Psychic Ability Through Microorganisms; Microbial Intelligence; Monosigna

[WissenschaftMann]

http://www.realitysandwich.com/does_telepathy_conflict_science

 

Reading this article about how if it was any other phenomenon ESP would've been confirmed scientific fact by 1950.

 

It seems the only reason it gets rejected is in the words of one scientist "it doesn't make sense". Afterall how could it work if there's no physical connection.

 

No one bothered to stop and think but microbes pass between people everyday.

 

And studies show the importance of the gut to how people think. Scientists are calling the gut where most microbes hang out as being the second brain. And there are more non-human cells in our bodies than there are human DNA cells.

 

It's not a stretch that information could go from one person's brain through microbes, into another person either through the microbes physically moving there or through communication networks between them and to another person.

 

I can't find the article but I read scientists have found Monosigna has more complex communication between each other than humans and spans the globe. How does it behave in its daily life? How do Monosigna relate to each other?

 

It also got me thinking if a microorganism could be shown to manipulate the environment around itself including for the purposes of storing information on how to manipulate its environment, make continuous advances in doing this, and communicated with each other and did this in a similar manner to the way that we do it that microbe population would essentially be very tiny people. Has this been ruled out? If so how?

 

And at a certain level of advance they would even be able to possibly communicate even in subtle ways with beings in the larger world. Perhaps relating to us as Universes or clusters in the Universe and possibly coming to know we are ourselves aware and thinking when they have advanced to a certain level of knowledge and understanding.

 

Any studies on this? Has there been research to try and relate psychic ability with microorganisms or to evaluate microbial intelligence to see if any are humanlike in relation to their environments?

[John Cuthber]

The timescale is wrong.

People say that ESP is immediate across long distances with people who have not recently been in contact.

There's no way for that to tally with the speed at which microbes are passed from one person to another.

 

Also, they may say that the evidence for ESP is good.

Why don't they claim the million dollars then?

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html

[CharonY]

That certainly does not belong into microbiology.

[WissenschaftMann]

The timescale is wrong.

People say that ESP is immediate across long distances with people who have not recently been in contact.

There's no way for that to tally with the speed at which microbes are passed from one person to another.

 

Also, they may say that the evidence for ESP is good.

Why don't they claim the million dollars then?

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/1m-challenge.html

 

If you want to strictly define ESP as being immediate then OK then I'll grant you the definition, but wouldn't it still be amazing even if not technically ESP if it turned out that psychological effects are sometimes mediated between people through microorganisms and their interactions with each other and with the environment? That could explain the appearance of ESP and that would still be something amazing.

 

And that doesn't detract from the question how do we know there are no humanlike microbe populations (humanlike in relation to the environments they are living in)? Monosigna is said to have even more complex communication between each other than humans have between each other which makes me curious about whether it is similarly amazing in other aspects.

Edited August 5, 2013 by WissenschaftMann

[swansont]

Before you worry about a mechanism you have to establish that the phenomenon exists. The article bypasses this by claiming that mounds of evidence exists and the mechanism is the problem, and even goes so far as to say that when people say that ESP hasn't been shown to be true, it is "rare for a skeptic to ever back up this claim with specific examples" Back up a claim of non-existence with specific examples?

!

Moderator Note

The burden of proof is to objectively show that the phenomenon exists. That is what is demanded by the speculations rules, and is required for further discussion.

[Delta1212]

It's rare that I've heard anyone back up a claim that Santa isn't real with specific examples.

[krash661]

i understand this is about microorganisms, but this below is interesting

for something to not exist, the government sure was/is interested in ESP/telepathy

 

 

History of Artificial Telepathy, 1950 - Present

http://artificialtelepathy.blogspot.com/2006/06/history-of-artificial-telepathy-1950.html

 

Exploration of Remote Mind Control methods began in the 1950's. From this point onward, experiments in telepathy and remote mind control ("artificial telepathy") began to overlap.

