Dative

[farah123]

Why can't H4O2+ be formed ? H2O has 2 pair it can form a dative bond to form H3O+ why then the second pair form another dative bond ?

[Enthalpy]

Did you mean H₅O₂⁺?

 

Ions exist in solids and solutions (or in vacuum before they meet matter). In water, H⁺ is always hydrated many times (I have 3 to 5 times as a mean in memory, could be wrong). So H₃O⁺ is already too short; rather a reminder the some H₂O must be accounted if H⁺ goes in a different compound.

[John Cuthber]

I think he means putting two additional protons onto a water molecule.

If I was convinced it wasn't a homework question, I would post an answer.

Remind me in a week (I guess homework would have to be handed in to the teacher by then)

[farah123]

I think he means putting two additional protons onto a water molecule.

If I was convinced it wasn't a homework question, I would post an answer.

Remind me in a week (I guess homework would have to be handed in to the teacher by then)

John i promse you that it's not a homework, i have an exam tomorrow and i still don't know the answer i need, so please ?

Did you mean H₅O₂⁺?

 

Ions exist in solids and solutions (or in vacuum before they meet matter). In water, H⁺ is always hydrated many times (I have 3 to 5 times as a mean in memory, could be wrong). So H₃O⁺ is already too short; rather a reminder the some H₂O must be accounted if H⁺ goes in a different compound.

No not exactly, i mean H4O that has a charge of 2+, you know the dative bond and the pair of electrons ? That's my question.

Edited December 18, 2013 by farah123

[Endy0816]

Pretty good topic about this already:

 

http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/67272-when-water-can-form-an-h30-ion-why-cant-it-form-an-h4o2-ion/

[farah123]

Pretty good topic about this already:

 

http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/67272-when-water-can-form-an-h30-ion-why-cant-it-form-an-h4o2-ion/

I opened this one already but the answers weren't convincing :/

[John Cuthber]

To make H4O ++ you would need to get H+ to stick to H3O+ and the electrostatic repulsion between the two positive charges makes that very unfavourable.

[farah123]

To make H4O ++ you would need to get H+ to stick to H3O+ and the electrostatic repulsion between the two positive charges makes that very unfavourable.

Thank you, unfortunately i already had my exam, but seriously thank you.

Edited December 19, 2013 by farah123