Can you speculate the magnitude of chaos in the U.S.A. if...

[Externet]

-Please move to 'speculations' if deserved-

 

Can you foresee the magnitude of general public chaos in the U.S.A. if the metric international system was mandated ? Together with the kilogram, Celsius, litre, Newton...
No more fluid ounces, tablespoons, miles, bushels, gallons, pounds, Farenheit, horsepower, feet, inches, acres, mils, 2"x4" that are not, BTUs,...

On a one-year term to convert ?

 

I just smile when hear ..."half pound hamburger has 16 grams of fat"...

Lucky some things are already turned with medicines, imported products, the Volt is already here to stay.

 

What is your perception in the subject ?

[Greg H.]

I doubt there would be much chaos, execept in the manufacturing world, where they would need to retool machines to use the new system.

 

Gas would probably go up since all of the pumps would need to be reworked to charge by the liter rather than the gallon. Oh and all the old cars that would need to have their speedometers/odometers updated to account for kms travelled and km per hour - I could see this causing some angry murmurings.

 

There would be some getting to the idea of new measurements - liter versus gallon, cm versus inch - but on the whole I think there would be more consternation and angry grumbling than outright chaos. After all, we do manage to go to places like Canada and Europe on a fairly regular basis without completely losing our cool and starting riots at this metric thingee.

Edited March 6, 2015 by Greg H.

[Phi for All]

As Greg H says, the real problem isn't the general public. I think they'd just like some consistency instead of the mix we have now. If they grumbled significantly, it would be about having to buy new tools, although many of the measuring devices in US home already have metric equivalents.

 

I think Americans would figure out the gasoline thing pretty quickly. Celsius temperature is another matter. It might take a while for us to figure out that the old 68 feels just like the new 20.

[Acme]

It's been tried. I remember when I was working in the trades in the mid-70s and they gave everybody metric tape measures in an attempt to convert the shop. Rather than chaos it resulted more-or-less in a big 'meh'. Nevertheless it is ongoing and we are going down crawling and whispering millimeter by millimeter.

 

TheMetricSystem.info

What has been happening

 

There was a push to convert the United States back in the 1970's. Similar programs were quite successful in many countries (such as Australia), but in the United States the effort was largely derailed by a lack of commitment. Since that time, metrication has been occurring at a slow pace. Many of our industries and corporations have been converting and often use metric. These include the automotive industry, electronics companies, and companies such as Kodak. Most recently, consumer products have started appearing in metric sizes (such as some shampoo, mouthwash, bottled drinks, etc.). Over the past few decades, while we have been making slow progress in conversion, countries around the world have been developing their economies and solidifying their use of the metric system.

...

Get involved

 

If you would like to help move us down the road to metric usage, consider joining The U.S. Metric Association. Your membership fee will go to support metric initiatives, and you will get a newsletter to keep you informed with news and information.

[StringJunky]

If you did adopt metric it would take at least 40 years to start noticing real change in the population; mainly younger ones. Some pursuits it will never die. Angling in the UK is intransigently imperial and even the little kids with no school training of imperial ask: "What pound line you using, mate?" or "How many pounds was that fish, mate?" Makes me smile to myself. :}

[Danijel Gorupec]

I just realized why Brits do not want to use metrics - it is because metrics is much more complex. Look at the following two diagrams:

 

- simple version: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Football_pitch_imperial.svg

- complex version: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_football#mediaviewer/File:Football_pitch_metric.svg

 

But what stops Americans? (Warning: you too might be an American if you do not intuitively understand above diagrams)

[Acme]

I just realized why Brits do not want to use metrics - it is because metrics is much more complex. Look at the following two diagrams:

 

- simple version: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Football_pitch_imperial.svg

- complex version: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_football#mediaviewer/File:Football_pitch_metric.svg

 

But what stops Americans? (Warning: you too might be an American if you do not intuitively understand above diagrams)

It seems you do not intuitively understand that it's a matter of what folks grow up using, not a matter of complexity. Parlez vous avoirdupois?

[swansont]

Oh and all the old cars that would need to have their speedometers/odometers updated to account for kms travelled and km per hour - I could see this causing some angry murmurings.

 

More likely these would be grandfathered. Speed limit signs would be added or updated to show km/hr, but mph signs would stay for several years.

 

My favorite metric perq from when I lived in Canada was that ice cream was in 2L containers, rather than half-gallon.

