Missing Malaysia 777 flight...

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

This morning on the news 'they' said a pilot can not only disable the transponder by pulling a fuse, but they can do the same for the flight recorders.

Yeah; when a guy hijacked a FedEx flight to commit suicide, he tried to disable the cockpit voice recorder before takeoff by flipping the circuit breaker. The pilots noticed and turned it back on:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Express_Flight_705

[swansont]

It's probably a good thing to be able to turn off a piece of equipment if it's faulty and might be a fire hazard. I read this morning that's for the transponder it's not even a matter of pulling a fuse — there's a a knob on the control panel. The article spent a paragraph explaining how you turn the dial to the off position. (because turning a dial two or three clicks counter-clockwise is probably outside the experience of most readers)

[Spyman]

But for to completely turn off the ACARS you would need expert knowledge and access to the electronics bay below cockpit.

 

The hijackers didn't likely know about this, so now we have a trace to where they might be, still a big search area though.

 

But to turn off the other part of the ACARS, it would be necessary to go to an electronics bay beneath the cockpit. Thats something a pilot wouldnt normally know how to do, Goglia said, and it wasnt done in the case of the Malaysia plane. Thus, the ACARS transmitter continued to send out blips that were recorded by the Inmarsat satellite once an hour for four to five hours after the transponder was turned off. The blips dont contain any messages or data, but the satellite can tell in a very broad way what region the blips are coming from and adjusts the angle of its antenna to be ready to receive message in case the ACARS sends them. Investigators are now trying to use data from the satellite to identify the region where the plane was when its last blip was sent.

http://www.nst.com.my/latest/font-color-red-missing-mh370-font-3-pieces-of-evidence-point-to-jet-s-takeover-1.515830

 

Possible last known locations of MH370 in red, based on final satellite ping at 08:11 Malaysia time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines_Flight_370

 

The only possible location to land slightly secret in the south path seems to be at the small Christmas Island Airport, but if they had I think they should have been revealed by now, so if the plane is still intact then they likely took the north path.

[michel123456]

Is it possible that the airplane remained flying without any pilot alive?

[swansont]

Is it possible that the airplane remained flying without any pilot alive?

 

The reports I've seen say they flew to successive waypoints, which means someone with reasonable flight experience was at the controls.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/14/us-malaysia-airlines-radar-exclusive-idUSBREA2D0DG20140314

 

But, as one might expect, other reports are saying that this may not be the case.

[Popcorn Sutton]

Can you guys check satellite footage? That was my suggestion. All other arguments seem like conspiracy theories at this point.

With respect to my location, at least.

[swansont]

Can you guys check satellite footage? That was my suggestion. All other arguments seem like conspiracy theories at this point.

With respect to my location, at least.

 

You need a satellite looking there, and in order to resolve something like a plane the image are will be small, so you need to know where to look.

 

I expect satellites are set to pass over as little ocean as possible, because there's no point in surveilling random patches of ocean. So you would have to be lucky. Then, you'd have to search lots of images because you need to be zoomed way in.

 

And I doubt any of "us guys" have access to these images.

[Cap'n Refsmmat]

Since the disappearance, various commercial satellite imagery providers have started searching sections of the ocean. But it's pretty damn big. There's a website where you can view the images and tag anything interesting you spot:

 

http://www.tomnod.com/nod/challenge/mh370_indian_ocean

 

Many people have already looked, but there's plenty of ocean to scan.

[Spyman]

In the news on the radio they said that satellites have found two large pieces of wreckage that could be from the airplane, somewhere in the Indian Ocean.

 

Ships are said to currently be on their way there to investigate but they had a long way to travel so it will take several hours before they can confirm it.

 

[EDIT] Found this article in Daily News:

 

Supposed objects from missing Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 being investigated

John Young, manager of Australian Maritime Safety Authoritys emergency response division, said two objects one being almost 80 feet long have been spotted in the Indian Ocean using satellite imagery. Military search planes were dispatched to investigate.

 

 

 

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2-objects-missing-malaysia-airlines-jet-australian-pm-article-1.1727548

Edited March 20, 2014 by Spyman

[Popcorn Sutton]

 

You need a satellite looking there, and in order to resolve something like a plane the image are will be small, so you need to know where to look.

 

I expect satellites are set to pass over as little ocean as possible, because there's no point in surveilling random patches of ocean. So you would have to be lucky. Then, you'd have to search lots of images because you need to be zoomed way in.

 

And I doubt any of "us guys" have access to these images.

I was informed that military personnel, specifically submarine squads, do have access to live satellite imagery, so I somewhat assumed that you guys (the moderators and administrators) may also have access. Cap'n cleared it up.

[Delbert]

I'm somewhat puzzled by the reports and the apparent scenario of what seems to have happened. MH370 reportedly turned around and headed back over land. This aircraft then being wildly off course with transponders switched off and not responding to traffic control was apparently tracked by the military, so why weren't fighter jets scrambled to intercept?

 

If nothing else, it seems a big hole in their defence system.

