(UpDated)Clock hands radium paint...

[Externet]

Hi.

What interesting thing to do with it ? It's a light green powder in a glass vial; the box is marked as "radium" and intended to mix with a clear glue also supplied in the kit.

Am still alive (I think) after that stuff has been in my house for 30 years.

Miguel

[H2SO4]

i dont know off any intersting things to do with the stuff, does it have the phosporescent stuff in it so it glows at night, because thats cool.

 

You can probaly get alot for it on ebay.

[Dave]

You can put it in front of a geiger counter and watch it click away like a mad cricket. Apart from that, I can't think of many "fun" uses of it. Just remember that it did kill Marie Curie, although she did carry it around with her all the time.

[budullewraagh]

dont breathe anywhere near it. it shouldnt be particularly dangerous unless you do so. if you breathe it in, it will give you anemia at least, and very well may kill you.

 

i wouldnt suggest any nuclear chem experiments, just because they are a bit sketchy.

 

oh, and if you have any bismuth KEEP IT AWAY FROM THE RADIUM OR ANY ALPHA SOURCES FOR THAT MATTER. Bi206+4/2He+2-->At210

astatine is bloody radioactive like crazy and will kill you if you have it anywhere near you

[H2SO4]

exposing bismuth to radiums alpha will make astatine? Thats interesting.

[budullewraagh]

exposing bismuth to any alpha will make 210 astatine. if you know what is good for you, do NOT make this.

 

the gamma will rip straight through you. it's something like 100,000x as radioactive as radium 226. it also has a half-life of something like 4 minutes. again, you dont want to make it.

[akcapr]

bloody hell!

[YT2095]

you could always put it in a thermos flask and take regular temperature measurments to see if it rises.

 

then go shopping for a model steam engine

[Gilded]

Haha, always with the engines YT. )

 

"Just remember that it did kill Marie Curie, although she did carry it around with her all the time."

 

Yeah, but she had a gram of it. There probably isn't even a milligram of actual radium metal on radioluminescent watch hands.

 

I'd recommend selling it too, for following reasons:

A) You don't need it, right?

B) I want it.

[swansont]

exposing bismuth to any alpha will make 210 astatine. if you know what is good for you' date=' do NOT make this.

 

the gamma will rip straight through you. it's something like 100,000x as radioactive as radium 226. it also has a half-life of something like 4 minutes. again, you dont want to make it.[/quote']

 

That's a little misleading - it may have a much shorter half life (8.1 h, not 4 min), but you only get one At, at most, per alpha decay of the Ra. So in that sense, it is not "more radioactive" since the activity level is going to be lower. It is a more hazardous dose, though, since it's a gamma source by virtue of its decay by electron capture. (unless you've ingested or inhaled the alpha source - then it becomes more dangerous)

[MulderMan]

Just remember that it did kill Marie Curie, although she did carry it around with her all the time.

 

Trust women eh !

 

Why dont you start an element collection, or add the radium to it if you already have one, or just sell it.

[jdurg]

Another thing is that the Bi would have to successfully capture the alpha particle in order to form At. It's not all that easy to do so, and because of the low half-life it would be pretty difficult to generate a massive quantity of At at any one time. (Unless of course you had some type of moderator to slow things down a bit).

[swansont]

Another thing is that the Bi would have to successfully capture the alpha particle in order to form At. It's not all that easy to do so, and because of the low half-life it would be pretty difficult to generate a massive quantity of At at any one time. (Unless of course you had some type of moderator to slow things down a bit).

 

I wouldn't imagine you'd want a moderator, as the alpha needs to have enough energy to overcome the Coulomb barrier in order to be absorbed by the Bi. (assuming you were trying to generate At) Of course a very thin sheet of shielding material does this, so as long as the Bi or Ra isn't exposed, it's not a danger.

[I_DONT_CARE]

If you people want nuclear stuff this is the site for you (look at the magnets read the about the big one http://unitednuclear.com/magnets.htm'>http://unitednuclear.com/magnets.htm )

 

http://unitednuclear.com/

[DQW]

Hi.

What interesting thing to do with it ? It's a light green powder in a glass vial; the box is marked as "radium" and intended to mix with a clear glue also supplied in the kit.

Am still alive (I think) after that stuff has been in my house for 30 years.

