What is a pedophile?

[Coral Rhedd]

Did you dress conservatively in school or sexually?

 

The trend today is for females to dress in ways that highlight and reveal their private parts' date=' but these females don't like it when men have sexual thoughts about them for dressing like this. In other words, the needs of females are always placed above the needs of males, which is what our modern feminist culture dictates.

 

Regarding your father getting angry, I agree with you that it's a good thing the highschool males did not come to the door. It seems to me that your father would have assaulted them and then end up in jail for assault and battery charges against a minor.[/quote']

 

Hi again Asian Guy.

 

So glad you decided to chime in here again.

 

Could you go back and answer my post # 37 about the sources you mentioned in post # 36?

[coquina]

I think it is extremely difficult to find a compassionate way to question these children also.

 

Several years back there was a man who was arrested for molesting children at a day care center. I believe he was the owner's son. At first, there was only one complaint, but it grew into dozens. When the tapes of the psychologists who interviewed the children were reviewed, it appeared that the asked "leading questions" over and over. After initial denials the children would change their story. It seemed they did it because they got vibes that saying the molestation had occurred would please the councilor.

 

I'm sure it must be tough to get a child to admit s/he has been molested without inadvertantly "putting words in their mouths".

[ed84c]

It would not surprise me if that in a lot of cases, words were put into the childerens mouths on purpouse.

[Coral Rhedd]

It would not surprise me if that in a lot of cases, words were put into the childerens mouths on purpouse.

 

You are absolutely right! Pedophiles spend a great deal of time trying to construct the child's reality for them. This allow them to both manipulate the child and to protect themselves from prosecution. Some of this takes place in the all important grooming process that enable pedophiles to commit their crims often without the use of force.

 

Force can leave bruises and emotional trauma and alert a protective and saavy adult.

[Coral Rhedd]

I think it is extremely difficult to find a compassionate way to question these children also.

 

Several years back there was a man who was arrested for molesting children at a day care center. I believe he was the owner's son. At first' date=' there was only one complaint, but it grew into dozens. When the tapes of the psychologists who interviewed the children were reviewed, it appeared that the asked "leading questions" over and over. After initial denials the children would change their story. It seemed they did it because they got vibes that saying the molestation had occurred would please the councilor.

 

[/quote']

 

These instance happen and often the truth is never known because of leading questions. Skilled child psychologists and police officers now know better. In my state, an accusation of sexual abuse within the family is reported to Child Protective Services. Accusations external to the family are reported to the police, most often with follow up done by CPS.

 

In cities of reasonable size, any serious interviewing is done by the psychologist -- usually someone very experienced in these cases. This is best for many reasons:

 

1. The child does not have to tell his/her experience so many times.

2. There is less chance for a zealous investigator to overstep.

3. There is a better utilization of resources and case coordination.

 

Almost any case that reaches trial will have expert testimony as to how a child processes experience. It is not that different really than adults but it helps juries to realize this. Also studies have shown that children lie no more frequently than adults.

 

I'm sure it must be tough to get a child to admit s/he has been molested without inadvertantly "putting words in their mouths".

 

Actually these cases arise because children to tell in the first place. However, certain things that the legal process requires such as knowing dates and times are beyond the scope of a five year old. Also, if a child initially discloses and his/her whole world starts to fall apart then they can really clam up. What is interesting to me is that I have found that if children feel safe enough, they will begin to spill all kinds of beans. I know this from groups of teenaged girls and women I have spoken to in counseling groups. I often learn far more from them than they learn from me. One thing that mother's of victims have found is that there is a point when the child feels safe and protected that the child will begin to more fully disclose. Oddly enough, the sexual abuse is not often as big an issue for young children as fear of being harmed, losing love, and verbal abuse or physical abuse that went with the victimization. Physical abuse is often the last disclosure. My theory of the reason for this is that children equate physical abuse with punishment. They don't tell about it initially because they think if they got it, they must have done something bad.

 

The key to disclosure is to keep the child's life safe, stable, and protected from the abuser.

 

Abusers have pulled some pretty amazing stunts to get access to a child after disclosure because they know that they have psychological power over the child. Another common but sad thread is that in incest cases, family pets are often killed to reinforce in the child's mind that the abuser means business.

