Worlds Energy requirements ' May be ' within our technological Grasp !

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 2, 2015

Not quite the risk is reduced not eliminated. It depends not just on frequency and power but also on soft tissue resonance.

Here is a sample chart.https://www.google.ca/url?q=http://www.bccdc.ca/NR/rdonlyres/ECBB20E0-A717-4FE9-BAE1-B1E48334459C/0/Section13Final06062013.pdf&sa=U&ei=unWVVYvdAYuWgwSFjbUQ&ved=0CBcQFjAC&sig2=GLJEqGALUuhv8SYdlWfY3g&usg=AFQjCNGh9dzZ5U9nPARwYYRpS4iKEdQBZg

safe threshold limits is the safe exposure time.and it depends on the SAR value.

I have started to look through the requirements of the different authorities in the different countries. Some like America start their range 300khz to 500ghz . Others like the U.k. Speak in terms of O hz to several hundred Ghz . I think the lower limit sounds a bit arbitrary . However you did say something about the soft tissue.

Do you have any knowledge of that . As if Rf at any frequency is dangerous then , my sending down high energy at even very low frequencies is going to be met with"" danger "" .

Do you think that is the case , even if I am suggesting 200 kHz ( 1500 meters ) ?

Mike

Harold Squared · July 5, 2015

Just to throw into the pot .

Arthur C Clark proposed space elevators.

I am not saying this is the solution . But now with carbon fibre technology . What was not possible in yesteryear . Now may be ?

Link to space elevator. :- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_elevator

Also examine you tube arthur c clark space elevator. :- arthur c clark space elivator google search

Mike

Ya, Mike. The great Tsiolkovsky was first, inspired by Jules Verne and Eiffel Tower. A compression only concept not possible with materials known at the time or even today. Then was Yuri Artsutonov with the tension structure building from the geosynchronous orbit.

To be overcoming the both geosynchronous and microwave transmission objections please to consider the "space Fountain" concept.

Not site dependent and of immediate benefit! Why? Hear me out!

As any child of four knows, electricity is difficult to store, despite modern battery technology, e.g. Teslamotors Powerwall, $3500 for 10 kWh model, 2 kw continuous output, do the math, that is not but 5 hours and it can take a long time for sunshine to return after 5 hours, depending where you are living. They are sold out right now last time I check.

So much for chemical storage.

What about KINETIC energy storage using linear induction motors and projectiles in evacuated tubes? Proposed is a great whacking loop horizontal to the ground with such projectiles whizzing along at high velocity, faster at low demand, slower at high demand, absorbing and yielding power as needed. While useful, this gets boring quickly.

So what?

So BEND loop into third dimension, like up, 90 degrees, then down 180 degrees, then a final 90 degrees into original loop.

Extend this loop in vertical dimension out of atmosphere, where solar energy can be harvesting continuously other side of clouds, maybe even night depending on height and latitude, etc.

Wikipedia article on "Space Fountain" for details diagram, history, etc. FOR VISIONARIES ONLY!

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 7, 2015

Ya, Mike. The great Tsiolkovsky was .......Hear me out!

As any child of four knows, electricity is difficult to store, despite modern battery technology, e.g. Teslamotors Powerwall,

FOR VISIONARIES ONLY!

Yes, but I am a Visionary .. That's my middle name ...

Something I noticed on the M25 motorway around London . Two days ago !

.

Mike

Edited July 7, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

**swansont** · July 7, 2015

While useful, this gets boring quickly.

Nothing inherently wrong with boring.

As any child of four knows, electricity is difficult to store, despite modern battery technology, e.g. Teslamotors Powerwall, $3500 for 10 kWh model, 2 kw continuous output, do the math, that is not but 5 hours and it can take a long time for sunshine to return after 5 hours, depending where you are living. They are sold out right now last time I check.

