drdino.com: Creation Science Evangelism

[bascule]

http://drdino.com/

 

Wow. What a bizzare site.

 

They're offering $250,000 for "empirical evidence/scientific proof" of evolution

 

Among the fun "dinosaur facts" they offer (from video #3, apparently):

 

"Scientists have theorized that the T-Rex could probably breathe fire"

 

"If you could get near him you could very easily pull off the arm of the T-Rex. He would die because he would bleed to death."

 

"Dinosaurs are reptiles, and reptiles never stop growing."

 

"Dinosaur footprints and people footprints were found together in Glenrose, Texas"

 

"The most up to date scientific information shows that dinosaurs did not live millions of years ago, they lived with man. There are still some around today."

 

"Missionaries have reported that the natives are scared of Pterodactyl's [sic] still living around Kenya, Africa. The natives call them Kongamato."

[Mokele]

Oh, and don't forget "All dinosaurs were herbivores and lived peacefully with man in the Garden of Eden."

[Hellbender]

I've been to this, and a lot of other creationist sites. Hovind calls himself "Dr. Dino" as you know, but he got his education at a diploma mill, and refers to plesiosaurs as 'aquatic dinos".

 

They're offering $250,000 for "empirical evidence/scientific proof" of evolution

 

This is nothing more than a cheap publicity stunt. When pressed, he revealed the only way to win the prize is to travel back in time and confirm that life started via abiogenesis. Hovind is a idiot, and an embarassment even to other creationists.

 

"Scientists have theorized that the T-Rex could probably breathe fire"

 

"If you could get near him you could very easily pull off the arm of the T-Rex. He would die because he would bleed to death."

 

Childish delusions. Some PhD he is.

 

"Dinosaur footprints and people footprints were found together in Glenrose, Texas"

 

He's seriously one of the only creationists that still use these as evidence.

 

"The most up to date scientific information shows that dinosaurs did not live millions of years ago, they lived with man. There are still some around today."

 

"Up to date scientific info" aka "whatever new b.s. some creationist dreamt up." And yeah, there are lots of dinosaurs around today. They are called "birds".

 

"Missionaries have reported that the natives are scared of Pterodactyl's [sic] still living around Kenya, Africa. The natives call them Kongamato."

 

Even if reports of kongamato and the mokele mbembe were confirmed, this would still not hurt evolution.

 

LOL bascule, I'm glad you see the humor in this as I do

[Mokele]

When pressed, he revealed the only way to win the prize is to travel back in time and confirm that life started via abiogenesis.

 

Oh, I'm betting that even if you *did* go back in time to prove it, they'd still weasel their way around it somehow.

 

"Satan is warping your vision!"

 

Mokele

[Hellbender]

Oh' date=' I'm betting that even if you *did* go back in time to prove it, they'd still weasel their way around it somehow.

 

"Satan is warping your vision!"[/quote']

 

LOL probably true.

[Christ slave]

Oh' date=' I'm betting that even if you *did* go back in time to prove it, they'd still weasel their way around it somehow.

 

"Satan is warping your vision!"

 

Mokele[/quote']

 

Or call you a New Age servant of the devil looking to prevent people from being saved in the rapture (their "big yummy gluttonous feast in the sky" which they're rewarded for outward behavior while those "less nobel" individuals are left here to suffer at the hands of the devil and then anyone who refuses to allow their self to get their head cut off for God is going to burn in a fiery hell for all eternity).

[In My Memory]

Hellbender,

 

This is nothing more than a cheap publicity stunt. When pressed, he revealed the only way to win the prize is to travel back in time and confirm that life started via abiogenesis.

The US$250,000 prize is more than a publicity stunt, its fraudulent. It cant be won. TalkOrigins has an impressive critique of the prize.

 

Hovind uses the blanket term "evolution" to lump together almost the whole of biological sciences, cosmologies, and (I'm pretty sure its safe to say) the entirety of all sciences. His challenge is essentially as follows:

* "Evolution" most be proven objectively and scientifically, and leave no room for the idea that it could have taken place with God

* The evidence will be presented to a panel of "trained scientists" of Hovind's choosing (the scientists will remain nameless and anonymous)

* Hovind will report the result of the scientists judgment

* It most be "proven" that evolution is the only possible way anything in the universe could have formed.

 

You know, I almost feel obligated to set up In My Memory's US$1,000,000 challenge. I will make it simple: Kent Hovind will have to prove any claim using his very own protocol of secret judges, disproving all alternative explanations, etc., then Mr. Hovind can judge for himself whether my test is fair.

