A challenge for creationists.

[swansont]

As an American you dont seem to know your history' date='or are choosing to ignore it.

All schools taught creation(not specifically 6,000year old earth creationist dogma).

In order to gain a foothold in the school system to teach evolution,it was proposed as a RELIGION.

[/quote']

 

references, please.

[Newtonian]

uhm..Im not sure i want to pass on my knowledge.

[ydoaPs]

in other words, no references.

[Mokele]

In yet other words, Useless creationist drivel, as always.

 

Why do you even bother trying? Creationists are incapable of reason, and haven't come up with any legitimate points against evolution in almost 150 years of trying.

 

To quote despair.com: "Winners never quit and quitters never win, but those who never win and never quit are idiots."

 

Mokele

[reverse]

I'll state my colours.

 

I'm neither a creationist or a evolutionist, but have great interest in all mythology and love the effectiveness of the scientific method.

I just enjoy both stories.

 

The thing about evolution is that it seems very cruel.

I would much rather live peacefully in a world populated by god fearing men.

[reverse]

Helbender,

Religion served humanity perfectly well for the bulk of it’s history.

It helped the primitives feel as though they had at least some say in the climatic events that frequently upturned their world.

You have to have respect for it at least in that capacity.

And when the Roman empire was in a state of decay, was it not the Church that protected and advanced the gifts of civilisation.

 

If you have a Scientific mind it is relatively easy to see how: the process of selected elimination over time will produce biodiversity.

 

If you do not have a scientific mind, then Evolution sounds like a hell of a hokey story.

Something like, one frog multiplied by one billion years equals a person.

One frog multiplied by a billion years equals a very old frog.

[ydoaPs]

god did it http://www.caseforacreator.com/home.php. lol

http://www.answersincreation.org/

[Gnieus]

Helbender' date='

Religion served humanity perfectly well for the bulk of it’s history.

It helped the primitives feel as though they had at least some say in the climatic events that frequently upturned their world. [/quote']

 

Nobody said that delusionary traits in adverse conditions aren't adaptive.

 

Better to sit in that foxhole, believing that her holiness guards you, having a clear head and making therefore survivable decisions, than cr@ping your pants cause you are so afraid, making rush decisions and die.

 

Nevertheless religion as proposed by man has still a very much higher probability to be severly wrong than hypotheses and theories derived by reason...

[Newtonian]

in other words, no references.

I dont understand,you have fingers and a brain.The fact i stated isnt that difficult to varify.Its your history try a google and dont be so lazy.

 

In yet other words' date=' Useless creationist drivel, as always.

 

Why do you even bother trying? Creationists are incapable of reason, and haven't come up with any legitimate points against evolution in almost 150 years of trying.[/quote']

I fail to understand your reason to TROLL ,please tell me how pointing out a mistake to another poster.Qualifies attacking me as some creationist.Its childish and without foundation.

This appears a prevalent opinion on anyone pointing out someones errors,in their assumptions of religious or evolutionary fact.

[swansont]

The thing about evolution is that it seems very cruel.

I would much rather live peacefully in a world populated by god fearing men.

 

Well, if you happen to also be male, evolution will be very cruel indeed, as you will be unable to pass along your genes. And god-fearing men seem not to be particularly peaceful, historically speaking.

 

How come people complain about the cruelty of evolution, and yet gravity, which has caused countless injuries and deaths, gets a free pass?

 

What makes people happy, or at least gives them a warm fuzzy, is not a consideration. How nature behaves is not caused by what makes you feel good.

[swansont]

I dont understand' date='you have fingers and a brain.The fact i stated isnt that difficult to varify.Its your history try a google and dont be so lazy.

[/quote']

 

It was your contention. It's up to you to back it up. The burden of proof is on the one making the statement.

[Newtonian]

Oh sorry i see now.In that case you may want to check the fact that evolution was made part of the school curriculum in US in the late 1920's.It was accepted as the religion of Humanism.

That was the only point i was making regarding Hellbenders bias assumption of history.

Though i appreciate it was the prevailing opinion of nazi germany at the time.

 

edit Hardly creationist propoganda on my part

[Hellbender]

Change that from "have to" to "are supposed to"

 

sorry I'm late on this. I didn't know this. Wow that sucks.

[Hellbender]

Hellbenders bias assumption of history.

 

I was not being biased here. My point was that people still continually try to sneak creation into the schools, it was my assumption that was under the guise of a science, not a religion. I wasn't talking about what they used to do. Sorry if I was wrong, I don usually give a rats a$$ what those southern fundamentalists did in the past. I was talking about what they are attempting now. Nad I don't think that everyone that is religious are crazy. Please don't put words in my mouth. You are telling me that southern fundamentists are rational human beings?

