If I can imagine it, it is possible!

[Le Repteux]

Imagination was meant for physical purposes, otherwise it would be useless. It has evolved to imagine anything from what we know of, but it was also designed to test our ideas for the same reason. There is a large gap between curiosity and foolishness: if you try to fly out a cliff before testing it from a chair, you have a lot of imagination but a lack of prudence. Some crackpots lack that prudence, they make too big a step. Some like me proceed with small steps (plug), but it does not mean that they are right (plug again).

Edited October 22, 2014 by Le Repteux

[BrainTrainer]

I think human imagination is limitless but ability is very limited so "If I can imagine it, it is possible" is not true in my opinion.

[thou]

The odds are not on your side but something could happen if u imagine them imagine u getting a new car yes posible imagine you win the lottery every one imagines it but only a few actually win. Some things you imagine can be possible, but not all

[Pan0ptical]

Imagining is definitely easier, which why most people prefer to dream if I may say, rather than inventing.

Invention is a step forward which take place if the fact of either need or inspiration or observation happen simultaneously.

 

 

 

 

We'll be right back!

[halsienkiewicz1]

We have very little understanding of what is possible in the universe, and we are so far from a solid understanding that it is far safer not to put things in the impossible basket. So the answer to the question suggests that it is possible.

[Finding the Elephant]

You might want to have a look at this: We have found a way of doing the impossible: http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/news/news/1000633/

[swansont]

You might want to have a look at this: We have found a way of doing the impossible: http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/news/news/1000633/

 

Then it wasn't impossible, was it?

[ajb]

You might want to have a look at this: We have found a way of doing the impossible: http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/news/news/1000633/

Was it ever actually thought impossible in principal, or just very difficult to achieve, maybe beyond the technology of the day?

[Mr. Laymen]

The second one is a bit harder, since there's disagreement on the exact requirements of what makes something metaphysically possible, but we do know that for something to be metaphysically possible, it must also be logically possible. That is, were things different, an accurate description of the universe still wouldn't entail a contradiction.

 

Why is a contradiction a deal breaker, are there no explainable contradictions observed to still be logically sound, for reasonable comparison? Sorry, if its a dumb question, or too off topic.

Edited March 26, 2015 by Mr. Laymen

[imatfaal]

Why is a contradiction a deal breaker, are there no explainable contradictions observed to still be logically sound, for reasonable comparison? Sorry, if its a dumb question, or too off topic.

 

It is a good question.

 

First it must be understood that this is refering to a full contradiction - not merely a situation in which previously seemingly contradictory events have occured. A vindaloo taken from a fridge could be both hot and cold - but that is merely linguistic silliness; I am sure you can think of other examples in which 'contradiciton' could be used sensibly in many areas.

 

But we are looking at the contradiction that A both is and isn't - ie that A no longer is A.

 

Our basic logic framework tells us that any sentence that says that A is equal to not A is inherently false. One of the reasons we do this is from the position that A equals not A we can prove anything we like. Any set of axiomata and logical progression that reaches an inescapable logical contradiction must be flawed

 

 

This is a formal discussion on the matter

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/contradiction/

 

Most of the above thread is based on Western - Aristolean logic. Some Eastern philosophies embrace contradiction (this has lead to their spurious and erroneous grasping of the pop-science of quantum theory) - but in my opinion this changes their philosophy to more approximate poetry and clever language usage. The logical power of an argument based on agreed assumptions and steady non-controversial steps is lost if you do not have the law of non-contradiction.

[DrP]

I can imagine the earth inside the sun being spun round and around like a marble inside of a balloon with all the people of the earth shouting for joy at the ride they are having...... This of course is impossible for many reasons.

[Mr. Laymen]

 

But we are looking at the contradiction that A both is and isn't - ie that A no longer is A.

 

This is a formal discussion on the matter

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/contradiction/

 

Thank you for the link, it was a good read. Especially the modal and negative squares parts. But ultimately it describes that it's uncertain if there are valid exceptions to the rules or not. In section 5 it discusses the Buddhist interpretation as being aligned with the "squares", intentionally to express something not of reality, intentionally.