Miguel

You could find out if you stuff really is radium - when radium paints were the in thing several years ago, the cheap substitute (often sold as radium to jack up profits) was zinc sulfide (I think). ZnS is photoluminescent, and its emission intensity will go up after exposure to the UV in sunlight. Take your bottle out to the sun (or hold it under a bright light), keep it there for an hour and take it back to a dark place. If it glows much brighter than before, it is more likely just ZnS. To make really sure there is really no Ra in it, check with a Geiger Counter (radium dust, if inhaled, will give you lung cancer).

[jdurg]

With the radium paint, ZnS existed in there anyway. Radium salts on their own will not glow unless you have so much of it that it will kill you. The hands were painted with the RaCl2/ZnS mixture which led to the glow as the emission of radiation from the radium 'excited' the ZnS. Many of the watch hands quit glowing not because the Ra had decayed, but because the ZnS failed to function.

[Psion]

Sell it to me!!! @_<

 

radioactive boyscout mmeee gottsa be. >_<

 

doity bomb expwosive

[DQW]

With the radium paint, ZnS existed in there anyway. Radium salts on their own will not glow unless you have so much of it that it will kill you. The hands were painted with the RaCl2/ZnS mixture which led to the glow as the emission of radiation from the radium 'excited' the ZnS. Many of the watch hands quit glowing not because the Ra had decayed, but because the ZnS failed to function.

Aha ! Didn't know that. But I'd heard something about spurious stuff - guess they just entirely skipped the RaCl2, eh ?

[jdurg]

Aha ! Didn't know that. But I'd heard something about spurious stuff - guess they just entirely skipped the RaCl2, eh ?

 

Exactly. Or they'd throw in some other 'glow in the dark' stuff that required exposure to sunlight in order to glow.

[olmpiad]

I thought they usually used Radium Bromide or Radium Sulfate...

[YT2095]

*Bump*

 

so let me see if I`ve got this straight, if I take a peice of this 99.96% pure bismuth, melt it into a thin flat sheet (it melts at 271c so that`s easy) then slap an alpha emitter behind it, I`ll have made a Gamma emitter?

 

AND therefore my Geiger counter should pick this up, as it`s really bad at Alpha, but ok at Beta and great at Gamma.

[YT2095]

oh, and if you have any bismuth KEEP IT AWAY FROM THE RADIUM OR ANY ALPHA SOURCES FOR THAT MATTER. Bi206+4/2He+2-->At210

astatine is bloody radioactive like crazy and will kill you if you have it anywhere near you

 

well, I`m not going to call BS alert here just yet, but I`ve just done exactly what you said not to, and it doesn`t happen!

Bi is quite an effective Blocker it would seem, on a par with Lead in fact.

I get readings from the Am 241 slugs quite well, even with alu foil around them, the .5mm thick peice if Bi I just made blocks it entirely, nothing above background at all, in fact I get better hits from the Back end of the slug through 2mm of stainless steel.

 

and I can assure that the Bi I have is perfectly real and pure enough, the G counter`s functioning just fine, and the alpha emitters are working well also.

 

any comments?

[insane_alien]

YT, doesn't it make neutron radiation from alpha particles? neutron radiation doesn't show up on geigers

[John Cuthber]

Most of the alphas just crash into the Bi and are slowed down, pick up a couple of electrons and are converted to He gas.

A tiny percentage are caught by the Bi nuclei and form 210At.

That At will, in time decay largely by electron capture (and give off a gamma ray) Partly by alpha emmission.

Of course, that all depends on having 206Bi to start with and, since it has a rather short half life (about 15 days), you almost certainly don't have any.

I doubt that the relatively stable 209Bi traps alphas to any great extent - not least because it's a (very weak) alpha emmiter.

Overall, I'm not sure what budullewraagh is talking about.

[YT2095]

my Bi is the 209, and quite pure at that.

I fail to his utter Panic in his post(s) though?

however, when my Radium 226 arrives I`ll do this again and check it`s results also.

I must admit though, it`s Not looking good, esp when it was stated: "OR ANY ALPHA SOURCES FOR THAT MATTER."

 

insane-alien, I`ve no idea mate, I know that Be metal can though, however he stated gamma, not Neutrons.