romney and Congressional Republicans claim they want to create jobs for Americans, but when they had a chance to prove it earlier this year, they decided to obstruct instead. What's wrong with giving a tax break to companies that want to hire Americans, and denying the deductions business gets for relocating overseas? It sounds pretty ideal to me. It would have been a great incentive, just the right amount of carrot and stick. If you have a real argument that makes it sound like the Republicans didn't purposely harm the American economy in order to get Romney elected, I'd love to hear it. "Romney isn't a congressman" is very weak, imo. I personally think it is a good idea. I'm going to assume the republicans have a better idea. If there was anything behind that argument, it probably would be in an ad right now... But then, maybe not. What you said is logical, except for republicans trying to harm America. 1 Not if you are a competent speaker. Remember you don't need to get everyone to believe you. You need to get more than half the votes. If you can't convince most people by telling the truth then it's because either you are incompetent at explaining or your ideas are wrong. Both of those should debar you from office. 2 yes, and the issue seems to be that they do it a lot. Much more than their opponents, and their lies are also much more outrageous. Why is that? 3 No he did not. However,a as has been pointed out elsewhere, that''s not a lie. It's a failure and there are reasons for it. Calling it a lie is a lie. 4 No, I didn't see it. Is it relevant? Did they debate the number of lies in each other's campaigns? If not, are you just trying to distract attention away from the lies the US right wing tells? 5 how many incidences of not knowing what you are talking about is considered excessive? I'd say 1 was enough to show that you are insincere or a lousy speaker. 6 yes, we know. The question is why? I content that their position is intrinsically untenable so they have to lie to defend it. Do you have either a counterpoint to that explanation or even an alternative? If you want to offer an explanation centred on the idea that the right wing in the US are all on morphine that's "interesting". I rather doubt the validity of the assumption. BTW, I didn't see the debate but it seems to have left Obama with a clear lead in the slightly longer run- once the facts came out. Perhaps the US public doesn't like being lied to. http://www.bbc.co.uk...canada-19835176 Teaching evolution to Catholics? That's near impossible to do.Rich people are sometimes crazy...He said he'd lower the debt, and decrease the unemployment rate, but he didn't. 5 trillion dollars and 3% disagree with you.People either didn't see him lie, or don't care. Or they like him better than Obama anyways. I'm not trying to distract the attention from it.I don't know why he did it...Rich people often get so egotistic they think they can say whatever they want. Still, most hold their tongues. The morphine was a joke, but sometimes I wondered if McCain was on it... -1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNow Posted October 6, 2012 Share Posted October 6, 2012 Teaching evolution to Catholics? That's near impossible to do. The Catholic church has accepted evolution as valid for 16 years already. http://biblelight.net/darwin.htm 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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