Concepts of Infinity and Random

[Buych778]

I cannot find any way possible to prove any of these two concepts to exist in our three dimensional world. So, therefore I would like someone to prove that either one or both of these concepts actually exist in our three dimensional world.

 

My only way that I can prove the concept of infinity would be a transition between dimensions. For instance, if you have a 2D square, and cut all of it into 1D lines, which is not physically possible, only theoretically, you would obtain infinite 1D lines, as they have no width to remove from the 2D square.

[Tzurain]

I'm sorry to stray from your request, for what I have in mind is to disapprove the existence of Infinity and Random.

 

In my perspective, everything is calculated, and had been placed in an order. What happens has happened, and what will happen, will happen. Denying the future is denying destiny, but we human beings, do not know much of what will happen. However, what we human Can do is accept events that have happened, which was once a possibility from the past.

Here's an example. A ball drops from the table onto the ground. There is no denying this, the ball drops from the table to the ground. However, Before the ball dropped from the table to the ground, it was only a possibility.

The question poses "Will the ball drop from the ground?"

If the question was conspired before the ball from the ground, we can honestly say "We have no idea".
But if the question was conspired AFTER the event, we can honestly say "Yes, the ball Will drop to the ground" Thus, the possibility of the initial question is now a certainty, and not of something that is random.

"We have been given the theory of the right to brag vainly about
both our "infinitely" expanding dream and our sketched future.
The two hands of the clock point out the "finite" factor. " --- Anonymous quote

We sometimes say knowledge and love is infinite. Never having a limit.

In my perspective, it is just an exaggeration, as both the highest point of knowledge and love are ones that are not within our grasp.

Imagine the peak of a mountain no one can reach. For some, the peak is infinity, as no matter how much you climb, you will never reach the top. However,

the mountain has a definite height all the same, just too far for one to reach.

The climb to the top of the mountain can be infinity, if the climber never stops, however I can assure you this, the climber will stop, at a moment in its time.
(In real world situations, that is)

These thoughts are indeed thought-provoking and fun, and I have been thoroughly amused from the topic. Thank you ^^

(Maybe random may not exist, but I will use the term a lot anyway x3)
(#Random)

Ah, I only realized this was in the mathematical section, as I found this topic in the "Recent Topic" section. As for that, I assume you would prefer a mathematical formula or equation to be in accordance to the Theory of Infinity and Random.

Due to that ,I sincerely apologize. x3

But the concept you pose is also a scientific and a real-based one. After all, what is maths, but a concept, to help us understand reality better? :3

Edited September 29, 2014 by Tzurain

[Strange]

I cannot find any way possible to prove any of these two concepts to exist in our three dimensional world.

 

I'm not sure it is (or ever will be) possible to prove it either way.

 

If the universe is infinite, then it is an example that proves that infinity exists. Butt if it isn't, then it might prove that there is nothing infinite.

If space is continuous then it can be infinitely subdivided. But if it isn't ...

 

Quantum effects appear to be random (for example, it is impossible to say which radium atom will decay next). But it might be that there is an underlying theory that will show them not to be.

[Buych778]

Ah, I only realized this was in the mathematical section, as I found this topic in the "Recent Topic" section. As for that, I assume you would prefer a mathematical formula or equation to be in accordance to the Theory of Infinity and Random.

Due to that ,I sincerely apologize. x3

 

But the concept you pose is also a scientific and a real-based one. After all, what is maths, but a concept, to help us understand reality better? :3

 

You don't have to apologize, I wasn't just referring to random and infinity in mathematical terms, I was also trying to get answers scientifically.

 

Due to my research, I have concluded that the universe cannot be infinite, as it would not be mathematically possible.

If the universe was infinitely sized, that would mean that the amount of inhabited planets and uninhabited planets would both be infinite. To find the percent of inhabited planets, you would divide the number of inhabited planets by the total number of planets, which would be infinity divided by infinity. If the equation were mathematically possible, which it is not, but if it were, the answer would be 1, which would imply that 100% of planets are inhabited. The same would go for uninhabited planets, therefore creating a paradox which can only be solved by having all numbers to the equation being finite. This concept can be implied in any situation, therefore making the physical, 'Infinity' impossible. However, the theoretical possibility of infinity can exist as a way to describe numbers, as 1/3 would be exactly described as zero point three repeated to infinity, implying that it never ends, which would make infinity a concept, not an exact number.

[imatfaal]

 

You don't have to apologize, I wasn't just referring to random and infinity in mathematical terms, I was also trying to get answers scientifically.

 

Due to my research, I have concluded that the universe cannot be infinite, as it would not be mathematically possible.

If the universe was infinitely sized, that would mean that the amount of inhabited planets and uninhabited planets would both be infinite. To find the percent of inhabited planets, you would divide the number of inhabited planets by the total number of planets, which would be infinity divided by infinity. If the equation were mathematically possible, which it is not, but if it were, the answer would be 1, which would imply that 100% of planets are inhabited. The same would go for uninhabited planets, therefore creating a paradox which can only be solved by having all numbers to the equation being finite. This concept can be implied in any situation, therefore making the physical, 'Infinity' impossible. However, the theoretical possibility of infinity can exist as a way to describe numbers, as 1/3 would be exactly described as zero point three repeated to infinity, implying that it never ends, which would make infinity a concept, not an exact number.

 

 

 

"If the equation were mathematically possible, which it is not, but if it were, the answer would be 1, which would imply that 100% of planets are inhabited."

 

There's your problem! You cannot speculate on a simple answer to a calculation that is undefined. Mixing infinity with Natural numbers in simple arithmetic can be fraught with problems. Your last sentence is much nicer and gets closer to some of the ideas of infinity; infinity is not just a very large number.

[studiot]

 

I cannot find any way possible to prove any of these two concepts to exist in our three dimensional world.

 

 

I assume that you are observing that the terms random and infinity are abstract nouns, which have an existence in their own right, and inquiring if they possess a manifestation as a concrete noun in our material world?

 

Since discussion has concentrated on infinity I will start with random.

 

Sure I can point to a real worls example.

 

Line up a dozen Cobalt 60 atoms and tell me in what order will they disintegrate.

 

As for infinity, there are mathematical ways to handle the ratios of two infinities - it is called L'Hopital's rule and can be found on Google.

However this is still abstract thinking. A concrete example is more difficult since we are limited by our own mortality or finiteness.

So we are stuck with thought experiments which we could not carry out to the end at infinity.

Would you accept the artists 'vanishing point' in perspective drawing as a real world example?

[Strange]

 

If the universe was infinitely sized, that would mean that the amount of inhabited planets and uninhabited planets would both be infinite. To find the percent of inhabited planets, you would divide the number of inhabited planets by the total number of planets, which would be infinity divided by infinity. If the equation were mathematically possible, which it is not, but if it were, the answer would be 1, which would imply that 100% of planets are inhabited. The same would go for uninhabited planets, therefore creating a paradox which can only be solved by having all numbers to the equation being finite.

 

As you rightly say, your calculation is totally bogus and therefore the conclusion is invalid.

 

As an example that makes the flaw more obvious, consider the odd and even numbers using the same argument:

 

If the set of natural numbers is infinite, that would mean that the amount of odd numbers and even numbers would both be infinite. To find the percent of odd numbers, you would divide the number of odd numbers by the total number of natural numbers, which would be infinity divided by infinity. If the equation were mathematically possible, which it is not, but if it were, the answer would be 1, which would imply that 100% of numbers are odd. The same would go for even numbers, therefore creating a paradox which can only be solved by having all numbers to the equation being finite.

 

Which is provably wrong.