 

Hovind is a idiot, and an embarassment even to other creationists.

Answers In Genesis - Maintaining Creationist Integrity has a fairly scathing critique of Mr. Hovind.

 

Off topic: Some Creationists are almost adorable in their crackpottery in comparison to Hovind. Have you heard of Ed Conrad? Some people might remember him from Sci.Evolution on Usenet a few years ago. Conrad believed pieces of coal that looked like body parts were actually fossilized human fingers and toes

 

Childish delusions. Some PhD he is.

He's not a PhD at all. Some information on his education:

Hovind says on his "drdino" web site that he graduated from Midwestern Baptist College in Michigan in education and Bible and received his master´s and doctoral degrees in education from Patriot University, "a small Christian University in Colorado." (http://www.drdino.com/FAQs/FAQmisc.htm#Q: Where did you get your degree?). In Part One of his videotape seminar, he boasts a "PhD in education." A little research about these credentials is enlightening.

 

MBC offers little science instruction, and it is saturated with religious doctrine; the objective of the MBC Department of Education is to train students "for teaching in Christian schools" (http://www.midwesternbaptist.edu/school/courseeducation.htm.

 

[information snipped for brevity]

 

...

 

Hovind´s credentials from Patriot University are even less substantial. PU was formerly in Colorado Springs CO, but is now in Alamos CO, in a house near the College Heights Baptist Church The street address ["External Studies Department Bulletin," Fall 1997] is the residential address of PU´s Executive Director of External Studies, Dr Lonnie Skinner (http://www.anywho.com.) The Bulletin indicates how a university could simply relocate to another town: There is no faculty, and credit is offered for "life experience and ministry evaluation". The courses, workbooks, audiotapes, and videotapes can be completed in 2-4 weeks. Tuition is a voluntary, monthly "freewill offering". The only graduate science course is "SC 701 - Biblical Basis of Modern Science". The DMin is offered in Biblical Studies, Pastoral Studies, Evangelism and Missions, Christian Education, and Christian Counseling.

 

When I e-mailed Skinner to inquire whether Patriot offered a PhD and whether Hovind had received one, the unsigned reply stated that "Kent Hovind did receive a PhD in Christian Education from Patriot in 1991. I think that may have been the last year Patriot awarded the PhD" (personal communication, January 21, 1999). Patriot is accredited only by the American Accrediting Association of Theological Institutions, which Steve Levicoff in Name It and Frame It classifies as an "accrediting mill" (Levicoff, Chapter 12). The US Dept of Education does not recognize AAATI as an accrediting agency (US Dept of Education, September 1998, p 28). Hovind´s PhD clearly does not meet even minimally respectable academic standards.

 

[my emphasis]

For US$50 and a 2 weeks out of your life, you could have the "PhD" credentials of Mr. Hovind.

[Ophiolite]

For US$50 and a 2 weeks out of your life, you could have the "PhD" credentials of Mr. Hovind.

Doesn't sound like it would be worth it on either count.

[Hellbender]

The US$250,000 prize is more than a publicity stunt, its fraudulent. It cant be won.

 

I am inclined to believe that he just uses it as a way to end evo/creat debates, ie. "If evolution is true, then why hasn't anyone completed my challenge.."

 

You know, I almost feel obligated to set up In My Memory's US$1,000,000 challenge. I will make it simple: Kent Hovind will have to prove any claim using his very own protocol of secret judges, disproving all alternative explanations, etc., then Mr. Hovind can judge for himself whether my test is fair.

 

Sounds good to me. But the problem with creationists is that their beliefs are unfalsifiable, and could weasel out of any challenge like this.

 

Off topic: Some Creationists are almost adorable in their crackpottery in comparison to Hovind. Have you heard of Ed Conrad? Some people might remember him from Sci.Evolution on Usenet a few years ago. Conrad believed pieces of coal that looked like body parts were actually fossilized human fingers and toes

 

I haven't heard of this particular moron, but maybe I will read up about him for a few laughs.

 

He's not a PhD at all.

 

I know, but he wants everyone to think he is, calling himself "Dr. Hovind".

 

For US$50 and a 2 weeks out of your life, you could have the "PhD" credentials of Mr. Hovind.

 

This degree from a diploma mill called "patriot university" has also been run out of a hotel as well.

[bascule]

The $250,000 to "prove evolution" offer reminds me of Gene Ray's $10,000 to disprove TimeCube Theory. No winners yet... surprise surprise

 

Although...

