why we still believe in a god

[Itoero]

5 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

You're going to have to provide some evidence of this, a third of Americans? Get a grip...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young_Earth_creationism  http://www.gallup.com/poll/210956/belief-creationist-view-humans-new-low.aspx

38% YEC's and USA has +/- 324mil people.

 

[dimreepr]

3 minutes ago, Itoero said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young_Earth_creationism  http://www.gallup.com/poll/210956/belief-creationist-view-humans-new-low.aspx

38% YEC's and USA has +/- 324mil people.

1

When are you going to start being honest?

The gallup poll essentially shows the percentage of Americans that are religious and the wiki link just explains what a YEC is.

No hatred for religions here...

[Itoero]

2 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

When are you going to start being honest?

The gallup poll essentially shows the percentage of Americans that are religious and the wiki link just explains what a YEC is.

No hatred for religions here...

Didn't you read it? Or are you an ignorant liar?The wiki talks about the %YEC in USA .

This comes from Gallup:         WASHINGTON, D.C. -- The percentage of U.S. adults who believe that God created humans in their present form at some time within the last 10,000 years or so -- the strict creationist view -- has reached a new low. Thirty-eight percent of U.S. adults now accept creationism, while 57% believe in some form of evolution -- either God-guided or not -- saying man developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life.

[dimreepr]

6 minutes ago, Itoero said:

Didn't you read it? Or are you an ignorant liar?The wiki talks about the %YEC in USA .

2

TLDR please quote the relevant part.

BTW, how many irony meters do you intend to test?

[Itoero]

5 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

TLDR please quote the relevant part.

BTW, how many irony meters do you intend to test?

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- The percentage of U.S. adults who believe that God created humans in their present form at some time within the last 10,000 years or so -- the strict creationist view -- has reached a new low. Thirty-eight percent of U.S. adults now accept creationism, while 57% believe in some form of evolution -- either God-guided or not -- saying man developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life.http://www.gallup.com/poll/210956/belief-creationist-view-humans-new-low.aspx

Edited August 1, 2017 by Itoero

[dimreepr]

Just now, Itoero said:

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- The percentage of U.S. adults who believe that God created humans in their present form at some time within the last 10,000 years or so -- the strict creationist view -- has reached a new low. Thirty-eight percent of U.S. adults now accept creationism, while 57% believe in some form of evolution -- either God-guided or not -- saying man developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life.

FFS just answer the question and quote THE RELEVANT PART. 

[Handy andy]

59 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

You both hate religions, that much is obvious but you both fail to see that for a vast majority of humanity and an even vaster majority of the religious, the books and/or god provides a great deal of solace and a path to wisdom.

Path to wisdom huh  . I best ask some questions then and learn something.

I can see how for many people religion gives some form of social cohesion or a way of life, I have no problem with that, but wisdom derived from the old testament your are joking right.

I had not taken you for religious until this post, I am still a bit suspicious are you a religious type chap, or do you just not think religion is a bad thing in moderation for peasants.

I asked someone to define which version of god is being discussed here on a couple of posts, what is your version of god. Great spirit, quantum foam, god particle, Jesus, Krishna, Vishnu Teapots etc. I think we have a fairly ambiguous statement about Allah who doesn't rest but sits on a throne from someone I assume is of a Islamic persuasion above. But am not clear on your view. 

Please define what you think it is you believe in as a god and who speaks for god and how they derive that ability?

PS I don't hate anyone, not even Moderators

 

Edited August 1, 2017 by Handy andy

[Itoero]

The percentage of U.S. adults who believe that God created humans in their present form at some time within the last 10,000 years or so -- the strict creationist view -- has reached a new low.

Thirty-eight percent of U.S. adults now accept creationism, while 57% believe in some form of evolution -- either God-guided or not -- saying man developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life.

[dimreepr]

3 minutes ago, Handy andy said:

Path to wisdom huh  . I best ask some questions then and learn something.

I can see how for many people religion gives some form of social cohesion or a way of life, I have no problem with that, but wisdom derived from the old testament your are joking right.

I had not taken you for religious until this post, I am still a bit suspicious are you a religious type chap, or do you just not think religion is a bad thing in moderation for peasants.