 

This also happens in cases of domestic violence. Families who take shelter from a batterer often find that the family pet they had to leave behind has been deliberately harmed or killed,

[MulderMan]

forgive me if i am wrong but is a sexual preference like being a pedophile preventable, or is it the same as sexuality? e.g straight, lesbian and gay. do these individuals have a choice or is it instinct? how is the definition of pedophile described in the law and psychology?

[Exordium]

forgive me if i am wrong but is a sexual preference like being a pedophile preventable, or is it the same as sexuality? e.g straight, lesbian and gay. do these individuals have a choice or is it instinct? how is the definition of pedophile described in the law and psychology?

 

Pedophilia isn't a natural sexual orientation, it's a mental illness. But nevertheless each pedophile is always responsible for his/her own behaviour.

 

For example, the American Psychiatry Association does not consider homosexulity a mental illness, but they do include pedophilia in their diagnostic manual.

 

As for the law, well, most civilized have outlawed sex with indivuduals under 16 or 18 years of age.

[Coral Rhedd]

forgive me if i am wrong but is a sexual preference like being a pedophile preventable, or is it the same as sexuality? e.g straight, lesbian and gay. do these individuals have a choice or is it instinct? how is the definition of pedophile described in the law and psychology?

 

Here is a link that explains some of the terms in this thread:

 

http://encyclopedia.laborlawtalk.com/child_molester

 

It attempts a very balanced attitude.

 

I especially rolled my eyes at this part:

 

Critics of outlawing sex with children, especially pedophile emancipation groups, disagree with labelling all child sexual activity as abuse and object to the use of terms victim and perpetrator when talking about consensual acts. Many pedophiles doubt that there is scientific evidence that consensual sexual activity causes harm to minors and argue that child sexual abuse is considered a crime solely because of sexual morality. Rind et al. (1998) stated that "CSA does not cause intense harm on a pervasive basis". Some further argue that denying a child the right to give informed consent ignores his/her right to 'sexual self-determination'.

 

Yes, folks there are pedophile emancipation groups. They want you to know that they are just ordinary guys.

 

These folks also say that they are just "loving" children and that if they are merely persuading them rather than forcing them then it's all okay.

 

Here is the psychological definition of pedophile you were looking for, a rather extensive elaboration at psychologytoday :

 

http://cms.psychologytoday.com/conditions/pedophilia.html

[Exordium]

I agree in part. But in even loving and protective homes' date=' the unthinkable can happen. Still, prepetrators do seem to target more vulnerable children. Having a good home probably does provide some protection even from perpetration by outsiders.

[/quote']

 

I think you misunderstood this part of my previous post. I meant to say that children who grow up in loving and supportive homes don't become pedophiles themselves. Of course this does not protect them predators outside the family.

 

However the sad fact is that the most common abuser is the child's parent.

 

 

There is also a rather different profile when it comes to gang rape. Contempt for women and peer pressure often motivate this behavior. Strangely enough, I once knew a guy who admitted to participating in a gang rape. He was the husband of a close friend of mine many years ago. We were all quite astonished when he revealed this incident to us and went on to justify his behavior by saying the woman had a slutty reputation to begin with. It is as if he was able to objectify her using this thinking and exonerate himself of having done anything bad

 

Unbelievable.

 

If I were your friend, I would immediately file for divorce, report him to the authorities and get a restraining order against him. People can often be prosecuted for violent crimes years after the fact.

[Exordium]

Yes' date=' folks there are pedophile emancipation groups. They want you to know that they are just ordinary guys.

 

These folks also say that they are just "loving" children and that if they are merely persuading them rather than forcing them then it's all okay.[/quote']

 

 

Many pedophile organizations like NAMBLA try to "infiltrate" gay rights groups in order to try to gain more acceptance and respectability for their "cause".

 

This is a very dangerous development and it is the responsibility of all gay/lesbian right groups and activists to dissasociate themselves from organized pedophiles -- because the fact is that when NAMBLA tries to come across as a "gay" group, it inevitably leads to an increase in public homophobia and non-acceptance of gays.

