Comparing These Two Majors

[Zaetus]

What advantages does a Biochemistry focus have over a biology degree? How do these majors contrast in terms of research of academia or industrial? What about MD/PhD programs? Do either of these majors become more efficient for someone who plans on completing an intensive program like an MD/PhD?

 

I know that most, if not all, these questions can be answered by merely Googling them, but the answers I am getting aren't sufficient. All I understand is that biochemistry is a harder major and that MD//PHD programs are expensive and difficult. I want to know what advantages one major may have over the other given the circumstances.

 

Thanks to anyone who shares an answer, and happy holidays!

[AndresKiani]

Biochemistry.. more money, much more interesting, much higher job availability.

 

However, Biochemistry is a little more intense than most pure biology programs besides perhaps Neuroscience.

 

Also there is a lot more career opportunities. Though, Biochemistry is more competitive, I wouldn't say it's highly competitive like engineering and medical school programs or some professional programs. As far as biological sciences goes (as well as chemical) I would say Biochem is one of the more competitive ones.

 

Biochemistry involves more chemistry than biology which is much more exciting than plain old biology...

Edited December 13, 2014 by AndresKiani

[ajb]

Biochemistry.. more money, much more interesting,

That is subjective and plenty of people will hold the opposite opinion.

 

...much higher job availability

This I think is true. Forgetting all the BS about a shortage of STEM graduates, finding a job is hard. As biochemisty interfaces well with medical science and so both charities and big businesses are interested, I would imagine finding a job to be easier than a degree in biology.

 

However, this may well depend on what you study within biology. For example biology with genetics (or something similar) may put you in a better position in the job market than say biology with zoology.

 

I will give the disclaimer that I have nothing to do with biology, just this is my observations founded on my own job searches and speaking to others.

What about MD/PhD programs? Do either of these majors become more efficient for someone who plans on completing an intensive program like an MD/PhD?

I have no idea about MD, but a PhD should be based on your interests. Remember you have to spend several years on this and a large part of you research career will probably follow a similar direction, if you stay in research that is.

[AndresKiani]

Yes it's subjective but it's subjective with experience and knowledge.

 

I have a lot of biochemist friends. A lot, I don't know what it is, but it seems Biochemistry is a popular major at my university. Most of them will expect a 80 to 90K pay salary at some point and talking to professional biochemist they are well above 100k a year.

 

I was originally a Neuroscience major before I switched to Physics, and so I know pretty familiar with most biology related majors and jobs. Biochemistry is definitely more in demand than Neuroscience, Genetics, Cell Biology, Developmental Biology, Microbiology, and these fields that I mentioned are much higher in depend than Zoology, General Biology, Plant Biology, Ecology, and other Wild Life Biology.

 

Ofcourse you will need a Phd in most cases unless your going straight into the industry you might not need it. Specially for Biochemistry, most of the people I know are not planning on going into graduate school unless is needed. I was just talking to a kid just yesterday he's a Biochem major and he's father is Biochemist with a BS and he's only planning on a BS. He also told me he's father is making 100k a year working for HCMC.

[ajb]

Most of them will expect a 80 to 90K pay salary at some point and talking to professional biochemist they are well above 100k a year.

Are you sure? That sounds a lot to me for graduates, unless the situation in the UK really is far worse than the US.

Edited December 14, 2014 by ajb

[AndresKiani]

Are you sure? That sounds a lot to me for graduates, unless the situation in the UK really is far worse than the US.

 

This is my experience, I'm sure it's because we here have a lot of industries like Mayo and HCMC and Medtronic that are paying these guys way more.

 

With Biochem. your also a very good applicant for Med school, Pharmacy school, Dental School ect.

Edited December 14, 2014 by AndresKiani

[hypervalent_iodine]

Are you sure? That sounds a lot to me for graduates, unless the situation in the UK really is far worse than the US.

This would be the higher end of what a post doc or senior lecturer might make where I'm from. I would be surprised to see those sorts of wages in the US, though I've never done any extensive searches.

 

OP: seems to me that a biology degree would lead to the same or similar prospects as a biochem major, depending (as ajb has said), what you plan on going with in the biology major. All in all, I can't really think of why one would benefit you significantly more than another going into a PhD or an MD. I myself have a chemistry degree with honours in o chem, but I've spent the last year working in genetics and molecular biology labs and I'm about to start back into a PhD focussing on both disciplines. The point is, your undergrad doesn't necessarily box you in to the major you chose. If you're looking at getting into research, I would try and get involved in undergrad research projects and go where your interests lie.