[Delbert]

Just read a newspaper report this morning that MH370 was carrying a consignment lithium-ion batteries in its hold.

[I-try]

According to information just supplied by a person whom has flown that aircraft, there is a control available to pilots to switch off the transponder in an emergency such as a fire. However, it requires a knowledge of how to do the switching off. All pilots flying that aircraft would know the procedure.

Judging from satellite information, there has been four detection of similar sized and number of floating objects in the southern part of the Indian Ocean. Drift indicating buoys have been dropped for close to seven days, and therefore the direction and rate of drift should be known to provide accurate predictions of where an object could be expected to be found.

However and if each detection is of a large whale and half grown calf, they might eventually realise that they have information regarding a portion of the return of a whale to its winter feeding area. With regards to the apparent total disappearance of that aircraft and no claims of responsibility or indications of wreckage on land or afloat on water, then world authorities should expect the eventual return of that aircraft with malicious intent.

[Delbert]

With regards to the apparent total disappearance of that aircraft and no claims of responsibility or indications of wreckage on land or afloat on water, then world authorities should expect the eventual return of that aircraft with malicious intent.

Doubtless that's one of the scenarios on the long list.

 

Frankly and as said, I find it difficult to believe there was no military intervention with, what was then, an unidentified aircraft with transponders turned off having turned around and flying back over land. Perhaps a similar situation here in the UK might be visualised, whereby an aircraft turned around and flew back over land with transponders turned off instead of continuing on its journey. Doubtless Typhoons would scrambled with a direct line to the PM's office requesting orders whether or not to shoot the thing down.

 

A friend of mine with a son on the navy says they are 'pinging' aircraft all the time for friend or foe.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Delbert

[swansont]

Doubtless that's one of the scenarios on the long list.

 

Frankly and as said, I find it difficult to believe there was no military intervention with, what was then, an unidentified aircraft with transponders turned off having turned around and flying back over land. Perhaps a similar situation here in the UK might be visualised, whereby an aircraft turned around and flew back over land with transponders turned off instead of continuing on its journey. Doubtless Typhoons would scrambled with a direct line to the PM's office requesting orders whether or not to shoot the thing down.

 

A friend of mine with a son on the navy says they are 'pinging' aircraft all the time for friend or foe.

 

That assumes a certain level of military capability. Is there evidence that such capability actually exists? Malaysia had a 2012 defense budget of around US $4.7 billion. Compare with the UK's at $61 billion.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures

 

The Malaysian military has about half as many active duty personnel as the UK (110,000 vs 205,000). I'm guessing that's a huge chunk of the budget right there.

[Delbert]

As for what happened, if it was a technical failure it seems a remarkable coincidence to have occurred just at the point of maximum confusion between one air traffic control and another.

 

For me there maybe a fair possibility those lithium-ion batteries reported to be in the cargo hold produced smoke or fire causing flight crew to switch things off and turn back. Toxic fumes then pervaded the craft, which doubtless incapacitated everyone on board, leaving the plane to continue on autopilot.

 

There, that's my thoughts - I await to be shown to be wrong

 

But if that's the case and in view of the trouble the 787 Dreamliner had with those batteries, how or why on earth could they allow the things to be in the cargo hold of an aircraft?

[John Cuthber]

As for what happened, if it was a technical failure it seems a remarkable coincidence to have occurred just at the point of maximum confusion between one air traffic control and another.

 

For me there maybe a fair possibility those lithium-ion batteries reported to be in the cargo hold produced smoke or fire causing flight crew to switch things off and turn back. Toxic fumes then pervaded the craft, everyone on board, leaving the plane to continue on autopilot.

 

There, that's my thoughts - I await to be shown to be wrong

 

But if that's the case and in view of the trouble the 787 Dreamliner had with those batteries, how or why on earth could they allow the things to be in the cargo hold of an aircraft?

"which doubtless incapacitated"

Nobody on Earth knows what happend, yet your guess is "doubtless".

[Spyman]

Malaysian prime minister: Missing flight MH370 ended in Indian Ocean and no one on board survived

/snip/

Mr Najib explained that new satellite data showed the Malaysian Airlines plane had flown through the southern corridor in the Indian Ocean, where its journey ended.

/snip/

It is still unclear whether any wreckage has actually been recovered although searches are still ongoing...

http://metro.co.uk/2014/03/24/malaysian-prime-minister-missing-flight-mh370-ended-in-indian-ocean-and-no-one-on-board-survived-4676844/

 

So, it's likely that the plane got hijacked, turned around and flied straight out over open water with nowhere to land for several hours until it ran out of fuel and then crashed into the ocean.

 

Why would anyone do this?

 

- If all they wanted was to crash the plane and kill the passengers, then why continue flying for several hours?

- If it was an act of terrorism then why have they not released any political statements?

- If it was a criminal attempt then why has there not been any demand for ransom?

 

The only logical explanation I can think of is that they, for some still unknown reason, wanted the plane to disappear mysteriously without any trace but the satellite pings gave away their last location and ruined the scheme.