That's why we have adults with science/engineering qualifications working on the problem. Maybe you should be taking your cues from them, rather than four year old. Children above the age of four can count past one (Two! I have two batteries, ah, ha, ha! Three! Four!) (i.e. the technology scales) and despite your repeated (and unsupported) deprecation of solar, being sold out implies that a lot of people are finding the technology useful.

Yes, but I am a Visionary .. That's my middle name ...

But you posted this on a science site, so how about some science?

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 7, 2015

But you posted this on a science site, so how about some science?

.

Well the big advantage of my proposed space based ( modulated sunlight) system ) is that it can be distributed so easily by pointing the focused beam to the specified location. Also it is AC. It is also less susceptible to shadowing or down time . Also if necessary there can be a concentration of Power .

Mike

Edited July 7, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

**swansont** · July 7, 2015

.

Well the big advantage of my proposed space based ( modulated sunlight) system )

Of which you've never explained any technical details of how it works or how much power you expect can be delivered

is that it can be distributed so easily by pointing the focused beam to the specified location.

The safety implications of which have not been addressed

It is also less susceptible to shadowing or down time .

Stated without proof, because , of course, it's not true. Satellites go into shadow. Receivers will still be susceptible to cloud cover. Things break, and are harder to service in orbit.

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 7, 2015

. Satellites go into shadow. Receivers will still be susceptible to cloud cover. Things break, and are harder to service in orbit.

Very long waves appear to penetrate very well . They have been used for submarine communication. See quote and Wikipedia ref

Quote " Extremely low frequency (ELF) radio waves of about 1 kHz are used to communicate with submerged submarines. The ability of radio waves to penetrate salt water is related to their wavelength (much like ultrasound penetrating tissue)the longer the wavelength, the farther they penetrate. Since salt water is a good conductor, radio waves are strongly absorbed by it; very long wavelengths are needed to reach a submarine under the surface. "

I think this apply to cloud cover , also .

Source: Boundless. Radio Waves. Boundless Physics. Boundless, 01 Jul. 2015. Retrieved 07 Jul. 2015 from https://www.boundless.com/physics/textbooks/boundless-physics-textbook/electromagnetic-waves-23/the-electromagnetic-spectrum-165/radio-waves-592-11171/

I am thinking through the modulation process. If this can be made to operate as an endemic system ( namely that it works as a product of its construction) rather than on some piece of equipment . ( thus alleviating the need for service facilities) . If I had already cracked this I would be a very rich man . As it happens I have not risen far above the level of most engineers ( fairly ordinary standard of wealth , teetering on the brink of poverty and survival ) .

However I am confident that should the principle of sending energy by a modulated , signal being sent containing energy , to a defined point . Then it could be scaled up to sunlight being modulated by long waves . ( using amplitude modulation )

Class C is a type of amplification that does not require a complete sine wave , but can work with a portion of a wave . Natural resonance can make up for missing parts of the wave .

So if we were to find a natural mechanism that could rotate at 200,000 times a second 200khz ( .1500meters ) so as to chop light to some degree , we would have achieved modulation of light by long waves

I am imagining a demodulation process at the receiving device . ( giving received energy ) .

The principle of this mechanism is that ' sunlight' acts as the ' carrier' . The 200khz signal becomes the specific package of energy being shipped from ' space grid ' to ' earth based receiver ( either small user , or large base station ) .

You could ask , what happens to the carrier ?

In some transmission systems , (which might well not be relevant here , as we are talking about energy rather than intelligent communication messages. ) , the carrier is suppressed at the transmitter and only the side band modulation is sent . The carrier is then re-introduced at the receiver. However , as I said this is for information, not energy. Maybe one could just use the side band only , as the energy , and never re-introduce the carrier , as you perhaps never need it. As you are only interested in the Energy .

Mike

Ps presumably a very large version of the possible mechanism is a pulsar , is it not . Do these not rotate at high speed and give out a sort of modulated wave sound ?

Link : Pulsar : - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulsar

Edited July 7, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

Sensei · July 7, 2015

Our current usage of coal, oil , uranium and other resources , has given concern that we may be ' or rather are' in danger of stripping our store of energy reserves dry.