1. Gene Ray claims he occupies all four corners of the timecube simultaneously

2. Gene Ray claims he is the Wisest Human

3. Gene Ray claims no human can occupy all four corners of the timecube simultaneously

 

I want my $10,000

[Hellbender]

Has anyone heard about his "Dinosaur funland" or whatever for kids? Pretty sad considering the purpose of this place is to propagandize children.

[AL]

Has anyone heard about his "Dinosaur funland" or whatever for kids? Pretty sad considering the purpose of this place is to propagandize children.

I've never been there, but I heard that in the bathrooms of his dinoland, he actually has laminated Jack Chick tracts suspended by chains from the ceiling over every toilet, so when kids are on the potty, they can read doomsday propaganda.

[swansont]

Off topic: Some Creationists are almost adorable in their crackpottery in comparison to Hovind. Have you heard of Ed Conrad? Some people might remember him from Sci.Evolution on Usenet a few years ago. Conrad believed pieces of coal that looked like body parts were actually fossilized human fingers and toes

 

That name seems to ring a bell from my days on talk.origins. I remember Ted Holden a lot more clearly, though.

[juslikecandi]

http://drdino.com/

 

Wow. What a bizzare site.

 

They're offering $250' date='000 for "empirical evidence/scientific proof" of evolution[/url']

 

Among the fun "dinosaur facts" they offer (from video #3, apparently):

 

"Scientists have theorized that the T-Rex could probably breathe fire"

 

"If you could get near him you could very easily pull off the arm of the T-Rex. He would die because he would bleed to death."

 

"Dinosaurs are reptiles, and reptiles never stop growing."

 

"Dinosaur footprints and people footprints were found together in Glenrose, Texas"

 

"The most up to date scientific information shows that dinosaurs did not live millions of years ago, they lived with man. There are still some around today."

 

"Missionaries have reported that the natives are scared of Pterodactyl's [sic] still living around Kenya, Africa. The natives call them Kongamato."

 

 

 

 

okay what ever bascule. You think his test is crazy but you aren't taking it are you? None of you are. And his degree? You can get a nurses degree in two years. Oh, I know, two years and two weeks are different right? If lenght mattered alot of people wouldn't have sex. But they do and it's ok( inside of marriage) , and although Dr.Hovind got his degree fast, he still got it.

[Hellbender]

okay what ever bascule. You think his test is crazy but you aren't taking it are you? None of you are.

hmm I wonder why that is? Because maybe its not a test at all, but a cheap publicity ploy? We already outlined why it is exactly this, and nothing more. Care to provide any arguments saying otherwise?

And his degree? You can get a nurses degree in two years. Oh, I know, two years and two weeks are different right?

You can't be serious. First of all, a nurse degree is a lot less in depth than a doctorate, you know. Thats like comparing apples to oranges. It takes almost a decade to fully get a PhD in some cases. How can anyone possibly get accredited PhD credentials in 2 weeks? They can't.

If lenght mattered alot of people wouldn't have sex. But they do and it's ok( inside of marriage) , and although Dr.Hovind got his degree fast, he still got it.

Yeah he still got it, from a unaccredited diploma mill that once operated out of a hotel. So it amounts to basically nothing. One look at anything Hovind writes shows he knows absolutely nothing about Dinosaurs. Come on, a supposed PhD that goes by the name "Dr. Dino" still thinks that plesiosaurs are dinosaurs. Get real.

[juslikecandi]

Hellbender' date='

 

 

The US$250,000 prize is more than a publicity stunt, its fraudulent. It cant be won. TalkOrigins has an impressive critique of the prize.

 

Hovind uses the blanket term "evolution" to lump together almost the whole of biological sciences, cosmologies, and (I'm pretty sure its safe to say) the entirety of all sciences. His challenge is essentially as follows:

* "Evolution" most be proven objectively and scientifically, and leave no room for the idea that it could have taken place with God

* The evidence will be presented to a panel of "trained scientists" of Hovind's choosing (the scientists will remain nameless and anonymous)

* Hovind will report the result of the scientists judgment

* It most be "proven" that evolution is the only possible way anything in the universe could have formed.

 

You know, I almost feel obligated to set up In My Memory's US$1,000,000 challenge. I will make it simple: Kent Hovind will have to prove any claim using his very own protocol of secret judges, disproving all alternative explanations, etc., then Mr. Hovind can judge for himself whether my test is fair.

 

 

Answers In Genesis - Maintaining Creationist Integrity has a fairly scathing critique of Mr. Hovind.

