The second coming the ultimate test of religious prophecies

[Semjase]

I would like to discuss prophecies concerning the second coming and

the outcome on the credibility of religion if these prophecies were to come to

pass.

 

Here's some relevant information

 

Much of the Bible is dedicated to the theme of the Second Coming. There
are over 1500 prophecies of Jesus’ Second Coming recorded in the Bible.
For every prophecy of His first coming mentioned in the Old Testament,
there are eight predicting His Second Coming. Christ’s return is also
mentioned once in every five verses in the New Testament.

 

Jesus discusses the events prior to His Second Coming. He intermingles
His warnings about the destruction of Jerusalem with the destruction of
the world at the end of time using the events surrounding the
destruction of Jerusalem

 

 

1. The coming of Christ will be instantaneous and worldwide. "For as
   the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will
   the coming of the Son of Man be." —Matthew 24:27
2. The coming of Christ will be visible to all. "Then the sign of the
   Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth
   will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of
   heaven with power and great glory." —Matthew 24:30

 

There will be signs in
the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity
at the roaring and tossing of the sea. Men will faint from terror, apprehensive
of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. At that
time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because
your redemption is drawing near." (Luke
21:25-28)

 

These bible prophecies could be tied to other prophecies signifying an

end of times coming this year which would indicate according to bible

prophecy that the second coming would be this year some time this

would definitely change the way that we perceive religion if the

second coming happened as prophesied. Science could no longer

ignore religious information.

 

[Phi for All]

Virtually every generation since the Bible was put together has seen themselves in these prophecies, and they were all wrong. Are you going to be part of the next generation that falls for vague, easily adapted fears and generalizations? I'm not.

 

If Jesus pulls his supercharged cloud up to my house and starts beheading zombies with his lightning katana, I will be visibly impressed. If he still wants to redeem me, cool, but if he tells me I should have listened to a specific sect of Christian dogma over all the others, I will be happy to spend eternity wherever he unjustly decides to put me.

[ydoaPs]

Virtually every generation since the Bible was put together has seen themselves in these prophecies, and they were all wrong. Are you going to be part of the next generation that falls for vague, easily adapted fears and generalizations? I'm not.

It's not vague at all, actually. It's very explicit and that generation is long gone. In the framework of the YEC's, they died almost a third of the age of the universe ago.

[Semjase]

May Immortal wasn't so wrong Hinduism predicts a similar

event to the second coming in the same time frame

as you can see below.

 

When the practices taught by the Vedas and the institutes of law shall nearly have ceased, and the close of the Kali age shall be soon,
a portion of that divine being who exists of his own spiritual nature
in the character of Brahma,and who is the beginning and the end, and who
comprehends all things, shall descend upon the earth…. He will then reestablish righteousness upon earth; and the minds of those who live at the end of the Kali age
shall be awakened, and shall be as pellucid as crystal. The men who are
thus changed by virtue of that peculiar time shall be as the seeds of
human beings, and shall give birth to a race that shall follow the laws
of the Krita age, the Age of Purity. As it is said, “When the sun and moon, and the lunar asterism Tishya, and the planet Jupiter, are in one mansion, the Krita age shall return.” - Vishnu Purana 4.24 (Hinduism)

 

It is said in the Hinduism that the Kalki (the savior) riding a white
horse (similar to the second coming of Christ according the Bible which
also says that the savior will come riding a white horse) will end the
darkness age of the goddess of destruction Kali and restore the age of
purity of Krita.

We can see that this prophecy says that the Messiah will come when the
evil reaches its peak, at the end of Kali age (or the age of the
darkness). It also says that the coming of the new age of purity will
arrive when the sun and the moon gather together.

The era of Kali finished officially in 1948 according to the Buddhism and
with no doubt this is one of the more disturbed times of the human
history. In the 20thcentury, along with two world wars, several
revolutions and local conflicts happened; plus crimes, terrorism,
corruption, diseases and moral decadence. This is for sure the time
described in this prophecy.

 

[iNow]

I'm telling you, folks... broken.

[Semjase]

I'm a science person not a religious mental case.

