Erik2014 Posted January 22, 2014 Posted January 22, 2014 New idea.Energy source: evaporation - condensation.See the attachment. CO2engl2.pdfRegards Emil Kutin
hypervalent_iodine Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Could you possibly have a go at summarizing your document in the thread?
Erik2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Author Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) "Could you possibly have a go at summarizing your document in the thread?" I'm sorry, I did not understand what you want? Please return back my topic. Edited January 23, 2014 by Erik2014
swansont Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 "Could you possibly have a go at summarizing your document in the thread?" I'm sorry, I did not understand what you want? Please return back my topic. Can you at least post something of an abstract here? Something to whet one's appetite, i.e. to give us a reason to download the document and read it?
Erik2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Author Posted January 23, 2014 Can you at least post something of an abstract here? Something to whet one's appetite, i.e. to give us a reason to download the document and read it? It serves hot sauce Maxwell demons. As a result, you get the calories and solution to the paradox. I hope it suits your needs?
Greg H. Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 It serves hot sauce Maxwell demons. As a result, you get the calories and solution to the paradox. I hope it suits your needs? I had to read this twice to make sure I had read it correctly. What are you talking about?
Erik2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Author Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) I do not know English, I use online translation, so there is a problem in communication. Article translated by a professional translator and I hope that the article is clear. Edited January 23, 2014 by Erik2014
Sensei Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Tell me, please, the work (CO2engl2.pdf) itself is written right? The text of the article is clear? Under standard pressure, normal temperature (on Earth), CO2 dry ice goes directly from solid state to gaseous state skipping liquid state (sublimation) at -79 C. So "bottom liquid CO2" from image C, the most probably, will never happen. Yes, piston would be pushed up. But why on image D it would go back to "squeezed"? Edited January 23, 2014 by Sensei
Endy0816 Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 I think you could use ocean pressure to condense it. Bit extreme but could be done. More concerning is the lack of mention of an external energy source to evaporate it again. Looks like a perpetual motion attempt if I'm understanding it correctly. Could be wrong but what it appears to me as. For the most part the paper itself is readable. Still could use proofreading by someone local. Maybe they could help clarify the meaning as well if we are in fact misunderstanding it.
Erik2014 Posted January 23, 2014 Author Posted January 23, 2014 Under standard pressure, normal temperature (on Earth), CO2 dry ice goes directly from solid state to gaseous state skipping liquid state (sublimation) at -79 C. So "bottom liquid CO2" from image C, the most probably, will never happen. Yes, piston would be pushed up. But why on image D it would go back to "squeezed"? The initial pressure above atmospheric pressure (50bar, +15C), and therefore, the liquid phase is. The piston performs a reciprocating motion, the piston may be connected to the flywheel through a curvilinear rod mechanism, not shown in the figure. I think you could use ocean pressure to condense it. Bit extreme but could be done. More concerning is the lack of mention of an external energy source to evaporate it again. It is possible to implement a heat exchange with the environment. Looks like a perpetual motion attempt if I'm understanding it correctly. Could be wrong but what it appears to me as. You are not mistaken, it should be a perpetual motion machine of the second kind. This engine, which performs the work at the expense of the internal energy the environment or due its self-cooling. For the most part the paper itself is readable. Still could use proofreading by someone local. Maybe they could help clarify the meaning as well if we are in fact misunderstanding it. I think that you understand the job right.
Endy0816 Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Where does the energy for the initial pressure come from? R744 really isn't my favorite refrigerant anyways. R12 or R134a would likely serve you better IMO. CO2 should be left for dry ice systems, deposit free cleaning and possibly Mars exploration. Edited January 23, 2014 by Endy0816
Sensei Posted January 23, 2014 Posted January 23, 2014 The initial pressure above atmospheric pressure (50bar, +15C), and therefore, the liquid phase is. The piston performs a reciprocating motion, the piston may be connected to the flywheel through a curvilinear rod mechanism, not shown in the figure. 50 bar is almost ~50x higher pressure than standard pressure. It's almost pressure that's at 500 meters below sea level in ocean. Water mass is 500 tons per m^2 at such depth. Submarines from II war were squashed at 200... 280 meters, at twice smaller pressure. Pressure will be so high, it's unlikely to push piston back... Normal piston is releasing gas that's inside when it'll go to upper est position, then piston goes in reverse direction, because it's empty and nothing disallows going it in that direction. Then there is injected fuel, and spark is igniting it, and changes liquid to gas which pushes piston again. And everything is repeated. You want to push piston back, without releasing CO2 from inside.