 

A pedophile who has sex with a 12-year boy is no more a "homosexual" than you would call a male (a human being who would do this cannot be called a man) who rapes a 12-year old girl a "heterosexual".

[MulderMan]

i just wanted more of a balanced oppinion as i dont know much about the area. i think that if teenagers are consenting to it and these teenagers can think for themselves then they get what they deserve for misleading people. real children are a different matter. by real children i mean ones that cannot make decisions themselves or pre-pubescent. the word "child" can mean a few things.

[Coral Rhedd]

I think you misunderstood this part of my previous post. I meant to say that children who grow up in loving and supportive homes don't become pedophiles themselves. Of course this does not protect them predators outside the family.

 

Understood.

 

However the sad fact is that the most common abuser is the child's parent.

 

Yes. The stranger lurking in the dark alley is fairly rare. These incest case are some of the saddest and they abuse can go on for many years. People I have known with PTSD were often incest victims.

 

If I were your friend' date=' I would immediately file for divorce, report him to the authorities and get a restraining order against him. People can often be prosecuted for violent crimes years after the fact.[/quote']

 

This was in Texas and the statute of limitations long ago ran out. I lost track of my friend. I found I could not tolerate her husband and when he began physically abusing her, I urged her to leave him, but she did not.

[Coral Rhedd]

Many pedophile organizations like NAMBLA try to "infiltrate" gay rights groups in order to try to gain more acceptance and respectability for their "cause".

 

This is a very dangerous development and it is the responsibility of all gay/lesbian right groups and activists to dissasociate themselves from organized pedophiles -- because the fact is that when NAMBLA tries to come across as a "gay" group' date=' it inevitably leads to an increase in public homophobia and non-acceptance of gays.

 

A pedophile who has sex with a 12-year boy is no more a "homosexual" than you would call a male (a human being who would do this cannot be called a man) who rapes a 12-year old girl a "heterosexual".[/quote']

 

Thanks for the good information. I did not know about the infiltration.

 

I completely agree with your last paragraph. A beloved uncle of mine was gay and we (my brothers and I were victims of our parents physical abuse.) were far safer with him than we were with our parents.

 

He had a twenty-five year long term partner. When he died, my homophobic extended family had fits because he left funeral instruction and his money to his partner. What did they think twenty-five years was supposed to mean.

 

IMO, he had a marriage.

[Bettina]

Did you dress conservatively in school or sexually?

 

The trend today is for females to dress in ways that highlight and reveal their private parts' date=' but these females don't like it when men have sexual thoughts about them for dressing like this. In other words, the needs of females are always placed above the needs of males, which is what our modern feminist culture dictates.

 

Regarding your father getting angry, I agree with you that it's a good thing the highschool males did not come to the door. It seems to me that your father would have assaulted them and then end up in jail for assault and battery charges against a minor.[/quote']

 

Definately conservative. I'm not into dressing sexually and my dad would never have allowed it in the first place.

 

Bettina

[Coral Rhedd]

i just wanted more of a balanced oppinion as i dont know much about the area. i think that if teenagers are consenting to it and these teenagers can think for themselves then they get what they deserve for misleading people. real children are a different matter. by real children i mean ones that cannot make decisions themselves or pre-pubescent. the word "child" can mean a few things.

 

I think the problem we run into is the widely varying maturity levels among teenagers and the fact that we have to draw a line somewhere. Some teens are very knowing and eager for sex and some are very naive and manipulable. Sometimes I wonder if we should eliminate statutory rape laws for teens over 16 and replace them with some sort of sexual exploitation law, but the religious right would never allow this and I cannot really see how to draw up a law that would make things better rather than worse. I am no lawyer.

[Coral Rhedd]

forgive me if i am wrong but is a sexual preference like being a pedophile preventable, or is it the same as sexuality? e.g straight, lesbian and gay. do these individuals have a choice or is it instinct? how is the definition of pedophile described in the law and psychology?

 

I don't know the answer to these questions. My hunch is that it is something like ducks and not so much genetic but I am just being very speculative. By ducks, I mean a sort of imprinting. For instance if you hatch a baby duck near your beagle, that duck will think he's a beagle. This is imprinting. A sort "belief" that cannot be altered.