Actually currently plentiful of energy and resources are wasted..

See all these plastic and glass bottles,

aluminium beer cans,

iron beer cans,

all over the place..

See refuse dumps that are covered with layer of ground by bulldoggers. Layers of trash that are later producing methane gas f.e..

If they can do it spontaneously, it's not that hard to force them to do it under control and actually collect produced liquids and gases for later use..

In "Bang Goes the Theory" presenters showed how to easily turn solid plastic trash bottles to liquid hydrocarbons, and use it as fuel to drive a car.

Scrap yard searchers are gathering aluminium beer cans, and largely ignoring iron beer cans,

gathering drink bottles possible to return to shop ($0.0921 per each), and ignoring non returnable bottles...

At least here.

For 1 kg of aluminium beer cans here we can get $0.71, one can has mass 18 grams, so there is needed 55.6 cans for 1 kg. Giving price $0.01292 per each.

For 1 kg of iron beer cans here we can get $0.171, one can has mass 33 grams, so there is needed 30 cans for 1 kg. Giving price $0.0057 per each.

2.24x less than for aluminium one. And plentiful of (homeless) people is literally ignoring them while searching for stuff.

Price of aluminium scrap is $1.06 per kg. While retail aluminium sheets were sold for $4.5 (half year+ ago bought several m² for my projects). That's ridiculous.

I know prices well, because just this week I returned 3 kg of aluminium beer cans, and 1-2 kg of iron beer cans, and something like 60+ bottles.

Governments could wipe out all these trashes from cities giving fair prices for everything.

Instead of relying on 3rd party companies gathering and wanting to have fair income = bad price for people who are actually involved in searching stuff.

The more fair price (closer to retail), the more people will be interested in recovering business, and the less trashes will be laying everywhere.

Electronics manufacturers are making their devices with encoded time of life, after which they're broking. And people have to buy new one.

Device which would work flawlessly for dozen years (like it was in the past, f.e. I had washing machine for 30 years same..) means no new income for these companies.

Conclusion: first waste less, than seek for new sources..

Edited July 8, 2015 by Sensei

**swansont** · July 8, 2015

Very long waves appear to penetrate very well . They have been used for submarine communication. See quote and Wikipedia ref

Quote " Extremely low frequency (ELF) radio waves of about 1 kHz are used to communicate with submerged submarines. The ability of radio waves to penetrate salt water is related to their wavelength (much like ultrasound penetrating tissue)the longer the wavelength, the farther they penetrate. Since salt water is a good conductor, radio waves are strongly absorbed by it; very long wavelengths are needed to reach a submarine under the surface. "

I think this apply to cloud cover , also .

Source: Boundless. Radio Waves. Boundless Physics. Boundless, 01 Jul. 2015. Retrieved 07 Jul. 2015 from https://www.boundless.com/physics/textbooks/boundless-physics-textbook/electromagnetic-waves-23/the-electromagnetic-spectrum-165/radio-waves-592-11171/

Modulated sunlight will not be long wave. ELF has the carrier at 1 kHz. The carrier for sunlight is around 10^15 Hz. Modulation gives you sidebands centered on the carrier.

I am thinking through the modulation process. If this can be made to operate as an endemic system ( namely that it works as a product of its construction) rather than on some piece of equipment . ( thus alleviating the need for service facilities) .

I have no idea what you mean by this. Something has to do the modulation, or downconversion, since that's what you seem to be talking about.

The principle of this mechanism is that ' sunlight' acts as the ' carrier' . The 200khz signal becomes the specific package of energy being shipped from ' space grid ' to ' earth based receiver ( either small user , or large base station ) .

You could ask , what happens to the carrier ?

In some transmission systems , (which might well not be relevant here , as we are talking about energy rather than intelligent communication messages. ) , the carrier is suppressed at the transmitter and only the side band modulation is sent . The carrier is then re-introduced at the receiver. However , as I said this is for information, not energy. Maybe one could just use the side band only , as the energy , and never re-introduce the carrier , as you perhaps never need it. As you are only interested in the Energy .