 

Off topic: Some Creationists are almost adorable in their crackpottery in comparison to Hovind. Have you heard of Ed Conrad? Some people might remember him from Sci.Evolution on Usenet a few years ago. Conrad believed pieces of coal that looked like body parts were actually fossilized human fingers and toes

 

 

He's not a PhD at all. Some information on his education:

 

For US$50 and a 2 weeks out of your life, you could have the "PhD" credentials of Mr. Hovind.

 

 

Okay. The challenge can't be won for one reason, macro evolution DID NOT happen! Did you look at his evidences? How about the guy who refused to lok at the dino and human footprints inside of eachother? He refused to look because he knew it would hurt the evolution theory( and if you know what theory we're talking about then you can be quiet about all this. You people need him to specify? Gosh- haha napoleon dynamite, ) okay yeah so if you are going to be so biased about not looking at the evidence, you are the most wrong of all. Hovind has SO much evidence that is scientifically proved that you people should just give up! The population, it grows. If we had been growing at this rate since the millions of years humans had been here( according to the evolution theory) there would be 160 thousand people per sq. inch . You can't say the rate was that different, I mean, what the crap, stick the penis where it pretty obviously goes, not that hard. I dont wanna sound perverted and sex crazed cuz Im not but, come on people. IT IS SO FREAKIN OBVIOUS! MY GOSH! Creationism wins by way over thirty evidences, scientifical, to one random guess. And those way over thirty? There's plentyplentyplenty more, that's just what I learned in Biology so far. EVOLUTION HAS NO FREAKING REAL SCIENTIFICAL PROOF. FIND SOME FOR ME PLEASE CUZ RITE NOW YOU MAKE NO SENSE WITH YOUR STUPID EVOLUTION THEORY

[Hellbender]

Okay. The challenge can't be won for one reason, macro evolution DID NOT happen!

so natural processes like evolution suddenly hit a wall and stop? There is lots of evidence for "macroevolution". It did, and continues to, happen.

Did you look at his evidences? How about the guy who refused to look at the dino and human footprints inside of eachother? He refused to look because he knew it would hurt the evolution theory

You are talking of the Paluxy tracks right? They are a pure hoax, there is nothing more to say. I'm sure this mystery guy of yours knew this as well. Scientists have better things to do than examine every piece of "evidence" creationists put forth.

(and if you know what theory we're talking about then you can be quiet about all this. You people need him to specify? Gosh- haha napoleon dynamite,)

Are you alright?

okay yeah so if you are going to be so biased about not looking at the evidence, you are the most wrong of all. Hovind has SO much evidence that is scientifically proved that you people should just give up!

There really isn't any evidence, all creationist do is find "problems" with evolution theory (or make up problems, more often than not), and then conclude that creationism wins by default. Care to provide some examples proving otherwise? How come there are no articles written by creationists in peer-reviewed scientific journals, which is not what you would expect if it was as "scientifically proved" as you say. (I sense the "global evolutionist conspiracy" argument coming... )

The population, it grows. If we had been growing at this rate since the millions of years humans had been here( according to the evolution theory) there would be 160 thousand people per sq. inch . You can't say the rate was that different, I mean, what the crap, stick the penis where it pretty obviously goes, not that hard.

Who says that population growth has to be constant? If the world was in stasis, maybe, but I see you conveniently didn't consider this fact.

I dont wanna sound perverted and sex crazed cuz Im not but, come on people. IT IS SO FREAKIN OBVIOUS! MY GOSH! Creationism wins by way over thirty evidences, scientifical, to one random guess.

Hmm what are these "scientifical evidences"? What is the random guess? Evolution? Creationism is the random guess, evolution started as a hypothesis (educated guess) to an accurate description of the mechanisms (theory). Evolution is both a fact and a theory. Its not just some "random guess". Thats not how science works, and I am appalled that a poster on a science forum knows nothing about the scientific method. Well, not that appalled.

And those way over thirty? There's plentyplentyplenty more, that's just what I learned in Biology so far.

Since public school systems teach evolution, and not christian creation myth, I doubt you learned this in Bio class.

EVOLUTION HAS NO FREAKING REAL SCIENTIFICAL PROOF. FIND SOME FOR ME PLEASE CUZ RITE NOW YOU MAKE NO SENSE WITH YOUR STUPID EVOLUTION THEORY

I could point you to a lot of sites with lots of evidence, but your mind is already made up, so I am not going to bother. Since the burden of proof is on you, I challenge you to provide evidence for your stupid creation myth.