 

My rather sketchy theory is that certain experiences that make the child feel very insecure (and stats say this would mostly be male children who later become sexual abusers) or frightened would cause him to try to overcome his fears by repeating the experience. Since the adult cannot be a child again, he chooses and child to enact this fear provoking event upon to relive his own fear.

 

Sounds crazy, I know. Don't ask me why people do this, but it seems they get very stuck in patterns. Have you ever known someone who kept repeating the same self-destructive behavior over and over?

 

But then I am no psychologist either.

[Coral Rhedd]

In a sense' date=' pedophilia, while perverse, is in the same way a necessity for pedophiles. It's a compulsion that they can't help (ok, they can, but it's a strong compulsion that many are weak-of-will to combat, remember sexual libido mind you). And no, they are not sane, so yes, they are insane in this way, because they are incapable (or at least, they argue) of preventing themselves of doing such a thing. And yes, it is a sexual preference because they are arroused through children, rather than peers.

[/quote']

 

I have read that nicotine is one of the most addictive substances on earth, and yet my brother gave up smoking cold turkey after many years. Let's just say that I think the compulsion of pedophiliac behavior may be much, much more powerful than nicotine. They like what they are doing, they don't want to give it up apparently because they find so many ways to justify it, and treatment strategies have proven woefully inaffective.

 

I say, until we can figure this one out, I say we lock em up an throw away the key. Protecting children is the more important value.

 

So, you're right on all accounts. At least, I think you are. Being somewhat of a would-be victim of pedophilia, I'd like to think I have some remote clue as to what I'm talking about . . .

 

You are safe now. That's what matters.

[Asian Guy]

A pedophile who has sex with a 12-year boy is no more a "homosexual" than you would call a male (a human being who would do this cannot be called a man) who rapes a 12-year old girl a "heterosexual".

 

I tend to disagree. I consider NAMBLA members to be homosexual, who prefer pre-pubescent males.

 

I've also seen statistics showing that most illegal sex with pre-teens involve homosexuals above the age of 18.

[Callipygous]

To be fair its probably because your attractive, and only older people thought they'd have a chance with you.

 

 

uh... that may be a nice compliment, but no.

 

while she may be attractive there is not a chance that boys her age would leave her alone because of it. having no chance doesnt stop guys from trying. dressing conservatively, as she mentioned, might get her a little more quite time. being attractive wont.

[Sorcerer]

Not following. What sort of scheming are your referring to?

 

Just a sexist opinion of mine which doesn't sit well with feminists, however true it is. Btw sexism is justified in alot of cases, you cannot tell me men and women are not different. Anyway, women tend to use gossip as their weapon of choice, destroying others ranking within social groups, while men tend to use violence.

 

So when fathers, lay down the law, it is usually more obvious they mean what they say as the body language is there saying "or I'll kill you!", even if the intention isn't, so they are more influential. However mothers when trying to get their children to do something will use other types of positive or negative reinforcement.

 

So basically, since the mothers have less sway over children, they will let the fact they disagree with their actions known by making a fuss, in this case making the life of the in-law less pleasant.

[Coral Rhedd]

Just a sexist opinion of mine which doesn't sit well with feminists, however true it is. Btw sexism is justified in alot of cases, you cannot tell me men and women are not different.

 

Interesting POV. Let's try it this way. If I were to say:

 

"Just a racist opinion of mine which doesn't sit at all well with black people, however true it is. Btw racism is justified in alot of cases, you cannot tell me white and black are not different."

 

. . . would you find anything wrong with that statement?

 

Anyway, women tend to use gossip as their weapon of choice, destroying others ranking within social groups, while men tend to use violence.

 

Is this folk wisdom? May I ask if you have any scientific studies on this.

 

So when fathers, lay down the law, it is usually more obvious they mean what they say as the body language is there saying "or I'll kill you!", even if the intention isn't, so they are more influential. However mothers when trying to get their children to do something will use other types of positive or negative reinforcement.

 

I am sure body language saying "or I'll kill you!" is bound to be effective. If you know any fathers like this be sure and offer them my congratulations on having found an effective parenting tool for striking fear into their children. Perhaps they beat their chest as well????

