My philosophy about observing space and time, in line with the principle of relativity

[Maartenn100]

I like to think, and I want to avoid fallacies. i was, during a few years in my life, obsessed with the question:

"how do we observe time and space". I was looking for answers via logic reasoning.

 

And I discovered Einstein last year, even if I did not want that. But I necessarily must confront myself his ideas about time and space, to answer the question: "how do we observe time and space?"

So, I walked through the spaceships of Einstein's thoughtexperiments and stood in heavy fields of gravity to observe the nightsky. I did a lot of thoughtexperiments.

And I came to the conclusion that 'the observer' will always, wherever he/she/it goes have the same idea of time and space. I derived other conclusions from it, and came to a final conclusion: the observer must be the backbone of the coördinatesystem. Real existing observers are measuring devices, telescopes, gps-systems, human beings, animals. And I think, their existence obey laws of nature.

To be clair, I do not think that 'I know it better'. I just had another perspective and started my reasoning from there on. And this perspective can give you feedback about what you think about 'observing expanding space' and 'observing time and space' in general.

I only want to share my conclusions, logically derived from some premisses, to give feedback about what I discovered about nature.

 

I derive from the principle of relativity for being in different fields of gravity:

The laws of physics must be exactly the same in his referenceframe, wherever the observer is.
Therefore, the observer measures space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

For example, the observer in a very fast spaceship near the speed of light, will have a normal idea of time. He will also observe normal properties of space. Nothing is shrinking, dilating, stretching. Because the laws of physics must be the same, wherever he is. (in every frame of reference)
Therefore, he will measure lengthcontractions and timedilations elsewhere.

Do you see the resemblance for observers in different fields of gravity?

Our clock is dilating here on Earth relative to clocks of hypothetical aliens in the voids of space. (without matter).

But according to us, our time flows as usual and we do not measure spaceshrinks at all. Nothing wrong with time and space in our coördinatesystem. Because the laws of physics must work as usual. Therefore, the timeflow of thé aliens is stretching. And their space is expanding according to the observers here on Earth.

An observer cannot afford himself space- and timedistortions in his own referenceframe, because the laws of physics must work exactly the same. So, he will project space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

So, the existing observer, is the backbone of the coördinatesystem.
And wherever he is, the laws of physics work properly. No spaceshrinks or timestretches.

When he is repositioning himself, his observations of space- and timedistortions elsewhere are repositioning themselves too.

His normal ticking clock and normal spatial observations in his coördinatesystem, are the norm for observing distortions of space and time elsewhere.

So, when you are in a void region of space, where 'the universe is expanding very fast", you will not observe such an expansion of space, because of the principle of relativity: the laws of physics must be the same for you, wherever you are.

 

 

 

Maarten Vergucht

obsessed with the question (duration: two years): how do we observe space and time?

 

 

 

[xyzt]

I like to think, and I want to avoid fallacies. i was, during a few years in my life, obsessed with the question:

"how do we observe time and space". I was looking for answers via logic reasoning.

 

And I discovered Einstein last year, even if I did not want that. But I necessarily must confront myself his ideas about time and space, to answer the question: "how do we observe time and space?"

 

So, I walked through the spaceships of Einstein's thoughtexperiments and stood in heavy fields of gravity to observe the nightsky. I did a lot of thoughtexperiments.

 

And I came to the conclusion that 'the observer' will always, wherever he/she/it goes have the same idea of time and space. I derived other conclusions from it, and came to a final conclusion: the observer must be the backbone of the coördinatesystem. Real existing observers are measuring devices, telescopes, gps-systems, human beings, animals. And I think, their existence obey laws of nature.

 

To be clair, I do not think that 'I know it better'. I just had another perspective and started my reasoning from there on. And this perspective can give you feedback about what you think about 'observing expanding space' and 'observing time and space' in general.

I only want to share my conclusions, logically derived from some premisses, to give feedback about what I discovered about nature.

 

I derive from the principle of relativity for being in different fields of gravity:

 

The laws of physics must be exactly the same in his referenceframe, wherever the observer is.

Therefore, the observer measures space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

 

For example, the observer in a very fast spaceship near the speed of light, will have a normal idea of time. He will also observe normal properties of space. Nothing is shrinking, dilating, stretching. Because the laws of physics must be the same, wherever he is. (in every frame of reference)

Therefore, he will measure lengthcontractions and timedilations elsewhere.

 

 

Do you see the resemblance for observers in different fields of gravity?

 

Our clock is dilating here on Earth relative to clocks of hypothetical aliens in the voids of space. (without matter).

 

But according to us, our time flows as usual and we do not measure spaceshrinks at all. Nothing wrong with time and space in our coördinatesystem. Because the laws of physics must work as usual. Therefore, the timeflow of thé aliens is stretching. And their space is expanding according to the observers here on Earth.

 

An observer cannot afford himself space- and timedistortions in his own referenceframe, because the laws of physics must work exactly the same. So, he will project space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

 

So, the existing observer, is the backbone of the coördinatesystem.