Specifically I am asking what happens when you send this through a cloud. You seem to acknowledge that the transmission is at optical frequencies.

What does modulation bring to the game? Why does sending a signal 200 kHz away from the carrier change anything? It's still at an optical frequency, and there is plenty of sunlight there, too!

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 8, 2015

Modulated sunlight will not be long wave. ELF has the carrier at 1 kHz. The carrier for sunlight is around 10^15 Hz. Modulation gives you sidebands centered on the carrier.

I have no idea what you mean by this. Something has to do the modulation, or downconversion, since that's what you seem to be talking about.

Specifically I am asking what happens when you send this through a cloud. You seem to acknowledge that the transmission is at optical frequencies.

What does modulation bring to the game? Why does sending a signal 200 kHz away from the carrier change anything? It's still at an optical frequency, and there is plenty of sunlight there, too!

Yes I do see what you are saying . But I do not think we are " on the same wavelength " , if that is not too much of a " pun" .

I will try and come at this from a slightly different angle.

... Give me a little thinking time !

My thinking is that "long wave" is far more able to penetrate things like water and cloud . And is far less dangerous than intense sun light ? And far more steerable , for distribution purposes, and / or spread out for reception purposes.

Thus , " if " we can convert the Sun energy. Up at giga hertz odd down to 100's khz long wave , we can ship the energy down to earth without the downsides of shadows, night time , distribution issues, AC rather than DC . Dangerous over exposure . Etc

My idea was to use modulation for this purpose,( even thinking of a spinning source , like a micro miniature pulsar style of device , such that the frequency of rotation was 200,000 revs per sec. ) however that is not mandatory . Could be any way of processing the sunlight so it's energy is translated from giga herz odd to 200khz approx .

Some form of frequency conversion . Say heterodyning. They used to do this in old radio sets . They heterodyned a signal frequency ( say 3 MHz ) with another local signal similarly radio frequency ,only removed by 465 kHz . ( say 3,465 kHz ) The resultant signal was 465 kHz ( fixed ) which was then amplified and generally processed , at this much lower frequency , more easily .

So I am thinking of some form of processing of light. ( say for illustration ) , you waved your hand in front of a light beam , at 10hz , surely it would be correct to say the light beam was modulated ( dimming and brightening at 10 hz ? No ?

Hence the comment , on pulsars , some I understand , sound like a buzzing sound. A light source spinning

At 200,000 revs per sec= note of 200khz? No?

Mike

Edited July 8, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

**swansont** · July 8, 2015

Yes I do see what you are saying . But I do not think we are " on the same wavelength " , if that is not too much of a " pun" .

I will try and come at this from a slightly different angle.

... Give me a little thinking time !

My thinking is that "long wave" is far more able to penetrate things like water and cloud . And is far less dangerous than intense sun light ?

Thus , " if " we can convert the Sun energy. Up at giga hertz odd down to 100's khz long wave , we can ship the energy down to earth without the downsides of shadows, night time , distribution issues, AC rather than DC . Dangerous over exposure . Etc

That's not modulation. How are you going to do this conversion?

You can't ship at night, unless you are storing it, which is the same issue on earth (no advantage there). Satellites get blocked by the earth too.

Overexposure is NOT solved simply because you are at a different wavelength. There's a power consideration you continue to ignore. This only works as a solution if you are sending large amounts of power. It doesn't matter if the photon energy is low. You are sending lots of photons.

Some form of frequency conversion . Say heterodyning. They used to do this in old radio sets . They heterodyned a signal frequency ( say 3 MHz ) with another local signal similarly radio frequency ,only removed by 465 kHz . ( say 3,465 kHz ) The resultant signal was 465 kHz ( fixed ) which was then amplified and generally processed , at this much lower frequency , more easily .