Religion is also a science, since it is taught at

universities. Mainstream science has yet to figure

out or come to terms with the science behind

religion. If the second coming occurs as been widely

prophesied by the bible in particular, it would give

religious material a certain amount of scientific credibility.

 

 

[imatfaal]

I'm a science person not a religious mental case.

Whilst I wouldn't comment on the second part of that sentence - nothing you have posted has given evidence that the first claim is true.

 

Religion is also a science, since it is taught at

universities.

More than science is taught at university. I studied/study law - this is not a science, in many ways it is the opposite of a science.

 

Mainstream science has yet to figure

out or come to terms with the science behind

religion.

I think the more honest and practical perspective is that science (in as much as science can be taken as an entity) does not give a damn about religion and just wishes it would stop sticking its nose into things it has no clue about.

 

If the second coming occurs as been widely

prophesied by the bible in particular, it would give

religious material a certain amount of scientific credibility.

It will confuse a lot of critics and lead to some re-evaluation certainly. However, if the world suddenly announces that the question to the ultimate answer of 42 has been discovered it will give a certain amount of credibility to the works of Douglas Adams. I think the chances of either your suggestion or mine happening are the same.

 

A scientific hypothesis that says "sometime in the indefinite future a group of stuff that is not well defined might happen if you are a bad species" is not a particularly robust notion. One nice observable would make all the difference - just one little one - if you do A, B, and C then God will do X in a significant proportion of tests.

[Semjase]

I agree but science and religion are hopelessly intertwined

from the standpoint what role a creator might of played

in the structure of the universe or universes or the

creation of life it's self. Religion needs scientific credibility

maybe fulfilled prophecies may give them some.

[tar]

 

Semjase, on 30 Jan 2013 - 14:58, said:

I would like to discuss prophecies concerning the second coming and

the outcome on the credibility of religion if these prophecies were to come to

pass.

 

Here's some relevant information

 

 

Much of the Bible is dedicated to the theme of the Second Coming. There

are over 1500 prophecies of Jesus’ Second Coming recorded in the Bible.

For every prophecy of His first coming mentioned in the Old Testament,

there are eight predicting His Second Coming. Christ’s return is also

mentioned once in every five verses in the New Testament.

 

Jesus discusses the events prior to His Second Coming. He intermingles

His warnings about the destruction of Jerusalem with the destruction of

the world at the end of time using the events surrounding the

destruction of Jerusalem

• The coming of Christ will be instantaneous and worldwide. "For as

  the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will

  the coming of the Son of Man be." —Matthew 24:27

• The coming of Christ will be visible to all. "Then the sign of the

  Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth

  will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of

  heaven with power and great glory." —Matthew 24:30

There will be signs in

the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity

at the roaring and tossing of the sea. Men will faint from terror, apprehensive

of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. At that

time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because

your redemption is drawing near."

(Luke

21:25-28

)

 

These bible prophecies could be tied to other prophecies signifying an

end of times coming this year which would indicate according to bible

prophecy that the second coming would be this year some time this

would definitely change the way that we perceive religion if the

second coming happened as prophesied. Science could no longer

ignore religious information.

Which religious information is it that science ignores?

 

This second coming thing is rather like the mother, saying to the unruly children, "Just you wait 'til your father comes home, then you will see the stick and the fury of justice and truth, then you will know you should have listened to me".

 

I would like to suggest that this is an empty threat, if the mother does not, in actuality, have a husband, or if father does not wield a stick. And the threat would be not made, if the mother herself would be able to use the valuable and workable information contained in religion, even if her husband were dead, without resorting to the stick, and destruction.

 

I would also like to point out, that we could have the general discussion, of "who is your daddy?"

without resorting to the stick.

 

When I was growing up, our family stayed at a summer cottage. There was a Catholic family we hung around with often (they had TV, a boy and a girl my sister's age, a boy and a girl my age, and a younger girl). There was a woodshed behind the house which the boys feared as a place where their father might take a stich to their behinds. My sister and I did not have such a woodshed. Both our father and their father worked during the week a decent car ride away, so came up, only on the weekends. All of us children were aware that retribution for any sins (failing to listen to our moms, lying, cheating, smoking, or breaking of any rules of society or family) would come, when I fathers got home. My father was not religious, nor did he ever strike us as punishment. He was a "reasonable" man. We were all basically "good" kids, and all feared the weekend and facing our fathers, should we have engaged in any transgressions. But I carried my conscience with me, and still have it. I would "be good" because not being good would upset my dad. My friend would occasionally cross the line, because he could "get away with it", if his mother did not find out, to tell his dad.