 

In this sense, the logic of Nāgārjuna and of the Buddhist tradition more generally can be seen not as inconsistent but paraconsistent

 

 

The only reasoning to reject this stance was described as determination. So the concept of, "no true contradictions except for...(variable)" is still on the table it seems. So I wouldn't jump to saying contradiction is a deal breaker without understanding the variables involved better.

 

Would that be illogical still?

 

I very likely have misinterpreted or failed to understand some things. I also feel like this is off topic and don't want to derail. I think I'll start a new thread on this topic, or look for an existing one. But not right now... I gotta run.

[Avalanche2001]

You can't use a paradox to prove a paradox.

[GeoChair]

This sounds like the plot line of "The Secret". I remember when it came out and people's go-to quote for awhile was, "what the mind can conceive, the body can achieve," and people bought it! Positive thinking, positive thinking everywhere.

[Harold Squared]

Without imagination there is no progress, indeed all of mathematics is a work of imagination, in the sense of abstract concepts, ideas outside our purely sensory experience.

 

But yes, imagination without discipline(another imagined concept) is worthless.

 

Is it surprising or not that we can express such abstractions more precisely to each other than sense perceptions?

 

I struggle to describe sunsets to the blind or symphonies to the deaf but we assume that even intelligent beings not native to this planet can grasp mathematics and so we start from there.

This sounds like the plot line of "The Secret". I remember when it came out and people's go-to quote for awhile was, "what the mind can conceive, the body can achieve," and people bought it! Positive thinking, positive thinking everywhere.

All the positive thinking in the world won't get you out of a concentration camp. I am pretty sure there are other limitations too. On the other hand, pessimism has defeated many who have yet to begin.

I can imagine the earth inside the sun being spun round and around like a marble inside of a balloon with all the people of the earth shouting for joy at the ride they are having...... This of course is impossible for many reasons.

This is a symptom of a truly robust imagination! Lol...

You can't use a paradox to prove a paradox.

The paradox has its function though. By definition, atoms are indivisible, how can they split? Yet they do split, both spontaneously and by our design. Nature cares nothing for our definitions, so we redefine our terms accordingly. And our body of knowledge profits thereby.

 

What was once "impossible" yields vast power both for destruction and beneficial service.

[Ultimate Infinity]

If you imagine it is real because it is part of the conscience realm which although we can not see is as real as our universe

[Moontanman]

If you imagine it is real because it is part of the conscience realm which although we can not see is as real as our universe

 

 

Again you make baseless assertions about things you obviously do not understand...

[Ultimate Infinity]

Again you follow me around and try to prove me wrong because you feel as though you are the man which can not be believed until there is evidence otherwise your are an imbecile according to you anyways

[Moontanman]

Again you follow me around and try to prove me wrong because you feel as though you are the man which can not be believed until there is evidence otherwise your are an imbecile according to you anyways

 

Again with the ad hominem attacks? I do not follow you around as much as I follow ignorance...

[Klaynos]

Again you follow me around and try to prove me wrong because you feel as though you are the man which can not be believed until there is evidence otherwise your are an imbecile according to you anyways

!

Moderator Note

Quit the personal insults.

 

They're against the rules you agreed to when you signed up.

[Ultimate Infinity]

Ya mr. Moderator like I not insulted not site 24/7 and by the way who gets to be moderators any ways

I meant that I am am insulted constantly on this site

[Moontanman]

Ya mr. Moderator like I not insulted not site 24/7 and by the way who gets to be moderators any ways

I meant that I am am insulted constantly on this site

 

 

Pointing out your ignorance of the issues is not insulting you...

[Phi for All]

Again you follow me around

 

!

Moderator Note

Welcome to internet forums! Discussions take place in pockets of mutual attraction and opportunity. All those you accuse of following you around are simply replying to the latest topics for discussion, which you yourself are doing. We try not to make things personal here. Nobody is following you, they're following the discussion you're following.

 

Of course, that's just what I would say if I were following you around....

[John Cuthber]

If you imagine it is real because it is part of the conscience realm which although we can not see is as real as our universe

You resurrected a year old thread to say something which doesn't parse in English.

Did you think that would help?

[ydoaPs]

Ya mr. Moderator like I not insulted not site 24/7 and by the way who gets to be moderators any ways

I meant that I am am insulted constantly on this site

You can apply to be a moderator via PM, but the process takes 8 years before the council votes on the appointment.