How did you lose your faith

[Vexen]

What convinced you that the God you were praying to was an imaginary being?

Edited December 14, 2014 by Vexen

[Ten oz]

Why is this question one you "could never ask"?

Personally I never had faith so it wasn't a matter of losing it. I did not grow up practicing any specific faith. As I got older and began hearing about various beliefs from others (friends, teachers, etc) none of it made any sense. Even as a 10yr old kid the concept seemed very convoluted. I think religion is something a person needs to be raised with. There needs to be a foundation in place for accepting the contradictions and absences of logical reasoning.

I have older siblings that are all closer in age to each other than they are to me. They were taking biology in high school at various times when I was between 7-10 yrs old. Through their conversations and studying I learned to basic concept of evolution during those years. I was never conflicted about it. It made sense to me. I recall one day being at a friends house. His family are Mormon. I made a comment about humans evolutioning from an ancestor common to primates mistakenly assuming everyone understood that as proven history. My friends mother exploded and began yelling at me and demanding an apologize. She accussed me of calling her father and grandfather monkeys. I could not make any sense of it but gave her an apology because she was an adult and I was a kid. Ultimately I was asked to leave. Prior to that experience I thought religion was just cute fairytales like the tooth fairy or Easter Bunny. I did not realize that people actually believed it was real.

[John Cuthber]

I think I realised it when I was at school. The school' preacher taught us there was a heaven where dead people went.

I realised that since none of them ever came back, there was no way anyone could tell if it was true.

[Robittybob1]

I'm using my posting powers to ask the questions I could never ask.

 

One of these questions is:

What convinced you that the God you were praying to was an imaginary being?

I am surprised a question like that is allowed on a science forum.

[dimreepr]

For me it was when I read

 

 

Matthew 6:5-6: "And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men....when thou prayest, enter into thy closet and when thou has shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret...."

 

It seemed to utterly contradict everything the church stood for.

 

 

 

I am surprised a question like that is allowed on a science forum.

 

 

It’s not so surprising the antipodes of science is questioned here.

Edited December 14, 2014 by dimreepr

[Vexen]

There, I changed my original post.

 

I am surprised a question like that is allowed on a science forum.

Why is this question one you "could never ask"?

Personally, I never met a self proclaimed atheist. As far as I know, everyone I ever met is a theist.

[Moontanman]

There, I changed my original post.

 

 

 

Personally, I never met a self proclaimed atheist. As far as I know, everyone I ever met is a theist.

 

 

Well just maybe you met atheists and didn't know it, what clinched it for me was looking into the bible closer than what was taught in sunday school. Once you read all of it it becomes difficult to be honest and a believer at the same time...

[Vexen]

You people are very lucky to live in a liberal, wealthy and powerful nation like the USA. You guys should have the best stories about how you lost your faith as the USA is highly religious and knowledge is easily accessible.

[EdEarl]

I didn't loose my faith; I tossed it like a stomach full rotten drugs.

[Robittybob1]

There, I changed my original post.

 

 

 

Personally, I never met a self proclaimed atheist. As far as I know, everyone I ever met is a theist.

But none of what is being discussed is science. It is mere garbage, mere opinion. What is the scientific basis to it?

Take Edearl's comment (above) for example:

"I didn't loose my faith; I tossed it like a stomach full rotten drugs."

That's not science. It is more like creative writing.

Edited December 14, 2014 by Robittybob1

[EdEarl]

But none of what is being discussed is science. It is mere garbage, mere opinion. What is the scientific basis to it?

Take Edearl's comment (above) for example:

"I didn't loose my faith; I tossed it like a stomach full rotten drugs."

That's not science. It is more like creative writing.

Yep, I was abused because of my religious family, and made me realize that a religious person is not necessarily a good person. Thus, I searched for a way to be better, and I read the bible critically instead of with reverence. I realized the bible and all religious documents have been written by people, and that no one knows whether there s a god. I found logic, reason, philosophy and science help live ones life as good as possible. I have found no rational argument for or against there being a god; it is an unanswerable question. And, there is no evidence one way or another. IMO anyone who thinks they have evidence is delusional.

[MigL]

You realise that things you can control require work.

And divine intervention will not allow you to control things beyond your control.

So what is the use ?

 

Some people rquire hope and faith to carry on,though.

Its not my place to take that away from them, or to ridicule them.

[Robittybob1]

Yep, I was abused because of my religious family, and made me realize that a religious person is not necessarily a good person. Thus, I searched for a way to be better, and I read the bible critically instead of with reverence. I realized the bible and all religious documents have been written by people, and that no one knows whether there s a god. I found logic, reason, philosophy and science help live ones life as good as possible. I have found no rational argument for or against there being a god; it is an unanswerable question. And, there is no evidence one way or another. IMO anyone who thinks they have evidence is delusional.

That is not dissimilar to me. But when I asked for proof I got what I considered was an answer, but you have already dismissed this aspect as delusional (which amounts to an opinion really).

