Belly fat...

[Externet]

¿? -- Is it wrong to say...

 

- By nature, animals and we humans store energy in times of bonanza to help ensure survival in times of scarcity and that process is embedded in genetics. It happens when there is abundance of food, bellies grow and life can be sustained longer.

 

- Health professionals and science assures being overweight shortens lives. *

 

How come these are in straight collision paths ? Nature promoting at the same time survival and earlier death ? Is there a gene fault to immediately get rid of stored fat in times food intake becomes plentiful ?

 

*Seems true, you do not see fat people in their seventies and eigthies. Fat ones are already dead by then.

 

 

 

 

[fiveworlds]

Health professionals and science assures being overweight shortens lives.

 

Ridiculously overweight some kids only have a handful of meals a month and they die really young

[DrP]

Yea, I'd have to agree... there is a difference between 'storing up' a bit of energy, putting on a little bit of weight as fat during times of plenty and putting on SO much weight due to over indulgence and excess that you become morbidly obese.

[StringJunky]

Up until food was plentiful all year round, people made the most of times of plenty to get them through the times of scarcity; usually Winter.and early Spring. They weren't carry excess weight all year round so morbidity from obesity was much less common and probably the sole preserve of the well-heeled. .

Edited March 10, 2015 by StringJunky

[Delta1212]

Up until food was plentiful all year round, people made the most of times of plenty to get them through the times of scarcity; usually Winter.and early Spring. They weren't carry excess weight all year round so morbidity from obesity was much less common and probably the sole preserve of the well-heeled. .

And this is really where the problem lies. There are areas where we didn't evolve constraints or proper feedback mechanism because we already had them imposed on us by nature.

 

No major reason for there to be a "stop storing fat, you're big enough already" switch when nobody ever had enough food for the health problems to become more of an issue than starvation.

Edited March 10, 2015 by Delta1212

[dimreepr]

It’s not so much how much we eat but what we eat.

[MonDie]

Our ancestors got less food, got more exercise and lived shorter lives. This probably wasn't a problem for them.

[Phi for All]

I've heard it explained this way. As hunter/gatherers, we went on the move in the Spring when the weather permitted, and staying on the move helped us lose fat stored over the winter. While we were on the move, we ate mostly meat, greens, fruit, nuts.

 

When the cold comes back, we look for a place to spend the winter. We have more time for gathering since we're staying in one place, and that also means digging for roots and tubers. Now we lay in a store of starchy foods that will last the winter. Complex carbs stimulate insulin production, which tells the body to store fat and salt, tells the cells to produce their own cholesterol, and also raises blood pressure and skin temp. So we get a little fat, we're warmer, and our lack of meat gets supplemented.

 

Of course now, we eat the roots and tubers all the time, and other worse sugars. We're on cold weather diet even in the summer.

[dimreepr]

Our ancestors got less food, got more exercise and lived shorter lives. This probably wasn't a problem for them.

 

 

 

Exercise has little impact on a high sugar diet, due to the way our bodies process the sugars.

This wasn’t a problem for our ancestors because they lacked, processed sugar in the quantities we now have and an industry intent on manipulating us for profit.

[pavelcherepan]

And this is really where the problem lies. There are areas where we didn't evolve constraints or proper feedback mechanism because we already had them imposed on us by nature.

 

The change from hunter-gatherer lifestyle of early humans to developing agriculture so that food now was more widely available all year round happened only very recently, some 20,000 years ago and it's not enough time for any protective/feedback mechanisms to evolve.

 

And as was pointed out by dimreepr not only we eat more, but the food we eat is higher is energy value, with more sugars and fat, so if you lead a non-active lifestyle, it's definitely too much for the body to utilize.

[Delta1212]

 

The change from hunter-gatherer lifestyle of early humans to developing agriculture so that food now was more widely available all year round happened only very recently, some 20,000 years ago and it's not enough time for any protective/feedback mechanisms to evolve.

 

And as was pointed out by dimreepr not only we eat more, but the food we eat is higher is energy value, with more sugars and fat, so if you lead a non-active lifestyle, it's definitely too much for the body to utilize.

Which is essentially what I said...

[StringJunky]

Which is essentially what I said...

Me too.

 

Up until food was plentiful all year round, people made the most of times of plenty to get them through the times of scarcity; usually Winter.and early Spring. They weren't carry excess weight all year round so morbidity from obesity was much less common and probably the sole preserve of the well-heeled. .

[Phi for All]

I'd be very interested in seeing a diet designed without the economy in mind, for modern human lifestyles. Few people have work that simulates the kind of activity we were used to 20,000 years ago. Most have moderate to low activity most days.

 

If we weren't interested in keeping every farmer, foodstuff manufacturer, and restaurant prosperous and economically viable, what would be the best things for us to eat? If we weren't used to three meals a day of certain proportions, how many meals of what size would we eat?

 

I had the idea years ago to open a restaurant that served sane portions instead of three times more than you need for a meal. The idea would be to trade off lower average ticket size for higher frequency of visits. I thought people would eat almost daily at a place that gave you about as much food as you'd fix at home, at half the price of other restaurants. It's an idea that sounds great, but I've never seen anything like it. Has it been tried and died?