What signal are you going to use for heterodyning? What is the efficiency of this method?

So I am thinking of some form of processing of light. ( say for illustration ) , you waved your hand in front of a light beam , at 10hz , surely it would be correct to say the light beam was modulated ( dimming and brightening at 10 hz ? No ?

Yes. But my objection is that you don't have any 10 Hz photons in your beam, so a material that is transparent at 10 Hz but opaque in the visible will pass zero of these photons through it. Modulation doesn't work the way you are describing it.

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 8, 2015

Overexposure is NOT solved simply because you are at a different wavelength. There's a power consideration you continue to ignore. This only works as a solution if you are sending large amounts of power. It doesn't matter if the photon energy is low. You are sending lots of photons.

SAR is a measure of danger with radio waves.

" quote

Basic RF

Radio frequencies are simply another way to say radio waves. They are a natural consequence of wireless and electronic devices. Radio waves are most closely associated with broadcasting media, such as radio and television. Anything that has an antenna, built in or otherwise, emits RFs and this includes wireless handsets. Microwave ovens and x-ray machines also emit RFs.

SAR

The Specific Absorption Rate (SAR) is a number that indicates how the human body absorbs a measure of RFs. The entire topic is unpalatable at besthow your body sucks up radio waves leaves you imagining much more than just a rate, or a number; you likely want to know exactly how those potentially harmful electrical emissions zing along through your bloodstream, seep into tissues, and ultimately: Are they harmful to your DNA?" Unquote

Link :- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specific_absorption_rate

So far I can find no danger attributable to LONG WAVES . In fact the opposite appears to be endorsed by research , that the higher the frequency , the more the penetration.

Your comment " You can't ship at night, unless you are storing it, which is the same issue on earth (no advantage there). Satellites get blocked by the earth too."

This is not really relevant . As a working system , would have multiple grids satellites , giving permanent coverage . Around the globe .

Your comment " Yes. But my objection is that you don't have any 10 Hz photons in your beam, so a material that is transparent at 10 Hz but opaque in the visible will pass zero of these photons through it. Modulation doesn't work the way you are describing it."

This was just a simple example of how it is easily possible to 'vary ' the amplitude of sunlight ' which is surely what amplitude modulation is . Tonight I saw dimming and rising intensity of sunlight occurring through my window . Leaves were interrupting the suns rays and swinging about in the breeze . Creating this change in amplitude. I was suggesting a high speed spinning metal ball like a Pulsar ?

Your comment " What signal are you going to use for heterodyning? What is the efficiency of this method?"

It needs to be similar to light frequency but 200khz less than light frequency . Then it should heterodyne against the light producing a 200khz signal . Efficiency , I am not sure of but I believe it must be satisfactory as it has been used by radio for half a Century. If not longer .

Your comment "

That's not modulation. How are you going to do this conversion?"

My answer

" don't know yet . But quite excited about the idea ! "

Mike

Edited July 8, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

**swansont** · July 8, 2015

SAR is a measure of danger with radio waves.

" quote

Basic RF

Radio frequencies are simply another way to say radio waves. They are a natural consequence of wireless and electronic devices. Radio waves are most closely associated with broadcasting media, such as radio and television. Anything that has an antenna, built in or otherwise, emits RFs and this includes wireless handsets. Microwave ovens and x-ray machines also emit RFs.

SAR

The Specific Absorption Rate (SAR) is a number that indicates how the human body absorbs a measure of RFs. The entire topic is unpalatable at besthow your body sucks up radio waves leaves you imagining much more than just a rate, or a number; you likely want to know exactly how those potentially harmful electrical emissions zing along through your bloodstream, seep into tissues, and ultimately: Are they harmful to your DNA?" Unquote

Link :- https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specific_absorption_rate

So far I can find no danger attributable to LONG WAVES . In fact the opposite appears to be endorsed by research , that the higher the frequency , the more the penetration.