 

Hopefully the black box will be found and contain enough data to provide a thorough explanation.

[michel123456]

My thoughts go towards the 20 passengers who were employees of Freescale Semiconductor, a company based in Austin, Texas

 

see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines_Flight_370#Passengers

and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freescale_Semiconductor

 

A company that produces technology for transponders. Can that be a coincidence?

As I go deeper, I am afraid many conspiracy theories will rise from this tragic incident.

 

For example:

One of the passenger was a China telecom executive who returned from Kuala Lumpur after signing the construction and maintenance agreement for future Sea-Me-We-5. Knowing that there are accusations from French operator Orange against NSA having tapped the Sea-Me-We-4, we have all the ingredients for a new James-Bond-Spying-Game-like story.

 

Sources

http://www.fiercetelecom.com/story/freescale-huawei-zte-employees-among-malaysia-airlines-flight-370-passenger/2014-03-10

Employees of several Asia Pacific-based communications service providers and vendors were aboard Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 at the time of its disappearance, including Huawei, competitor ZTE, U.S. company Freescale Semiconductor, and reportedly, China Telecom.

Two executives from Huawei, an employee of ZTE, and 20 employees of Freescale were on board the flight, their respective companies confirmed on Saturday.

Updated: According to Sunil Tagare of BuySellBandwidth, Hualian "Happy" Zhang, vice president of network planning for China Telecom Global, was also aboard, listed on the manifest as passenger number 207.

China Telecom has not officially confirmed that Zhang was aboard the flight. Tagare said he obtained the information from contacts at China Telecom.

Zhang was reportedly returning from Kuala Lumpur after signing the construction and maintenance agreement for Sea-Me-We-5, the planned submarine cable which will stretch 20,000 km from Singapore to Europe.

 

http://www.fiercetelecom.com/story/nsa-taps-seamewe-4-cable-system-orange-threatens-suit/2014-01-02

 

Nevertheless, i don't think it was intended for the plane to crash. You don't kill hundred of people just like that. I am more tented to believe it is a failure of some sort. An accident.

[Spyman]

It would have to be a very remarkable accident if several individual systems goes off but the plane remains able to change course and continue to fly for more than seven hours. As I understand it those maneuvers was made by skilled pilots and if there was a problem but the plane could still be steered, then the pilots should opt to make an emergency landing where search and rescue would be swift and practical.

 

It's certainly possible with a failed hijack, but even so, why choose and continue to fly in that direction?

 

Regarding murderous intent, the 9/11 event clearly showed that hundreds of people can be killed just like that.

[Delbert]

"which doubtless incapacitated"

Nobody on Earth knows what happend, yet your guess is "doubtless".

I used the word doubtless following my suggestion about fumes from those lithium-ion batteries. Which I think is not an unreasonable conclusion following possible toxic fumes from such.

 

If the crew and passengers weren't incapacitated, I'd have thought the plane may have performed a more circuitous path consequential to possible human conflict.

 

Anyway, I only offered a possible scenario. The fly in my suggestion, I have thought, is the apparent absence of a mayday call before, during or immediately after the apparent change of direction. Not having time to put out a mayday would seem to be an objection to my suggestion and perhaps point more to a hijacking. But it seems a strange hijacking to fly in an apparent straight line uninterrupted and not deflected by the consequence of conflict.

[michel123456]

A common factor of large disasters is that there is not a single cause but an accumulation of causes. Sometimes human error combined with faulty equipment and wathever.

I find no reason to kill that many people without any claim.

If it was a hijack, it is a failure.

Anyway I don't see anyone having won anything from this event. It is lose-lose situation.

[Delbert]

Anyway I don't see anyone having won anything from this event. It is lose-lose situation.

Seem to recall someone suggesting such disappearance wasn't just a game changer, but a world changer. Presumably the world changer suggestion was made should a scenario or cause cannot be established.

[Delbert]

So, the black box 'pings' were a mirage - apparently produced by their own ships!

 

Noticed a interviewee commenting on the TV today suggesting that even if the various bodies involved were even half asleep, action would've been taken within minutes following the non acquisition by the Vietnamese air traffic control after leaving Malaysian control.

 

For me, and as I think I mentioned somewhere else on this forum, upon the reported acquisition by the Malaysian military radar of an unidentified substantial flying object, why weren't jets scrambled?

 

A complete shambles, if you ask me.

[swansont]

So, the black box 'pings' were a mirage - apparently produced by their own ships!

 

Noticed a interviewee commenting on the TV today suggesting that even if the various bodies involved were even half asleep, action would've been taken within minutes following the non acquisition by the Vietnamese air traffic control after leaving Malaysian control.

 

For me, and as I think I mentioned somewhere else on this forum, upon the reported acquisition by the Malaysian military radar of an unidentified substantial flying object, why weren't jets scrambled?

 

A complete shambles, if you ask me.

 

I'm sorry, when/where was acquisition by Malaysian military radar confirmed? Does the US, UK or other countries routinely scramble jets at every UFO sighting?