[John]

Just moved to Australia several months ago, still getting used to people using "40 degrees" to describe a hot day, or seeing speed limits over 100 (kph), or adults talking about weighing "70" without being severely underweight, etc. Overall, though, it's not too big an adjustment, though I guess the fact that I've been a science nerd for ages has helped.

Anecdote: Not too long ago I went to the gas station ("servo") down the street to get a few things. It was late, so the doors were locked and I had to request the items through the service window outside. I asked the girl for a quart of milk. (Admittedly mild) hilarity ensued.

Edited March 6, 2015 by John

[StringJunky]

Being in my 50s and English I'm a casualty of the slow conversion, resulting in me using hybridised unit sets like 2 foot 4 inches and 3mm or 6lb 5oz and 3g when measuring stuff for myself; metric's good on the small units and does away with fractions.or thou'

Edited March 7, 2015 by StringJunky

[John Cuthber]

Meanwhile, in reality...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_Conversion_Act

[StringJunky]

Meanwhile, in reality...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_Conversion_Act

Law is one thing, reality is another. Until it's the adopted by the general population it's still a niche system.

[Robittybob1]

-Please move to 'speculations' if deserved-

 

Can you foresee the magnitude of general public chaos in the U.S.A. if the metric international system was mandated ? Together with the kilogram, Celsius, litre, Newton...

No more fluid ounces, tablespoons, miles, bushels, gallons, pounds, Farenheit, horsepower, feet, inches, acres, mils, 2"x4" that are not, BTUs,...

 

On a one-year term to convert ?

 

I just smile when hear ..."half pound hamburger has 16 grams of fat"...

Lucky some things are already turned with medicines, imported products, the Volt is already here to stay.

 

What is your perception in the subject ?

NZ has been metric for many years but babies are still posted in pounds and a person's height in feet and inches.

[swansont]

Meanwhile, in reality...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_Conversion_Act

Metric is used in a lot of commerce. My soda comes in 2L bottles. Most canned and bottled goods list a mass in grams if it's sold by weight, and also list serving sizes in grams. Medicine and vitamin doses are given in mg, and nutritional information on food packaging is listed in grams.

 

The big failure is in manufacturing and possibly construction. Re-tooling would be expensive. I suspect as the US manufacturing base continues to shrink and we import more goods, that there will be increased metric everywhere, but it will be largely invisible since we don't fix things anymore. e.g. I have no idea if the parts inside my computer and phone are metric or not. It doesn't matter, because I'm not going to do anything that requires replacing components where metric vs imperial matters. USB cables are, for example, metric. Headphone jacks have been metric for years. Are Apple's lightning connectors built to a metric standard? I don't know — I would guess yes. Does that impact me in any way? No.

 

So I think there's a lot more metric around in the US than folks may realize, they're just largely hidden. The aforementioned gasoline-related items are probably the most visible area where we don't have a metric measure alongside the imperial.

[StringJunky]

Camera tripod mount holes are 1/4" Whitworth. That one will probably stick around a long time everywhere.

Metric is used in a lot of commerce. My soda comes in 2L bottles. Most canned and bottled goods list a mass in grams if it's sold by weight, and also list serving sizes in grams. Medicine and vitamin doses are given in mg, and nutritional information on food packaging is listed in grams.

The big failure is in manufacturing and possibly construction. Re-tooling would be expensive. I suspect as the US manufacturing base continues to shrink and we import more goods, that there will be increased metric everywhere, but it will be largely invisible since we don't fix things anymore. e.g. I have no idea if the parts inside my computer and phone are metric or not. It doesn't matter, because I'm not going to do anything that requires replacing components where metric vs imperial matters. USB cables are, for example, metric. Headphone jacks have been metric for years. Are Apple's lightning connectors built to a metric standard? I don't know — I would guess yes. Does that impact me in any way? No.

So I think there's a lot more metric around in the US than folks may realize, they're just largely hidden. The aforementioned gasoline-related items are probably the most visible area where we don't have a metric measure alongside the imperial.

It seems the US started to adopt metric in the early 1800s. The guy who wrote the blog this is quoted from, and designs PCBs, says it is actually fully committed to metric but the powers-that-be basically went for evolution rather than revolution and it has got stuck in the process, leading to the hotchpotch adhoc situation it is in now. The whole article, including the comments, is a thoughtful synopsis of the history and uptake of the metric system. I enjoyed reading it. The contributors are like-minded to the blog author in PCBs and electronics. This part-quote is in the comments 7th down:

 

 

Most Americans think that our involvement with metric measurement is relatively new. In fact, the United States has been increasing its use of metric units for many years, and the pace has accelerated in the past three decades. In the early 1800’s the U.S. Coast and Geodetic Survey (the government’s surveying and map-making agency) used meter and kilogram standards brought from France. In 1866, Congress authorized the use of the metric system in this country and supplied each state with a set of standard metric weights and measures.