 

Leaving me, in regards to this discussion with a couple questions for you. Can you be good, even if you are not going to see your father soon? What "good" would come of it, if your father came home, and burned the house down?

 

The woodshed and the end of the world have been hanging over the heads since the Bible was first written up, and probably even was hanging over our heads as far back as man had clans and parents.

 

Although the woodshed is an ever present thing, and there are consequences to breaking the rules of your clubs, the universe itself seems rather constant in providing us with dangers, and benefits. It doles out good and bad arbitralily, with no withholding or offering based on our thoughts or prayers or sins or based even on our adherence to our conscience.

 

If a great retribution is required for you to be good, and the retribution never comes, then why should you be good?

 

I heard a grown Catholic once, talking about stick weilding Nuns, and following the rules and such, say that he became aware of the emptiness of their threats of retribution, the first time he secretly sinned, and was not struck by lightning.

 

If you feel that religion has good messages for mankind, I would agree 100%. If however there are unreasonable components of the message, that are NOT real, then these components can be easily ignored with no chance of harm. The real components of the message that ARE real and valuable can be held in our conscience, not only without the white horse and the "son of man" riding in, on a global basis, but without dad getting home, on a personal basis.

 

And in any case, the failure of the arrival of the second coming is sure evidence that it need not come at all, inorder to be simply taken as the threat "just wait till your father comes home".

 

Personally, I would rather envision "God" as being a "reasonable man". (if I were to anthropomorphize the universe).

 

And as a reasonable man, myself, in terms of worrying about the end of the world, I would say "Don't".

 

Live by the rules on their own merit. Remembering that once you are an adult, and have kids, you ARE the parent. You have no reason to fear the family woodshed, or the Nun's stick, or have any reason to fear the actual end of the world. And let your conscience be your guide.

 

So, again, what are these valuable messages of religion, that you think, TAR as an atheist, might be missing?

 

Regards, TAR2

Edited January 31, 2013 by tar

[Phi for All]

I agree but science and religion are hopelessly intertwined

from the standpoint what role a creator might of played

in the structure of the universe or universes or the

creation of life it's self.

 

No, they're really not. Science doesn't require a creator.

 

Religion needs scientific credibility

maybe fulfilled prophecies may give them some.

 

Religion will never get scientific credibility until those pesky gods agree to appear and be tested. Until then they are just like ghosts and Bigfoot.

[John Cuthber]

I'm a science person not a religious mental case.

Religion is also a science, since it is taught at

universities. Mainstream science has yet to figure

out or come to terms with the science behind

religion. If the second coming occurs as been widely

prophesied by the bible in particular, it would give

religious material a certain amount of scientific credibility.

You are quite clearly not a science person. You -ignore science a lot in your posting, for example the recent one about the Coriolis effect.

Religion is not a science. Religion tries to stay the same, science tries to learn and change.

All sorts of things are taught at universities, but that doesn't make them science.

There simply isn't really any science behind religion with the possible exception of things like sociology or psychology.

If the second coming happened when it was predicted then it might lend religion some sort of credibility.

However the second coming has been prophesied a lot: but it never turned up when religion said it would.

the fact that religion keeps getting the date of the second coming wrong shows that religion has no real idea what it is talking about.

If it were a science, then it would be a failed one.

Theories fail when they make false predictions. Religion makes false predictions (as shown by any number of failed "end of the world" scenarios") so religion fails.

 

If you were a science person, I'd not need to point that out to you.

[zapatos]

I'm telling you, folks... broken.

I was about to tell you why you were wrong but no reasons came to mind...

[tar]

Besides, if God is always present, in what sense could he "arrive" for even a first time, much less a second coming.

 

Popping in and out, would require his absence in the mean time. Like perhaps just coming home at the end of the day, or during the weekend?