Erik2014 Posted January 24, 2014 Author Posted January 24, 2014 Where does the energy for the initial pressure come from? Starting position can provide battery. R744 really isn't my favorite refrigerant anyways. R12 or R134a would likely serve you better IMO. Yes, any freon - a matter of taste. CO2 should be left for dry ice systems, deposit free cleaning and possibly Mars exploration. As you wish. I do not forbid you. 50 bar is almost ~50x higher pressure than standard pressure. It's almost pressure that's at 500 meters below sea level in ocean. Water mass is 500 tons per m^2 at such depth. Submarines from II war were squashed at 200... 280 meters, at twice smaller pressure. Submarine needed buoyancy in the water. Submarine must be definitely easy to drown. This limits its structural strength. Installing energy generation based on evaporation and condensation processes can stand on the ground and be quite heavy and solid. Pressure will be so high, it's unlikely to push piston back... The validity of the principle should be considered in an ideal system. In an ideal system there are no forces of friction and heat losses. Piston returns to its original position if the work of expansion equal to or greater compression work. The paper shows that the work of expansion more the work compression, see fig.2. Normal piston is releasing gas that's inside when it'll go to upper est position, then piston goes in reverse direction, because it's empty and nothing disallows going it in that direction. Then there is injected fuel, and spark is igniting it, and changes liquid to gas which pushes piston again. And everything is repeated. You want to push piston back, without releasing CO2 from inside. Yes, this is normal.
Endy0816 Posted January 24, 2014 Posted January 24, 2014 (edited) You would need to compress and cool the CO2 to cause it to form a liquid. Then to cause it to expand you will need a heat source and obviously decompression. Heat sink, heat source, equals Carnot cycle. To have it to also move the the piston you are increasing your demand on the environmental heat sink and heat source. In practical terms I would expect minimal useful work out of this setup. Edited January 24, 2014 by Endy0816
Erik2014 Posted January 24, 2014 Author Posted January 24, 2014 (edited) You would need to compress and cool the CO2 to cause it to form a liquid. Then to cause it to expand you will need a heat source and obviously decompression. I mean that CO2 expands adiabatically cooled, thus there is a partial condensation of CO2. Expansion takes place under the pressure of CO2 and CO2 cooling (condensation of CO2) is a consequence of the adiabatic expansion of CO2. Unfortunately, I did not understand about what you wrote on. But you also do not seem to understand ... Edited January 24, 2014 by Erik2014
Endy0816 Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 To find ideal efficiency your graph should look roughly like this: I don't know any better way to explain it. What you have is the very rough CO2 equivalent of a steam engine. Energy from Evaporation - Condensation has been around for a long while. Eyeballing it, your graph seems to be missing a pressure drop between B and C. 1
Erik2014 Posted January 26, 2014 Author Posted January 26, 2014 Eyeballing it, your graph seems to be missing a pressure drop between B and C. In the transition from position B to position C (Fig. 1) the CO2 condensate drops down beneath a bobber - thermal insulator. B and C are shown for clarity, improved perception, better understanding. Pressure at passage B to C is not changed for this logical model. The point of this paper is to show that the evaporation and condensation in an adiabatic process of expansion and contraction can be used as a renewable and environmentally friendly source of energy.
Erik2014 Posted February 22, 2014 Author Posted February 22, 2014 (edited) I edited the article. http://www.youblisher.com/p/825780-Energy-source-evaporation-condensation-Edited-version/Regards, Emil Kutin Edited February 22, 2014 by Erik2014
Erik2014 Posted March 13, 2014 Author Posted March 13, 2014 Editing 12 March http://www.youblisher.com/p/838827-Energy-source-evaporation-condensation-Edited-version-2/Regards, Emil Kutin
Erik2014 Posted March 26, 2014 Author Posted March 26, 2014 (edited) Editing by March 26, 2014 http://www.youblisher.com/p/850885-Energy-source-evaporation-condensation-Edited-version-2/ Or see attachment: CO2engl_01.jpg, CO2engl_02.jpg, CO2engl_03.jpg - 1, 2, 3 the pages. Regards, Emil Kutin P. S. Link 12 March invalid. Edited March 26, 2014 by Erik2014
Erik2014 Posted April 20, 2014 Author Posted April 20, 2014 (edited) First page jpg-format here (CO2engl2_01.jpg). Or see (all pages pdf-format): http://www.youblisher.com/p/871437-Energy-source-evaporation-condensation-Editing-on-April-20-2014/ Edited April 20, 2014 by Erik2014
Erik2014 Posted January 19, 2022 Author Posted January 19, 2022 Hello! Humanity can make up for the lack of energy and at the same time maintain the ecological balance of the native planet. How to do it? The answer is offered on three pages. This is a real chance. CO2red3engl.pdf Thank you for your attention.
exchemist Posted January 19, 2022 Posted January 19, 2022 4 minutes ago, Erik2014 said: Hello! Humanity can make up for the lack of energy and at the same time maintain the ecological balance of the native planet. How to do it? The answer is offered on three pages. This is a real chance. CO2red3engl.pdf 2.74 MB · 0 downloads Thank you for your attention. You've already done this, haven't you, 8 years ago? What do you hope to gain by repeating it?
Phi for All Posted January 19, 2022 Posted January 19, 2022 34 minutes ago, Erik2014 said: How to do it? The answer is offered on three pages. ! Moderator Note Identical topics merged. Please give us an overview, since members must be able to participate without downloading anything or leaving the site. Please explain how you've addressed the previous concerns.
Erik2014 Posted January 20, 2022 Author Posted January 20, 2022 Hello! Humanity can make up for the lack of energy and at the same time maintain the ecological balance of the native planet. How to do it? The answer is offered on three pages. This is a real chance. Thank you for your attention. Little edit, sorry. CO2red3engl.pdf
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