The "unpalatable" quote is not from that wikipedia article, but the link has a table of SAR values, depending on the regulatory organization and type of exposure. So how can you then state there is no danger attributable for long waves? It's a few watts per kilogram.

Your comment " You can't ship at night, unless you are storing it, which is the same issue on earth (no advantage there). Satellites get blocked by the earth too."

This is not really relevant . As a working system , would have multiple grids satellites , giving permanent coverage . Around the globe .

And this is different from terrestrial solar in what way?

This was just a simple example of how it is easily possible to 'vary ' the amplitude of sunlight ' which is surely what amplitude modulation is . Tonight I saw dimming and rising intensity of sunlight occurring through my window . Leaves were interrupting the suns rays and swinging about in the breeze . Creating this change in amplitude. I was suggesting a high speed spinning metal ball like a Pulsar ?

Amplitude modulation changes the number of photons. It doesn't give you photons at the modulation frequency.

It needs to be similar to light frequency but 200khz less than light frequency . Then it should heterodyne against the light producing a 200khz signal . Efficiency , I am not sure of but I believe it must be satisfactory as it has been used by radio for half a Century. If not longer .

200 kHz less than "light frequency" is "light frequency". Light frequency occupies a band spanning a few x 10^14 Hz. This modulation is a part in 10^11

Radio isn't in the business of efficiently transferring energy, and uses a lot less power than we're discussing here. (or I am. You haven't provided any numbers. There's no evidence you are aware of the values involved). You're trying to make the case that this makes economic sense. For power, efficiency matters.

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 9, 2015

Swansont said

Quote "

The "unpalatable" quote is not from that wikipedia article, but the link has a table of SAR values, depending on the regulatory organization and type of exposure. So how can you then state there is no danger attributable for long waves? It's a few watts per kilogram." Unquote

I agree it is something that is relevant , as absorption ( unwanted) is an energy issue . I was assuming any of the bodily parts are very , very , small in comparison to the wavelength of 1500 meters. Even the whole body is 1/1000 th . However if we are dealing with Kwatts of energy it becomes 1 watt . Not sure that 1 watt is going to do much damage. 100 times would be like an electric blanket, ( 100 watts ) . 1000 times is going to be a kilowatt that's like an electric fire ( that would hurt ) . So need to keep the exposed R.F down to less than 100 KILOWATTS PER SQUARE METER . say .

It was the exposure to microwaves oven magnetrons and mobile phone UHF next to the brain and MRI scanners that got people concerned.

Clearly a few tests need to be done . I guess I need to offer myself as a test piece !

Mike

Edited July 9, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 9, 2015

It is interesting that Sunlight, which is a composite group of high frequency electro magnetic waves are themselves falling to earth, say on a human body at 1000 watts ( 1 kilowatt ) of energy over each square meter , which is approximately a human flattened out . This is of course at very very high frequency , which is penetrating .

So compared to my long waves ( comparatively low frequency - much less penetrating ) of 100 watts ( 0.1 kilowatt ) per square meter .

I think we could accept this showering of energy from above a good thing ?

Mike

**swansont** · July 9, 2015

It is interesting that Sunlight, which is a composite group of high frequency electro magnetic waves are themselves falling to earth, say on a human body at 1000 watts ( 1 kilowatt ) of energy over each square meter , which is approximately a human flattened out . This is of course at very very high frequency , which is penetrating .

So compared to my long waves ( comparatively low frequency - much less penetrating ) of 100 watts ( 0.1 kilowatt ) per square meter .

I think we could accept this showering of energy from above a good thing ?

Mike

Why would you think that longer wavelengths are less penetrating? Does sunlight go through you, or walls? How about your wi-fi, or radio waves? One justification of yours for going to lower frequencies is that it penetrates clouds better.

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 10, 2015

Why would you think that longer wavelengths are less penetrating? Does sunlight go through you, or walls? How about your wi-fi, or radio waves? One justification of yours for going to lower frequencies is that it penetrates clouds better.

I think it's all to do with size of objects compared with wavelength.