 

This would indicate to me, that part of lessons of the Bible were to empower one's Earthly lord with Divine rights, power and priveledges.

A theme that was strong in the Kuran (a bible derivitive) as well, what with Muhammed saying that a 1/5th should be given to Allah...or his Messenger...or blood relatives of the messenger.

 

The sexism of the Bible and Koran give more authority to the male. U.S secular society still has vestiges of this ethos, but even progressive churches give mother and father equal sway, and the Jewish Mom is the vessel through which the divine nature flows.

 

I think it important to separate any "valuable" religious messages that appear in the Bible, New Testament, and Koran, into those that serve mankind, and those that serve Earthly power structures. Though one, actually means the other, there are "people" that usurp the "power" of the universe, and claim to have befriended it, claim to know its secrets, and claim this power in the absence of reasonable evidence.

 

The scientist claims knowledge and truth and power over the universe and the world, and each other, only where it evidently appears to be the case. And sees no evidence of impending fire and brimstone, nor has of yet found it likely that gods or sons of gods, or anti-gods have any likelyhood of appearing in our skys on flying horses.

 

There have been few verifyable reports of this kind of activity in the past. We have some visions and anecdotal evidence of a burning bush and such, but very little to NO hard evidence.

 

If your beliefs are to be found valid, ONLY if this flying white horse appears, I would say the validity of your beliefs, is highly suspect.

 

Regards, TAR2

and quite ironically would be validated only at the very point where they would no longer apply

Yes my dear, I will validate your belief in me, right after you die.

And also, just so you don't believe me, I will validate your belief in me, just after I obliterate the world.

 

So be sure to provide me with the weekly tithe, my dear.

[Semjase]

Which religious information is it that science ignores?

 

 

Science ignores religious information that does not work within the scientific knowledge of the day.

 

Besides, if God is always present, in what sense could he "arrive" for even a first time, much less a second coming.

 

Popping in and out, would require his absence in the mean time. Like perhaps just coming home at the end of the day, or during the weekend?

 

This would indicate to me, that part of lessons of the Bible were to empower one's Earthly lord with Divine rights, power and priveledges.

A theme that was strong in the Kuran (a bible derivitive) as well, what with Muhammed saying that a 1/5th should be given to Allah...or his Messenger...or blood relatives of the messenger.

 

The sexism of the Bible and Koran give more authority to the male. U.S secular society still has vestiges of this ethos, but even progressive churches give mother and father equal sway, and the Jewish Mom is the vessel through which the divine nature flows.

 

I think it important to separate any "valuable" religious messages that appear in the Bible, New Testament, and Koran, into those that serve mankind, and those that serve Earthly power structures. Though one, actually means the other, there are "people" that usurp the "power" of the universe, and claim to have befriended it, claim to know its secrets, and claim this power in the absence of reasonable evidence.

 

The scientist claims knowledge and truth and power over the universe and the world, and each other, only where it evidently appears to be the case. And sees no evidence of impending fire and brimstone, nor has of yet found it likely that gods or sons of gods, or anti-gods have any likelyhood of appearing in our skys on flying horses.

 

There have been few verifyable reports of this kind of activity in the past. We have some visions and anecdotal evidence of a burning bush and such, but very little to NO hard evidence.

 

If your beliefs are to be found valid, ONLY if this flying white horse appears, I would say the validity of your beliefs, is highly suspect.

 

Regards, TAR2

 

and quite ironically would be validated only at the very point where they would no longer apply

 

The bible is a poorly written a divinely inspired manuscripts relating archaic ideas of the day.

The second coming will likely be modern and futuristic it could involve off

worldly advanced civilizations and their historical connection to us.

 

No, they're really not. Science doesn't require a creator.

 

 

Religion will never get scientific credibility until those pesky gods agree to appear and be tested. Until then they are just like ghosts and Bigfoot.

There is no creator of this reality, something always had to be here or there would be no existence at all,

The chance of an unexplainable organized structure being here forever seems highly unlikely so this

leaves evolution left to explain every structure that is here, a creator may be evolved to be here, who possibly

may have put some of the complex structures together

 

You are quite clearly not a science person. You -ignore science a lot in your posting, for example the recent one about the Coriolis effect.