[ajb]

This would be the higher end of what a post doc or senior lecturer might make where I'm from. I would be surprised to see those sorts of wages in the US, though I've never done any extensive searches.

I just translated the money into GBP and reached the same conclusion. Either there is a mistake here, or the US costs a lot more to live in. This I imagine could vary state to state.

[Ophiolite]

Andres said the key words on salary "at some point", not "on graduation". And he refers to someone's father (i.e. an established person) making 100k. I'm on well over 100k (US$) in the UK, but I've been around a long time, though I only have a B.Sc. But then I'm not doing science - neither are most science graduates.

[CharonY]

The outlook for biochem grads is not that much better than of other STEM grads. There was a biotech boom a few years back, but many jobs are vanishing and some companies are still struggling with not firing people. There is also the issue with degree inflation and while it is not impossible to eventually reach 100k with only a MSc, with the oversaturated market it is certainly getting harder. From what I have heard some pharm/biotech companies have reduced some entry-level salaries to almost postdoc levels (in the range of 40k) and progression (at least in the non-managerial track) has been stunted in several areas.

That being said, many of these positions are fairly interchangeable between biochem/molecular bio degrees. Although this is probably more true for MSc and upward, where people have gathered at least some more technical skills.

[ajb]

Andres said the key words on salary "at some point", not "on graduation". And he refers to someone's father (i.e. an established person) making 100k. I'm on well over 100k (US$) in the UK, but I've been around a long time, though I only have a B.Sc. But then I'm not doing science - neither are most science graduates.

Okay, point taken.

 

But still 100k USD is something like 63k GBP. That would be senior professor level in academia. Your job pays better than most I would say.

[Ophiolite]

I am really old and I am in the oil industry. And I have a wife and a taxman to support.

[Strange]

I am really old and I am in the oil industry.

 

Suddenly, I have a completely different mental image of you...

 

(Couldn't remember his name so just searched for "sam actor moustache"!)

Edited December 15, 2014 by Strange

[Ophiolite]

Frighteningly accurate.

[CharonY]

With hat and all?

[Ophiolite]

Well not the hat, or the denim, or the leather waistcoat, but the wrinkles, the moustache and the wry smile.

[Arete]

But you do have a pickup with a gun rack, right

 

OP's question:

 

So, as background my lab is a university research lab which is currently funded by a pharma company. I pursued the PhD track, my Co-PI went down the MD/PhD track, so I've had a fair bit of exposure to many scientific career routes.

 

I don't think your particular major matters very much. Ultimately your transcript and particular courses you take matters a lot more, along with experience. If I had two candidates for grad school - one of who had a mediocre GPA in all highly relevant courses, and another who had a slightly different field of study, but a stellar GPA and lab experience, I'd be going with student 2, on the proviso they did a few catch up courses. Obviously if you're looking at graduate study you need a pretty decent GPA to qualify - assuming that, the particular major isn't too big of a deal. If the bio major is more flexible, do some chemistry courses and you'd have virtually the same degree as the biochem major.

The other big thing is to do some extracurricluar research, like a summer internship or two. Actual experience at a wet bench, or with bioinformatics will put you head and shoulders above people with none. I can't stress that enough.

 

As for research/career trajectories:

1) Assuming you are in the US, do not do an MD if you don't wish to be a clinical doctor. MD programs are extremely expensive, if the aim is to do non-clinical research, incurring hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt for a superfluous degree is only going to cause you grief.

2) I'd think carefully about your motivations to do a PhD before embarking on one. Currently, just under half of PhDs in STEM actually end up with a STEM career (the remainder retraining into non-science industries e.g. a postdoc in my former lab left biology to become an investment banker) and less than 10% wind up tenured academics. PhDs aren't magical lucrative career tickets, and it's highly competitive all the way through. If you're not passionate about scientific research there are far easier paths to a comfortable salary and a secure job.

3) Always have a back up plan you are pretty certain you'd enjoy doing. There's a fair bit of luck in every successful academic career.

 

If you have any specific questions, feel free to drop me a PM.

 

I have a lot of biochemist friends. A lot, I don't know what it is, but it seems Biochemistry is a popular major at my university. Most of them will expect a 80 to 90K pay salary at some point and talking to professional biochemist they are well above 100k a year.

 

Agroscience (Monsanto, Du-Pont, etc), Pharma (Pfizer, Sanfoni-Aventis, etc) and Biotech (Roushe, ABI etc) have all hired both Bachelor and PhD grads from our lab. Starting salaries for BSc grads are in the $40k range, and PhD grads in the 60k range. The ceiling is considerably higher for the PhD grads.

