Gay animals

[Mr.Zurich92]

They say gay animal do exist. Well, this means there are male animals who are 100% attracted to other males and show no sexual interest for females. Ok, but when we look at gorillas or chimpansees male homosexuality is not seen realy. When you talk about gay chimpansees, we are talking about a chimpansee which only wants to have sexual intercourse with other males. But there aren't such chimpansees.

 

 

I have never heard about a gay brown bear!

 

I saw in CNN about a gay Pinguin couple. But this gay Pinguin couple break up and find later other females for procreating and child parenting. So I would be a little bit careful when you talk about ''gay Pinguins''!

Edited September 11, 2014 by Mr.Zurich92

[Fuzzwood]

And this discussion would be about.... ?

Edited September 11, 2014 by Fuzzwood

[Mr.Zurich92]

Why there isn't realy homosexuality found in the animal world while in human homosexuality clearly exist. I don't understand that.

 

Gorillas and chimpansees are genetic most similar to humans. But clear homosexuality is not seen by them.

 

 

Only in sheep this is seen. In sheep 7 % to 8% of male sheep had clearly only sexual interests for other males and zero interest for ewes.

Edited September 11, 2014 by Mr.Zurich92

[Ten oz]

Why there isn't realy homosexuality found in the animal world while in human homosexuality clearly exist. I don't understand that.

 

Gorillas and chimpansees are genetic most similar to humans. But clear homosexuality is not seen by them.

 

 

Only in sheep this is seen. In sheep 7 % to 8% of male sheep had clearly only sexual interests for other males and zero interest for ewes.

I am not a zoologist but have had pets (cats, dogs, rabbits) throughout mylife. If you consider performing sexual acts of another of the same gender to a homosexual or lesbian act than I would agrue that every pet I have ever had were gay. Whether it's male dogs trying to mount each other or my leg. So I am not sure what your criteria here is?

[Skeptic134]

I am not a zoologist but have had pets (cats, dogs, rabbits) throughout mylife. If you consider performing sexual acts of another of the same gender to a homosexual or lesbian act than I would agrue that every pet I have ever had were gay. Whether it's male dogs trying to mount each other or my leg. So I am not sure what your criteria here is?

 

I think he is referring to exclusive homosexual activity vs bisexual activity.

[Ten oz]

I think he is referring to exclusive homosexual activity vs bisexual activity.

 

What about exclusive heterosexual behavior? For example, if dogs are bisexual what does that speak to?

[StringJunky]

Exclusive homosexual behaviour apparently occurs in about 10% of male rams.

 

 

One species in which exclusive homosexual orientation occurs, however, is that of domesticated sheep (Ovis aries).^[8][9] "About 10% of rams (males) refuse to mate with ewes (females) but do readily mate with other rams."^[9]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals

[Skeptic134]

What about exclusive heterosexual behavior? For example, if dogs are bisexual what does that speak to?

 

I don't know... all I can tell is the OP was something about exclusive homosexuality in different species, he hasn't provided many sources though, other than it occurs in rams.

[Mr.Zurich92]

I'm talking about exclusiv homosexuality in animals! Correct!

 

I do not get a boner when I see naked women or faces of women and this is exclusive homosexuality. I also observed that male homosexuality is very common in humans.

 

 

If a rind only gets a boner when he is next to another rind and want to mate other rind and the same time shows ZERO sexual interests for other cows(female) this was exclusive homosexuality. I have never heard of such rinds.

 

 

Male rats which are treaten with anti-androgens right after brith aren't able to get an erection later as adults when they stay next to other female rats! That's a kind of exclusive homosexuality.

 

Why male homosexuality is so common in humans? Are there any medicaments used which causes that?

 

Or has it to do because humans are able to influence their hormone levels psychologically? Let's say a mother changes their hormon levels in the blood only through thinking during pregnancy. In humans adrenal hormon levels are highly influenced psychologically. the fetus is affected!

Edited September 12, 2014 by Mr.Zurich92

[Ten oz]

Exclusivetivity is not a standard in nature. Many humans are exclusive between each other for life but that is not the case for all mammals. Not even always the case for humans. Many mammals play the odds. Mate with everything and anything they can until something winds up pregnant. Defining sexual behavior as any one thing is a human thing. It doesn't universal apply throughout nature in the same terms.

[Mr.Zurich92]

Exclusivetivity is not a standard in nature. Many humans are exclusive between each other for life but that is not the case for all mammals. Not even always the case for humans. Many mammals play the odds. Mate with everything and anything they can until something winds up pregnant. Defining sexual behavior as any one thing is a human thing. It doesn't universal apply throughout nature in the same terms.

I guess you are heterosexual man? I hardly believe you get attracted to men even once!