 

So basically, since the mothers have less sway over children, they will let the fact they disagree with their actions known by making a fuss, in this case making the life of the in-law less pleasant.

 

Interesting. Why does my would-be alpha German Shepherd obey me instantly on most commands? Could it be he has forgotten I am female?

 

Last question: And your point about pedophiles was . . .?

[Sorcerer]

Interesting POV. Let's try it this way. If I were to say:

 

"Just a racist opinion of mine which doesn't sit at all well with black people' date=' however true it is. Btw racism is justified in alot of cases, you cannot tell me white and black are not different."

 

. . . would you find anything wrong with that statement?[/quote']

 

Well, the differences between black and white are smaller than the differences between men and women. Tell me, would you welcome and integrated Olympic games? Would you truly like to see an even playing feild, where women are only dominant in gymnatics (and IMHO a few other crap sports).

 

Is this folk wisdom? May I ask if you have any scientific studies on this.

 

Well, I cant be bothered looking for the anthropological/psychological references, but I can offer you an argument as to why women and mens social strategies are generally different. You want to hear it? It doesn't have anything to do with paedophiles, start me a new thread, the psychology of sexism.

[Coral Rhedd]

Well' date=' the differences between black and white are smaller than the differences between men and women. Tell me, would you welcome and integrated Olympic games? Would you truly like to see an even playing feild, where women are only dominant in gymnatics (and IMHO a few other crap sports).

[/quote']

 

I know nothing about sports and generally have no interest in them, but as far as I know the Olympics have long been intergrated. People of many nationalities and both sexes have particpated for a long time.

 

Also, since this thread is about pedophiles, talking about "crap sports" -- whatever that is -- is hardly to the point. In fact, sports have nothing to do with the subject of scheming which prompted my reply to you. I thought scheming might have something to do with female pedophile strategies of sexual abuse as opposed to male strategies.

 

Well, I cant be bothered looking for the anthropological/psychological references, but I can offer you an argument as to why women and mens social strategies are generally different. You want to hear it? It doesn't have anything to do with paedophiles, start me a new thread, the psychology of sexism.

 

Since you can't bothered with references, to what point would I open a thread about sexism -- of which you seem to approve? We already have a thread where no one can seem to differientiate child abuse from discipline. The fact that you think sexism is a good thing does not bode well for intelligent discourse.

[Callipygous]

coral, are you saying you really dont think men and women are different? look back to the part of this discussion where we had to explain why such a young girl would be attractive.

 

men are the protectors, our bodies are designed for fighting. we have more upper body strength, bruise less easily, and are pumped full of testosterone so when the mountain lions attack we can defend the women and the little people. the effects of millions of years of evolution dont go away with a few decades of relative equality in society. as a result, men tend more towards violence than women, we are better suited to different jobs. for example, women are better suited for multitasking than men are.

 

women are the nurturers. your bodies are focused around your centers because your most important role is protecting a child from any and all harm for 9 months.

 

these roles can be seen in more than just our physical differences. a woman can only make one child every nine months. a man can take part in the creation of thousands in that same time. as a result, a man could be married to someone he sees as the most beautiful, smartest, most loving woman in the world. the relationship can be absolutely perfect in everyway imaginable, but after they have sex he will still get the urge to have sex with the womans sister, best friend, and any other females he comes into contact with. in modern society the good loyal men are merely resisting their urges. since a woman can only have one child a year she is looking for someone to settle with. she wants someone who will stick around and fight off the cougars while shes incapacitated by having a child.

 

obviously not all people fit into these catagories; there are exceptions to every rule, but this is the general theme. its evolutionary necessity.

 

sexism is fact, not in that one sex is better than the other, just that we are definately different.

[Callipygous]

I know nothing about sports and generally have no interest in them, but as far as I know the Olympics have long been intergrated. People of many nationalities and both sexes have particpated for a long time.

 

both sexes have competed, but seperately. the men never compete against the women. the reason is because the average and top scores are on a totally different level.

 

 

(hes right, by the way, men are more likely to punch someone in the face. women seem to prefer to slander the person behind their back or emotionally scar them)