And wherever he is, the laws of physics work properly. No spaceshrinks or timestretches.

 

When he is repositioning himself, his observations of space- and timedistortions elsewhere are repositioning themselves too.

 

His normal ticking clock and normal spatial observations in his coördinatesystem, are the norm for observing distortions of space and time elsewhere.

 

So, when you are in a void region of space, where 'the universe is expanding very fast", you will not observe such an expansion of space, because of the principle of relativity: the laws of physics must be the same for you, wherever you are.

 

 

 

Maarten Vergucht

obsessed with the question (duration: two years): how do we observe space and time?

 

 

 

This is pretty much a rehash of what you posted here

[Strange]

I derive from the principle of relativity for being in different fields of gravity:

The laws of physics must be exactly the same in his referenceframe, wherever the observer is.

 

You can't really derive this from relativity as it is one of the postulates that the theory is based on...

[Maartenn100]

No, but you quoted me wrong. You forgot the 'therefore....'

 

The laws of physics must be exactly the same in his referenceframe, wherever the observer is.
Therefore, the observer measures space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

 

 

premisse: all laws of physics must be the same, wherever an observer is in the gravitational field. (principle of relativity)

Ergo (deduced idea): observations of space- and time-distortions must be elsewhere.

(otherwise, his observations of time and space and the laws of physics would not be the same in his coördinatesystem)

 

So, an observer will never see a space-expansion or a space-stretch in his laboratory. He will never discover 'dark energy' in his environment.

 

Because he must measure space and time the same, wherever he is. (principle of relativity)

Edited August 15, 2013 by Maartenn100

[Maartenn100]

I do not send my idea to scientific magazines, because I don't think they will accept my idea.
But I think I have a good alternative to explain our observation of expanding space.

The observed velocity-distance-relationship is an unobservable gravitational timestretch/distance relationship.

The observed velocity of recession of galaxies, proportional to their distance (Hubble) is an observation of expanding space, because of an invisible timestretch relative to our clocks due to a weaker and weaker gravitational attraction between these receding galaxies, further and further away from each other. The gravitational timedilation is becoming less weaker, when galaxies are further from each other, then when they are close to each other. We can call this ‘gravitational timestretch’ of imaginary clocks in the empty regions between them.
So, the observed velocity-distance relationship is also a field of gravity-distance relationship.

It’s crucial to mention that the empty region of space must be of remote galaxies, because locally, we always measure normal properties of time and normal properties of space. In our own referenceframe, all laws of physics are as usual. (relativity principle). The difference in timeflow is small.

We can say, that there is a stronger field of gravity between two remote galaxies closer to each other then between remote galaxies further away from each other.
Therefore, we know that the empty space between galaxies closer to each other have a slower timeflow then galaxies further away from eachother.

We are part of Earth, a solarsystem, a galaxy with a black hole in the centre of it, the Virgo cluster and the Local Group.
The gravity of these objects are slowing down our clocks, relative to clocks in the empty regions of space without matter. But to us, our time is ticking as usual, wherever we are. And our space doesn’t seem to be distorted.

conclusion
The observed space-distortion is due to the difference between clocks on Earth and the invisible clocks in empty space between remote galaxies because of the difference in gravitational timedistortion. If the timeflow between remote galaxies or stars is faster than our clock, we see a space-expansion, when the timeflow between remote galaxies or stars is slower than our clock, we see a spaceshrink. Locally, we do not observe such differences, because the difference in timeflow is too small and our idea of time in our own referenceframe is always the standard to observe space- and timedistortions elsewhere. We will always observe space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

Summary:

Observed space-expansion is due to a gravitational timestretch relative to our clock and observed space-shrink is due to a gravitational timedilation relative to our clock.

But when the difference in timeflow between clocks on Earth and clocks in the empty regions of space between remote galaxies is almost the same, we do not observe distortions of space.


Testable predictions?

When we leave our solarsystem and our galaxy, the influence of the gravitational timedilation of our galaxy on our clock will decrease. But according to us, our clock is still the standard for observations elsewhere. Our time and our idea of space is the norm for observations of distortions elsewhere, wherever we are. Which means: we observe a spaceshrink of the space between stars in our galaxies closer to the centre of our galaxy then further away from the centre. We observe a decreasing of ‘the expanding universe’ when we leave our galaxy.
When we are further and further away from our Local Group in the voids of space, and we look back, we will see galaxies coming back together. We will see ‘a shrinking universe’.
When we are closer to the black hole in the centre of our galaxy, we will observe ‘an increasing expansion of the universe’ because the difference in timeflow will increase. Our timeflow will always be the standard for observations of space- and timedistortions elsewhere, so the observed expansion rate will be higher when we are closer to the centre of the black hole.

The math

I only like to think about space and time and I was obsessed by the question of observations of time and space. But I invite you to find the mathematical equation, who will explain the relationship I described here in words with the proper well-defined terms.

Maarten Vergucht, Belgium.
Obsessive thinker about our observations of time and space.

This article supports my theory that 'the universe an sich' is not expanding. It's just a relative observation of space.