 

I'm pretty sure you have never got a boner cause of another man and you will never get a boner cause of a man. So sexual orientation IS exclusive!

Edited September 12, 2014 by Mr.Zurich92

[Ten oz]

I guess you are heterosexual man? I hardly believe you get attracted to men even once!

 

I'm pretty sure you have never got a boner cause of another man and you will never get a boner cause of a man. So sexual orientation IS exclusive!

.....but that is not the standard. By the human definition many mammals are bisexual and few mate for life with an exclusive partner. Edited September 12, 2014 by Ten oz

[iNow]

See also this thread I created back 6 years ago: http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/33922-homosexuality-in-the-animal-kingdom/

[Ophiolite]

They say gay animal do exist. Well, this means there are male animals who are 100% attracted to other males and show no sexual interest for females.

Your definition of gay is faulty. Gay refers to a strong preference for homosexual relationships, not an exclusive interest in them. Homosexual refers, as the name suggests, to any sexual relations between members of the same sex, regardless of whether or not this is a unique event for the participants.

 

Since your opening statement is faulty the rest of your post becomes meaningless.

 

Ok, but when we look at gorillas or chimpansees male homosexuality is not seen realy. When you talk about gay chimpansees, we are talking about a chimpansee which only wants to have sexual intercourse with other males. But there aren't such chimpansees.

Researchers into primate sexual behaviour rarely, if ever speak of gay gorillas, or chimpanzees. They speak of homosexual behaviour. Are you wanting to talk about this subject in a loose, colloquial way, or in a precise scientific way?

 

In that context you may wish to consider, as a starting point, the following:

 

Yamagiwa, J."Intra- and inter-group interactions of an all-male group of virunga mountain gorillas (Gorilla gorilla beringei)" Primates January 1987, Volume 28, Issue 1, pp 1-30

 

Abstract

Six unrelated male gorillas formed an all-male group within the Virunga mountain gorilla population. Frequent homosexual interactions characterized the high cohesiveness of this group. Such homosexual behavior reduced the inter-individual distances and increased the social tension between the two silverbacks in the group. The silverbacks retained “ownership” of the homosexual partners, but competed and fought with each other violently when the partners avoided or ignored their courtship. Neither submissive nor reassurance behavior was noted between the silverbacks. Thus, their relationships may not be explained in terms of dominance and subordinancy. However, the loser-support and mediating behavior observed in the group prevented them from engaging in severe fights. Aggression was always directed from the elder and dominant males to the younger and subordinate males, while supporting interactions occurred in the opposite direction. The blackbacks frequently supported the subadult aggressees by attacking the silverbacks, and the younger males displayed mediating behavior in violent fights between the silverbacks. The group's ranging was influenced by encounters with neighboring social units. The members avoided contact with other units and shifted their range after several encounters. On the other hand, when and after a subadult male had immigrated into their group, they frequently encountered other units and did not move away from the encounter site. An all-male group may not be a favorable unit for females to transfer to, but may be profitable for maturing males to associate with. Its formation is probably related to recent social change in the Virunga gorilla population.

 

There are plenty of examples out there. You only had to look. You didn't. That was unscientific.

 

I have never heard about a gay brown bear!

And there are dozens, scores, probably hundreds of species in which homosexual behaviour is either common, or known.

 

So I would be a little bit careful when you talk about ''gay Pinguins''!

I agree. Although most penguins are illiterate, some may object to being misspelled.

[Mr.Zurich92]

Gay means to be sexually interested to the same sex. I'm gay but do not have interest to have an relationship with another man. Despite that, I don't get horny cause of women.

 

 

The gay ram studies are the only studies of homosexuality in animals I believe to be well done. Also those differences in sexual dimorphic nuclei of gay rams compared to hetero rams is fascinating. It's not easy to do such studies with chimpansees or gorillas, because they often have sex just for fun and it doesn't mean they are really attracted to the same sex. I also could have sexual intercourse with women just for fun, but I don't get really horny!

Edited September 13, 2014 by Mr.Zurich92

[Ophiolite]

I am interested in discussing science, not personal opinions. Good luck with your thread.

[iNow]

Given the tone and nature of the OPs replies, I'm doubtful this will help, but just in case... And for clarity:

 

 

 

 

This is not exactly rocket science. It's too bad social and cultural ignorance so often come reinforced and exaggerated by intellectual and logical ignorance.

[Ten oz]

Gay means to be sexually interested to the same sex. I'm gay but do not have interest to have an relationship with another man. Despite that, I don't get horny cause of women.

 

 

The gay ram studies are the only studies of homosexuality in animals I believe to be well done. Also those differences in sexual dimorphic nuclei of gay rams compared to hetero rams is fascinating. It's not easy to do such studies with chimpansees or gorillas, because they often have sex just for fun and it doesn't mean they are really attracted to the same sex. I also could have sexual intercourse with women just for fun, but I don't get really horny!