 

In 1875, the United States solidified its commitment to the development of the internationally recognized metric system by becoming one of the original seventeen signatory nations to the Treaty of the Meter. The signing of this international agreement concluded five years of meetings in which the metric system was reformulated, refining the accuracy of its standards. The Treaty of the Meter, also know as the “Metric Convention,” established the International Bureau of Weights and Measures (BIPM) in Sèvres, France, to provide standards of measurement for worldwide use.

 

In 1893, metric standards, developed through international cooperation under the auspices of BIPM, were adopted as the fundamental standards for length and mass in the United States. Our customary measurements — the foot, pound, quart, etc. — have been defined in relation to the meter and the kilogram ever since. The General Conference of Weights and Measures, the governing body that has overall responsibility for the metric system, and which is made up of the signatory nations to the Treaty of the Meter, approved an updated version of the metric system in 1960. This modern system is called Le Système International d’Unités or the International System of Units, abbreviated SI. Read more (7th comment down)

Edited March 7, 2015 by StringJunky

[John Cuthber]

Law is one thing, reality is another. Until it's the adopted by the general population it's still a niche system.

The mandate which the OP asked about is there.

Enforcement isn't.

[MigL]

We made the 'switch' in Canada when I was in school.

This gave me the advantage of being conversant in either system ( bi-systemic if you will ).

People older than me have problems with Metric.

People younger than me have problems with Imperial.

 

I use whatever system is appropriate to the situation.

[Klaynos]

In the UK, there's a reason I have both imperial and metric tools...

 

We have a great system almost everything is sold in metric but you'll drive at mph and measure your consumption in mpg but buy your fuel in litres. And you'll be getting your milk for your tea in pints. Got days are in degF cold in degC...

[Phi for All]

Got days are in degF cold in degC...

 

Interesting. Systems used as a measure of emphasis. In the US, we'll use meters instead of yards to denote accuracy on a large scale (although yards are still used in American football), but for small-scale accuracy we use our lovely fraction-of-an-inch scale. Nothing says you care like measuring that board to a 64th of an inch.

[John Cuthber]

I look forward to the day when a politician says "We could always sell beer in half- litres. Nobody needs to use pints".

[CharonY]

Well, in Germany that would be a litre (or mass as called in the funny area called Bavaria).

[swansont]

We made the 'switch' in Canada when I was in school.

This gave me the advantage of being conversant in either system ( bi-systemic if you will ).

People older than me have problems with Metric.

People younger than me have problems with Imperial.

 

I use whatever system is appropriate to the situation.

 

I seem to recall in Vancouver at the Safeway the deli counter had prices per 100g, but the produce section was per-pound.

 

I was more thrown by the bilingual labeling. Confused why they sold canned spiders in the nut aisle, until I checked the spelling more carefully (peanuts = arachides)

 

As to an earlier comment, now that I think about it, the road signs being in kph didn't matter because my speedometer already had those markings on it. They were just in smaller print and finer lines, below the mph markings.

 

I wonder if digital display speedometers have a setting to toggle between them? (edit: Google indicates the answer is generally yes)

[Klaynos]

My car I can toggle, same for consumption, range etc...

 

My old physics department everyone in the workshop switched between thou (thousandths of an inch) and mm with little regard. You do need to always be sure of writing down your units.

 

When talking to people I use which ever is closer/easier to say, mm for small, cm of it's about a round number of cm but if it's 7.5 cm or becomes 3 inches, around 30cm I'd use a foot, then metres then miles...

[StringJunky]

My car I can toggle, same for consumption, range etc...

 

My old physics department everyone in the workshop switched between thou (thousandths of an inch) and mm with little regard. You do need to always be sure of writing down your units.

 

When talking to people I use which ever is closer/easier to say, mm for small, cm of it's about a round number of cm but if it's 7.5 cm or becomes 3 inches, around 30cm I'd use a foot, then metres then miles...

Does 'Mil' refer to a 'Thou' or a metric MM?

Edited March 10, 2015 by StringJunky

[Klaynos]

Does 'Mil' refer to 'Thou' or metric MM?

That would depend on who you're talking to... An older hands on engineer type probably thou, a younger or more science orientated then mm... Best to get clarification.