[Hellbender]

Though i appreciate it was the prevailing opinion of nazi germany at the time.

 

What was? evolution? Replace "opinion" with "ackowledgement". I'm not saying you said or implied this, but evolution is scientific fact, not a religion or opinion of any sort. The problem is that evolution was used as a tool for Hitler's racism. It doesn't mean I am a bad person and I agree with Hitler becasue he accepted (or maybe appeared to have a base knowledge to further racist sentiements) evolution. Need I say that Hitler thought that he was God's tool and thought he was on a Holy mission to eliminate Jews, etc.? Please don't equate a person who accepts scientific fact with Nazis just to make it look bad to accept evolution. By your rationale, it also makes religious people look bad becasue they believe in god, Just as the Nazis did, but it really doesn't matter.

[Newtonian]

woooah there Hellbender.

I was referring to a false representation of historical fact.Not evolution and nazi's.

As for post 189 why shouldnt schools teach RE as well as evolution.Or are you saying that in the US they actually teach creationist science(a literal bible interpretation)

[Hellbender]

IN the U.S. some extremists want creation "science: taught as a way of furthering religious agenda. Sorry for jumping the gun of the Nazi thing, I just didn't know what you are talking about.

[Hellbender]

As for post 189 why shouldnt schools teach RE as well as evolution.

 

?? whats RE?

[jordan]

?? whats RE?

Religious Education.

[Hellbender]

Helbender' date='

Religion served humanity perfectly well for the bulk of it’s history.

It helped the primitives feel as though they had at least some say in the climatic events that frequently upturned their world.

You have to have respect for it at least in that capacity.

And when the Roman empire was in a state of decay, was it not the Church that protected and advanced the gifts of civilisation.[/quote']

 

I never said that histroically religion didn't give satisfactory answers for some people. They don't give me any now, and never will. I don't need religion to be happy or lead a full life. As for the good that the church did, I am not about to get into a theological discussion here. The church has done some good and some bad. It all depends on the motivation and situation.

 

If you do not have a scientific mind, then Evolution sounds like a hell of a hokey story.

 

I have a scientific mind. I am making a post on a science forum aren't I? the process of evolution bugs some poeple for a lot of reasons. It is pretty complex and hard for some people to grasp. It can also be cruel. I can see that if you don't have an objective, scientific mind it can seem hard to grasp, but hardly "hokey" unless you are reading about it from some creationist source who make it seem that way.

 

Something like' date=' one frog multiplied by one billion years equals a person.

One frog multiplied by a billion years equals a very old frog.[/quote']

 

No one said frogs are members of the direct line of human ancestors. This is simply a radical oversimplification of human evolution.

[Hellbender]

Religious Education.

 

Oh. religious education is a good idea. (read my post in the politics forum thread about church and state). If you mean making religious instruction of a certain faith mandatory for all students then I would say you are a right-wing idiot. If you mean learning about world religions from a histrorical unbiased perspective, then I would say it is a good idea. I learned that stuff in high school.

[Gnieus]

I think Nazis had their own wee thing going on (Pseudo Science), Eugenics (not as thought of by Galton I might add, more the Pearson perversion of it), anthropometrics etc. Pervesrion of "science" ...

 

Well Galton was the master of pseudo science ... Measured the beuty of woman by making ticks or classifications ... Counting all tiles in Westminster abbey ... He was an OK mathematician ... Galton actually wanted to improve on human nature based on intelligence NOT on race and not "fit" were supposed to be treated nice, just an arrogant Victorian. I think Pearson was the agressive one...

 

Ok I am starting to ramble.. I better stop ...

[jordan]

I just answered your question, not offering any oppinions of my own, but I might as well do so now. I think that making classes teaching the historical facts of all the world's major religion as manditory is a good idea. But I've also held for while now that if you're going to read one book in your life, the Bible would be the best to choose.

[Hellbender]

But I've also held for while now that if you're going to read one book in your life, the Bible would be the best to choose.

 

You are entitled yo your opinion, but would you care to give a reason why the bible over the Koran, the Avesta or any other book for that matter.

 

I Personally feel that everyone should read the "Zombie Survival Guide" by Max Brooks. What a great book.....

[jordan]

Sure. I you want to read one book that has influenced more people across a larger portion of the Earth over more years than any other, you'd have to read the Bible. Reading "Zombie Survival Guide" might be fun and nice, but what advantage would it offer me when I have to deal people in everyday life (I run into zombies far less frequently than Christians...I think)?