 

In 1952, the CIA began Project Moonstruck. Electronic devices were designed to be implanted in the brain or teeth, surreptitiously or during abduction, with the specific goal of mind and behavior control.

 

In 1953, the agency launched Project MK-ULTRA, also known as Project Artichoke, an umbrella program with many sub-programs. Psychiatrists experimented with drugs, narcoleptic trance, electronics, and electroshock to create "cyborg" mentalities. The experiments involved "remote control" insofar as VHF, UHF and modulated ELF broadcasts were used for E.D.O.M. (Electronic Dissolution of Memory).

 

A short list of US mind control projects

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread9381/pg

 

Major U.S. Millitary and Intelligence Agency Electromagnetic Mind-Control Projects

 

 

Project Moonstruck, 1952, CIA:

Description -- Electronic implants in brain and teeth.

Targeting -- Long range; Implants introduced during surgery or surreptitiously during abduction.

Frequency range: HF-ELF transceiver implants.

Purpose: Tracking, mind and behavior control, conditioning, programming, covert operations.

Functional Basis: Electronic stimulation of the brain, E.S.B.

 

Project MK-ULTRA (BLUEBIRD/ARTICHOKE), 1953, CIA:

Description -- Electronics and electroshock.

Targeting -- Short range.

Frequency range: VHF, HF, UHF, modulated at ELF. Local transmission and reception.

Purpose: Programming behavior, creation of 'cyborg" mentalities.

Effects: Narcoleptic trance states, programming by suggestion.

Functional Basis: Electronic dissolution of memory, E.D.O.M.

 

Project ORION (DREAMLAND), 1958, U.S.A.F.:

Description -- Drugs, hypnosis, and ESB.

Targeting -- Short range, in person.

Frequency range: ELF modulation. Transmission and reception by radar and microwaves.

Purpose: Top security debriefing, programming, insure security and loyalty.

Effects: Narcoleptic trance states, programming by suggestion.

Functional Basis: Electronic dissolution of memory, E.D.O.M.

 

Project MK-DELTA (DEEP SLEEP), 1960, CIA:

Description -- Fine-tuned electromagnetic subliminal programming.

Targeting -- Long range.

Frequency range: VHF, HF, UHF, modulated at ELF. Tramsmission and reception through television and radio antennae, power lines, mattress spring coils, modulation of 60 Hz wiring.

Purpose: Programming behavior and attitudes in general population.

Effects: Fatigue, mood swings, behavior dysfunction and criminality.

 

Project PHOENIX II (MONTAUK), 1983, U.S.A.F., NSA:

Description -- Electronic multi-directional targeting of select population groups.

Targeting -- Medium range.

Frequency range: Radar, microwaves, EHF, UHF modulated with gigawatt through terawatt power.

Purpose: Loading of Earth grids, planetary sonombulescence to stave off geological activity, specific-point earthquake creation, population programming for sensitized individuals.

Pseudonym: "Rainbow," ZAP.

 

Project TRIDENT, 1989, ONR, NSA:

Description -- Electronic directed targeting of individuals or populations.

Targeting: Large population groups assembled.

Frequency range: VHF, HF, UHF, modulated at ELF. Local transmission and reception.

Purpose: Crowd dispersion and others.

Display: Black helicopters flying in triad formation.

 

terkelowna.tripod.com...

 

If you notice, a good number of these are electromagnetic in nature, and represent the beginnings of research that led to the operational deployment of HAARP.

[John Cuthber]

Is this the first time you have noticed a government being stupid?

 

Also, most of the things you have cited there are nothing to do with ESP.

[krash661]

Is this the first time you have noticed a government being stupid?

 

Also, most of the things you have cited there are nothing to do with ESP.