Religion is not a science. Religion tries to stay the same, science tries to learn and change.

All sorts of things are taught at universities, but that doesn't make them science.

There simply isn't really any science behind religion with the possible exception of things like sociology or psychology.

If the second coming happened when it was predicted then it might lend religion some sort of credibility.

However the second coming has been prophesied a lot: but it never turned up when religion said it would.

the fact that religion keeps getting the date of the second coming wrong shows that religion has no real idea what it is talking about.

If it were a science, then it would be a failed one.

Theories fail when they make false predictions. Religion makes false predictions (as shown by any number of failed "end of the world" scenarios") so religion fails.

 

If you were a science person, I'd not need to point that out to you.

If you follow the prophecy sources that have the best track record for

getting prophecies right and do prophetic detective work you come

up with an approximate time for the second coming which is this

year sometime followed by a possible world conflict then a pole shift

causing geological upheaval in the month of October this year.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Semjase

[tomgwyther]

 

If you follow the prophecy sources that have the best track record for

getting prophecies right and do prophetic detective work you come

up with an approximate time for the second coming which is this

year sometime followed by a possible world conflict then a pole shift

causing geological upheaval in the month of October this year.

 

We'll see.

Care to place a bet? I wager £1000 that none of the above happen.

[Semjase]

If I had a spare 1000 pounds lying around

I'd bet you but if I won I wouldn't be able

to collect considering the predicted

world trouble ahead.

[Phi for All]

We'll see.

Care to place a bet? I wager £1000 that none of the above happen.

 

Do I get to define "geological upheaval"?

[Semjase]

Here's the biblical interpretation of the pole shift the six seal of revelations

 

And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a
great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the
moon became as blood;

¹³ And the stars of the heavens fell unto the earth, even as a
fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty
wind.

¹⁴ And the heavens departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

 

Other pole shift prophecies indicate coast line changes, major earthquakes and tsunamis.

[Moontanman]

I would like to discuss prophecies concerning the second coming and

the outcome on the credibility of religion if these prophecies were to come to

pass.

 

Here's some relevant information

 

 

Much of the Bible is dedicated to the theme of the Second Coming. There

are over 1500 prophecies of Jesus’ Second Coming recorded in the Bible.

For every prophecy of His first coming mentioned in the Old Testament,

there are eight predicting His Second Coming. Christ’s return is also

mentioned once in every five verses in the New Testament.

 

Jesus discusses the events prior to His Second Coming. He intermingles

His warnings about the destruction of Jerusalem with the destruction of

the world at the end of time using the events surrounding the

destruction of Jerusalem

 

 

1. The coming of Christ will be instantaneous and worldwide. "For as

   the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will

   the coming of the Son of Man be." —Matthew 24:27

2. The coming of Christ will be visible to all. "Then the sign of the

   Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth

   will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of

   heaven with power and great glory." —Matthew 24:30

 

There will be signs in

the sun, moon and stars. On the earth, nations will be in anguish and perplexity

at the roaring and tossing of the sea. Men will faint from terror, apprehensive

of what is coming on the world, for the heavenly bodies will be shaken. At that

time they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.

When these things begin to take place, stand up and lift up your heads, because

your redemption is drawing near." (Luke

21:25-28)

 

These bible prophecies could be tied to other prophecies signifying an

end of times coming this year which would indicate according to bible

prophecy that the second coming would be this year some time this

would definitely change the way that we perceive religion if the

second coming happened as prophesied. Science could no longer

ignore religious information.

 

 

The prophecy of the second coming of Christ is trivially falsified, Jesus states in no uncertain terms that some of Christs followers would still be alive when he returns... none of Christs followers are still alive so the prophecy is false...

[Semjase]

The life story of Jesus was recorded 2000 years ago on 4

scrolls titled "The Talmud Of Jmmanuel " they were found

in 1963 in East Jerusalem the scrolls were translated, but

then were accidentally destroyed. According to the Talmud

of Jmmanuel Jesus name was actually Jmmanuel. Jmmanuel

said he would be falsely known a Jesus and he clearly did not die

on the cross he survived the crucifixion. This would clear up

his contradictory statements in the bible. This is his prophecy

about his second coming

 

"For as lightning flashes and illuminates from start to finish, so will be my

coming in the future, when I will bring teachings anew and announce

the legions of celestial sons. At that time I will have a renewed life and will again

be accused of deception and blasphemy across the entire world, until the teaching

of truth will bring about insight and change in people."