I asked someone to define which version of god is being discussed here on a couple of posts, what is your version of god. Great spirit, quantum foam, god particle, Jesus, Krishna, Vishnu Teapots etc. I think we have a fairly ambiguous statement about Allah who doesn't rest but sits on a throne from someone I assume is of a Islamic persuasion above. But am not clear on your view. 

Please define what you think it is you believe in as a god and who speaks for god and how they derive that ability?

PS I don't hate anyone, not even Moderators

8

Did either of you even read my post?

[Handy andy]

8 minutes ago, dimreepr said:

Did either of you even read my post?

Yes I did, and the path to wisdom you mention attracted my attention. I was hoping you could enlighten me ref god, however I do note that you claim to be an atheist on other posts, so you have me a little confused but still in suspense waiting for a response ref a good god definition .

Good god please don't let it be the eternal jelly fish or Dr Who again

 

 

[Area54]

2 hours ago, Itoero said:

Seriously? You have obviously very little knowledge concerning this subject and you don't bother to look things up....what's the point of this discussion?

I was wrong, USA has at least 123.000.000 YEC's.

You did move the goalposts? Do you deny this?

I look things up when I have to. As demonstrated on earlier posts I had sufficient knowledge of the subject to come up with the number of YECs that was considerably closer to what may be the correct one than your quoted number.

The point of this part of the discussion was to establish that you had posted inaccurate information. Thank you for conceding that.

Unofrtunately, you followed up that concession with another inaccurate number. Do you want to try again and get it right this time?

[Handy andy]

6 minutes ago, Area54 said:

You did move the goalposts? Do you deny this?

I look things up when I have to. As demonstrated on earlier posts I had sufficient knowledge of the subject to come up with the number of YECs that was considerably closer to what may be the correct one than your quoted number.

The point of this part of the discussion was to establish that you had posted inaccurate information. Thank you for conceding that.

Unofrtunately, you followed up that concession with another inaccurate number. Do you want to try again and get it right this time?

Probably not a good point but you spelt unfortunately wrong.

[Area54]

1 minute ago, Handy andy said:

Probably not a good point but you spelt unfortunately wrong.

It woudl probalby be  more accurtae to say I tyepd it worng.

[Itoero]

1 hour ago, Area54 said:

You did move the goalposts? Do you deny this?

I look things up when I have to. As demonstrated on earlier posts I had sufficient knowledge of the subject to come up with the number of YECs that was considerably closer to what may be the correct one than your quoted number.

The point of this part of the discussion was to establish that you had posted inaccurate information. Thank you for conceding that.

Unofrtunately, you followed up that concession with another inaccurate number. Do you want to try again and get it right this time?

Can you give the example of how I moved the goalpost? So 38% of 324 mil is not 123 mil?

[Acme]

45 minutes ago, Itoero said:

Can you give the example of how I moved the goalpost? So 38% of 324 mil is not 123 mil?

 Curses on the multiquote! As Area54 corrected me when I brought this data to light, it was 38% of adults and adults are about 260 million, so the 38% is just under 99 million. This is still over a third of adults who believe Earth is only 10,000 years old and God created it just as we find it, to answer Dim's earlier challenge.  

To Area54's earlier reply to me, I'm fine with people getting comfort with their belief in a god, but not fine when acting on their belief brings discomfort to others and/or is set in opposition to facts and critical thinking.

Here's a link to Area54's correction.

 

Edited August 1, 2017 by Acme

[Itoero]

39 minutes ago, Acme said:

 Curses on the multiquote! As Area54 corrected me when I brought this data to light, it was 38% of adults and adults are about 260 million, so the 38% is just under 99 million. This is still over a third of adults who believe Earth is only 10,000 years old and God created it just as we find it, to answer Dim's earlier challenge.  

That's true. It doesn't really matter but with the pre-adolescents the number would go well above 100 million.

[Area54]

1 hour ago, Itoero said:

Can you give the example of how I moved the goalpost? So 38% of 324 mil is not 123 mil?

I agree with everything Acme said in the prior post, but the moving of goalposts occured earlier. You were making assertions about Christians. Full Stop. Period. No qualifications. When I responded to that you suddenly switched to a subset - YECs. That is switching the goalposts. Please have the decency to admit you have done it.