Extrasensory perception

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extrasensory_perception

Extrasensory perception (ESP) involves reception of information not gained through the recognized physical senses but sensed with the mind. The term was adopted by Duke University psychologist J. B. Rhine to denote psychic abilities such as telepathy,

telepathy

te·lep·a·thy

 

te·lep·a·thy [tə léppəthee]

n

supposed extrasensory psychic communication: supposed communication directly from one person's mind to another's without speech, writing, or other signs or symbols

extrasensory perception

ex·tra·sen·so·ry per·cep·tion

 

n

awareness beyond normal senses: the apparent ability of some people to become aware of things by means other than the normal senses, e.g. through clairvoyance or telepathy

Edited August 5, 2013 by krash661

[John Cuthber]

Does this count as ESP?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroconvulsive_therapy

[WissenschaftMann]

Before you worry about a mechanism you have to establish that the phenomenon exists. The article bypasses this by claiming that mounds of evidence exists and the mechanism is the problem, and even goes so far as to say that when people say that ESP hasn't been shown to be true, it is "rare for a skeptic to ever back up this claim with specific examples" Back up a claim of non-existence with specific examples?

 

!

Moderator Note

The burden of proof is to objectively show that the phenomenon exists. That is what is demanded by the speculations rules, and is required for further discussion.

 

New here. Sorry about having put it in the wrong thread and for not having elaborated how this is testable enough.

 

How it is testable:

 

All they'd have to do is run psychological tests on people having them guess what's on each other's minds or for example guess who is more or less likely to come into a room a person is in and tests on their gut bacteria in controlled settings over a period of time and repeat the studies. Perhaps you'd see similar gut bacteria means higher rates of accurate guessing. Or perhaps not. Either way I'd be interested in seeing the results and even wonder if perhaps studies like this have been conducted. If they have then clearly they came out either negative or inconclusive (or else we would've all heard about this), which would still be great to know. If not someone should get to work on that. I'll grant even if the results showed a correlation gut flora influence on personality characteristics would still be a viable explanation so then we'd need to conduct yet more research.

 

We could have tests on the precise behaviors of these bacterias both with their own species and others and how they react when exposed to various chemicals found in the human body, as well as to test how each set of molecules and chemicals (including the microbes themselves) interact with one another based on what you'd expect to find in the human body as well as the air that people breathe. Run some calculations and they should be able to say whether this is at least a possibility and ultimately yes prove or disprove the theory. If the mathematics of a microbial populations' interactions with themselves and their environment happened to coincide with the way that humans interact (or exhibit even higher levels of complexity) with each other and their environment there would be no reason to say they aren't conscious and indeed intelligent. If the material interactions look exactly the same physically when analyzed from every angle then it is exactly the same and can be characterized as being conscious and possessing humanlike intelligence. Of course if the mathematics were to show they don't line up at all then the theory would be falsified.

 

Monosigna in particular. There's got to be more information on that other than that their communication patterns are more complex than humans. I'd love to see the full mathematics of it so I could begin parsing out how they interact and whether there are any major parallels with how the matter and energy we call "humans" interacts with each other. But everytime I try looking for more information on that subject I can't find anything. If anybody could direct me towards any relevant information on Monosigna that would be great. It's next to impossible for me to find through regular search engines.

 

Maybe I'd find something completely different, still worth the search.

 

Edit:

 

It's Monosiga Brevicollis not Monosigna. I can't locate the original article that claims their communication is more complex than humans but I did find an article that says their tyrosine kinase signaling network is more complex than any other protist.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18621719

 

Disregard what I said about it being more complex than humans, granted that would be amazing if it were and it's likely it would require a great deal more tests and analysis (such as what I described could be done above) to figure that out. Or we already know in which case the helpful people here can point me to the specific pieces of information to either confirm or deny and either way it's always good to learn more information.

Edited August 7, 2013 by WissenschaftMann

[swansont]

Before you start measuring gut bacteria, where are the studies that show that anyone is able to consistently guess better than what random chance would dictate?

[John Cuthber]

If you can show that, then you can use the prize money from the Randi foundation to test your theory.