[dimreepr]

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head, it’s impossible to differentiate the economic drive of farmers to the greater need of the populous. The farmer needs to make money and will tailor the produce towards greater efficiency, in terms of yield, in both the most productive and the most profitable.

 

As for your restaurant idea, maybe is a few years too early.

[Externet]

Thanks, gentlemen.

 

Seems a consensus that two factors would have to be addressed to keep a lean belly.

- Quantity of food -manageable.

- Type of food. -Harder in the 21st century with the mind of too many into pleasure, comfort, lazyness. If it is not of great taste, won't be eaten even by hungry ones.

Seen people tossing perfectly nutritious food to the garbage can because was wrongly prepared and did not fit their taste buds.

 

A measured portion of the correct food fine tuned to the amount of activity then, could keep a lean belly. That is what I believe hundreds of diet plans promote, and none appears to work to satisfaction. I say none because otherwise, everyone would be into that plan that does not show up yet.

 

Thousands of years ago, our ancestors did have the right recipe, but got lost in time.

 

Sugars turn to fat. Starches turn to fat. Fat turns to stored fat or is it burned right away ?

Are proteins the ones that do not turn to fatty tissue ?

 

Is gene manipulation the hope to be leaner and live longer ?

[imatfaal]

I had the idea years ago to open a restaurant that served sane portions instead of three times more than you need for a meal. The idea would be to trade off lower average ticket size for higher frequency of visits. I thought people would eat almost daily at a place that gave you about as much food as you'd fix at home, at half the price of other restaurants. It's an idea that sounds great, but I've never seen anything like it. Has it been tried and died?

 

You need to spend more time in Europe Portion sizes are one of the biggest shocks when eating in USA for first time

 

here are the menus of my favourite steak house in both London and New York

 

http://www.goodmanrestaurants.com/assets/pdf/menus/mayfair/food-menu-jan-2015.pdf#view=fit

http://www.smithandwollensky.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/SW_Dinner_Fall2014.pdf

 

Goodman's 14,12,8,8,14 ounces - if I have done my sums right

Smith and Wollensky's 24, 21,14, 24, 24 ounces

 

OK - not scientific and not quite the ratio you were suggesting but you get the point. You will note that Goodman is using USDA meat and is deliberately American orientated in its outlook; I could have chosen a more continental place and I would have been surprised to even see a 14oz steak

although I see that I have picked the wrong Smith and Wollensky - this is the NYC one - but doesn't have the weights

http://smithandwollenskynyc.com/pdfs/menu-lunchD.pdf

[Phi for All]

You need to spend more time in Europe

Fix up the spare room, I'm on my way to the airport right now.

 

Portion sizes are one of the biggest shocks when eating in USA for first time

I know a restaurant has some fixed costs that they have to charge customers just to sit down at a table, but there should be a way to scale the meal size down proportionately with the costs, to a certain extent. We've come to associate huge portions with good value, and we've disassociated good nutrition with the process of eating out.

 

To be honest, it's probably not the restaurants that are the problem with obesity in the US, it's the snacking. The snack aisles in the grocery stores have grown to the point where they need separate aisles for sweet and savory. Cookies/candy here, chips/pretzels/crackers over there.

 

One thing I've noticed in traveling is that Europeans have more traditions involving food. I used to think they were more obsessed by it because of this, but now I realize that tradition is really good for portion control. The British single soft-boiled egg and toast points, the French cafe latte for breakfast (the only meal where milk is allowed in coffee), the German insistence on seasonal foods only when they're in season (do they still do this? I remember being laughed at in a Frankfurt supermarket when asking for cashews in late August).

[dimreepr]

Thanks, gentlemen.

 

Seems a consensus that two factors would have to be addressed to keep a lean belly.

- Quantity of food -manageable.

- Type of food. -Harder in the 21st century with the mind of too many into pleasure, comfort, lazyness. If it is not of great taste, won't be eaten even by hungry ones.

Seen people tossing perfectly nutritious food to the garbage can because was wrongly prepared and did not fit their taste buds.

 

A measured portion of the correct food fine tuned to the amount of activity then, could keep a lean belly. That is what I believe hundreds of diet plans promote, and none appears to work to satisfaction. I say none because otherwise, everyone would be into that plan that does not show up yet.

 

Thousands of years ago, our ancestors did have the right recipe, but got lost in time.

 

Sugars turn to fat. Starches turn to fat. Fat turns to stored fat or is it burned right away ?

Are proteins the ones that do not turn to fatty tissue ?

 

Is gene manipulation the hope to be leaner and live longer ?

 

 

 

A recent BBC Horizon program “What’s the right diet for you?” in which they divided up 75 overweight people by type and modelled individual diets for each based on that type. They were largely successful after, I think, ten weeks.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02ddsd9

 

Check out the test.

[imatfaal]

Fix up the spare room, I'm on my way to the airport right now.

 

I know a restaurant has some fixed costs that they have to charge customers just to sit down at a table, but there should be a way to scale the meal size down proportionately with the costs, to a certain extent. We've come to associate huge portions with good value, and we've disassociated good nutrition with the process of eating out.

