Jet propulsion under water?

[P_Rog]

If you've ever seen the movie "the hunt for red october" (tom clancy novel), it says how a submarine has a silent propulsion system. they explain it as a jet engine for water, but with no moving parts. i was just curious if this is even possible, and if it is, how it would work.

 

I've been looking at the site, and i like it, im only a jr. in high school, so i don't understand too much of the real technical stuff yet. but i think im leaning toward engineering for a career and all.

 

another quick question, how do nuclear reactors transmit energy from nuclear to mechanical? is it steam...can't remember for some reason right now.

 

wonder if zarkov has any crazy ideas on this one? hehe

[blike]

.

another quick question, how do nuclear reactors transmit energy from nuclear to mechanical? is it steam...can't remember for some reason right now.

 

Yes, they use the energy(in the form of heat) that is released when fission occurs to convert water to steam. The steam then turns giant turbines that create electrical energy.

 

Dunno about the first question.

[Brad]

I'm not sure about a real jet engine, but rockets can work underwater. For example the Polaris submarine-launched ICBM can be launched from up to a couple hundred feet under the surface. A traditional jet engine couldn't work underwater unless you had some way to supply it with air (like a tank of compressed air) but of course that would limit the time it could be used. Just a thought...

[P_Rog]

in the movie they called it a "magneto (don't know if i spelled that right, sounds like magneato) hydro-dynamic propulsion. The only way that they explain how it works is water is sucked in and shot out.

 

I was just reading that teleportation post on here, and thought about this.

[blike]

Alright, I looked it up and its commonly referred to as "MHD Propulsion".

 

Basically they use superconducting magnets that create a very powerful magnetic field that can create water movement through an enclosed tunnel and use it as propulsion. This process requires no moving parts.

 

At present, however, there are no submersable vessels that are equipped with this technology (or maybe there is, and the government just isn't telling anyone). The japanese have an experimental ship called "Yamato" that is equipped with this.

 

Keep up your interest in science

[P_Rog]

allright, thanks. i was thinking last night that it would almost have to have something to do with ions and magnetic fields of some sort. like electrically charging the water molecules and having something pull them to move the ship.

[P_Rog]

blike, are you a star wars fan?

[kenel]

I was reading in my Popular Mechanics magazine that the US Navy has recently developed a new "class" of submarines, replacing the decade old dinosaurs. From what little they explained, it appeared as though they were equipping it with MHD Propulsion, making it virtually "Silent". It also had a helipad on top...which I found a little humorous (How's a Helicopter going to land on it underwater?). (RDRR)

[blike]

blike, are you a star wars fan?

 

Somewhat, I havn't seen the older series in awhile. I'm a fan, but not an addict

 

(How's a Helicopter going to land on it underwater?).

 

um.

[kenel]

A little humor to brighten up your day....I don't think anyone's really that dumb, so don't assume.

[P_Rog]

bout the helicopter pad, i'd have to say it's for transporting people on and off the sub while it's at sea. Again, if you've seen Red October, has a scene where they try to get a guy on a sub while at sea, and it's no easy task. ( i know it's a movie, but the idea is all the same) all it would do is surface, land, drop off/take on, and take off. i'd say it's a good idea.

 

blike,

 

the older ones are the best ones. i think the first 3 (well 2 so far) would be a lot more exciting if we didn't already know how it all ends.

[Guest Unregistered]

Yea, I'm really hoping the third in the series will kick.

 

The first two were OK, but not super. The second one could have been alot better if it weren't so drawn out with their love story. But I suppose it was necessary to tell :/

[P_Rog]

yeah, i think the second one was better than the first though. wonder when it's comin out on dvd?

[chris]

More thank likely, anything that Tom Clancy has written is true. The goverement has checked this guy out time and time again, because his books are based on real/things that almost happened. They haven't found anything on it. Don't be suprised though if the goverment does have a sub like this. Anything that he has written about (hes a great author) is true, or almost happened.

 

btw star wars rox ur sox

[Radical Edward]

not nescessarily superconductors, just really powerful electromagnets. a mate of mine built one, albeit only a little one, that pumped water round a pipe. oh and they had to put some stuff in the water to make sure it had a very high ionic content - it's basically just an ion drive of sorts.

 

oh and yes they exist.

[chris]

couldnt that be created by simply just adding a few chemicals in the water a few feet in front of the system?

[Radical Edward]

yes, but rather than a few, alot of chemicals. probably more than you could carry.

[chris]

I didn't mean it like that. I mean like, if you had a machine to do it. thats how i think it would have to work.

[Radical Edward]

oh you could, but you could just do it with salt water - that's how these subs work. the thing is the power of the device my mate built wasn't all that high, so he needed to dump alot more stuff into the water to get it to work.

[chris]

So salt creates electromagnetic fields?

[sky_8512]

how steam jet propulsion system works?

[Helix]

Alright' date=' I looked it up and its commonly referred to as "MHD Propulsion".

 

Basically they use superconducting magnets that create a very powerful magnetic field that can create water movement through an enclosed tunnel and use it as propulsion. This process requires no moving parts.

 

At present, however, there are no submersable vessels that are equipped with this technology (or maybe there is, and the government just isn't telling anyone). The japanese have an experimental ship called "Yamato" that is equipped with this.

 

Keep up your interest in science [/quote']

 

 

So, the water is moved magnetically? That's amazing, how exactly is that acheived?

[reyam200]

anything can be moved with a strong enough magnetic field, all matter has protons, and electrons. which are effected by EM forces.

[vrus]

Ofcourse what I'm going to say is dangerous for large scale use, but it might be okay just for a demonstration or test-run. Instead of dumping loads of chemicals, why not use Alpha or Beta radiation? The are both ionisig radiation. The will probably ionise the water and since they can be manipulated by electric & magnetic fields, you don't have to use loads of chemicals. If they don't ionise the water, they will still be present in the medium and the field will still affect them causing them to be vectored in a particular direction. A sort of rod with the radioactive substance can be attached a few metres before the engine. The problem is what to do with the radiation after it has left the engine;

 

Maybe attaching a grille plated with a substance that absorbs the radiation...

 

Since these types of radiation are not very penetrating they probably won't affect the crew in the vessel !

[DQW]

anything can be moved with a strong enough magnetic field, all matter has protons, and electrons. which are effected by EM forces.

That's hardly an answer. You would expect electrons and protons to respond in opposite manners to an applied field.