 

Compare that to to law grads where it ranges from $135-160K http://www.forbes.com/sites/susanadams/2014/03/28/law-schools-whose-grads-make-the-highest-starting-salaries/

 

If money is your primary motivator, biology is probably not the best choice.

Edited December 16, 2014 by Arete

[AndresKiani]

I admit, I probably have heard some over exaggerations. I'm not in direct contact with anyone's salary information and have gotten most of my information from undergrad. biochemist majors lol.

 

But I wills say this, I do know of one professional Biochemist working at TTU, who does make 80~90 K with a Phd doing research. The other biochemist major is the father of my friend, who makes about 100 K working in the industry. The rest of the BIochemist I know are just undergrads.

 

I know in most other biology majors you would be lucky to see a 50 K a year.

[ajb]

I admit, I probably have heard some over exaggerations.

This is always difficult to judge. What you really want to know is not the most you could possibly earn, but rather what is the average for someone like you working hard, with a similar skills set and experience.

[chadn737]

Yes it's subjective but it's subjective with experience and knowledge.

 

I have a lot of biochemist friends. A lot, I don't know what it is, but it seems Biochemistry is a popular major at my university. Most of them will expect a 80 to 90K pay salary at some point and talking to professional biochemist they are well above 100k a year.

 

I was originally a Neuroscience major before I switched to Physics, and so I know pretty familiar with most biology related majors and jobs. Biochemistry is definitely more in demand than Neuroscience, Genetics, Cell Biology, Developmental Biology, Microbiology, and these fields that I mentioned are much higher in depend than Zoology, General Biology, Plant Biology, Ecology, and other Wild Life Biology.

 

Ofcourse you will need a Phd in most cases unless your going straight into the industry you might not need it. Specially for Biochemistry, most of the people I know are not planning on going into graduate school unless is needed. I was just talking to a kid just yesterday he's a Biochem major and he's father is Biochemist with a BS and he's only planning on a BS. He also told me he's father is making 100k a year working for HCMC.

 

Science careers are not determined by the actual "degree" you get. In reality there are very few hard lines regarding any of these subjects. My bachelors was in Agronomy and my phd is in biology. My actual expertise is in genetics and genomics with strong computational emphasis. However, I also have a long history in molecular biology and biochemistry. I could get a job in biochemistry without a biochemistry degree. I could get a job in plant biology, biochemistry, genetics, biology, cell biology....etc.

 

The simple fact is that these "subjects" are the byproducts of history. At one time, the methods and knowledge required to be a geneticist was very different than that of a biochemist or a zoologist. Now, biochemistry is typically a required course in many biology departments, biology courses in many biochemistry departments. I took 5 semesters of chemistry as an Agronomy major. Regardless of what department you do a PhD in, your research may require you to do any of these subjects. I know biochemistry PhDs who do more molecular biology and genetics than actual "biochemistry" and "biology" PhDs who do more biochemistry than many in the biochemistry department. The hard lines/methods have broken down. What is important is less the specific degree than what you do with it, what sort of work you do, and where you carve out the niche of your expertise.

Edited December 17, 2014 by chadn737

[AndresKiani]

 

Science careers are not determined by the actual "degree" you get. In reality there are very few hard lines regarding any of these subjects. My bachelors was in Agronomy and my phd is in biology. My actual expertise is in genetics and genomics with strong computational emphasis. However, I also have a long history in molecular biology and biochemistry. I could get a job in biochemistry without a biochemistry degree. I could get a job in plant biology, biochemistry, genetics, biology, cell biology....etc.

 

The simple fact is that these "subjects" are the byproducts of history. At one time, the methods and knowledge required to be a geneticist was very different than that of a biochemist or a zoologist. Now, biochemistry is typically a required course in many biology departments, biology courses in many biochemistry departments. I took 5 semesters of chemistry as an Agronomy major. Regardless of what department you do a PhD in, your research may require you to do any of these subjects. I know biochemistry PhDs who do more molecular biology and genetics than actual "biochemistry" and "biology" PhDs who do more biochemistry than many in the biochemistry department. The hard lines/methods have broken down. What is important is less the specific degree than what you do with it, what sort of work you do, and where you carve out the niche of your expertise.

 

Yes from my limited experience, this is what I've come to realize as well.

[Vexen]

I'm studying biochemistry. The study includes mainly the metabolism of the four main biomolecules, nucleic acids, proteins, carbohydrates and lipids. In addition we study, in detail, enzymes, immunology and metabolic regulation.