[Dak]

EVOLUTION HAS NO FREAKING REAL SCIENTIFICAL PROOF. FIND SOME FOR ME PLEASE CUZ RITE NOW YOU MAKE NO SENSE WITH YOUR STUPID EVOLUTION THEORY

how about this

 

The population, it grows. If we had been growing at this rate since the millions of years humans had been here( according to the evolution theory) there would be 160 thousand people per sq. inch . You can't say the rate was that different,

i believe that, according to science, modern humans have only been around for approximately 200,000 years. not millions. any yes, even a cursory look at population dynamics shows that the rate of population growth can dramatically change. it is the product of both reproduction rate and death rate. if the death rate drops (as has been the case in recent times in the advanced nations due to inprovements in living standards, diet, medicine etc) it takes a while for the rate of reproduction to drop into line, and a huge population boom ensues. there is no reason to believe that the population increase has always been at this rate. anyway, the same argument (were it true) could be applied to the theory of creationism. actually, it could be applied more so to creationism, due to the fact that science claims that modern humans have been around for aprox. 200,000 years, whereas i believe creationism maintains humanity has been around for millions of years, thus making the argument (were it true) more applicable to creationism. unless your a young-earth creationist.

 

Hovind has SO much evidence that is scientifically proved that you people should just give up!

exactly the same argument could be applied to the theory of creationism.

 

Creationism wins by way over thirty evidences, scientifical, to one random guess.

OMFG! a creationist with evidence. that must be a first. no seriously, im genuinely not trying to extract the urine from you, its just that most creationists turn up and go "evolution is bull: iv got this book, you see...". if you genuinely have evidence, please share it.

 

::EDIT:: hellbenders right: as you're arguing against a theory which is accepted by most as having been proven sound, the burdon of supplying proof to your conrary claims lies with you ::EDIT::

 

may i sujjest (based purely on my previouse experience with creationists) that you aquaint yourself with these common logical errors/errors in accepting something as 'evidence'.

[Dak]

EVOLUTION HAS NO FREAKING REAL SCIENTIFICAL PROOF.

ps: lol

[Hellbender]

i believe that, according to science, modern humans have only been around for approximately 200,000 years. not millions. any yes, even a cursory look at population dynamics shows that the rate of population growth can[/i'] dramatically change. it is the product of both reproduction rate and death rate. if the death rate drops (as has been the case in recent times in the advanced nations due to inprovements in living standards, diet, medicine etc) it takes a while for the rate of reproduction to drop into line, and a huge population boom ensues. there is no reason to believe that the population increase has always been at this rate.

A more elaborate way of putting my response above, that the world is not in a state of stasis. Good job.

OMFG! a creationist with evidence. that must be a first. no seriously, im genuinely not trying to extract the urine from you, its just that most creationists turn up and go "evolution is bull: iv got this book, you see...". if you genuinely have evidence, please share it.

I don't really see this happening, man. He is just going to come back to scream that "evolution is false, I have all this evidence...blah blah blah"

may i suggest (based purely on my previous experience with creationists) that you aquaint yourself with these common logical errors/errors in accepting something as 'evidence'.

you'd think, given that creationists (anti-evolution creationists, in case anyone is keeping track) use these logical fallacies all the freaking time, that they would already be aquainted with them .

[Hellbender]

ps: lol

 

Scientifical??

[Dak]

I don't really see this happening, man. He is just going to come back to scream that "evolution is false, I have all this evidence...blah blah blah"

just because most creationists are loons, doesnt mean that this one is, or that his points wont be valid.

 

EVOLUTION HAS NO FREAKING REAL SCIENTIFICAL PROOF.

ps: lol

Scientifical??

no. i didnt notice the word the first time round, i had to think for quite a while before i figured what you were talking about, and ultimately i had to ask my housemate who duly informed me that 'scientifical' isnt actually a word; im by far the last person who would/could make fun of someone for their useage of the english langualge.

 

it was aimed at the assertation that the theory of natural evolution has no scientific evidence to support it: lolly roffles

[Hellbender]

just because most creationists are loons, doesnt mean that this one is, or that his points wont be valid.

True, but if his previous posts are any indication, that was a logical assumption for me to make. The fact that he is obviously a creationist was not what I based my statement on.

[Hellbender]

it was aimed at the assertation that the theory of natural evolution has no scientific evidence to support it: lolly roffles

ok. That part is pretty funny too. I guess I have to ask (not you, specifically, just brainstorming), if evolution supposedly has absolutely no evidence to support it, then why is 99% of the scientific community still hanging on to it? Given the self-correcting nature of science, this doesn't logically follow.

 

PS what does "lolly roffles" mean?

[Dak]

its based on lol rofl, meaning Laugh Out Loud, Roll On Floor Laughing.