 

The entire Talmud OF Jmmanuel can be downloaded below

 

 

talmud.pdf

[Moontanman]

The life story of Jesus was recorded 2000 years ago on 4

scrolls titled "The Talmud Of Jmmanuel " they were found

in 1963 in East Jerusalem the scrolls were translated, but

then were accidentally destroyed. According to the Talmud

of Jmmanuel Jesus name was actually Jmmanuel. Jmmanuel

said he would be falsely known a Jesus and he clearly did not die

on the cross he survived the crucifixion. This would clear up

his contradictory statements in the bible. This is his prophecy

about his second coming

 

"For as lightning flashes and illuminates from start to finish, so will be my

coming in the future, when I will bring teachings anew and announce

the legions of celestial sons. At that time I will have a renewed life and will again

be accused of deception and blasphemy across the entire world, until the teaching

of truth will bring about insight and change in people."

 

The entire Talmud OF Jmmanuel can be downloaded below

 

 

 

talmud.pdf

 

And why should we believe you much less the Talmud Of Jmmanuel?

[iNow]

No, they're really not. Science doesn't require a creator.

 

While I agree with the thrust of your point, in fairness neither does religion... Only some of the more popular ones do.

[tar]

Semjase,

 

Well, aliens COULD exist, and they could have sprinkled the Earth with mitochondria but the Bible tells some story about God creating an Adult Human named Adam, and taking one of his Ribs and Creating Eve, and then names the lineage, person by person, down to actual individuals that lived on this Planet. The two stories don't match. They don't fit the facts. They don't add up . One or the other, or both, is/are not the case.

 

So let's say, we construct a convoluted story about just when these aliens created humans, and placed them on Earth. It then would not be God that created heaven and Earth. We would have a situation where the Stars and Earth and Aliens were available, and the Aliens created us, and led us to believe that we should refer to them, as God. And still we are left with the fact that they are not actually God, just a bunch of Aliens pretending to be. Still leaves the question of how might THEY have evolved, and who it might be that's lying to THEM about their beginnings.

 

And you call this imaginary scenario a search for truth?

 

I think it better we apply the scientific method to the problem, and come up with a story that fits the facts.

 

Perhaps come up with a theory that matches all available evidence, and float a theory, and test it against all new information we uncover. Something we could call "The theory of evolution", that would describe a possible, fit the facts type of explanation of our emergence as a species.

 

And besides, the aliens would have to be rather complex themselves, once they arrive on Judgement day, we should ask them to explain where the heck they got that mitochondria from, and how they figure they may have come about.

 

Oh us? Our circuits where designed and placed on Planet X couple of weeks before we did that human experiment thing on your Earth, by some Gods on Planet Z, and those folks are going to toast our tails if we don't straighten out your defective immortal souls, right now. The whole bunch of you, has been recalled and scheduled for destruction. You guys should have seen this coming...we TOLD you this would happen.

 

Possible? No, not likely at all. Doesn't explain a single thing that does not already have a good explanation, and raises about a Zillion new questions...all hypothetical, and none based on fact.

 

And what is that new destruction date the Bible has so plainly given for this incredible nonsense?

 

I really think it would be nice for you to post it again in really big font on this thread. That way at least, I can make you a bet.

If you lose the bet, you have to answer any post on this thread, addressed to you, and explain to us, in 500 words or less, why scientific method is superior to Biblical prose, in predicting future events.

 

If I lose, and I see you in heaven, I'll give you a kiss. If I lose, and am in hell, I won't be able to pay up, but you will understand my predictament. If the world ends and both our consciousnesses are out of the picture entirely, then we both lose.

 

Are we on? Will you take the bet?

 

Regards, TAR2

Bet payable the day after the date you post in really big font.