 

To be honest, it's probably not the restaurants that are the problem with obesity in the US, it's the snacking. The snack aisles in the grocery stores have grown to the point where they need separate aisles for sweet and savory. Cookies/candy here, chips/pretzels/crackers over there.

 

One thing I've noticed in traveling is that Europeans have more traditions involving food. I used to think they were more obsessed by it because of this, but now I realize that tradition is really good for portion control. The British single soft-boiled egg and toast points, the French cafe latte for breakfast (the only meal where milk is allowed in coffee), the German insistence on seasonal foods only when they're in season (do they still do this? I remember being laughed at in a Frankfurt supermarket when asking for cashews in late August).

 

boiled egg and toast soldiers! That was my dinner last night. Snacking is deadly - I now have supplies of citrus fruit to answer the craving for snacks; which of course were in turn a substitute for a cigarette.

 

I do think that it is unfair that there seem to be negative unconscious correlations too - when I exercise I don't have any desire for snacks or junk food, as soon as I stop cycling for more than a few days my diet also goes to pot.

[StringJunky]

 

boiled egg and toast soldiers! That was my dinner last night. Snacking is deadly - I now have supplies of citrus fruit to answer the craving for snacks; which of course were in turn a substitute for a cigarette.

 

I do think that it is unfair that there seem to be negative unconscious correlations too - when I exercise I don't have any desire for snacks or junk food, as soon as I stop cycling for more than a few days my diet also goes to pot.

If you've just given smoking, your brain looking for a feelgood fix that calorie-rush snacking can give you. Cycling sorts it out as well because you are inducing endorphin production. You need to find something that makes you feel good and healthful. You are probably at a loose end when you get the snacking urge; fill the time with something else. Giving up things means you still have to fill that vacancy. You don't actually ever give up anything, you just transfer to something else. Knowing this you can channel it to something positive.

[Phi for All]

I do think that it is unfair that there seem to be negative unconscious correlations too - when I exercise I don't have any desire for snacks or junk food, as soon as I stop cycling for more than a few days my diet also goes to pot.

 

The double whammy! Like on a snowy winter day when you're huddled up inside doing very little, nothing sounds better than a carbocheesemeat plate that could fuel a couple of gravediggers for a day. On days like that, I cut up some raw veg and eat that when I feel hungry rather than make full meals.

 

My belly fat went down significantly when I stopped "sharking" to find a parking space. This is something I learned back in college at the downtown campus where close parking was scarce. You follow someone who's walking to their car so you can take their space when they leave. I always hummed the Jaws theme song while I did it, that's why I called it "sharking". That became any appreciable amount of time spent trying to find a close-in space to park. I didn't question the need, it just seemed intuitive that the closer spaces were better.

 

I caught myself sharking one day as I was also thinking that I really wanted to go for a long walk later. It was so funny that I parked in the farthest space away from the store I could find, and walked. It took less time to walk than to wait for a good space with a shorter walk, and I got needed exercise. I started to look at other activities that way, and adjusted whenever I found more absurdity (like hiring someone to rake my leaves so I have time to go to the gym).

[StringJunky]

 

....started to look at other activities that way, and adjusted whenever I found more absurdity (like hiring someone to rake my leaves so I have time to go to the gym).

LOL!

Being about 9-10 stone with a light frame for decades I was choughed to bits, when I got weighed at a medical checkup the other day, to be told I was 11stone 7lb. Walking and cycling which are my usual modes of transport have been the bane of any weight gain for me. I've been quite sedentary the last 3-4months so was able to pack on a bit of fat.

[imatfaal]

LOL!

 

Being about 9-10 stone with a light frame for decades I was choughed to bits, when I got weighed at a medical checkup the other day, to be told I was 11stone 7lb. Walking and cycling which are my usual modes of transport have been the bane of any weight gain for me. I've been quite sedentary the last 3-4months so was able to pack on a bit of fat.

##

 

Exacty opposite to my body type. It is a constant fight against piling on pounds. i took a tumble off my bike and decided to give cycling a rest over winter - put on 9 kilos. Clawed back about 3 so far. Anyway need to jump on my bike and lose a few more grammes

[Externet]

With downsizing of meals, that I consider as manageable; there is another hurdle I read somewhere long ago :

 

'The body goes into packing reserve fat when there is less food intake in genetic? prevention of starvation'. Can anyone confirm such 'study' am quite certaint to have read ?

 

Same as :

 

'The body goes into packing reserve fat when there is abundance of food intake in prevention of future scarcity'.

 

Which collide.

 

All science for belly fat reduction and fine tuning was inexistant thousands of years ago, and suppose obesity was very rare then. And both times of plenty and scarcity for sure existed. There has to be a key to the subject.

[StringJunky]

##

 

Exacty opposite to my body type. It is a constant fight against piling on pounds. i took a tumble off my bike and decided to give cycling a rest over winter - put on 9 kilos. Clawed back about 3 so far. Anyway need to jump on my bike and lose a few more grammes

Don't dismiss soup for losing weight and prolonging the feeling of fullness.. Half the problem with carby foods is they physically compress down very quickly and lead to eating more sooner.