I think conceptually you are mistaken in trying to compare human sexuality directly against animal sexuality. Sex serves a slightly different purpose amongst all societies of animals and behaviors vary. A male Quoll for example savages multiple females during mating season. Many females die has a result. While an albatrosses practices peaceful courtships that lead to life long mating relationships. Human sexuality to Rams or any other animal's sexuality isn't an apples to apples comparison.

[Moontanman]

They say gay animal do exist. Well, this means there are male animals who are 100% attracted to other males and show no sexual interest for females. Ok, but when we look at gorillas or chimpansees male homosexuality is not seen realy. When you talk about gay chimpansees, we are talking about a chimpansee which only wants to have sexual intercourse with other males. But there aren't such chimpansees.

 

 

I have never heard about a gay brown bear!

 

I saw in CNN about a gay Pinguin couple. But this gay Pinguin couple break up and find later other females for procreating and child parenting. So I would be a little bit careful when you talk about ''gay Pinguins''!

 

 

Why do you assume that homosexuality precludes having sex with someone of the opposite gender? I know many homosexuals, both male and female and all of them have had sex with someone of the opposite gender at some point.

 

Being homosexual means that your preferred sexual partner is some one of the same sex it does not mean you cannot have sex with any but those of the same gender.

 

Sexual preference is not a white or black on or off proposition. Sexuality is a spectrum of sexual preferences...

[Mr.Zurich92]

 

 

Why do you assume that homosexuality precludes having sex with someone of the opposite gender? I know many homosexuals, both male and female and all of them have had sex with someone of the opposite gender at some point.

 

Being homosexual means that your preferred sexual partner is some one of the same sex it does not mean you cannot have sex with any but those of the same gender.

 

Sexual preference is not a white or black on or off proposition. Sexuality is a spectrum of sexual preferences...

I have never said a that. Haven't you read my posts?

 

I d not believe their is true bisexuality in men. I don't believe there is any man in the world, who can get horny cause of both gender. Of course ''I believe'', otherwise I want to see the proof that there are bisexual men.

[Ten oz]

I have never said a that. Haven't you read my posts?

 

I d not believe their is true bisexuality in men. I don't believe there is any man in the world, who can get horny cause of both gender. Of course ''I believe'', otherwise I want to see the proof that there are bisexual men.

You are using getting "horny" as a standard of some sort and I don't understand what you mean. My cat get "horny" and attempts to have sex with my house shoes when I leave out. Many of dogs have gotten "horny" at first sight of my legs. The sensation of being horny is hormonal more than it is conscious.

[Ophiolite]

I d not believe their is true bisexuality in men. I don't believe there is any man in the world, who can get horny cause of both gender. Of course ''I believe'', otherwise I want to see the proof that there are bisexual men.

Science (and bisexual men) have no interest in your beliefs. This is a science forum. Personal beliefs and biases have no place here.

[Moontanman]

I have never said a that. Haven't you read my posts?

 

I d not believe their is true bisexuality in men. I don't believe there is any man in the world, who can get horny cause of both gender. Of course ''I believe'', otherwise I want to see the proof that there are bisexual men.

 

 

I was using humans as an example, you were using chimps nonetheless you are incorrect..

[MonDie]

I forgot that I wanted to post this.

 

fruitless Splicing Specifies Male Courtship Behavior in Drosophila (Demir and Dickson, 2005) - Cell vol. 121

http://www.cell.com/cell/fulltext/S0092-8674%2805%2900407-1

 

"Remarkably, fru^M and fru^Δtra females court wild-type females [...] they perform the male courtship ritual, and, like normal males, direct their courtship toward females (Demir and Dickson, 2005)."

 

It's hard to imagine how these mutations could persist unless they're advantageous in males, but it shows that it can happen. Furthermore, mutations that cause this should be very rare unless there are many different genes that converge on the same pathway.

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I have never said a that. Haven't you read my posts?

 

I d not believe their is true bisexuality in men. I don't believe there is any man in the world, who can get horny cause of both gender. Of course ''I believe'', otherwise I want to see the proof that there are bisexual men.

 

Given the research I've read, some men may be more bisexual than others. However, research with the penile plethysmograph does suggest that true bisexuality is like true ambidexterity, everybody has a preference one way or the other, regardless what their subjective reports say.

 

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Returning the 17th, for the third time, MonDie!!!

Edited October 6, 2014 by MonDie

[MonDie]

It's burning me up inside!!

 

Sexual arousal patterns of bisexual men. (Rieger, Chivers, Bailey)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16102058

 

Sexual arousal patterns of bisexual men revisited (Rosenthal, Sylva, Safron, Bailey)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21763395

 

They do exist.