I think microwaves are able to resonate with water and human kidneys, thus are dangerous. Long waves being long like. 1500 meters can't make much resonate , even though they probably still go through the body. A coil and capacitor tuned to that frequency. ( ie an old fashioned radio set . )

This is what I think , but am not certain ?

I think ( only think ) , this is true of everything , it either interacts , or not . Hence neutrinos pour through us but do not interact.

The cities could be the Energy zones ( 90% sunlight 10% longwave energy)

The countryside could be (100% sunlight . )

Don't suppose anyone would notice the difference , except they would have free energy available for all sorts of uses. Transport , flight, factories, homes, pocket radios and iPad charging etc. in the countryside we can make other arrangements for gaining access to the long wave energy .

Mike

Edited July 10, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

**swansont** · July 10, 2015

I think it's all to do with size of objects compared with wavelength.

I think microwaves are able to resonate with water and human kidneys, thus are dangerous. Long waves being long like. 1500 meters can't make much resonate , even though they probably still go through the body. A coil and capacitor tuned to that frequency. ( ie an old fashioned radio set . )

Microwaves are around 10 cm wavelength. Water molecules are much, much smaller than that.

This is what I think , but am not certain ?

I think ( only think ) , this is true of everything , it either interacts , or not . Hence neutrinos pour through us but do not interact.

A very simplistic truth, since those are the only two choices. Neutrinos don't interact readily, but when they do, they interact.

image.jpg

The cities could be the Energy zones ( 90% sunlight 10% longwave energy)

The countryside could be (100% sunlight . )

How do you have this magical device hover over a city, between it and the sun?

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 10, 2015

Microwaves are around 10 cm wavelength. Water molecules are much, much smaller than that.A very simplistic truth, since those are the only two choices. Neutrinos don't interact readily, but when they do, they interact.How do you have this magical device hover over a city, between it and the sun?

One of the comments a few viewers have made " why bother to do it in space , do it down here on earth? "

Two major points on that are :-

Being much much shorter wavelength , sunlight is very directional . Tends not to go round things. Whereas long waves , diverge more and refract more . So to their advantage in this use . A beam that is spread out and ' homogenised a bit' not sure one should use that word with RF signals. However , it is in our interest that the energy is spread out a bit and available to a dispersed set of users. If one was reliant on a light beam then you are either ' in signal or out '

Also light is of course seen :- if you shine it about it will be seen . If you shine long wave about they will not see it.

The other advantage of this project being in space is this distribution issue. Today electric pylons span the landscape. Some would say in an ugly way . By mealy pointing a space born energy source , distribution is altered.

Perhaps this is best appreciated , with the advent of ' mobile phones' and ' wi fi ' . I can operate my mobile phone in the middle of a field , I can use my I pad nearly anywhere as I have a little portable device that tunes into the net. ( on a bus, strange town, etc ) . When a power source is available ' anywhere ' it will be great.

The space grid does not need to be near , I am sure there are a number of orbits that could soon provide global coverage . Like global positioning systems. The high power links may need to be more fixed.

Mike

Edited July 10, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

**swansont** · July 11, 2015

One of the comments a few viewers have made " why bother to do it in space , do it down here on earth? "

Two major points on that are :-

Being much much shorter wavelength , sunlight is very directional . Tends not to go round things. Whereas long waves , diverge more and refract more . So to their advantage in this use . A beam that is spread out and ' homogenised a bit' not sure one should use that word with RF signals. However , it is in our interest that the energy is spread out a bit and available to a dispersed set of users. If one was reliant on a light beam then you are either ' in signal or out '

You don't want it to spread out, though, if you are trying to hit an antenna dish.

Also light is of course seen :- if you shine it about it will be seen . If you shine long wave about they will not see it.

Invisible is potentially more dangerous, since you can't avoid it.

The other advantage of this project being in space is this distribution issue. Today electric pylons span the landscape. Some would say in an ugly way . By mealy pointing a space born energy source , distribution is altered.