Now, frankly in one sense it does not matter to me if 140 million, or 123 million, or 2 million, or 20,000 people are so misinformed and misguided to reject all the evidence against a Young Earth. What matters to me is that anyone is so misinformed.

And if I return to the original point that led to this unedifying tangent, the New Testament changes the whole picture for Christians, introducing a new perspective and approach and amending the significance of portions of the Old Testament. That means that your singleminded claims about the "hatred" of Christians is on decidedly weak ground. Contrary to the claims of some atheists, religion can and does evolve.

 

[Itoero]

I did not move the goalpost.

You said that the significance of the OT and NT are quite different in which I answered that YEC's have a different view concerning the significance....for them the OT is more significant then the NT.

[beecee]

I would question the validity of any survey that said 100 million people still believe the Earth is only 10,000 years old...Either that or question the education system that could ever lead to such ignorance! 

Quote

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallup_(company)

In 2013, the accuracy of Gallup polling on religious faith was questioned.^[23] Gallup's polling on religiosity in the U.S. has produced results somewhat different^[24][25] from other studies on religious issues, including a 2012 study by the Pew Research Center, which found that those who lack a religious affiliation were a fast-growingdemographic group in the U.S

 

IMHO also I believe many so called Christians in western countries, seem to admit to a belief in a deity more out of convention and fear. I am also of the opinion that scientists of all persuasions need to be far more vocal in putting down and scientifically invalidating such ignorant nonsense as that sold by these YEC. 

Finally I offer my apologies to USA citizens for us Aussies for the likes of Ken Ham who probably is partly responsible for such nonsensical ignorance and who now lives in your country... Although this could be in retaliation for the many TV evangelistic shows on Fox and the likes of Billy Graham that once toured Australia preaching fire and brimstone to those gullible enough to accept it.  

[beecee]

On 1/4/2015 at 3:43 PM, tylerbrowner said:

most importantly arguing if god is real and if god is not real will get us nowhere because there will always be another reason to why there is or isn't a god.

Actually a nice post except imo for the above. I'm pretty sure the reasons for accepting any god or creator is diminishing all the time, even as we speak/type. But the media needs to start promoting more science programs based on cosmology, and get it out to the masses that science can now reasonably and logically explain how the universe came to be, at least back to 10-43 seconds after the BB. I went to a Catholic school, and at our last 57th old boys reunion, I had plenty of genuine interest from a couple of my old mates, who still were rather religious in their outlook, on the scientific account and the evidence of how the universe came to be and that a creator was not really needed. The fact that science could not as yet explain with evidence the how or the why of the BB was though some comfort to them in the end.   Both also were taken aback somewhat with my revelation to them that the Catholic church has now virtually accepted the BB explanation and also evolution. It's a painfully slow process, and of course groups like the YEC will occasionally kick and scream at such "scientific blasphemy"  but I do see people slowly coming around to the proper scientific way of thinking and rejecting the myth.       

 

[dimreepr]

19 hours ago, Handy andy said:

Yes I did, and the path to wisdom you mention attracted my attention. I was hoping you could enlighten me ref god, however I do note that you claim to be an atheist on other posts, so you have me a little confused but still in suspense waiting for a response ref a good god definition .

4

I think the easiest way to explain it is by invoking "The Wizard of Oz", the characters all followed the yellow brick road and despite the wizard being a geezer behind a curtain with a megaphone and not at all magical, they all got their wish. God, for me, is just a teaching aid and only needed to keep one on the right path.

 

19 hours ago, Handy andy said:

Good god please don't let it be the eternal jelly fish or Dr Who again

Why are you still bleating on about this? You asked for an explanation and I provided one.

[Baron d'Holbach]

All religious notions are uniformly founded on authority; all the religions of the world forbid examination, and are not disposed that men should reason upon them.

Only timid and weak minded individuals need a sky god. 

By BD

Edited August 2, 2017 by Baron d'Holbach

[Baron d'Holbach]

If the ignorance of nature gave birth to such a variety of gods, the knowledge of this nature is calculated to destroy them.

[Baron d'Holbach]

All children are atheists, they have no idea of God

Adults are an insult to children. With their made up delusional monsters 

 

[Baron d'Holbach]

How could the human mind progress, while tormented with frightful phantoms, and guided by men, interested in perpetuating its ignorance and fears?

"God is the foundation for the fall of mankind"