Is logic a branch of philosophy or maths?

[andrewcellini]

there are a few posts i've seen by members here which are along the lines of "logic is branch of mathematics." is "logic" considered indistinct from "mathematical logic?" if so that seems to be a narrow generalization of what logic is(at least in comparison to the descriptions i can find elsewhere such as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logic),but i could be wrong and that's why i wanted to ask.

Edited November 18, 2015 by andrewcellini

[ydoaPs]

Why not both?

[Klaynos]

Logic is often used as "it makes sense to me" which can cause problems on a science forum.

[ajb]

There is using logic in mathematics (which we all do informally) and then there is using mathematics in logic.

[Strange]

I think I would say that mathematical logic is the formalization (and possibly extension?) of one part of the more general subject of logic (which probably belongs under philosophy).

[swansont]

Logic is certainly a discipline in philosophy, but there is also logic taught in math. It's a floor wax and a dessert topping.

[Strange]

Versatile and delicious.

[studiot]

 

Is logic a branch of philosophy or maths?

 

 

You have mathematics (maths) in the plural so the first need to to clarify

 

Which Mathematics?

 

(I refer to the quadrivium)

 

The second clarification needed is to ask do you regard philosophy as singular and in that case what is included?

[Strange]

You have mathematics (maths) in the plural so the first need to to clarify

 

It is not (normally) plural. It is a singular form, that just happens to end in an 's' (like physics or glass).

[studiot]

 

It is not (normally) plural. It is a singular form, that just happens to end in an 's' (like physics or glass).

 

With the greatest respect, have you read the OED lately?

 

To quote the philosopher R G Collingwood

 

 

As mathematics is the logic of physics, so law is the logic of politics

Edited November 18, 2015 by studiot

[Klaynos]

Maths is the normal form in British English, math sounds funny to our ears.

[studiot]

 

Maths is the normal form in British English, math sounds funny to our ears.

 

 

You all seem to be missing the point.

 

The boundaries of all three words, maths (with whatever spelling), logic and philosophy are not clear or rigid, neither is what is included or excluded. It is not even clear if for each one there is one system more than one system.

 

So the original question, as posed, is too vague to be meaningful or properly answerable.

[Strange]

 

With the greatest respect, have you read the OED lately?

 

To quote the philosopher R G Collingwood

 

 

"As mathematics IS the logic of physics, so law is the logic of politics."

 

"Is" is the singular copula. Also, a parallel is being drawn with "law", which is also singular. Therefore, in this context, mathematics is singular. As it nearly always is. I can't think of an example where mathematics is used as a plural, but I'm sure there are some.

 

You all seem to be missing the point.

 

The boundaries of all three words, maths (with whatever spelling), logic and philosophy are not clear or rigid, neither is what is included or excluded. It is not even clear if for each one there is one system more than one system.

 

Perhaps because that isn't the point you made?

Edited November 18, 2015 by Strange

[studiot]

 

"As mathematics IS the logic of physics, so law is the logic of politics."

 

"Is" is the singular copula. Also, a parallel is being drawn with "law", which is also singular. Therefore, in this context, mathematics is singular. As it nearly always is. I can't think of an example where mathematics is used as a plural, but I'm sure there are some.

 

Perhaps because that isn't the point you made?

 

 

I though I gave the reference clue to look up.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en-GB&source=hp&biw=&bih=&q=quadrivium&gbv=2&oq=quadrivium&gs_l=heirloom-hp.3..0l10.1906.4813.0.5156.10.9.0.1.1.0.187.1219.0j9.9.0....0...1ac.1.34.heirloom-hp..0.10.1250.gTxBIo5Xegg

 

The four disciplines of the quadrivium is the origin of the plural in the word 'mathematics', although today we use it as if it were a singular noun.

Edited November 18, 2015 by studiot

[Strange]

today we use it as if it were a singular noun.

 

Indeed. As if it is a singular noun.

[andrewcellini]

Logic is often used as "it makes sense to me" which can cause problems on a science forum.

yes that is quite irritating. i should clarify that is not what i mean lol

 

So the original question, as posed, is too vague to be meaningful or properly answerable.

this is actually what i was thinking about last night after posting, and i agree. for example, depending on how you define philosophy (or what "philosophies" you include) you could have mathematics falling under it. also as ydoa pointed out you could have logic falling under maths and philosophy.

 

Indeed. As if it is a singular noun.

can't have a philosophy thread without clarification of meaning lol

Edited November 18, 2015 by andrewcellini

[studiot]

This question lends itself to a Venn diagram for discussion.

 

But only so long as we can agree boundaries and there is only one ring for each of the three words.

 

[Strange]

Nice. But aren't Venn diagrams a product of mathematics (specifically, set theory). And so everything can be subsumed under that.

[studiot]

 

And so everything can be subsumed under that

 

I hope that was a joke, but I will explain if you require.

[Strange]

I hope that was a joke ...

 

I think so ...

 

[andrewcellini]

This question lends itself to a Venn diagram for discussion.

 

But only so long as we can agree boundaries and there is only one ring for each of the three words.

 

venn1.gif

i would think you'd also need to show the relationship between logic and computer science (as well as CS's relationship to the others).

Edited November 18, 2015 by andrewcellini

[Strange]

i would think you'd need to also show the relationship between logic and computer science (as well as CS's relationship to the others).

 

Interesting point. I would say that CS is a branch of (applied) mathematics that makes extensive use of logic. As such, it has probably had in impact on philosophy - e.g. models of how the universe or mind works.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Strange

[andrewcellini]

 

Interesting point. I would say that CS is a branch of (applied) mathematics that makes extensive use of logic. As such, it has probably had in impact on philosophy - e.g. models of how the universe or mind works.

that's precisely why i thought about it.

 

CS being related to maths, especially discrete mathematics, it seems necessary to include.

[studiot]

 

Mathematics

Originally treasted as plural, the sciences or disciplines of the quadrivium collectively (My addition quadrivium = Number, Geometry, Music and Cosmology).

Later these and optics, architecture, navigation etc.

Now treated as singular, the deductive science of space, number quantity and arrangement, including geometry, arithmetic, algebra etc studied in its own right (pure mathematics) or as applied to various branches of physics and other sciences (applied mathematics)

 

 

Logic

Reasoning, discourse,

The branch of philosophy that deals with forms of reasoning and thinking, esp inference and scientific method.

Also the systematic use of symbolic techniques and mathematical methods to determine valid deductive argument.

They place computing in sub category 4 here

 

 

Philosophy

Love study or pursuit (through knowledge and reason) of wisdom, truth and knowledge.

Natural P. The branch of knowledge that deals with the principles governing the material universe and perception of physiocal phenomena. Physical Science.

Metaphysical P. The branch which deals with ultimate reality or with the nature and causes of things and of existence.

 

So there is considerable overlap.

[cladking]

I'd say natural logic underlies math and philosophy is a failed attempt to assign words to the logic.

 

The three concepts are distinct.