Edited February 1, 2013 by tar

[Semjase]

Semjase,

 

Well, aliens COULD exist, and they could have sprinkled the Earth with mitochondria but the Bible tells some story about God creating an Adult Human named Adam, and taking one of his Ribs and Creating Eve, and then names the lineage, person by person, down to actual individuals that lived on this Planet. The two stories don't match. They don't fit the facts. They don't add up . One or the other, or both, is/are not the case.

 

So let's say, we construct a convoluted story about just when these aliens created humans, and placed them on Earth. It then would not be God that created heaven and Earth. We would have a situation where the Stars and Earth and Aliens were available, and the Aliens created us, and led us to believe that we should refer to them, as God. And still we are left with the fact that they are not actually God, just a bunch of Aliens pretending to be. Still leaves the question of how might THEY have evolved, and who it might be that's lying to THEM about their beginnings.

 

And you call this imaginary scenario a search for truth?

 

I think it better we apply the scientific method to the problem, and come up with a story that fits the facts.

 

Perhaps come up with a theory that matches all available evidence, and float a theory, and test it against all new information we uncover. Something we could call "The theory of evolution", that would describe a possible, fit the facts type of explanation of our emergence as a species.

 

And besides, the aliens would have to be rather complex themselves, once they arrive on Judgement day, we should ask them to explain where the heck they got that mitochondria from, and how they figure they may have come about.

 

Oh us? Our circuits where designed and placed on Planet X couple of weeks before we did that human experiment thing on your Earth, by some Gods on Planet Z, and those folks are going to toast our tails if we don't straighten out your defective immortal souls, right now. The whole bunch of you, has been recalled and scheduled for destruction. You guys should have seen this coming...we TOLD you this would happen.

 

Possible? No, not likely at all. Doesn't explain a single thing that does not already have a good explanation, and raises about a Zillion new questions...all hypothetical, and none based on fact.

 

And what is that new destruction date the Bible has so plainly given for this incredible nonsense?

 

I really think it would be nice for you to post it again in really big font on this thread. That way at least, I can make you a bet.

If you lose the bet, you have to answer any post on this thread, addressed to you, and explain to us, in 500 words or less, why scientific method is superior to Biblical prose, in predicting future events.

 

If I lose, and I see you in heaven, I'll give you a kiss. If I lose, and am in hell, I won't be able to pay up, but you will understand my predictament. If the world ends and both our consciousnesses are out of the picture entirely, then we both lose.

 

Are we on? Will you take the bet?

 

Regards, TAR2

 

Bet payable the day after the date you post in really big font.

 

Semjase is a contact person representing the Plejaren

Race located 500 light years away from us time shifted

in the future.

Most of their contact information is available on a 14 mb pdf

download at the link below

 

http://www.helirods.net/apps/documents/

 

I used her name as my user ID to bring attention

to her story.

 

The bible didn't give an exact of an end time before a peaceful

age it said that it would be at the time of the second coming

Other people with the power of prophecy with a proven

track record for being right have given exact dates.

In revelation 20 the bible states there would be a

1000 years of peace following the second coming

Other prophets totally unknown to each other

said this time would be known as the golden age.

The overall accuracy of the bible effects the integrity

of God and concerns all believers in the bible. If

key prophecies turn out to be correct it gives the bible

more credibility. Prophecy can be reduced to a science

the better understanding of this science and having the ability

to access this science will make prophecy common place.

Semjase's people use technology to access the future.

A reality that operates under science can be reduced to a

science

 

And why should we believe you much less the Talmud Of Jmmanuel?

I'm a believer in eye witness testimonies I'm not a eye witness to these

events but other people are, if eye witness testimonies had no

credibility why would they be allowed in a court of law? Science

doesn't accept eye witnesses but a court of law does?

[John Cuthber]

If you follow the prophecy sources that have the best track record for

getting prophecies right and do prophetic detective work you come

up with an approximate time for the second coming which is this

year sometime followed by a possible world conflict then a pole shift

causing geological upheaval in the month of October this year.

OK, that's a testable prediction. If we are still here at Christmas will you accept that religion gets things wrong and science gets things right?

 

If not then you are admitting that your actions have nothing much to do with science and you earlier assertion that you are a "science person" is nonsense.