(Phys.org) —Cosmologist Christof Wetterich of the University of Heidelberg has uploaded a paper to the arXiv server in which he claims it's possible that the theory of expansion of the universe might be incorrect. He suggests instead that the redshift observed by researchers here on Earth might be caused by an increase in the mass in the universe.
For nearly a century, the consensus among astrophysicists has been that the universe started with a Big Bang and has been expanding ever since. This hypothesis formed because researchers found that in analyzing the light emitted from stars, a redshift occurred—where its frequency changes as an object that emits light moves away from us. But Wetterich says the redshift might me due to something else—an increase in the total mass in the universe.

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2013-08-cosmolo...verse.html#jCp

 

 

Edited August 16, 2013 by Maartenn100

[michel123456]

I like to think, and I want to avoid fallacies. i was, during a few years in my life, obsessed with the question:

"how do we observe time and space". I was looking for answers via logic reasoning.

 

And I discovered Einstein last year, even if I did not want that. But I necessarily must confront myself his ideas about time and space, to answer the question: "how do we observe time and space?"

 

So, I walked through the spaceships of Einstein's thoughtexperiments and stood in heavy fields of gravity to observe the nightsky. I did a lot of thoughtexperiments.

 

And I came to the conclusion that 'the observer' will always, wherever he/she/it goes have the same idea of time and space. I derived other conclusions from it, and came to a final conclusion: the observer must be the backbone of the coördinatesystem. Real existing observers are measuring devices, telescopes, gps-systems, human beings, animals. And I think, their existence obey laws of nature.

 

To be clair, I do not think that 'I know it better'. I just had another perspective and started my reasoning from there on. And this perspective can give you feedback about what you think about 'observing expanding space' and 'observing time and space' in general.

I only want to share my conclusions, logically derived from some premisses, to give feedback about what I discovered about nature.

 

I derive from the principle of relativity for being in different fields of gravity:

 

The laws of physics must be exactly the same in his referenceframe, wherever the observer is.

Therefore, the observer measures space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

 

For example, the observer in a very fast spaceship near the speed of light, will have a normal idea of time. He will also observe normal properties of space. Nothing is shrinking, dilating, stretching. Because the laws of physics must be the same, wherever he is. (in every frame of reference)

Therefore, he will measure lengthcontractions and timedilations elsewhere.

 

 

Do you see the resemblance for observers in different fields of gravity?

 

Our clock is dilating here on Earth relative to clocks of hypothetical aliens in the voids of space. (without matter).

 

But according to us, our time flows as usual and we do not measure spaceshrinks at all. Nothing wrong with time and space in our coördinatesystem. Because the laws of physics must work as usual. Therefore, the timeflow of thé aliens is stretching. And their space is expanding according to the observers here on Earth.

 

An observer cannot afford himself space- and timedistortions in his own referenceframe, because the laws of physics must work exactly the same. So, he will project space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

 

So, the existing observer, is the backbone of the coördinatesystem.

And wherever he is, the laws of physics work properly. No spaceshrinks or timestretches.

 

When he is repositioning himself, his observations of space- and timedistortions elsewhere are repositioning themselves too.

 

His normal ticking clock and normal spatial observations in his coördinatesystem, are the norm for observing distortions of space and time elsewhere.

 

So, when you are in a void region of space, where 'the universe is expanding very fast", you will not observe such an expansion of space, because of the principle of relativity: the laws of physics must be the same for you, wherever you are.

 

 

 

Maarten Vergucht

obsessed with the question (duration: two years): how do we observe space and time?

 

 

 

Welcome Maarten from Belgium.

 

IMHO your views are mainstream,

you wrote

 

'the observer' will always, wherever he/she/it goes have the same idea of time and space

 

Yes that is pretty much what I have read from random informations about Relativity. i have even read that somewhere that an observer reaching a Black Hole would not feel anything strange happening to him. (I'll have to back this up) (1)

 

 

The laws of physics must be exactly the same in his referenceframe, wherever the observer is.

 

Yes, that is Relativity.

Therefore, the observer measures space- and timedistortions elsewhere.

 

Yes, that is my understanding too.

 

The rest of your interpretation about cosmology is not exactly mainstream but follows very logically from your premises.

So

i don't understand why people vote your posts negative.

 

(1) erased since I saw that the issue is unresolved. See here.

Edited August 16, 2013 by michel123456

[Didymus]

Quick sociological input:

 

People will take you more seriously if you don't take yourself so seriously.

 

You have a viewpoint... Fabulous.... But, you marketed that viewpoint as if it were a new theory.... But you didn't really question or add to anything....you just stated your understanding of relativity.

 

It's good to think and find new things.... Just be less dramatic about it and people will give you more hugs.

 

Oh, and remember what Einstein was a tually good at: philosophy. Science never advanced by people accepting what was already thought of. It moves forward when people find new limitations.... Or kick old ones in the nuts. (loose paraphrase, of course).

 

Basically, you're only contributing if you're saying some

Edited August 16, 2013 by Didymus