Stalemate.

[Ten oz]

But when I asked for proof I got what I considered was an answer,

Please share. I have never been privy to anything I would consider a remotely reasonable answer for a proof question regarding god.

[Moontanman]

That is not dissimilar to me. But when I asked for proof I got what I considered was an answer, but you have already dismissed this aspect as delusional (which amounts to an opinion really).

Stalemate.

 

 

If you can't show it, you don't know it...

[EdEarl]

That is not dissimilar to me. But when I asked for proof I got what I considered was an answer, but you have already dismissed this aspect as delusional (which amounts to an opinion really).

Stalemate.

Exactly, lack of evidence proves nothing; only opinion remains. I accept the possibility of such a proof, but I believe it is impossible.

[Robittybob1]

Exactly, lack of evidence proves nothing; only opinion remains. I accept the possibility of such a proof, but I believe it is impossible.

That borders on a contradiction doesn't it. "accept the possibility ... but believe it is impossible" You can't have it both ways. It may be rare, I'll accept that.

 

 

If you can't show it, you don't know it...

...and you are a poet and don't know it.

[davidivad]

always science against religion...

i choose not to make an uninformed decision as one offers no more proof than the other.

why? logic is only part of the equation in everyday life.

i dont fix my child cereal in the morning because she requires a specific number of nutrients.

i do so because it feels good.

if i wish to believe that the flying spaghetti monster is real then i have the right as a citizen.

i may even lie to myself to feel better about it.

if one is to prove they can be moral without religion then how do we pick which will be the first religion to go?

take away religion and men will have no rock to hide under.

lets keep religion as it is useful in places other than science.

 

 

my child is an athiest and portrays some really questionable "scientific traits" that are not desireable for a successful society.

she holds a very judgemental backyard justice type of attitude towards religion.

now why in the heck would i want to foster that...

"it puts us in the same shoes as the fanatics."

 

science will be abused just like religion.

we are human beings and that is what WE do.

Edited December 15, 2014 by davidivad

[EdEarl]

That borders on a contradiction doesn't it. "accept the possibility ... but believe it is impossible" You can't have it both ways. It may be rare, I'll accept that.

Since the existence of a god has not been proved or disproved, there is a possibility someone will prove god exists. A belief does not require proof.

[Robittybob1]

Since the existence of a god has not been proved or disproved, there is a possibility someone will prove god exists. A belief does not require proof.

So when you accept proof, it will no longer be a matter of belief. What is proof then? What sort of proof do you need? Proof that I accept may still be not good enough for you. So you must say what sort of proof you need. (Like has this proof already been done.) Beside what has already been done there is a possibility that that "someone" is you!

[EdEarl]

So when you accept proof, it will no longer be a matter of belief. What is proof then? What sort of proof do you need? Proof that I accept may still be not good enough for you. So you must say what sort of proof you need. (Like has this proof already been done.) Beside what has already been done there is a possibility that that "someone" is you!

Well, since there is no current proof, I cannot imagine all the things that would constitute proof. For example, suppose you said,"Monday morning I will pray supplies will be delivered to the International Space Station without a rocket delivering them." And, NASA confirmed that after you prayed, supplies did show up on the International Space Station, a miracle. However, better proof would be several miracles, and not things that can occur or things that have occurred in the past.

Edited December 15, 2014 by EdEarl

[Ophiolite]

Well, since there is no current proof, I cannot imagine all the things that would constitute proof. For example, suppose you said,"Monday morning I will pray supplies will be delivered to the International Space Station without a rocket delivering them." And, NASA confirmed that after you prayed, supplies did show up on the International Space Station, a miracle. However, better proof would be several miracles, and not things that can occur or things that have occurred in the past.

I would suspect aliens with a warped sense of humour.

 

Referring back to Ed's answer to the original question. Like Ed I didn't lose my faith, but unlike Ed I didn't throw mine away, I put it down quietly as no longer being of relevance to me.

[Robittybob1]

Well, since there is no current proof, I cannot imagine all the things that would constitute proof. For example, suppose you said,"Monday morning I will pray supplies will be delivered to the International Space Station without a rocket delivering them." And, NASA confirmed that after you prayed, supplies did show up on the International Space Station, a miracle. However, better proof would be several miracles, and not things that can occur or things that have occurred in the past.

As Ophiolite says that would be so unusual, that NASA would be unlikely to admit it for they'd suspect UFOs. Either that or the supplies arriving out of the blue smash a hole in the ISS and then bringing the whole mission down.

But it was a good idea, no more difficult than the Feeding the 5000, or parting the Reed Sea.

 

Have you said "Amen"? Which Monday was it? Do they have Monday's on the ISS?

Edited December 15, 2014 by Robittybob1

[Vexen]

Opinion:

Aliens have never visited earth.

Edited December 15, 2014 by Vexen

[Ophiolite]

Fact:

Aliens have never visited earth.

Please provide the evidence to support this assertion. Alternatively retract it, or identify it as an opinion.