Perhaps this is best appreciated , with the advent of ' mobile phones' and ' wi fi ' . I can operate my mobile phone in the middle of a field , I can use my I pad nearly anywhere as I have a little portable device that tunes into the net. ( on a bus, strange town, etc ) . When a power source is available ' anywhere ' it will be great.

The space grid does not need to be near , I am sure there are a number of orbits that could soon provide global coverage . Like global positioning systems. The high power links may need to be more fixed.

Mike

If it's strong enough to be useful and available anywhere means you are cooking in it all the time. And so is everything else. What's the ecological impact?

Mordred · July 11, 2015

Lol I shudder to think about it.

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 11, 2015

Lol I shudder to think about it.

I must admit the way Swansont was portraying my suggested project, equally made me ' laugh out loud' . In fact I laughed so much it brought tears to my eyes!

However , it is not intended to be the way he says.

The spread out energy source , is intended to be low intensity . As I said only 10-100 watts per square meter. As sunlight is 1000 watts( 1kw/ sq m). And long wave is less aggressive than sunlight , this makes it very safe.

There are a lot of useful devices that could be powered by 100 watts ! Equally that is continuous. If it were part of a cumulative users device that could peak at say 1000 watts( 1 kW) , while ticking along at much less in the low consumption part of its cycle. Say for instance a new form of personal transport . ( 0 watts while free-wheeling part of cycle/ 100 watt another part gentle movement / 1000 watts short acceleration peaks) .

A whole host of mobile facilities could be supplied by a distributed energy source of this nature.

Heavier consumption could by supplied by the more conventional solar panels at set fixed locations , or I do imagine using this long wave link at static large plants but positioned where they are out of harms way , but positioned by a directed beam from one of these discs previously illustrated. Again even if these were run at 1000 watts per square meter ( that would be no more intense than sunlight ) yet less harmful and more reliable source of energy ) . This due to continuity ,reliability , positioning reasons etc )

Mike

Ps

Any way it would be good for us to turn down the ,level of our energy consumption to ten percent or less of our current usage. We have 'been living beyond our means ' for the last 100-200 years and have stripped our energy bank nearly dry . If we revert to a less consumptive amount of incoming energy we could build a sustainable society , living well within its energy means.

Ray Bradbury wrote an interesting si fi book " silver locusts" where we went to Mars and picked up the history of a society that once lived there , used up the resources and now could only drift about I. Flying feather like craft to get about ..... Very good read ..

Edited July 11, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

Mordred · July 11, 2015

Sorry Mike but your no where near an expert in the field of Radio wave SAR values. That's the simple truth in the matter. Not to mention any interferance your proposal can potentially have on communications over a broad area.

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 11, 2015

Sorry Mike but your no where near an expert in the field of Radio wave SAR values. That's the simple truth in the matter. Not to mention any interferance your proposal can potentially have on communications over a broad area.

Well I am sure you are right about the SAR .

But I am trying to offer some way out of our Energy Crisis .

Mike

Mike Smith Cosmos · July 11, 2015

I can remember as a 12 or 13 year old boy , just getting interested in electrical, electronic , radio all jumbled up . I put a long copper wire down our long garden . I think I put just a germanium solid crystal ( grey / silver ) with a spring contact wire to this very long aerial wire and a pair of 'john brown' ear phones to earth . There was no tuning by way of selection . I heard everything all at once. I am sure now in retrospect I was picking up a bit of the BBC on long wave .

It would be an interesting exercise to get hold of a sensitive spectrum analyser and re look using such an analyser , and see, just what one ' see's( hears) looking up at the sun , with an untuned long wire , picking up something , raw sunlight . My guess is some energy from the sunlight ( even though no where near long wave , may just set up some form of resonance as a half wave dipole ( Centre fed ) or just as a long wire ( end fed ) . Earth as the second terminal .

Mike

Edited July 11, 2015 by Mike Smith Cosmos

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